New meat plant - Banagher in County Offaly

patsy_mccabe

Don't know what I think of this. It's smells of visas for sale.

Posted earlier on Beef Plan WhatsApp.

https://www.petitions.net/i_the_undersigned_am_supportive_and_would_like_to_see_the_new_meat_plant_at_banagher_in_co_offaly_being_built?u=5875839&utm_source=whatsapp

Say my name

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Don't know what I think of this. It's smells of visas for sale.

Posted earlier on Beef Plan WhatsApp.

https://www.petitions.net/i_the_undersigned_am_supportive_and_would_like_to_see_the_new_meat_plant_at_banagher_in_co_offaly_being_built?u=5875839&utm_source=whatsapp

It's better have the money being spent on something useful.

Currently lots of foreign nationalities just pay the government €450k directly for an Irish passport. At least with the investment scheme that €450 might start an enterprise and create employment and benefit society that way.

Now the ethics of a European country selling passports for hundreds of thousands of Euro is a completely different subject.
I wonder would Michael Collins or Eamon DeValera have approved.
Charlie Haughey got into stick for the same stunt. Nowadays anything goes..

Base price

This article was on Agriland the other day about it.
https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/major-offaly-meat-factory-plan-blocked-by-the-iip-but-who-or-what-is-the-iip/

Jjameson

European and Chinese political relations are strained at the minute and that’s putting it mildly I’d say. The lauded Chinese market for beef is no match for the uk in any case and that’s pretty clear since their ban. I signed anyway despite my misgivings.. who knows it might come to something.

charolais0153

I really really don't think the Chinese are going to be any more generous. Leave them where they are

ganmo

The skeptic in me is seeing why barry Cowen wanted to be minister for ag now.

Bass Reeves

charolais0153 wrote: »

I really really don't think the Chinese are going to be any more generous. Leave them where they are

While they may or may not be more generous it would have been competition to the big three. As well this processor would have been cutting out the middle man mainly Irish processors so would have more room to pay a slightly higher price.

What really interesting is that to obtain an Irish Passport normally all you have to do is


Enterprise investment: A minimum of €1 million invested in an Irish enterprise for at least three years;
Investment fund: A minimum of €1 million invested in an approved investment fund for at least three years;
Real estate investment trusts (REIT): A minimum investment of €2 million in any Irish REIT that is listed on the Irish Stock Exchange for at least three years;
Endowment: A minimum €500,000 philanthropic donation to a project which is of ‘public benefit’ – the document outlines projects in the arts, sports, health, culture or education.

In this case the company was investing 40 million in a meat plant that could not be extracted easily. With the exception of the last case above all the rest could technically walk away with a profit within three year.

I not too sure if Larry and Co would buy a plant that cost 40 million and allow the investors a profit in 2 or 3 years. The plant would be the need another 200-300 million in working capital to process 600 cattle a day allowing 60 days credit before being paid for them.

patsy_mccabe

Remember too that Covid 19 came from a wet market where live exoitc animals were sold. China allowed the sale of such animals since their famine in the 1970s.
That ban may be coming back again in light of further threats of new viruses.
Food security is high on their agenda.

SouthWesterly

ganmo wrote: »

The skeptic in me is seeing why barry Cowen wanted to be minister for ag now.

It's a good job it's only your bias and has no bearing in reality

Rodney Bathgate

charolais0153 wrote: »

I really really don't think the Chinese are going to be any more generous. Leave them where they are

The Chinese have done enough harm to the country (and the rest of the world).

The last thing we should be encouraging is Chinese investment in Ireland.

Bass Reeves

Rodney Bathgate wrote: »

The Chinese have done enough harm to the country (and the rest of the world).

The last thing we should be encouraging is Chinese investment in Ireland.

Usually the saying is ''the devil you know'' however in the Irish beef sector we will risk any devil to compete with the cartel that is there.

I hope this factory gets off the ground and if the Chinese want to build 2-3 more as well all the better. We are getting it in the hole from Irish processor's and British retailers a Chinese processor's/retailers combination can be no worse.

bb12

the chinese have no interest in being magnanimous anywhere they try to invest. history has proven once they get a foot in the doorway they do their best to exploit and steal information all to be brought back to china. have a look at what they did to agriculture in the US. Students were sent over to work in the industry and they stole all the info they needed to bring back to the fatherland to increase their own crop yields and thus reduce their reliance on us imports. they'd just do the same here..see how beef is raised and processed here, not to increase exports from ireland to china, but to improve their own knowledge in the area to apply at home and stop any imports into china. anywhere they set up shop it's just a huge trojan horse.

just one example:

https://www.marketplace.org/2020/01/15/theft-of-farming-secrets-is-backdrop-for-u-s-china-trade-deal/

patsy_mccabe

You mean like how Irish dairy farm students went to New Zealand to learn about grass management?

Say my name

bb12 wrote: »

the chinese have no interest in being magnanimous anywhere they try to invest. history has proven once they get a foot in the doorway they do their best to exploit and steal information all to be brought back to china. have a look at what they did to agriculture in the US. Students were sent over to work in the industry and they stole all the info they needed to bring back to the fatherland to increase their own crop yields and thus reduce their reliance on us imports. they'd just do the same here..see how beef is raised and processed here, not to increase exports from ireland to china, but to improve their own knowledge in the area to apply at home and stop any imports into china. anywhere they set up shop it's just a huge trojan horse.

just one example:

https://www.marketplace.org/2020/01/15/theft-of-farming-secrets-is-backdrop-for-u-s-china-trade-deal/

Now that's crap.

The U.S. has been taking ideas and agricultural secrets from the rest of the world for centuries.
The only reason it's tolerated by the irish is that our ancestors emigrated to the U.S. and they speak English and look the same as us.

Newsflash.

China already owns the majority of worldwide ag business.

If there's going to be an agricultural war between China and the U.S. why should we pick the U.S. side.
Sitting on the fence between the two should benefit the primary farmer in this country more.

Danzy

Jjameson wrote: »

European and Chinese political relations are strained at the minute and that’s putting it mildly I’d say. The lauded Chinese market for beef is no match for the uk in any case and that’s pretty clear since their ban. I signed anyway despite my misgivings.. who knows it might come to something.

Yet if the Chinese eat meet like Western countries do, then they'll buy every carcasse in the world that is exported, nevermind our bit.

The increases alone that are happening now and the next few years is going to have a big impact on beef prices, much more than what Britain does.

Danzy

charolais0153 wrote: »

I really really don't think the Chinese are going to be any more generous. Leave them where they are

They won't be generous but they will buy what they need to keep their people fed and happy, so they people don't rebel against them.

They're not going to care about prices the cartel fix or about getting the Dept of agriculture to comply with the needs of beef processors, they'll do what they must to suit themselves.

That alone means an improvement for Irish farmers.

patsy_mccabe

Any time there is an extra bidder around the ring, so to speak,...... its good thing.

Jjameson

https://www.agriculture.gov.ie/publications/2011/annualreviewandoutlookforagriculturefisheriesandfood20102011/nationaldevelopments/foodharvest2020/

Maximum “efficient” high volume output is government policy as drawn up during the tenure of super shiney Simon Coveney Minister for Ag along with the captains of food processing industry. Farm family incomes or those of low paid skilled processing operatives were not the motivation..

Revenue from the economic activity any exports for the national exchequer (we were in serious bother at the time IMF and so on). Greencore, Abp, Dawn meats, Kepak were to Fianna Gael what the banks were to Fianna fail.

jaymla627

bb12 wrote: »

the chinese have no interest in being magnanimous anywhere they try to invest. history has proven once they get a foot in the doorway they do their best to exploit and steal information all to be brought back to china. have a look at what they did to agriculture in the US. Students were sent over to work in the industry and they stole all the info they needed to bring back to the fatherland to increase their own crop yields and thus reduce their reliance on us imports. they'd just do the same here..see how beef is raised and processed here, not to increase exports from ireland to china, but to improve their own knowledge in the area to apply at home and stop any imports into china. anywhere they set up shop it's just a huge trojan horse.

just one example:

https://www.marketplace.org/2020/01/15/theft-of-farming-secrets-is-backdrop-for-u-s-china-trade-deal/

They currently have 20,000 square kilometers of farmland flooded due to their policy of destroying rural areas in order to save industrial centers and cities, weather patterns over their are making farming pretty difficult and its only getting worse, they will never be self sufficient in food our anywhere near it, having said that if the plant ever did get up and going you’d nearly want the money in your account before letting cattle into the place

Bass Reeves

bb12 wrote: »

the chinese have no interest in being magnanimous anywhere they try to invest. history has proven once they get a foot in the doorway they do their best to exploit and steal information all to be brought back to china. have a look at what they did to agriculture in the US. Students were sent over to work in the industry and they stole all the info they needed to bring back to the fatherland to increase their own crop yields and thus reduce their reliance on us imports. they'd just do the same here..see how beef is raised and processed here, not to increase exports from ireland to china, but to improve their own knowledge in the area to apply at home and stop any imports into china. anywhere they set up shop it's just a huge trojan horse.

just one example:

https://www.marketplace.org/2020/01/15/theft-of-farming-secrets-is-backdrop-for-u-s-china-trade-deal/

Well if the Chinese government ant to learn about beef production they would not choose a temperate climate country with a grass based system. It more likely they would choose a country with a similar climate to themselves that uses feedlots and complete grain and straw based diets.

It was interesting for all the hype that none of he Irish processor's made any serious attempt to sell products into the Chinese market. They seemed more interested in retaining present customers and not rocking the boat or rising the price to them

When you are getting 10-15%less of a price than 8-10years ago you are not really interested in what the motivation of a new customer is

Dickie10

just wait and watch for the IFA to come out as being very luke warm to this . if not outright against oit for some crazy reason they were told too by Larry and his lads. The IFA most defo wont back this.

Jjameson

Dickie10 wrote: »

just wait and watch for the IFA to come out as being very luke warm to this . if not outright against oit for some crazy reason they were told too by Larry and his lads. The IFA most defo wont back this.

The silence speaks volumes.

patsy_mccabe

Will there be Chinese lads hanging in over the ringside with their arms waving.

SouthWesterly

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Will there be Chinese lads hanging in over the ringside with their arms waving.

They'll be in the corner playing mahjong

Dickie10

SouthWesterly wrote: »

They'll be in the corner playing mahjong

I hear your a racist now....

wrangler

Jjameson wrote: »

The silence speaks volumes.

Beefplan think they're in charge now, they'll give it their kiss of death blessing.

leoch

I was wondering when wrangler would come in with his usual comments and.....boom

Jjameson

leoch wrote: »

I was wondering when wrangler would come in with his usual comments and.....boom

Ah that beef plan are worse than the tans. Dipping into your sales cheques without your permission and helping themselves to a percentage of It unless you explicitly ask them not too. Ring you to sell Vodafone mobile contracts on commission. Is that them or is that the other clowns who have lost their balls some years back and just watch dirty Larry in admiration as he robs the widows cow?

wrangler

Jjameson wrote: »

Ah that beef plan are worse than the tans. Dipping into your sales cheques without your permission and helping themselves to a percentage of It unless you explicitly ask them not too. Ring you to sell Vodafone mobile contracts on commission. Is that them or is that the other clowns who have lost their balls some years back and just watch dirty Larry in admiration as he robs the widows cow?

I think beef processors are very tolerant to give yous anything.
Are you that sad that you can't, even yet, see that you cannot interfere with a private business, surely the beef trade for the last year will demonstrate how it backfired on Beef Plan when they thought they'd do it. they've destroyed the beef trade and but for the Northern trade you'd be ****ed. I thought you yourself learnt a strong lesson last year but seemingly not.
Or maybe you expect others to take on the factories while you sit back because that's what it's starting to look like. You've either got sense or you too have lost your balls and watching in admiration.
Are you that sad that you can't see that a percentage of the profits from the phone deals is coming back to farmers same as from FBD and IFJ.

MfMan

wrangler wrote: »

I think beef processors are very tolerant to give yous anything.
Are you that sad that you can't, even yet, see that you cannot interfere with a private business, surely the beef trade for the last year will demonstrate how it backfired on Beef Plan when they thought they'd do it. they've destroyed the beef trade and but for the Northern trade you'd be ****ed. I thought you yourself learnt a strong lesson last year but seemingly not.
Or maybe you expect others to take on the factories while you sit back because that's what it's starting to look like. You've either got sense or you too have lost your balls and watching in admiration.
Are you that sad that you can't see that a percentage of the profits from the phone deals is coming back to farmers same as from FBD and IFJ.

The blockades last year resulted in the QA bonus scheme being increased and also extended to 36-month old cattle. For the first time it put real fear into factories about farmers' power, and belatedly led to the IFA complaining to the Competition Authority about cartels operating in the industry. Are you sad that you can't see that?

wrangler

MfMan wrote: »

The blockades last year resulted in the QA bonus scheme being increased and also extended to 36-month old cattle. For the first time it put real fear into factories about farmers' power, and belatedly led to the IFA complaining to the Competition Authority about cartels operating in the industry. Are you sad that you can't see that?

Bonuses mean nothing if the base price is kept down, we get great bonuses on our lambs but look where the base price quoted from Camolin is every week.
IFA is forever on to CPPC since they were fined in 2001, Don't ever think factories are afraid of you, I've been through a lot more wars than you with them.
They'll let you rot at the gates before they give in