Dairy Chitchat 4, an udder new thread.

GrasstoMilk

Gillespy wrote: »

Two years is plenty if the heifer has had a good life. An extra month or two can make a world of difference if they are a bit light. Three year old heifers is fine for heifers that would be way too small to calve at 24 months. Carrying a good heifer an extra year can backfire if they start getting fat. 30 months is probably ideal. Heifer are that bit stronger and more mature and can be great milkers in the first year.

That's why you push then hard to grow the frame so that they're well able to eat lots and milk well
3 year old heifers never last here, always too fat

Say my name

GrasstoMilk wrote: »

That's why you push then hard to grow the frame so that they're well able to eat lots and milk well
3 year old heifers never last here, always too fat

Same here. Even a 26 month at calving can be harder to go back in calf than the 24 month.
Not a concern for ayr calving though. Ayr calving hides lots..:pac:

Buford T. Justice XIX

GrasstoMilk wrote: »

They were 3 year olds calving down ?

You'd do well to get 700e off a dealer atm I would say
100e of meal will do alot on them
Did the same last year and got 900e and beef price wasnt as good

Once I get a heifer calf off them, I'll be happy enough. Most will go back in calf and stay in the herd from my experience here.

Expanding a small bit this year again so not going buying in just for numbers. I'd prefer to use my own and work around any problems until I have enough for voluntary culling again.

Panch18

Say my name wrote: »

Same here. Even a 26 month at calving can be harder to go back in calf than the 24 month.
Not a concern for ayr calving though. Ayr calving hides lots..:pac:

Not sure i would say AYR hides a lot - its just a different outlook

Like if a cow doesn't calve by April 1st in AYR - does it really matter? not at all. So in many ways its less rigid which can mean less costly.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Just did a grass walk now, bloody melting. I don't think I could have drunk the amount of water that's running off me atm:)

Timmaay

Panch18 wrote: »

Not sure i would say AYR hides a lot - its just a different outlook

Like if a cow doesn't calve by April 1st in AYR - does it really matter? not at all. So in many ways its less rigid which can mean less costly.

I'd argue that in the largely single fulltime labour unit farm, where that labour unit actually puts a value on all hours worked, ayr calving will significantly add cost, and almost definitely make the job unsustainable. And I'm not saying that compact calving as an alternative is without any faults, that same labour unit needs to be well setup coming into the spring for a tough workload for them. But having being through both systems (well 2bh I still calf from late Jan to June, but 80% in 6wks), I would take the compact calving "rigid" system anyday over ayr and significantly more groups of animals, being on call for calving, more breeding seasons, scanning, extra feeding, and significantly more tied down to milkings.

Say my name

Panch18 wrote: »

Not sure i would say AYR hides a lot - its just a different outlook

Like if a cow doesn't calve by April 1st in AYR - does it really matter? not at all. So in many ways its less rigid which can mean less costly.

Ah it does.
As you say there's no time limit on calving. So fertility won't be bred for. And before people jump down my throat by that I mean in spring systems you're in a strict time period and outside of that they're culled. So every year fertility is better and bred for.
Not blowing my own trumpet but I've been in the spring system for forever and any that don't make that spring calving window are gone. Calving @ 2 year old with CI of 356.
I've bought in stock at times over the years and they never compare to your own stock. Bought five cows last year and only 2 carried over into the next year.
It's hard to get other farmers with the same breeding criteria and culling strategy as yourself with stock.
Everyone has their own ideas.

Acquiescence

Buford T. Justice XIX wrote: »

Just did a grass walk now, bloody melting. I don't think I could have drunk the amount of water that's running off me atm:)

I had to buy boots recently and the way the year is going I said I'd get thermals now and gamble it.

It was a mistake.

Panch18

Timmaay wrote: »

I'd argue that in the largely single fulltime labour unit farm, where that labour unit actually puts a value on all hours worked, ayr calving will significantly add cost, and almost definitely make the job unsustainable. And I'm not saying that compact calving as an alternative is without any faults, that same labour unit needs to be well setup coming into the spring for a tough workload for them. But having being through both systems (well 2bh I still calf from late Jan to June, but 80% in 6wks), I would take the compact calving "rigid" system anyday over ayr and significantly more groups of animals, being on call for calving, more breeding seasons, scanning, extra feeding, and significantly more tied down to milkings.

a 120 cow herd - is it harder calving 12 cows every month for 10 months of the year or calving 70 cows in Feb, 35 in March and 15 in April?

Also far less demand for calving resources such as calving pens, calf sheds etc, 15 calves on hand all the time verus what 100 in March April

Panch18

Say my name wrote: »

Ah it does.
As you say there's no time limit on calving. So fertility won't be bred for. And before people jump down my throat by that I mean in spring systems you're in a strict time period and outside of that they're culled. So every year fertility is better and bred for.
Not blowing my own trumpet but I've been in the spring system for forever and any that don't make that spring calving window are gone. Calving @ 2 year old with CI of 356.
I've bought in stock at times over the years and they never compare to your own stock. Bought five cows last year and only 2 carried over into the next year.
It's hard to get other farmers with the same breeding criteria and culling strategy as yourself with stock.
Everyone has their own ideas.

Spring calving here as well for longer than i can remember, and i was born in the 70's.

What is the cost of culling say a 3rd laction cow because she has slipped a few weeks?

mahoney_j

Panch18 wrote: »

a 120 cow herd - is it harder calving 12 cows every month for 10 months of the year or calving 70 cows in Feb, 35 in March and 15 in April?

Also far less demand for calving resources such as calving pens, calf sheds etc, 15 calves on hand all the time verus what 100 in March April

I’d much prefer calve from late January to early April calving a number every month is just relentless constant calf rearing ,shed work breeding etc in a compact calving scenarios u can syich your self up for it get sheds ready labour organised and get good routine going

mahoney_j

Panch18 wrote: »

Spring calving here as well for longer than i can remember, and i was born in the 70's.

What is the cost of culling say a 3rd laction cow because she has slipped a few weeks?

Good question ended up with more empties than I’d like and lost 3 of my best cows ,I thought about milking thru ....but I’m too lazy those cows will never be replaced

alps

Buford T. Justice XIX wrote: »

Just did a grass walk now, bloody melting. I don't think I could have drunk the amount of water that's running off me atm:)

Went to Tralee earlier..stopped in Ballyseedy for brunch..

The place was packed...everyone eating outside...its still high summer down your way..

Great part of the world to farm (if you've a nice piece of ground)

Say my name

Panch18 wrote: »

Spring calving here as well for longer than i can remember, and i was born in the 70's.

What is the cost of culling say a 3rd laction cow because she has slipped a few weeks?

Cost nothing.

You'll have the same number of proper culls that you can fatten in a static year on year herd number and you'll have your compact calving with cows reaching up to 12 - 15 years of age.
Culling for fertility in that timeframe covers for a myriad other reasons why that cow never went in calf. So culling is based on those reasons too and out of the herd.

straight

Buford T. Justice XIX wrote: »

Just did a grass walk now, bloody melting. I don't think I could have drunk the amount of water that's running off me atm:)

Same here. Conditions are excellent, it some turnaround from the storms. I love this time of year when the weather is good. Grass is after turning a very dark green around here.

blackdog1

mahoney_j wrote: »

I’d much prefer calve from late January to early April calving a number every month is just relentless constant calf rearing ,shed work breeding etc in a compact calving scenarios u can syich your self up for it get sheds ready labour organised and get good routine going

Can't beat calving in September/October. Cows outside. Calves clean and healthy. No bedding or silage feeding. Just have a well setup paddock or 3 Close to the housing so if you have to bring them in you can. As long as you calve in 2 tight blocks your fine. Scan autumn traditional way and spring calves with milk recording. Breeding season is longer but you get used to it. Biggest problem is milking 365 and feeding diets. They're are plenty of advantages too. Extra cents per litre. Less calving and calf space needed and if something goes wrong your not under too much pressure.

GrasstoMilk

Panch18 wrote: »

a 120 cow herd - is it harder calving 12 cows every month for 10 months of the year or calving 70 cows in Feb, 35 in March and 15 in April?

Also far less demand for calving resources such as calving pens, calf sheds etc, 15 calves on hand all the time verus what 100 in March April

Been there done that, hated it
If things go right for us here next year we'll have what number we're going to milk for the year calved by the last days of March and wont be breeding till the 3rd week of April
We were autumn calving 30 odd cows up till 3 years ago and it was just relentless, no break at all.
It's been nice and easy going here all summer and we've enjoyed it

3 the square

Nothing like a milk cheque every few weeks in fairness..

jaymla627

Panch18 wrote: »

a 120 cow herd - is it harder calving 12 cows every month for 10 months of the year or calving 70 cows in Feb, 35 in March and 15 in April?

Also far less demand for calving resources such as calving pens, calf sheds etc, 15 calves on hand all the time verus what 100 in March April

All depends on the level of help you have, the lads that love spring calving usually still have the ole chap around doing a good days work, take the family labour away and make the show a one man band and the wheels quickly come of the wagon

Say my name

jaymla627 wrote: »

All depends on the level of help you have, the lads that love spring calving usually still have the ole chap around doing a good days work, take the family labour away and make the show a one man band and the wheels quickly come of the wagon

Ah I'd say the lads or lassies with paid help like it too.

Buford T. Justice XIX

alps wrote: »

Went to Tralee earlier..stopped in Ballyseedy for brunch..

The place was packed...everyone eating outside...its still high summer down your way..

Great part of the world to farm (if you've a nice piece of ground)

There's some tough ground either side of the road there once it rains. And over the hill on your right as you go into town is heavy ground and takes its time drying out. I worked on a dairy farm there for a few months and we weren't allowed take the tractor into the paddocks to bring in the cows. Out and walk all round the field waking the cows in the morning and get them moving on the way back. And ground was dry then.

whelan2

blackdog1 wrote: »

Can't beat calving in September/October. Cows outside. Calves clean and healthy. No bedding or silage feeding. Just have a well setup paddock or 3 Close to the housing so if you have to bring them in you can. As long as you calve in 2 tight blocks your fine. Scan autumn traditional way and spring calves with milk recording. Breeding season is longer but you get used to it. Biggest problem is milking 365 and feeding diets. They're are plenty of advantages too. Extra cents per litre. Less calving and calf space needed and if something goes wrong your not under too much pressure.

All is good when things go ok. Had a cow calved in calving paddock last night. She point blank refused to come out of the paddock this evening, I had brought calf in first. Was a calf with colic also. Young lad went for cows at 3pm and first cow arrived at parlour at 4.25. I was to be at football at 5.30 which didnt happen

blackdog1

jaymla627 wrote: »

All depends on the level of help you have, the lads that love spring calving usually still have the ole chap around doing a good days work, take the family labour away and make the show a one man band and the wheels quickly come of the wagon

I think that applies to all systems Jay labour is a huge problem. Only difference is it tends to be easier to get help in the winter months as demand isn't they're. Everyone wants help from Jan-April.

blackdog1

whelan2 wrote: »

All is good when things go ok. Had a cow calved in calving paddock last night. She point blank refused to come out of the paddock this evening, I had brought calf in first. Was a calf with colic also. Young lad went for cows at 3pm and first cow arrived at parlour at 4.25. I was to be at football at 5.30 which didnt happen

Your always going to have trouble cows. What I'm saying is calves and cows are much healthier calving outside... Weather permitting.

jaymla627

blackdog1 wrote: »

I think that applies to all systems Jay labour is a huge problem. Only difference is it tends to be easier to get help in the winter months as demand isn't they're. Everyone wants help from Jan-April.

It's the sheer hours required in them few months that's my issue, I can work away perfect calving around 30 cows a month here on my own, anymore and the workload with calves becomes to much instead of a 12 hour workday your into a 16 hour day and then fatigue becomes a major issue you just end up burning yourself out

straight

You can do whatever system you want but none of them will make you rich so just do whatever suits you. I have to have 6 weeks around Christmas without milking if only for the sake of my marriage

Castlekeeper

Buford T. Justice XIX wrote: »

There's some tough ground either side of the road there once it rains. And over the hill on your right as you go into town is heavy ground and takes its time drying out. I worked on a dairy farm there for a few months and we weren't allowed take the tractor into the paddocks to bring in the cows. Out and walk all round the field waking the cows in the morning and get them moving on the way back. And ground was dry then.

That'd be normal around our area too. Never heard of anyone in these parishes taking the tractor for the cows, you'd wreck fields barring a heatwave. It's a bad old habit anyway for man and beast.

tismesoitis

How are cows performing? 18.3litres @ 4.24fat and 3.63 protein 3.5kgs meal being fed. All heifers.

straight

jaymla627 wrote: »

It's the sheer hours required in them few months that's my issue, I can work away perfect calving around 30 cows a month here on my own, anymore and the workload with calves becomes to much instead of a 12 hour workday your into a 16 hour day and then fatigue becomes a major issue you just end up burning yourself out

The co-ops are running Lean courses now. I'd say you'd get all that work done in about 24 hours a week. You'd probably have to take on a full time job to cope with the boredom. And then you could accept even less money for your milk.

GrasstoMilk

tismesoitis wrote: »

How are cows performing? 18.3litres @ 4.24fat and 3.63 protein 3.5kgs meal being fed. All heifers.

18.3l 5.25bf 4.08pr 3kg meal