Electricity supplier

slave1

unkel wrote: »

Just off the phone to Energia and they have switched me to a new contract starting today, on the EV plan. No penalties for switching for anyone already on an Energia contract.

Day rate 16.64c (was 14.22c) and night rate 4.79c (was 6.82c) all rates including VAT. Standing charges stay the same

This means that this plan will only save you money if at least 55% of your electricity units are used at night. With 8MWh consumption per year, 60% will save you €20, 75% willl save you €75 and 95% will save you nearly €150

And of course night electricity is much better for the environment as a vastly higher percentage of it is from renewables

If you have a battery, or plan to buy one, this plan will accelerate its pay back period.

Good stuff, I'm in same boat but going to wait until FIT comes in July 1st as I'll be closer to out of contract then.

ted1

JimmyVik wrote: »

I have night <7c unit, Day <15c unit with Energia.

I dont think the consumer is going to win with smart meter tariffs. It will end up as confusing as mobile phone and health insurance plans.

After 12 months your supplier will advise you which tariff is best suited , like the way banks now do with mortgages.

liamog

ted1 wrote: »

After 12 months your supplier will advise you which tariff is best suited , like the way banks now do with mortgages.

Did you miss the sarcasm mark there, I've only seen banks roll you on to a standard rate variable instead of actively selling you a better deal.

KCross

ted1 wrote: »

After 12 months your supplier will advise you which tariff is best suited...

You are very naive if you believe that!

They will happily let you revert to standard undiscounted rates once your 12 months is up... its actually what they hope you will do. They have no interest in proactively advising you on a better tariff.

Change provider every year is the current best practice to get the best rate.

garo

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

Yes, a fully charged battery (charged up on the cheap night rate), can be used during the day to run the house, so you're not paying for more expensive daytime electricity...

Doing this though means you are cycling the battery every day, and batteries only have a finite number of times they can be cycled before degrading, and becoming less optimal. So the cost benefit of only using night rate electricity would need to be stacked up against teh cost of a battery (and probably a replacement a number of years later).

Correct. Also count the approximately 20% of loss in converting AC to DC, charging the battery and then taking energy out of the battery and converting back to AC.
LiFePO4s are supposed to have pretty long lifecycles and tolerate a high level of charge pretty well. Still when I charge at night to use during the day I leave the battery to cycle between 15-85%. This significatntly reduces battery wear for Li-Ion batteries.

ted1

liamog wrote: »

Did you miss the sarcasm mark there, I've only seen banks roll you on to a standard rate variable instead of actively selling you a better deal.

Since 2019, At the end of each year they, legally must send you a letter detailing what better rate you are eligible for.

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2019/0103/1020092-banks-now-required-to-tell-mortgage-holders-how-to-save/

ted1

KCross wrote: »

You are very naive if you believe that!

They will happily let you revert to standard undiscounted rates once your 12 months is up... its actually what they hope you will do. They have no interest in proactively advising you on a better tariff.

Change provider every year is the current best practice to get the best rate.

Banks must legally inform you if better rates if available

Electric Ireland rates don’t expire, so that’s breaking the 12 month rule.

KCross

ted1 wrote: »

Banks mist legally inform you if better rates if available

I'm talking about energy providers though.

ted1 wrote: »

Electric Ireland rates don’t expire, so that’s breaking the 12 month rule.

I dont understand what you mean there.

You signup for 12 months and get your new customer discount rate. At the end of the 12 months you get put on standard rates and if you do nothing thats where you will stay. They have no obligation to ring you, that Im aware of, to offer you a better rate.

If they are obligated can you link to that?

ted1

KCross wrote: »

I'm talking about energy providers though.



I dont understand what you mean there.

You signup for 12 months and get your new customer discount rate. At the end of the 12 months you get put on standard rates and if you do nothing thats where you will stay. They have no obligation to ring you, that Im aware of, to offer you a better rate.

If they are obligated can you link to that?

No, the electric Ireland discounts don’t expiry after 12 months. They don’t revert to standard rates. They are for all customers but just new ones

https://www.electricireland.ie/news/article/electric-ireland-rewarding-its-loyal-residential-customers


Banks don’t have an obligation to call you, they send you a letter

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.thejournal.ie/mortgage-rules-2-4080581-Jun2018/?amp=1

the_amazing_raisin

ted1 wrote: »

No, the electric Ireland discounts don’t expiry after 12 months. They don’t revert to standard rates. They are for all customers but just new ones

https://www.electricireland.ie/news/article/electric-ireland-rewarding-its-loyal-residential-customers


Banks don’t have an obligation to call you, they send you a letter

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.thejournal.ie/mortgage-rules-2-4080581-Jun2018/%3famp=1

That article is from 2016 when there were numerous price drops due to an oversupply of natural gas. EI as well as other suppliers were dropping their unit rates at that time. Since then those unit rates have increased



KCross is correct, every energy provider gives a fixed term discount to new customers which expires. If the customer doesn't sign up to another discount then they revert to the standard rate


It doesn't violate the 12 month rule because they aren't changing the unit rate, they're removing a discount which is provided at their discretion


I've been with several energy providers and only one of them have ever contacted me regarding my discount expiring. In that instance, they offered me a unit rate which was worse than the best rate they were offering new customers


The best advice is to still shop around every year and see if you can avail of cheaper rates elsewhere. Often it seems if you mention switching to your current provider they'll try to match the competitors rates

ted1

cruisey1987 wrote: »

That article is from 2016 when there were numerous price drops due to an oversupply of natural gas. EI as well as other suppliers were dropping their unit rates at that time. Since then those unit rates have increased



KCross is correct, every energy provider gives a fixed term discount to new customers which expires. If the customer doesn't sign up to another discount then they revert to the standard rate


It doesn't violate the 12 month rule because they aren't changing the unit rate, they're removing a discount which is provided at their discretion


I've been with several energy providers and only one of them have ever contacted me regarding my discount expiring. In that instance, they offered me a unit rate which was worse than the best rate they were offering new customers


The best advice is to still shop around every year and see if you can avail of cheaper rates elsewhere. Often it seems if you mention switching to your current provider they'll try to match the competitors rates

Here a recent article : https://www.electricireland.ie/news/article/electric-ireland-announce-continuity-of-supply-for-all-its-over-one-million-customers-during-level-5-of-the-plan-for-living-with-covid

In addition, Electric Ireland are the only Irish supplier to offer an enduring discount rate

Electric Ireland’s discounts do not expiry after 12 months. They are not for a fixed term.

garo

This is sounding more and more like an EI hardsell. The moratorium was put in place by the regulator:
https://www.cru.ie/covid-19-information/

EI are probably the best choice for those who couldn't be bothered ringing up every year or changing providers. But if you are reading this thread you probably don't fall in that category and going to bonkers.ie or some other price comparison website will save you money.

KCross

ted1 wrote: »

Here a recent article : https://www.electricireland.ie/news/article/electric-ireland-announce-continuity-of-supply-for-all-its-over-one-million-customers-during-level-5-of-the-plan-for-living-with-covid

In addition, Electric Ireland are the only Irish supplier to offer an enduring discount rate

Electric Ireland’s discounts do not expiry after 12 months. They are not for a fixed term.

Fair enough, EI's discount doesnt expire (any I have dealt with do) but thats still very different to what you said...

ted1 wrote: »

After 12 months your supplier will advise you which tariff is best suited...

All the providers I have used do not proactively ensure you are on the best rate unless they get wind that you are leaving... then they come calling!

I dont use EI as they were never competitive for me, which is probably why their discount doesnt expire because its expensive to begin with!

ted1

KCross wrote: »

The providers, EI included, do not proactively ensure you are on the best rate unless they get wind that you are leaving... then they come calling!

That’s in relation to the smart meters, going forward they’ll tell you what tariff you should be in. 24hour, 3 TOU, free weekend etc. The smart meter gives them all the information.

the_amazing_raisin

ted1 wrote: »

In addition, Electric Ireland are the only Irish supplier to offer an enduring discount rate

Electric Ireland’s discounts do not expiry after 12 months. They are not for a fixed term.

I'm still not convinced there's value in sticking with EI especially when it would cost me €500 more per year than the cheapest provider


It takes about 30 mins max to switch provider, to save €500 I'd say that's well worth the effort

KCross

ted1 wrote: »

That’s in relation to the smart meters, going forward they’ll tell you what tariff you should be in. 24hour, 3 TOU, free weekend etc. The smart meter gives them all the information.

Ah ok, you're making a future statement rather than saying thats how it is now. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on that so but I wont be taking the providers word for it, thats for sure!

the_amazing_raisin

Just off the phone with Energia and they said they're only willing to give me a 33% discount as opposed to the 41% one for new customers

Might need to get the missus to sign up instead

ted1

cruisey1987 wrote: »

I'm still not convinced there's value in sticking with EI especially when it would cost me €500 more per year than the cheapest provider


It takes about 30 mins max to switch provider, to save €500 I'd say that's well worth the effort

That doesn’t sound right , who are you with? How did you do the comparison?
Based on average usage, Bonkers has EI being 2euro dearer than the cheapest

the_amazing_raisin

KCross wrote: »

Ah ok, you're making a future statement rather than saying thats how it is now. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on that so but I wont be taking the providers word for it, thats for sure!

I imagine they'll only be advising you on EI plans, and not the competitiors which may be a lot cheaper


Hopefully you can view and download the usage data so you can get better insights into which plans might suit you better

Duine_Eigin

unkel wrote: »

Just off the phone to Energia and they have switched me to a new contract starting today, on the EV plan. No penalties for switching for anyone already on an Energia contract.

Day rate 16.64c (was 14.22c) and night rate 4.79c (was 6.82c) all rates including VAT. Standing charges stay the same

This means that this plan will only save you money if at least 55% of your electricity units are used at night. With 8MWh consumption per year, 60% will save you €20, 75% willl save you €75 and 95% will save you nearly €150

And of course night electricity is much better for the environment as a vastly higher percentage of it is from renewables

If you have a battery, or plan to buy one, this plan will accelerate its pay back period.

Hard to know whether to switch to this plan now or wait and see what FIT tariffs become available, if any. I'm currently with Energia on the same discounted rate that you were on. There's no real benefit in switching to it now since I do very little EV charging with WFH and the heat pump won't be needed for heat or hot water from next month on (3kW PV and Eddi plus the heat pump is nearly exclusively run on night rate). I've about a 50/50 split of day/night rate during the late spring and summer months so it may make more sense to wait until the colder months to switch. Looking at the whole year though, the day/night split is more like 30/70 with WFH and 20/80 without WFH.

the_amazing_raisin

ted1 wrote: »

That doesn’t sound right , who are you with? How did you do the comparison?
Based on average usage, Bonkers has EI being 2euro dearer than the cheapest

Average usage is the key stumbling block, once you've an EV or a heat pump (or both in my case) you go way beyond average usage


Past 12 months I used just under 10,000kWh, I'm expecting this could go up to 12-13,000kWh next year with the 2 EVs (although lockdown may reduce that considerably)


Once you're at that usage level, then the discounted unit rates from other suppliers make a big difference. Try it yourself, put the same calculation in on bonkers but with much higher usage

stimpson

cruisey1987 wrote: »

Just off the phone with Energia and they said they're only willing to give me a 33% discount as opposed to the 41% one for new customers

Might need to get the missus to sign up instead

Move to a different provider. They will ring you when they get notified. You can then haggle hard. I got 38% on gas and electricity.

the_amazing_raisin

stimpson wrote: »

Move to a different provider. They will ring you when they get notified. You can then haggle hard. I got 38% on gas and electricity.

That's the other possibility, I really want that 41% discount though

peposhi

stimpson wrote: »

Move to a different provider. They will ring you when they get notified. You can then haggle hard. I got 38% on gas and electricity.

How does that work? You sign up with the competition, the notify the current provider, they call you with new better offer, you agree to stay with them and then you call the new supplier to cancel the contract?

JimmyVik

peposhi wrote: »

How does that work? You sign up with the competition, the notify the current provider, they call you with new better offer, you agree to stay with them and then you call the new supplier to cancel the contract?

Ive often called the current provider before i move.
They offer a bad deal.
I move and then they call me a few weeks after when its too late.
They just waste everyones time.
Even if they did call you in time with a better offer.
Is it possible to reverse a move? Is it a complicated process?
Will the old provider take care of it all for you.

the_amazing_raisin

JimmyVik wrote: »

Ive often called the current provider before i move.
They offer a bad deal.
I move and then they call me a few weeks after when its too late.
They just waste everyones time.
Even if they did call you in time with a better offer.
Is it possible to reverse a move? Is it a complicated process?
Will the old provider take care of it all for you.

So my experience is that I'll change providers (say Energia to Airticity) and it takes a couple of days for the request to change suppliers to go through


Once that happens, you have a 14 day cooling off period to change your mind. This is a consumer right, no provider can argue differently


During this time, usually within a couple of days, my Energia calls me and asks if they can convince me to stay. They'll ask the unit rate from Airtricity, they'll try to offer something better, we negotitate something which is either better than Airtricity or not


If I decide to stay with Energia, then they can acutally cancel the change of provider, so there's nothing needed from me in that case


Last time this happened, Energia gave me a slightly better rate than Airtricity but also backdated the new discount to when the old one ended. There was about a months gap there so it was worthwhile in the end


I've done things a bit differently this time in that I called Energia first to hear their offer (33% discount)


Given my levels of consumption, that's close to the competition, but I know that Energia can do better given they're offering a 41% discount.


So I might switch and see if Energia come back with a better offer. I still have a month left so time to decide on who is best

garo

I did this once. I switched, got a call back with a superior rate so decided to stay with the original provider. It was a few years ago now and it was Airtricity and Bord Gais. No hassle as long as the switchback happens within the 14 day cooloff period. You get no bill from the new provider.

gandalfio

Sheep Shagger wrote: »

You'll need to do two quotes as one tariff probably won't be cheapest for both scenarios.

If looking at night rate consider how much you will be working from home (dearer unit price), for us it wasn't worth switching to a night rate setup.

Moved from an ultra cheap electric ireland plan that is no longer available to Flogas. About €400 (incl €250 cash back) better off for the next year compared to the roll off EI rate).

Sorry to resurrect an old thread. How are you finding Flogas? Good customer service etc? Do they supply both your electricity and gas? Thanks.

homer911

Energia seems to have introduced some sort of deal for EV owners. I got caught off on the call but I think there was a mention of 5c per Kwh for EV charging but the guy was unsure if I could avail of it on a smart meter (which seems really weird). Going to follow up for more information but has anyone any details of this?

bambam

homer911 wrote: »

Energia seems to have introduced some sort of deal for EV owners. I got caught off on the call but I think there was a mention of 5c per Kwh for EV charging but the guy was unsure if I could avail of it on a smart meter (which seems really weird). Going to follow up for more information but has anyone any details of this?

Any link for that offer? sounds really good. Last time I spoke with them they had a 7c/kWh offer on night meter (after VAT)