2020 the battle of the septuagenarians - Trump vs Biden, Part 2

xgronkjabv6pcl

sydthebeat wrote: »

.

8/13 is EXTREMELY short in a 2 horse race

No it's not.

8/13 is effectively saying the probability he wins is approx 62%.
That is not particularly short in any race; two or otherwise.

All else equal, Biden will continue to shorten in the coming weeks as people become more confident in the polling data.

There's a scepticism that exists around polling data given what it suggested in 2016 and Brexit but those fears will dissipate if the gap remains as big closer to polling day.

8/13 may very well end up as relatively close to the longest odds between now and then.

Carfacemandog

HDMI wrote: »

Sure Antifa isn't a group, all these people just happen to turn up with truck loads of weapons with no organization. I think the residents of Portland would disagree.

If Antifa is an organised group, then who is it's leader/leaders?

The Proud Boys leader for example was Gavin McInnes who also founded it, but is now Enrique Tarrio with its leadership group (which they refer to as 'elders') consisting of Harry Fox, Heath Hair, Patrick William Roberts, Joshua Hall, Timothy Kelly, Luke Rofhling and Rufio Panman.

So how about Antifa?

francois

Will the accusations of mental impairment still be continuing today? Or will it be an earpiece narrative?

bobbyy gee

Trump has wanted the election to be about anything but the coronavirus pandemic, but he couldn’t outrun reality on the debate stage.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/election-2020/ct-trump-biden-debate-takeaways-20200930-pi4ffwsgjzau7px46qqfvo4svm-story.html

namloc1980

francois wrote: »

Will the accusations of mental impairment still be continuing today? Or will it be an earpiece narrative?

The early talking points are that Chris Wallace was soft on Biden and very hard on poor Donald.

All those posters who said that Biden would be incoherent and a demented mess and might not even show up will be scrambling around for talking points today.

alchemist33

namloc1980 wrote: »

The early talking points are that Chris Wallace was soft on Biden and very hard on poor Donald.

All those posters who said that Biden would be incoherent and a demented mess and might not even show up will be scrambling around for talking points today.

Genuinely curious - posters who repeatedly claimed Biden had dementia, what do you think now? He has faked a cure, never had it, or gave the performance of a man with dementia?

namloc1980

alchemist33 wrote: »

Genuinely curious - posters who repeatedly claimed Biden had dementia, what do you think now? He has faked a cure, never had it, or gave the performance of a man with dementia?

They fully swallowed the Trump campaign lies and believed all the manipulated videos on social media.

Playing the narrative that Biden was demented and incoherent was a huge error by the Trump campaign. They tried to redirect in the last few days with the drugs and earpiece nonsense.

Trumpists on here were told this repeatedly but they continued the mantra of their dear leader that Biden has dementia. As I say they are scrambling for fresh talking points this morning.

HDMI

Carfacemandog wrote: »

If Antifa is an organised group, then who is it's leader/leaders?

The Proud Boys leader for example was Gavin McInnes who also founded it, but is now Enrique Tarrio with its leadership group (which they refer to as 'elders') consisting of Harry Fox, Heath Hair, Patrick William Roberts, Joshua Hall, Timothy Kelly, Luke Rofhling and Rufio Panman.

So how about Antifa?

I couldn't have named any from the right wing so fair play to you.

Just like the right wing which I am sure there is more than one group, my guess is Antifa is a bunch of smaller groups with maybe less obvious leaders willing to step forward but that doesn't mean they don't exist. Someone is funding them and someone is directing them, to suggest otherwise is just foolish.

francois

HDMI wrote: »

Someone is funding them and someone is directing them, to suggest otherwise is just foolish.

"someone"

Carfacemandog

HDMI wrote: »

I couldn't have named any from the right wing so fair play to you.

Just like the right wing which I am sure there is more than one group, my guess is Antifa is a bunch of smaller groups with maybe less obvious leaders willing to step forward but that doesn't mean they don't exist. Someone is funding them and someone is directing them to suggest otherwise is just foolish.

The right wing is more thanine group. The left wing is too. But the proud boys are not more tha one group and are an organisation with a set chain of command and leadership structure rather than an ideology, and their leadership is extremely easy to find with a Google search. If Antifa is the same, then it should also be easy to find who their overall leadership group is.

It's not that Antifa do not exist, it's that they are an ideological movement rather than a unified and defined, singular organised group.

osarusan

Sounds like I was lucky I was fast asleep for the whole thing.

HDMI

Carfacemandog wrote: »

It's not that Antifa do not exist, it's that they are an ideological movement rather than a unified and defined, singular organised group.

Maybe being on the receiving end of their behaviour might make one feel that that they are less ideological and just as thuggish and violent as their right wing buddies.

MeMen2_MoRi_

What happens when you buy love...

https://twitter.com/nowthisnews/status/1311187188164579333?s=09

walshb

DraftDodger wrote: »

My God what a stinking turd of a "debate" that was. If this is the best the American political system can up with then they are absolutely fcuked going forward. An utter embarrassment

Truly despicable spectacle...

The U.S. really is a basket case!

RIGOLO

Great debate.
TRump summed it up in this one liner - "Ive done more in 47 months than you done in 47 years "
Trump wins the debate he trounced Chris Wallace ohh and he beat the other guy too.
Voters have one major issue , it’s the economy , and Trump trounced him on the economy segment.
Poor old Joe was using the podium to keep himself upright as Trump hammered him on China stealing his lunch.

Great points for Trump to get Hunters corruption out into the open. Media have ignored the story, but now the voters know .
Very biased questioning and it was plain to see Wallace helping Joe by leading him in the question.
Race issue and violence segment and the question is posed in reference to an event in Charlottsville from 3 years ago, instead of phrasing the question in terms of whats going on right here right now, 100+ days of constant violent protests in Portland and Wallace asks about Charlottsville.
Joe lost the race-relations segment hands down.
Trump was able to list huge endorsments from law and order side .
Trump destroyed him on law and order , Joe tried to divert to Covid as the left don’t have any stance on law and order.

Wonder how much Wallace was paid off. Everytime Joe was struggling Wallace had to come in and move along before Joe lost it completely.
As Trump asked Joe to name one law and order group that has come out to endorse him, joe started mumbling and then Wallace came to his defence but moving the debate along.

The order of the questioning ended up suiting Trump.
Leading with Covid segment but ending on economy and race relations .
Any patriotic American only heard one candidate standing up for Americas core values and will vote Trump.
I guess Chris Wallace has had his critical race theory .
Joe thinks Antifa is an idea and not an ideology , must be ideological bricks flying thru the shop windows and ideological fires burning buisnesses down.
Wallace saves Joe from disaster by only allowing points to be made on right wing groups but dis-allowed any in depth statements to be made on antifa/radical left, cos he knew Biden was going to bury himself if he had to defend the protests.

Obama left 128 judicial openings for Trump to fill… wow that’s an interesting factoid. Nice of Trump to thank Biden and Obama to leave him that gift.

What a segment.
The more Biden tried to defend his cocaine taking dishonourably discharged un qualified son Hunter, who ended up getting millions for sitting on a corrupt Ukrainian energy company whilst Joe Biden was VP the more voters woke up. The main stream media have tried to bury and ignore this story but not more voters will ask about this and have second thoughts.

Trump won the climate change segment. He destroyed the left , using California as an example. No forest management , you get widespread fires. Like all things Trump solution is roll up the sleeves and do some work, the left solution is bring out the bongo drums and hope the pixie fairies take care of it all.

Joe lost crucial swing state votes, doesn’t he realise coal country is swing state country and he states there will be NO investment in coal. Bye bye to those votes.

The US president has to deal with the leaders of the free and not so free world, the tough men of the world. After this debate few Americans would consider that Biden is a better President to fight Americas corner in any global discussions.

Joe lost a lot of ‘The Squads’ radical left, Joe says he doest support ‘The Green New Deal’ .. has his master AOC being informed.

TRump 1 - Chris Wallace & Joe Biden 0

Harry Palmr

Let's get to the most important thing, did Biden take a toilet break?

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

Jaysus. We all know what Trump is like but I didn’t know what Biden was like until last night. Is that the best candidate they could come up with, simply awful.

Dillonb3

Just saw clips of the debate and I dont have much hope in Steve Scully in moderating it more effectively in the next one

Cody montana

Dana Perino's debate verdict: 'Biden cleared the very low bar that had been set for him'
Senior political analyst Brit Hume compares Trump to 'bucking bronco' on debate stage

From fix news website.
They are the ones who set the bar low.

MeMen2_MoRi_

RIGOLO wrote: »

Great debate.
TRump summed it up in this one liner - "Ive done more in 47 months than you done in 47 years "
Trump wins the debate he trounced Chris Wallace ohh and he beat the other guy too.
Voters have one major issue , it’s the economy , and Trump trounced him on the economy segment.
Poor old Joe was using the podium to keep himself upright as Trump hammered him on China stealing his lunch.

Great points for Trump to get Hunters corruption out into the open. Media have ignored the story, but now the voters know .
Very biased questioning and it was plain to see Wallace helping Joe by leading him in the question.
Race issue and violence segment and the question is posed in reference to an event in Charlottsville from 3 years ago, instead of phrasing the question in terms of whats going on right here right now, 100+ days of constant violent protests in Portland and Wallace asks about Charlottsville.
Joe lost the race-relations segment hands down.
Trump was able to list huge endorsments from law and order side .
Trump destroyed him on law and order , Joe tried to divert to Covid as the left don’t have any stance on law and order.

Wonder how much Wallace was paid off. Everytime Joe was struggling Wallace had to come in and move along before Joe lost it completely.
As Trump asked Joe to name one law and order group that has come out to endorse him, joe started mumbling and then Wallace came to his defence but moving the debate along.

The order of the questioning ended up suiting Trump.
Leading with Covid segment but ending on economy and race relations .
Any patriotic American only heard one candidate standing up for Americas core values and will vote Trump.
I guess Chris Wallace has had his critical race theory .
Joe thinks Antifa is an idea and not an ideology , must be ideological bricks flying thru the shop windows and ideological fires burning buisnesses down.
Wallace saves Joe from disaster by only allowing points to be made on right wing groups but dis-allowed any in depth statements to be made on antifa/radical left, cos he knew Biden was going to bury himself if he had to defend the protests.

Obama left 128 judicial openings for Trump to fill… wow that’s an interesting factoid. Nice of Trump to thank Biden and Obama to leave him that gift.

What a segment.
The more Biden tried to defend his cocaine taking dishonourably discharged un qualified son Hunter, who ended up getting millions for sitting on a corrupt Ukrainian energy company whilst Joe Biden was VP the more voters woke up. The main stream media have tried to bury and ignore this story but not more voters will ask about this and have second thoughts.

Trump won the climate change segment. He destroyed the left , using California as an example. No forest management , you get widespread fires. Like all things Trump solution is roll up the sleeves and do some work, the left solution is bring out the bongo drums and hope the pixie fairies take care of it all.

Joe lost crucial swing state votes, doesn’t he realise coal country is swing state country and he states there will be NO investment in coal. Bye bye to those votes.

The US president has to deal with the leaders of the free and not so free world, the tough men of the world. After this debate few Americans would consider that Biden is a better President to fight Americas corner in any global discussions.

Joe lost a lot of ‘The Squads’ radical left, Joe says he doest support ‘The Green New Deal’ .. has his master AOC being informed.

TRump 1 - Chris Wallace & Joe Biden 0

Here you go...

https://twitter.com/AOC/status/1311133187251359744?s=19

RIGOLO

Cody montana wrote: »

Dana Perino's debate verdict: 'Biden cleared the very low bar that had been set for him'
Senior political analyst Brit Hume compares Trump to 'bucking bronco' on debate stage

From fix news website.
They are the ones who set the bar low.

Is this the FOX NEWS your talking about ...
the one that just broke TV HISTORY record ratings

For the first time ever, a cable network has outperformed the legacy broadcast networks in prime time—the most valuable real estate on television—for an entire broadcast quarter. Fox News Channel ended the third quarter of 2020 as the most-watched network in all of TV with an average total audience of 3.507 million viewers—up 44 percent from the same period one year ago, according to ratings data compiled by Nielsen.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/markjoyella/2020/09/29/hannity-has-highest-rated-quarter-in-history-as-fox-news-beats-broadcast-networks-a-tv-first/

must be lonely watching main stream news and fake news, knowing your a dwindling audience and more people are flipping the channel.

Fiery mutant

The big loser for me was Chris Wallace. Couldn’t control the debate from the get go, should have cut Trumps mic when he started going off. Biden should have known what Trump was gonna be like, and avoid the frustration.

The thing is this is Trumps only way, he will perform like this in the final 2 debates. Whereas I think Biden will adapt better, and the other two moderators will want to be more assertive in their control.

ohnonotgmail

RIGOLO wrote: »

Is this the FOX NEWS your talking about ...
the one that just broke TV HISTORY record ratings



https://www.forbes.com/sites/markjoyella/2020/09/29/hannity-has-highest-rated-quarter-in-history-as-fox-news-beats-broadcast-networks-a-tv-first/

must be lonely watching main stream news and fake news, knowing your a dwindling audience and more people are flipping the channel.

there is no accounting for taste

Quin_Dub

HDMI wrote: »

Maybe being on the receiving end of their behaviour might make one feel that that they are less ideological and just as thuggish and violent as their right wing buddies.

Ì think a good analogy is Football Holligans.

Antifa are "Football Hooligans" , the Proud Boys etc. are The Chelsea Headhunters.

Antifa is a generic grouping describing people with a similar mindset but without any kind of specific organised command structure.

Whereas The Proud Boys , The Three Percenters etc. all have structured national leaderships with a clear "chain of command" from Local level through to National.

Are there organised groups within Antifa? Almost certainly , but they are individual localised grouping , none of them roll up to a regional or National command Structure.

RIGOLO

Hunky Monster wrote: »

Jaysus. We all know what Trump is like but I didn’t know what Biden was like until last night. Is that the best candidate they could come up with, simply awful.

cmon go easy on the left, havent you heard everyone gets a prize in their world.

They only had 4 years , $4 billion dollars, 24x7 main stream media backing, and 3rd level institutional academia in their corner to prepare for this .

The will get it right one of these days or not

extra gravy

Just finished watching, thought Biden finished strongly after a tentative start. He coped fairly well with Trump's rudeness and continuous interruptions. No gaffes, toilet breaks or any signs of the dementia that we've all been hearing about from the Trump fangirls. I'd call it a successful night's work.

Beechwoodspark

trump acted like an ignorant bollix - no great shock there

His base will lap it up

Doubt he managed to win over many swing voters though

D.Q

Irish people that find themselves entrenched on either side of this debate really need to take a long hard look at themselves.

It's pathetic.

gmisk

RIGOLO wrote: »

Is this the FOX NEWS your talking about ...
the one that just broke TV HISTORY record ratings



https://www.forbes.com/sites/markjoyella/2020/09/29/hannity-has-highest-rated-quarter-in-history-as-fox-news-beats-broadcast-networks-a-tv-first/

must be lonely watching main stream news and fake news, knowing your a dwindling audience and more people are flipping the channel.

So you are trying to say viewing figures are a true sign
of the quality and trust worthiness of a news source?...come on now.
That is like trump boasting about his viewing figures for the covid press conferences... laughable

pjohnson

As expected, jusg looking at the two if you were told one has dementia and to guess which one it was, 90% of people wouldn't have picked Biden.