Formula 1 2021 - General Discussion Thread (Read 1st post rules)

Frank Bullitt

Albon to contest DTM this year.

El_Duderino 09

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

The lack of competition isn’t any kind of evidence. I read what you’re saying as a wish - a wish which I share. And apart from his age, there’s absolutely no evidence for it.

He’s 36 this month and you’re suggesting it’s evidence he’s on the way down. How would you assess a 39 year old Alonso (40 in July)?

Most drivers lose their edge at some point in their 30s. It's not just down to physicality/reaction times, if it were then drivers would peak before 25 then taper off. I don't see how someone who has faced no competition for 4 years could be at their sharpest.

Alonso is unusually driven. He's probably closer to his peak than most would be at his age (even allowing for the fact they're all professional sportsmen). I find it hard to put Alonso in the top 5 of all time based purely on results but his ruthlessness and drive over his career puts him in the conversation IMO. His talent is unquestionable and many results went against him by a point or two.

I have zero doubt Hamilton can lead from the front and win at a canter. But 5 years with no challenge has to lead to some blunting of competitiveness if we end up next year with 2 teams within a tenth of a second of each other. We saw him fade during his time at McLaren as they fell into disarray and he got out and got the first back. It's a different attitude required. Do I think Hamilton is going to crumble at the first sign of a challenge? Definitely not. But I get the impression he's lost some of the fire that would be needed in a straight battle, mostly because he hasn't needed it in quite a while.

tipp_tipp_tipp

Gintonious wrote: »

Albon to contest DTM this year.

I find that a bit odd, would have thought an LMP program somewhere would have been a better option. Wonder if he'll be driving the Honda NSX. Bit of a coupe that for DTM.

flazio

LollipopJimmy wrote: »

Bahrain to to be the season opener on march 28th :mad:

Not seen any official report confirming this.

Harika

flazio wrote: »

Not seen any official report confirming this.

Waiting for the official delay of the Aussie GP

Frank Bullitt

tipp_tipp_tipp wrote: »

I find that a bit odd, would have thought an LMP program somewhere would have been a better option. Wonder if he'll be driving the Honda NSX. Bit of a coupe that for DTM.

He has full backing with RB, and I don't really think RB are in with support with LMP at the minute. Might change though.

El_Duderino 09

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Most drivers lose their edge at some point in their 30s. It's not just down to physicality/reaction times, if it were then drivers would peak before 25 then taper off. I don't see how someone who has faced no competition for 4 years could be at their sharpest.

Alonso is unusually driven. He's probably closer to his peak than most would be at his age (even allowing for the fact they're all professional sportsmen). I find it hard to put Alonso in the top 5 of all time based purely on results but his ruthlessness and drive over his career puts him in the conversation IMO. His talent is unquestionable and many results went against him by a point or two.

I have zero doubt Hamilton can lead from the front and win at a canter. But 5 years with no challenge has to lead to some blunting of competitiveness if we end up next year with 2 teams within a tenth of a second of each other. We saw him fade during his time at McLaren as they fell into disarray and he got out and got the first back. It's a different attitude required. Do I think Hamilton is going to crumble at the first sign of a challenge? Definitely not. But I get the impression he's lost some of the fire that would be needed in a straight battle, mostly because he hasn't needed it in quite a while.

Re the bit in bold: what have you formed the impression from? What’s the evidence that he’s lost some of the fire?

Has Alonso had great competition in the last few years to keep his sharpness?

Has Vettel also lost the fire or is Hamilton’s fire subject to different rules than the fire of drivers you like more and want to see do well?

Do we think they'd bother subbing in an extra Bahrain GP to replace Australia? I wouldn't mind seeing the short track again this year to open the season.

Frank Bullitt

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-marketing-guru-john-hogan-dies-aged-76/4935609/

John Hogan, a hugely respected pioneer in the Formula 1 sponsorship and marketing world, has died of a COVID-related illness at the age of 76.

A hugely important figure in the history of 2 of the biggest teams in F1s history, along with funding some of the drivers.

Jordan 199

Deleted User wrote: »

Do we think they'd bother subbing in an extra Bahrain GP to replace Australia? I wouldn't mind seeing the short track again this year to open the season.

Have the 'outie' layout again.

kopite386

Jordan 199 wrote: »

Hopefully there will be more car launch dates announced soon.

Not a date but Aston Martin will be launching in February.

https://twitter.com/F1/status/1346062571053334528?s=19

Im going to guess February 19th but I could be way off

El_Duderino 09

Jordan 199 wrote: »

Have the 'outie' layout again.

I don’t think many would object. Bottas called it a Micky Mouse track, but it was a good spectacle as a specific race.

I think the new tracks had a big advantage by virtue of being new. The teams had less data and there was more scope for teams to make mistakes. Going there a second time would probably mean the teams have much more data and can model all eventualities more accurate.

It might be a bit of a let-down compared to the drama that happened at the first race, but it would definitely be an improvement on Albert Park which is one of the worst tracks of the year. It’s pretty though.

El_Duderino 09

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Re the bit in bold: what have you formed the impression from? What’s the evidence that he’s lost some of the fire?

Hard to put my finger on completely. But put simply he hasn't needed it and stuff like that can be hard to re-capture. Schumacher eventually lost it, I don't think anyone thought they'd see the day he'd come back and be smiling and laughing and enjoying himself while going 50-odd races without even a podium.

Has Alonso bad great competition in the last few years?

Well he sauntered over and won Le Mans a couple of times and had an outstanding first run at Indy.
In his last F1 season he beat Vandoorne 50-12 in points.
I expect him to at least match what Ricciardo did with Ocon last season.

Has Vettel also lost the fire or is Hamilton’s fire subject to different rules than the fire of drivers you like more and want to see do well?

Vettel is probably done as a top-level driver. I don't fully buy the "He can't race wheel-to-wheel" but he's a lead from the front kind of driver and that won't be happening unless Aston Martin fluke into something amazing for 2022.
I have different views on different drivers because they're different people in different situations. Vettel is young enough to go again but is likely viewed as poor value to take a punt on compared to younger drivers so he probably won't get that shot.
Hamilton is getting old and has been cruising for quite a while now and lost out the last time he faced a serious challenge.

Also man, it'd be really nice to have a discussion with you that didn't involve asking for evidence when someone's expressing a gut feeling and that you could get through a post without making little digs in the middle of every other sentence. Oh well, I suppose it's only another 355-odd days til I can ask Santa again.

AMKC

I think this years season is going to surprise a few people. For one McLaren will now have a Mercedes engine so if they can continue to improve from last year and if that engine really is faster than all the others I guess we will know this year. That is hoping they do not make a balls of there aero somewhere. Then there is Red Bulls constant improvement. Hopefully they come out running this time. There is also Alonso at Renault so hopefully he can do at least as good if not better at Renault than Ricciardo did and hopefully Renault continue to improve. Would really love to see Alonso fighting up at the front. Then there is the two dark horses of Aston Martin and Ferrari with it's new engine. Who knows they could surprise us.
Then there is the new tyres that will last longer but also slow the cars down a bit. Some teams might get used to them better than others and get ahead quicker. So all in all I think we could have a very exciting season ahead.

El_Duderino 09

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Hard to put my finger on completely. But put simply he hasn't needed it and stuff like that can be hard to re-capture. Schumacher eventually lost it, I don't think anyone thought they'd see the day he'd come back and be smiling and laughing and enjoying himself while going 50-odd races without even a podium.


Well he sauntered over and won Le Mans a couple of times and had an outstanding first run at Indy.
In his last F1 season he beat Vandoorne 50-12 in points.
I expect him to at least match what Ricciardo did with Ocon last season.


Vettel is probably done as a top-level driver. I don't fully buy the "He can't race wheel-to-wheel" but he's a lead from the front kind of driver and that won't be happening unless Aston Martin fluke into something amazing for 2022.
I have different views on different drivers because they're different people in different situations. Vettel is young enough to go again but is likely viewed as poor value to take a punt on compared to younger drivers so he probably won't get that shot.
Hamilton is getting old and has been cruising for quite a while now and lost out the last time he faced a serious challenge.

Also man, it'd be really nice to have a discussion with you that didn't involve asking for evidence when someone's expressing a gut feeling and that you could get through a post without making little digs in the middle of every other sentence. Oh well, I suppose it's only another 355-odd days til I can ask Santa again.

If it’s hard to put your finger on, and it’s just a hunch but has no evidence, the it’s usually just a wish. I get those kind of hunches every time I buy a lotto ticket - it’s just a wish.

If I ask for evidence, I don’t expect to break into the Mercedes factory to bring back secured documents. Just a reasoned and consistent argument. For example: the post above had Hamilton hammering his teammate and cruising to a series of championships as evidence that he’s gone off the boil but Alonso hammering Vandoorne and sauntering to wins at Le Mans is evidence that he’s still got it. That’s using the same kind of evidence to reach contradictory conclusions.

A hope or wish is fine. But why not just say you hope Hamilton goes off the boil and Alonso is still fast? Hopes and wishes don’t need evidence or argument as they don’t claim any knowledge.

El_Duderino 09

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

If it’s hard to put your finger on, and it’s just a hunch but has no evidence, the it’s usually just a wish. I get those kind of hunches every time I buy a lotto ticket - it’s just a wish.

A hunch and a wish are 2 completely different things. Look them up. I've had plenty of negative hunches over the years, pretty sure I'm not the only one.

If I ask for evidence, I don’t expect to break into the Mercedes factory to bring back secured documents. Just a reasoned and consistent argument. For example: the post above had Hamilton hammering his teammate and cruising to a series of championships as evidence that he’s gone off the boil but Alonso hammering Vandoorne and sauntering to wins at Le Mans is evidence that he’s still got it. That’s using the same kind of evidence to reach contradictory conclusions.

Christ above.
In my opinion, and the impression I get is, Hamilton has been going through the motions somewhat in the last few years. We saw, an albeit excellent, young driver step into an unfamiliar car with a bodged cockpit jump in and do what Hamilton does week-to-week in a familiar set-up with everything tuned to his liking.
From the way he answers questions, what he talks about, his demeanour, age, activities off the track I don't think he's got 4 years of his peak still left in him. Will likely not need to be near his peak this season to cruise to another title.

A hope or wish is fine. But why not just say you hope Hamilton goes off the boil and Alonso is still fast? Hopes and wishes don’t need evidence or argument as they don’t claim any knowledge.

I don't particularly give a ****e how Alonso does unless in 2022 he's in a car that can challenge for the title. That applies to pretty much all of the grid.

flazio

Found some support for the claim that Oz is delayed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Np6jEGY0oII

flazio

flazio wrote: »

Found some support for the claim that Oz is delayed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Np6jEGY0oII

The Race had a video today saying all indications are that it'll be cancelled, the quarantine restrictions they want would be completely unworkable.

This is it

Lando tests positive hopefully a quick recovery and no lasting effects

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.lando-norris-self-isolating-after-testing-positive-for-covid-19-in-dubai.2rhG8YKi3kQ15wBgQVLFYt.html

ELM327

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

I don’t think many would object. Bottas called it a Micky Mouse track, but it was a good spectacle as a specific race.

I think the new tracks had a big advantage by virtue of being new. The teams had less data and there was more scope for teams to make mistakes. Going there a second time would probably mean the teams have much more data and can model all eventualities more accurate.

It might be a bit of a let-down compared to the drama that happened at the first race, but it would definitely be an improvement on Albert Park which is one of the worst tracks of the year. It’s pretty though.

If bottas doesnt like it then I'm all for it frankly.

LollipopJimmy

Alonso had it on his social media yesterday that Bahrain will be tge first race of 2021

El_Duderino 09

LollipopJimmy wrote: »

Alonso had it on his social media yesterday that Bahrain will be tge first race of 2021

I’ll bet at this stage all sides involved in hosting the Australian GP know it won’t go ahead and it’s just a matter of who pulls the trigger. The ideal for everyone would be either the contract just rolls over to next year, or everyone gets someone else to pay for cancelling the contract (city, state and national government, most likely).

Jordan 199

I don't know if any of ye are into Lego, but I couldn't turn this down:



It arrived to me this morning so I must get building! Lego rules!

This is it

Not really into Lego but I'd love that! The misses got me this for Christmas, delighted with it

ELM327

This is it wrote: »

Not really into Lego but I'd love that! The misses got me this for Christmas, delighted with it

Hope it's the one from the start of the season

(and at least she knew not to get you the SF1000!)

Jordan 199

Nice model there This is it. Must get more Jordan models to add to my collection.

Frank Bullitt

Jordan 199 wrote: »

I don't know if any of ye are into Lego, but I couldn't turn this down:



It arrived to me this morning so I must get building! Lego rules!

I saw one of these in the flesh here in Vancouver. Insane looking machine.


*Side note* This is Gintonious, just changed my name for the new year

muckwarrior

AMKC wrote: »

For one McLaren will now have a Mercedes engine so if they can continue to improve from last year and if that engine really is faster than all the others I guess we will know this year.

Except that McLaren have had to use a lot of their development tokens making the engine fit, so won't be able to make as many upgrades to the car itself as other teams.

Personally I din't see much changing next season. Merc will be in their own league, Max will challenge the odd time, the mid-field will be extremely competitive.

This is it

Jordan 199 wrote: »

Nice model there This is it. Must get more Jordan models to add to my collection.

I had one about 20 years ago but it was taken from the box and lost radio antenna, wing mirrors etc loved it. This one will be taken care of

El_Duderino 09

muckwarrior wrote: »

Except that McLaren have had to use a lot of their development tokens making the engine fit, so won't be able to make as many upgrades to the car itself as other teams.

Personally I din't see much changing next season. Merc will be in their own league, Max will challenge the odd time, the mid-field will be extremely competitive.

Agree with that. Mclaren has a solid base to work from so I hope it will be able to develop a bit and stay competitive in the midfield.

I also think Ferrari will rejoin the midfield this year. New engine and huge kick up the arse and two competitive drivers will hopefully see them improve.