Will you take an approved COVID-19 vaccine?

Call me Al

peter kern wrote: »

would be good if people that recommend reading a paper or article put a link to it to save others the search

I tried to link the document.
I wasn't able to unfortunately.

The Google search takes a matter of seconds.

ixoy

Deleted User wrote: »

What are you worried about other people for if you're already vaccinated yourself? You're 'safe', right?

Because not everyone can take the vaccine so there's an element of collective responsibility to help them as there is with many vaccine programs.

Fodla

virginmediapls wrote: »

Then you're (a) wrong and (b) putting other people at higher risk with your inaction. The end-result is the same.

Professor Johan Giesecke described it a s a mild virus. Professor Sucharit Bhakdi says it's no worse than the flu and that he wouldn't take a vaccine as "I'm not mad": https://twitter.com/triggerpod/status/1328306322262159365

It is statistically-speaking a very mild virus for the vast majority of people. That's why a lot of people don't believe it to be serious enough to warrant being vaccinated against.

But there won't be a problem with uptake in Ireland, so it doesn't really matter.

ixoy

ixoy wrote: »

Because not everyone can take the vaccine so there's an element of collective responsibility to help them as there is with many vaccine programs.

These are RNA vaccines never before used in humans. No long-term safety data. That "responsibility" to others ends where the risk to myself begins.

Pandremix, anyone?

Call me Al

lawred2 wrote: »

My wife and I have every vaccine that was ever nationalised - our three kids have every vaccine as per the HSE vaccination program... So we are definitely not anti-vaccines.

Yes my wife has already been accused of being one of those "anti-vaxers" for questioning how much can be known about the side effects of any of these vaccines.

That's hardly a helpful level of discourse..

I understand completely.
I see that as a perfectly reasonable question to ask.
I expect that you are both more likely to look for answers you might have from legitimate and appropriately informed sources, and be able to discern what the truth is from the "alternative facts".

ceegee

lawred2 wrote: »

the vaccine changes our DNA?

what?

There's two schools of thought on the topic.

The first (held by everyone with any level of expertise in the field) is that an mRNA injection will have no effect on your DNA.

The second (held primarily by people with MAGA hats and guns in their profile picture) is that they're trying to implant us with the mark of the beast and will alter our DNA.

Hoboo

Fodla wrote: »

Professor Johan Giesecke described it a s a mild virus. Professor Sucharit Bhakdi says it's no worse than the flu and that he wouldn't take a vaccine as "I'm not mad": https://twitter.com/triggerpod/status/1328306322262159365

It is statistically-speaking a very mild virus for the vast majority of people. That's why a lot of people don't believe it to be serious enough to warrant being vaccinated against.

But there won't be a problem with uptake in Ireland, so it doesn't really matter.

No one is saying it's not mild. But its extremely contagious. The fear is not about people getting it or people dying from it, it's the fear of too many people getting it at the same time, doctors/nurses being out sick, the hospitals being overrun and the health system collapsing, and having to chose who gets treatment or not......road traffic accident, boy with broken leg or heart attack victim.

If the health system is overrun we're ****ed to put it mildly.

Fodla

Hoboo wrote: »

No one is saying it's not mild. But its extremely contagious. The fear is not about people getting it or people dying from it, it's the fear of too many people getting it at the same time, doctors/nurses being out sick, the hospitals being overrun and the health system collapsing, and having to chose who gets treatment or not......road traffic accident, boy with broken leg or heart attack victim.

If the health system is overrun we're ****ed to put it mildly.

I understand that and I wouldn't be against being vaccinated per se, as long as it wasn't coerced. But people argue that it's not mild. It is statistically-speaking extremely mild for the vast majority of people. That's all I'm saying. I'm just arguing against coercion.

seamie78

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

I will, but I will also allow many thousands go before me.

they already have, trials I think they were called

antimatterx

I'll take it as soon as it's available. I want normality back.

My parents however, won't. They claim it was developed too fast :mad:. Apparently having all the top researchers and vaccine developers working on a vaccine all year, isn't a good enough explanation on how there a vaccine.

Call me Al

antimatterx wrote: »

I'll take it as soon as it's available. I want normality back.

My parents however, won't. They claim it was developed too fast :mad:. Apparently having all the top researchers and vaccine developers working on a vaccine all year, isn't a good enough explanation on how there a vaccine.

I take it they are in the 70+ age group?
Have they been cocooning to date? Do they expect they will have to continue with that indefinitely?
I'd love to know what they expect can change for them if they choose not to vaccinate themselves. I expect that once the vaccination rollout begins those who aren't vulnerable will begin to forget about the restrictions.

ahnowbrowncow

lawred2 wrote: »

My wife and I have every vaccine that was ever nationalised - our three kids have every vaccine as per the HSE vaccination program... So we are definitely not anti-vaccines.

Yet my wife has already been accused of being one of those "anti-vaxers" for questioning how much can be known about the side effects of any of these vaccines.

That's hardly a helpful level of discourse..

"Anybody who challenges the prevailing orthodoxy finds himself silenced with surprising effectiveness. A genuinely unfashionable opinion is almost never given a fair hearing."

George Orwell's thoughts on the freedom of the press, still rings true today.

There are huge financial benefits to being the first one to have a vaccine available. I think it's reasonable to be somewhat cautious about them, especially in the absence of any investigative journalism into possible issues.

FlubberJones

If it means I can travel and socialize and live a normal life then yes, I don't feel I'm in one of the high risk groups and would not be doing it for protecting myself.

Traficante

Not for at least 12 to 18 months after it is released and even then I will have to think about it.

I have taken all the typical vaccines throughout my lifetime and yes most if not all were not my choice, however they were proven vaccines and the BCG for instance was hailed as the panacea it was. The OPV was also a game changer and highly effective against Polio, a devastating disease. I remember as a kid in primary school seeing other kids wearing calipers on their legs because they could not walk properly due to contracting Polio. So anybody that rails against Vaccines and claims they are designed to harm people are talking out of their holes. The later Vaccines for young women for instance I had my children take because I happen to believe Vaccines are for in the main developed with the best of intent in mind, that there might be an eye on profit does not detract from this imo, the costs of r&d and such are considered in any field. Having said all that I do think the Covid Vaccine appears to have been rushed and developed in a super quick period of time and this is where my concerns lie. Because of the pressure to beat this thing not only for health reasons but also the worldwide economic effect I suspect corners may have been cut or at least I have no confidence that corners were not cut. Only time will tell. BTW I would be totally against anybody being forced or coerced into taking the vaccine, people have to be able to trust what they put into their own bodies.

ByTheSea2019

I saw, admittedly on a UK news programme, a representative of the hospitality industry saying he envisaged entry to venues being based on being able to show some kind of passport on your phone to prove you've had the vaccine.

Would be interesting to know if such an approach could take off there or here. I can imagine a situation where it becomes essential if you want to go back to normal life.

Plumbthedepths

ByTheSea2019 wrote: »

I saw, admittedly on a UK news programme, a representative of the hospitality industry saying he envisaged entry to venues being based on being able to show some kind of passport on your phone to prove you've had the vaccine.

Would be interesting to know if such an approach could take off there or here. I can imagine a situation where it becomes essential if you want to go back to normal life.

Unless a vaccine is made mandatory by law, I can see the courts dealing with discrimination cases if a person is refused service also there is a GDPR issue.

Call me Al

lawred2 wrote: »

My wife and I have every vaccine that was ever nationalised - our three kids have every vaccine as per the HSE vaccination program... So we are definitely not anti-vaccines.

Yet my wife has already been accused of being one of those "anti-vaxers" for questioning how much can be known about the side effects of any of these vaccines.

That's hardly a helpful level of discourse..

I'm just listening now to Claire Byrne on Radio1.
She's talking with Cliona OFarrelly who is an immunologist and is extremely well versed in these vaccines.
This interview could be a good 1st stop for your wife in answering your questions.

She also dismisses the DNA modifier rumour.

josip

On average it takes 2 years for a child and 6 years for an adult to be diagnosed with narcolepsy.
https://narcolepsyireland.org/diagnosing-narcolepsy
So I'd like a drug to be in use/test a little longer than 6 months.

Also, given Ireland's record with Pandemrix and how it treated diagnosed victims, I'm not in a hurry to be one of the first.

7 years after it was widely acknowledged that Pandemrix caused narcolepsy, the HSE, the Dept of Health and GSK refused to admit liability and made one of the victims go to court.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/high-court/hse-rejects-claim-of-liability-over-alleged-swine-flu-vaccine-effects-1.4047895

and after playing hardball, when they saw that the victim was not prepared to roll over, they settled out of court, so as not to have a precedent set for the other victims and pay out more money.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/narcolepsy-case-state-faces-4m-bill-after-vaccine-settlement-1.4088687

If anyone here after reading the above, still thinks that HSE management, the Dept of Health or the Pharma companies have our best interests at heart, I think you're deluded.

Russman

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Unless a vaccine is made mandatory by law, I can see the courts dealing with discrimination cases if a person is refused service also there is a GDPR issue.

It'd be an interesting case alright. Echoes of that case up the north with the cake:)
But I doubt it, as long as they refused service to everyone who didn't have a vaccine and weren't selective. But who knows.
I can't get into a stadium without a ticket and its not discrimination. It might be a condition of buying a ticket from certain providers, I dunno.

ELM327

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Unless a vaccine is made mandatory by law, I can see the courts dealing with discrimination cases if a person is refused service also there is a GDPR issue.

Nonsense.
Private organization can refuse entry to anyone it pleases, as long as it's not one of the 7 reasons

Russman

Traficante wrote: »

Not for at least 12 to 18 months after it is released and even then I will have to think about it.

I have taken all the typical vaccines throughout my lifetime and yes most if not all were not my choice, however they were proven vaccines and the BCG for instance was hailed as the panacea it was. The OPV was also a game changer and highly effective against Polio, a devastating disease. I remember as a kid in primary school seeing other kids wearing calipers on their legs because they could not walk properly due to contracting Polio. So anybody that rails against Vaccines and claims they are designed to harm people are talking out of their holes. The later Vaccines for young women for instance I had my children take because I happen to believe Vaccines are for in the main developed with the best of intent in mind, that there might be an eye on profit does not detract from this imo, the costs of r&d and such are considered in any field. Having said all that I do think the Covid Vaccine appears to have been rushed and developed in a super quick period of time and this is where my concerns lie. Because of the pressure to beat this thing not only for health reasons but also the worldwide economic effect I suspect corners may have been cut or at least I have no confidence that corners were not cut. Only time will tell. BTW I would be totally against anybody being forced or coerced into taking the vaccine, people have to be able to trust what they put into their own bodies.

What, if anything, would convince you corners weren't cut ? Genuinely curious. Its hard to prove a negative.
I've no idea myself, but I take the view that, given the scale of the problem and the focus on it, companies will be very wary of being seen to do something iffy. Especially with all the "at risk" manufacturing going on, and all their competitors trying to come up with the same thing. It'd be ruinous for a company to be caught at anything in this case I think.

johnire

I read your post with interest but want to ask a genuine question. What exactly does your wife envisage life to be like if she doesn't get this vaccine? To continue doing what we've been doing since March? That's impossible and frankly not sustainable. A vaccine is our only hope to get back to normal. I'm not being confrontational but I really really don't understand that mindset.
What's the alternative?

lawred2 wrote: »

My wife and I have every vaccine that was ever nationalised - our three kids have every vaccine as per the HSE vaccination program... So we are definitely not anti-vaccines.

Yet my wife has already been accused of being one of those "anti-vaxers" for questioning how much can be known about the side effects of any of these vaccines.

That's hardly a helpful level of discourse..

lawred2

johnire wrote: »

I read your post with interest but want to ask a genuine question. What exactly does your wife envisage life to be like if she doesn't get this vaccine? To continue doing what we've been doing since March? That's impossible and frankly not sustainable. A vaccine is our only hope to get back to normal. I'm not being confrontational but I really really don't understand that mindset.
What's the alternative?

mindset?

wtf

Plumbthedepths

ELM327 wrote: »

Nonsense.
Private organization can refuse entry to anyone it pleases, as long as it's not one of the 7 reasons

We might soon have an 8th reason. At present unvaccinated people face no restrictions. As I said unless a vaccine becomes mandatory I can an issue if service providers act unilaterally.

MacDanger

titan18 wrote: »

If someone gave me one tomorrow, I would not take it. After 3-4 months of rollout with tens or hundreds of millions of people vaccinated already, I will. Always possible there'll be long term effects that are still unknown but seems likely that the vast majority of side effects and interactions with other drugs will be known by then

How did you come up with this 3-4 months period as being safe?

Deep Thought

Traficante wrote: »

Not for at least 12 to 18 months after it is released and even then I will have to think about it.

I have taken all the typical vaccines throughout my lifetime and yes most if not all were not my choice, however they were proven vaccines and the BCG for instance was hailed as the panacea it was. The OPV was also a game changer and highly effective against Polio, a devastating disease. I remember as a kid in primary school seeing other kids wearing calipers on their legs because they could not walk properly due to contracting Polio. So anybody that rails against Vaccines and claims they are designed to harm people are talking out of their holes. The later Vaccines for young women for instance I had my children take because I happen to believe Vaccines are for in the main developed with the best of intent in mind, that there might be an eye on profit does not detract from this imo, the costs of r&d and such are considered in any field. Having said all that I do think the Covid Vaccine appears to have been rushed and developed in a super quick period of time and this is where my concerns lie. Because of the pressure to beat this thing not only for health reasons but also the worldwide economic effect I suspect corners may have been cut or at least I have no confidence that corners were not cut. Only time will tell. BTW I would be totally against anybody being forced or coerced into taking the vaccine, people have to be able to trust what they put into their own bodies.

I have worked in vaccine manufacturing for 20 years.

This is what the world looks like without ONE vaccine. I know the people who have developed, manufactured and testing some Covid vaccines.

The safety of patients is our primary objective. Integrity is paramount and is how we deliver products to make people’s lives better.

You don’t want it, fine at least those of us who do will be immune to you if you have it.

Don’t denigrate a team of people who’s primary goal is to make other people’s lives better.

MacDanger

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

I was always in two minds about the vaccine and I still am. Hoping by the time my time comes around to get the vaccine, there will be more information out there and if there's any adverse reactions.

How much more information do you want? I'm just wondering what specifically could be provided that would allay the fears some people have.

irishgrover

I'll absolutely get it asap
I think my wife will do same by not as quickly (lower risk)
Will need to do more study on the trials before deciding on the kids getting it

MacDanger

lawred2 wrote: »

My wife and I have every vaccine that was ever nationalised - our three kids have every vaccine as per the HSE vaccination program... So we are definitely not anti-vaccines.

Yet my wife has already been accused of being one of those "anti-vaxers" for questioning how much can be known about the side effects of any of these vaccines.

That's hardly a helpful level of discourse..

What would you (or your wife) need to be provided with to answer these questions?

Delta2113

Fodla wrote: »

Doesn't bother me. The risk is miniscule. And I'd be happy to take the risk.

-And to hell with my family,close friends, the rest off society -nice one.