Why no town square in Dublin?

MrMusician18

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Speak for yourself. When the weather is nice I've spent hours in there, it's beautiful.
You obviously don't like Dublin, it's not the best city in the world but it's by far the city/town/village whatever in Ireland with the most options of everything really.

Dublin city is a city of coffee shops. As one poster put it, it's a place you enter and leave.

It's a shame because the city, and in particular is centre has the potential to be rather nice, but it had been completely mismanaged. We have a council that's seemingly focussed on cycling (while a positive for the city) but little else. It seems to do nothing in relation improving the visual appearance of the city (o'connell st and the lack of enforcement is a prime example), nothing about the junkies, nothing about public toilets, nothing about graffiti and the stickers that have been plastered on every piece of street furniture.

imme

MrMusician18 wrote: »

If cities are about more than work, then why is Dublin so quiet? Now that people have to choose to go to the city rather than be forced due to work, they are choosing not to go. This was even during the good weather and light restrictions during the summer.

The problem for Dublin is that it offers nothing enticing in and of itself, but plenty of reasons to avoid.

It's a filthy dump where authorities have buried their head in the sand about it's problems for decades. With the absence of workers, it's been exposed for what it is, a junkie ridden kip that decent people avoid.

As another poster has said there is this thing called Covid 19 on at the moment.

Tourism has been ended.
Cultural and social life has been upended.
Physical retail is locked up.

I think people will go back to restaurants and pubs and see their friends again and laugh and joke and enjoy the company of those close to them. In time.

People will go and hear someone play live or sing live.
They're only itching for it.

MrMusician18

imme wrote: »

As another poster has said there is this thing called Covid 19 on at the moment.

Tourism has been ended.
Cultural and social life has been upended.
Physical retail is locked up.

I think people will go back to restaurants and pubs and see their friends again and laugh and joke and enjoy the company of those close to them. In time.

People will go and hear someone play live or sing live.
They're only itching for it.

It's locked up now, but it wasn't during the summer. Yes I'm certain people will go back to doing those things when normality resumes. My point is that the bustling Dublin we knew was because the trips a lot of people were making was because it was a necessity for work not a choice. When given the choice, most are not making that journey, they are rejecting Dublin.

imme

completedit wrote: »

True. I am Dublin through and through BTW. My family are all from the inner city. But just lacks something. I think it lacks a truly city center character. The suburbanisation of Dublin reflects in the city.

The suburbanisation (for the middle classes) has been a feature since Edwardian times same as English cities.
For the working classes after that.

It would be great if there weren't as many large-scale public housing developments of the past in city centre areas.

imme

MrMusician18 wrote: »

It's locked up now, but it wasn't during the summer. Yes I'm certain people will go back to doing those things when normality resumes. My point is that the bustling Dublin we knew was because the trips a lot of people were making was because it was a necessity for work not a choice. When given the choice, most are not making that journey, they are rejecting Dublin.

Everyone was staycationing in Summer. Didn't the government tell us to stay cation. :P
At the start of easing of some restrictions I think people were generally cautious.

Maybe dubliners or people living I neighbouring counties who would have gone to the city for work etc will have less of an automatic instinct to go to Dublin or use the city for whatever reason.

It does look like we'll have a constant line of people coming from Brazil and India. Aren't we lucky.

tdf7187

Eleven Benevolent Elephants wrote: »

:rolleyes: this again.

Neither was London.

So what are you actually advocating? Flatten Dublin city centre and make a Trafalgar Square on the ruins? FFS man be realistic.

donvito99

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Dublin city is a city of coffee shops. As one poster put it, it's a place you enter and leave.

It's a shame because the city, and in particular is centre has the potential to be rather nice, but it had been completely mismanaged. We have a council that's seemingly focussed on cycling (while a positive for the city) but little else. It seems to do nothing in relation improving the visual appearance of the city (o'connell st and the lack of enforcement is a prime example), nothing about the junkies, nothing about public toilets, nothing about graffiti and the stickers that have been plastered on every piece of street furniture.

What do you expect Dublin City Council to do about junkies? The council seems to be more concerned with parking and traffic than it is with cycling, you only have to look at the state of the place to see that.

tdf7187

Dublin city centre has vastly improved in the last 30 years. It was an utter, utter kip in the 1980s in particular. Granted, still a junkie problem in some areas.

imme

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Dublin city is a city of coffee shops. As one poster put it, it's a place you enter and leave.

It's a shame because the city, and in particular is centre has the potential to be rather nice, but it had been completely mismanaged. We have a council that's seemingly focussed on cycling (while a positive for the city) but little else. It seems to do nothing in relation improving the visual appearance of the city (o'connell st and the lack of enforcement is a prime example), nothing about the junkies, nothing about public toilets, nothing about graffiti and the stickers that have been plastered on every piece of street furniture.

Junkies are a societal issue.
Local authorities don't have any enforcement powers when it comes to junkies.

Are the public toilets that were opened at Stephen's Green and Wolfe Tone Park earlier this year still operating.

You can report objectionable graffiti here
https://www.dublincity.ie/residential/environment/waste-and-recycling/litter-illegal-dumping-and-graffiti/report-graffiti

Valresnick

We just aren’t ready for anything like that in Ireland yet ! Look at Malahide, Main Street is pedestrianised and businesses are already asking for it to be put back to the way it was before - a road full of cars and traffic.

blackbox

Policing in Dublin is very different from most European city centres.

MrMusician18

imme wrote: »

Junkies are a societal issue.
Local authorities don't have any enforcement powers when it comes to junkies.

Are the public toilets that were opened at Stephen's Green and Wolfe Tone Park earlier this year still operating.

You can report objectionable graffiti here
https://www.dublincity.ie/residential/environment/waste-and-recycling/litter-illegal-dumping-and-graffiti/report-graffiti

I could report objectionable graffiti all day and I wouldn't get half way down o'connell st. The city is overrun with stickers that gob****es put on every available square inch of signage and street furniture.

imme

MrMusician18 wrote: »

I could report objectionable graffiti all day and I wouldn't get half way down o'connell st. The city is overrun with stickers that gob****es put on every available square inch of signage and street furniture.

I don't recall much graffiti on O'Connell Street.

I don't understand the sticker thing.
Is it a kid hipster thing, or something akin to tagging as in graffiti and staking a kind of ownership in an area.

Dyr

If we had a public square could we have public hangings?

Start with the City Manager

Strumms

MrMusician18 wrote: »

It's the junkies that ruined that square, like every other amenity in the city. The boardwalk, the remembrance garden, O'connell st generally. I could go on.

Yes, totally. But junkies off their faces, why is that an acceptable situation ? I live in Dublin about 6kms from the city. I can’t remember the last time I’m in O’Connell st... there is nothing there aside from Easons...

The Clearys quarter in fairness looks rather great and hopefully maybe it can kickstart some footfall back into the street.

https://clerysquarter.ie/

boardise

I get really annoyed when people describe Dublin as an unadulterated kip. To me it has always been quite adulterated.

L1011

O'Connell Street also needs the Hammerson site (Chartered Land site, Moore Mall site, Carlton site, go back as many decades as you want for a proposal name!) done. The new central library and associated cultural stuff planned for Parnell Square will help too.

Thelonious Monk

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Dublin city is a city of coffee shops. As one poster put it, it's a place you enter and leave.

It's a shame because the city, and in particular is centre has the potential to be rather nice, but it had been completely mismanaged. We have a council that's seemingly focussed on cycling (while a positive for the city) but little else. It seems to do nothing in relation improving the visual appearance of the city (o'connell st and the lack of enforcement is a prime example), nothing about the junkies, nothing about public toilets, nothing about graffiti and the stickers that have been plastered on every piece of street furniture.

Well personally I go into town most weekends for a couple of hours, just to wander around, I quite enjoy it.
I think most cities are cities of coffee shops these days, people love coffee.
I cycle around town myself and they've put a few bike lanes in but that's about all, it's still totally in favour of private cars.
I'm probably on my own in that I think O'Connell st looks well since they did the road up, the surfacing is lovely, better than most of the city. The buildings towards the north end especially certainly need some loving but it's getting better.
The likes of South Anne St and Baggot St look like they have tanks chugging down the streets all day and night. The tiny footpaths, and the road surfaces are just a total wreck.

It's not a Dublin thing anyway, it's an Irish thing. Most of our towns and villages are absolute dives, usually just clogged with traffic and zero love put into the buildings or streets. Not pedestrian or cyclist orientated and way too much car parking.
Dublin is just a big version of all the things that suck about urban areas in Ireland, I find most of the non Dubs giving out about Dublin aren't quick to tell us what Irish utopia they come from.

Dyr

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Well personally I go into town most weekends for a couple of hours, just to wander around, I quite enjoy it.
I think most cities are cities of coffee shops these days, people love coffee.
I cycle around town myself and they've put a few bike lanes in but that's about all, it's still totally in favour of private cars.
I'm probably on my own in that I think O'Connell st looks well since they did the road up, the surfacing is lovely, better than most of the city. The buildings towards the north end especially certainly need some loving but it's getting better.
The likes of South Anne St and Baggot St look like they have tanks chugging down the streets all day and night.

One of the things that makes Dublin so ugly is the horrendous public transport infrastructure thats been put in, its all as ugly as sin.

whisky_galore

Planning, which Ireland is generally shít at, then and now.
No joined-up grand design for an area, just all little bits fcuked together like the Little House on the Prarie.

Doing things half-arsed and on the cheap.

TheW1zard

Fred Cryton wrote: »

If it's true , then it's true. On every thread.


If you want a car free zone then pedestrianize a street. South William street would be top of my list. But a square or open space would just be a congregation zone for the types i mentioned.

Was that you buyin all them pints

MrMusician18

whisky_galore wrote: »

Planning, which Ireland is generally shít at, then and now.

Doing things half-arsed and on the cheap.

Half arsed certainly but it's never cheap.

Thelonious Monk

whisky_galore wrote: »

Planning, which Ireland is generally shít at, then and now.
No joined-up grand design for an area, just all little bits fcuked together like the Little House on the Prarie.

Doing things half-arsed and on the cheap.

You can't really do anything, too many NIMBYs and counsellors and TDs whingeing about everything. Look at the furore over bike lanes, or taking a tiny piece of people's gardens for Bus Connects. It's just ridiculous.
If we could just CPO the sh*t out of lots of stuff and build what we need, like they did in places like Barcelona and Paris, albeit a long time ago, we could put a proper city in place.
We have a ring of tiny little cottages around the city and the likes, 18th century peasant designs, and we still build around the likes of that.
I doubt much is going to change here in the rest of my life, no drastic changes anyway, if the metro is built before I retire I'll be shocked, can't see it actually happening though.
So I just try and make the most of it these days, we are privileged to live here compared to the vast majority of places on earth.

Spanish Eyes

Non existent Garda presence in such public places makes it great for the unwashed tappers etc., but not for those who have to pay for it.

But why not try it out and see. No pain, no gain. Doing nothing is not helping, I bet lots of people would enjoy outdoor socialising, people watching is one of life's great pleasures.

But it's all about Keegan's cycle lane obsession now. Idiot.

Thelonious Monk

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

But it's all about Keegan's cycle lane obsession now. Idiot.

It's not like he's done that much in the city centre, some parking taken off the quays is all. The place is completely ruined with cars so the less of them the better, in my opinion.

expectationlost

spurious wrote: »

It used to be a nice little spot. What are they doing to it now? It looks like they are digging up graves.

http://wolfetonepark.com/

Valresnick

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Non existent Garda presence in such public places makes it great for the unwashed tappers etc., but not for those who have to pay for it.

But why not try it out and see. No pain, no gain. Doing nothing is not helping, I bet lots of people would enjoy outdoor socialising, people watching is one of life's great pleasures.

But it's all about Keegan's cycle lane obsession now. Idiot.

The costal cycle lane at Clontarf / Raheny is a marvel to behold. It’s design replicates a bowling alley, the walkers being the pins and the cyclists being the bowling ball. Only a matter of time before a strike !

Thelonious Monk

Valresnick wrote: »

The costal cycle lane is a marvel to behold. It’s design replicates a bowling alley, the walkers being the pins and the cyclists being the bowling ball. Only a matter of time before a strike !

It has been a great success, any time I've been there it's been packed with cyclists.
It's cars that kill pedestrians not bikes!
Anyway that's Dun Laoighaire Rathdown council, so nothing to do with DCC.

Spanish Eyes

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

It's not like he's done that much in the city centre, some parking taken off the quays is all. The place is completely ruined with cars so the less of them the better, in my opinion.

I have no issue with fewer cars in the city, it is just that Keegan is cycle obsessed.

Pity there is not a City Forum for places like Dublin that includes all users of the city, cars, bikes, motorbikes, walkers, delivery drivers and many I have failed to mention, but I'm sure you get the drift.

We need a bit of joined up thinking to get the city centre enjoyable again. But Covid has intervened, I know that.

Valresnick

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

It has been a great success, any time I've been there it's been packed with cyclists.
It's cars that kill pedestrians not bikes!
Anyway that's Dun Laoighaire Rathdown council, so nothing to do with DCC.

It’s DCC as it’s in North Dublin.