An argument for upgrading the Waterford-Limerick railway(or at least part of it)

ohographite

https://www.offalyexpress.ie/news/home/600741/irish-rail-publishes-revised-timetable-to-operate-on-rail-network-from-monday.html

According to this article, this railway and the Limerick-Nenagh-Ballybrophy railway will have suspended services from Monday the 11th of January until further notice.

end of the road

same happened last time during the lock down as we know.

Curb Your Enthusiasm

ohographite wrote: »

https://www.offalyexpress.ie/news/home/600741/irish-rail-publishes-revised-timetable-to-operate-on-rail-network-from-monday.html

According to this article, this railway and the Limerick-Nenagh-Ballybrophy railway will have suspended services from Monday the 11th of January until further notice.

Irish Rail said 'engineering works' - bs most likely

L1011

There were four people on my four car normally crush capacity train on Tuesday evening; on the train I transfers to which usually has well over 100 left on it at the end there were 6 on Wednesday.

If those are the loadings on traditionally incredibly busy services I suspect these trains would be moving air during L5.

end of the road

fair point, but if they are going to operate the network with very low numbers it should be it all.
i suppose at least they are actually telling people about the suspensions, which is something.

ohographite

A few weeks ago I made a timetable which I posted on this thread, which I thought would be reasonable to ask for on the Waterford-Limerick railway. I changed this timetable in response to what some posts said about the timetable. For example, I eliminated the direct train from Carrick-on-Suir to Dublin via Limerick Junction. I also recall a post saying there was no train leaving Waterford between 15:40 and 18:30, which meant that it wouldn't suit people travelling home from work in Waterford. I added in a train which leaves Waterford at 17:25 and serves only Carrick-on-Suir, and then returns to Waterford, arriving there at 18:22. Since the line has only 1 passing loop at Clonmel, I wasn't able to figure out a way to have a train leaving Waterford for Limerick at peak time without getting stuck for a long time in Clonmel, waiting for a train from Limerick to pass. I was mainly making this timetable to see what could be achieved without increasing speeds or reinstating passing loops on the line, but I now think that both speed increases and loops are needed so that trains are able to run at the most convenient times.

I also considered the capacity between Limerick Junction and Limerick city, so I timed trains to run on this section of track at the same time as a Limerick-Limerick junction shuttle train already does in the normal timetable(I mean the everyday timetable that was in operation before the lockdown timetable beginning today).

Does anyone here know what kind of investment would be required to implement this timetable? I know you would need a few trains dedicated to the line, and you would need to send the people who man the level crossing gates to work a bit earlier in the morning and a bit later in the evening.
Would anything else be required?

goingnowhere

Its a good start

1. Late evening demand is zero so you have 2 empty trains
2. No reasonable AM arrival time in Waterford, need a 0830 arrival if you want the commuting business

Cost wise you have doubled the staff cost in one go as it currently manages to get away with a single shift

cml387

Curb Your Enthusiasm wrote: »

Irish Rail said 'engineering works' - bs most likely

The sign up on Clonmel Sation confirms the closure is Covid related.

ohographite

I made a third timetable which can be achieved on this railway with the current speeds and one passing loop in Clonmel. This was partly in response to the feedback I got on the previous one. I have removed the train on the previous timetable which departed Waterford for Limerick at 20:50.
I kept the train that departed Limerick for Waterford at 20:10(moving it back to 19:54) because it connects with a Dublin to Cork train that departs Dublin at 19:00, and the previous train from Dublin connecting with a Limerick-Waterford train departs Dublin at 17:00, which I think is a bit too early for some people from South Tipperary on day trips in Dublin or going to college in Dublin*. That's why I kept the later train.

Also, there were posts on this thread saying the early morning train into Waterford arrived too early for commuters, and I don't think that can change without an additional passing loop, or without timing the early morning train into Limerick to arrive too early or too late for commuters instead. However, I added in a train from Carrick-on-Suir to Waterford that arrives at Waterford at 08:35, which I think would be better for commuters.

The timetable has 6 Waterford-Limerick trains each way, as well as 2 Carrick-Waterford trains each way. I think that implementing this timetable would require dedicating 3 trains to the Waterford-Limerick railway all day. On the timetable I have marked them A, B and C to show how they can be rostered.
A less ambitious ask would be to remove the 07:40 Waterford-Carrick, the 08:08 Carrick-Waterford, the 09:35 Waterford-Limerick and the 12:50 Limerick-Waterford, because that way, train C would only be dedicated to the railway after 15:45 each day, so it could be used elsewhere on the rail network earlier in the day.

*I am aware that a full-time college student living in south Tipperary couldn't travel to college in the morning using the railway with this timetable, but if they have accomodation in Dublin, and if there is an evening train that takes them to Dublin the day before, they can use it.

tabbey

You propose a 0935 departure from Waterford, eleven minutes before the arrival of a train from Dublin. That is not the best.

ohographite

If a new platform was built in Limerick Junction, on the line to Waterford just east of the Dublin-Cork mainline, would it shorten the journey time from Waterford to Limerick Junction if trains stopped on such a platform?
I know that when the service was in operation, Waterford-LimerickJunction trains stopped on the bay platform parallel to the Dublin-Cork mainline, and when arriving at the junction from Waterford, they had to first cross the mainline and stop west of the junction, and then turn back to stop on the bay platform.
If trains were able to stop just east of the mainline, they wouldn't have to go to the bay platform, so would it be realistic to expect that this would shorten the journey time by about 5 minutes?

Isambard

it took about 150 years to get a "second" platform, don't hold your breath for a third

tabbey

ohographite wrote: »

If a new platform was built in Limerick Junction, on the line to Waterford just east of the Dublin-Cork mainline, would it shorten the journey time from Waterford to Limerick Junction if trains stopped on such a platform?
I know that when the service was in operation, Waterford-LimerickJunction trains stopped on the bay platform parallel to the Dublin-Cork mainline, and when arriving at the junction from Waterford, they had to first cross the mainline and stop west of the junction, and then turn back to stop on the bay platform.
If trains were able to stop just east of the mainline, they wouldn't have to go to the bay platform, so would it be realistic to expect that this would shorten the journey time by about 5 minutes?

Yes it would save about five minutes, but it would require a substantial realignment of the line from where it is crossed by the n 24 road, effectively a new railway of maybe half a mile.
Compared to the billions spent on new roads, it's not a lot, but probably would not get through the layers of penpushers in the national transport authority and department of public expenditure.
It might be worth raising with the minister for transport, as the current minister is a green and thus more pro rail than previous ministers

mrsoundie

Things may be changing at Irish Rail (link)

Del.Monte

mrsoundie wrote: »

Things may be changing at Irish Rail (link)

Slow news day - nothing will ever change at CIE/IE.

ohographite

tabbey wrote: »

Yes it would save about five minutes, but it would require a substantial realignment of the line from where it is crossed by the n 24 road, effectively a new railway of maybe half a mile.
Compared to the billions spent on new roads, it's not a lot, but probably would not get through the layers of penpushers in the national transport authority and department of public expenditure.
It might be worth raising with the minister for transport, as the current minister is a green and thus more pro rail than previous ministers

Do you mean realignment of the line between Limerick junction and the point on the edge of Tipperary town where the line crosses the n24?
It looks like it's harder than I thought to stick in a new platform. I had the notion that a platform could've just been built alongside the existing line without any realignment.

tabbey

ohographite wrote: »

Do you mean realignment of the line between Limerick junction and the point on the edge of Tipperary town where the line crosses the n24?
It looks like it's harder than I thought to stick in a new platform. I had the notion that a platform could've just been built alongside the existing line without any realignment.

You could provide a new platform on the existing route near the crossing but passengers would then have to walk to the platforms on the mainline. The extra walking time would counteract the train time saved. During wet weather passengers would also get wet and complaints would rise.

ExoPolitic

Del.Monte wrote: »

Slow news day - nothing will ever change at CIE/IE.

Agreed, it is a statement to provide goodwill to CIE/IE and nothing more.