The National Party

ILoveYourVibes

Originally Posted by ELM327 View Post
AGree.
Lose barret.
Lose the anti women, anti abortion, anti LGBT rubbish and maybe you'd get some support. The country is crying out for a right wing party without the nonsense

Basically you want facists who don't pose a threat to YOU.

Varik

People are deluding themselves, it likely won't be the national party but people are so far up their own holes on this. There will be some populous/far/hard/radical right party here eventually.

Someone can correct me on this but Ireland seems to be literally the last EU country without one holding any seats. Spain were slapping themselves on the back and talking up lessons learned since Franco, but now Vox are the 3rd largest party. Portugal were there with us but now they've the most unpopular populist party holding a single seat.

Loafing Oaf

Cal4567 wrote: »

There will be an area for what is known as a mainstream nationalist party,

No, there has probably been no real need to see a nationalist orientated political party up to now but we are slowly getting there

I would not be at surprised if a charismatic far right individual emerges here over the course of the next decade. The IT and RTE aided and abetted by the EU will try to put a lid on it but I am

I've been hearing these dark prognostications since the turn of the century and nothing much has ever come of them. Declan Ganley, Peter Casey and various others were supposed to be the messiah of the right and where are they now?

So I'll believe these 'new nationalists' are a real political force when they start winning significant votes in meaningful elections...

sabat

Kiith wrote: »

ban a womans right to choose,

"The right to choose" is a marketing slogan-it does not exist. In the USA where the phrase originated it became erroneously attached to the Roe vs Wade judgement which was actually based on "the right to privacy" which does exist.

TomTomTim

ELM327 wrote: »

AGree.
Lose barret.
Lose the anti women, anti abortion, anti LGBT rubbish and maybe you'd get some support. The country is crying out for a right wing party without the nonsense

Why would any right wing party be pro LGBT considering all the trappings that come with it? LGBT stuff isn't simply supporting gays right, it hasn't been for along time.

suicide_circus

Leaving aside the pro life stuff, this kind of anti immigration party will only get traction once its "too late" ie: once we've fully replicated the issues you see in the UK with parallel societies, ghettoisation etc

Cal4567

Cal4567 wrote: »

When I see the socially liberal types just denigrating and ridiculing and trying to shut down debate, I know then they are worried about this and are devoid of reasonably argument.

They do this by just repeating terms like Nazi and Fascists oblivious to the fact their actions(like those of PBP Joe in the video on page one) are that of a fascist.

Refusing asylum to bogus asylum seekers who entered the country ILLEGALLY(and coming through safe countries in the EU), is not the same as invading countries and mass killing portions of that population.

RWCNT

coinop wrote: »

Let's have a thread about Ireland rather than America for a change. Founded in November 2016, the National Party was founded by Justin Barrett and his old friend James Reynolds. The two men had been involved in pro-life activism as teenagers and Barrett got a taste of the media spotlight during his No campaign to the Nice Treaty referendum in the early 2000s.

The National Party revolves around 9 core principles which makes it unique among Irish political parties in that it is ideologically based rather than following the populist trend of the day. The main points of NP ideology are: support for a 32 county Ireland, against mass immigration and against abortion.

The NP tested the waters by running candidates in the 2020 general election but none of their candidates were elected with only a few hundred votes each. The party blamed the media's determination to ignore them for their poor performance with most voters claiming to have never heard of the NP. Newspapers had incorrectly listed NP candidates as Independents if they even listed them at all. It seemed like there was a concerted effort by the mainstream media to pretend the NP did not exist and hope that they would fade away.

That all changed last night with RTE's hatchet job on Justin Barrett and the Nationalist movement in Ireland. RTE have realised that the NP are not going away so have decided they must take Barrett down. The public discovered the NP after the last general election and now the cat is out of the bag. They will build upon their name recognition for a more successful election run next time around. How do the esteemed posters of Boards feel about the NP?

"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.”

The National Party are 100% populist, in the way the word is most commonly used these days, a hard right nationalist party.

They certainly wouldn't be my cup of tea at all, but I have no worries about them as I don't believe an appetite for their brand of politics exists in this country outside of some of the angry chaps on this forum and people with Pepe the frog avatars on twitter.

I don't buy anyone in the mainstream being scared of the party or wanting to "take them down". They're largely ignored because they're simply not relevant. Their membership and voter base is tiny. I havnt seen the RTE bit you're referring to but I'm sure it was just an excuse to do a bit of pearl clutching about the scary nasty right wing party.

weldoninhio

Fred Cryton wrote: »

There's definitely room for a party in Ireland which is against ILLEGAL immigration, and especially bogus asylum seekers who are clearly third world economic migrants. Law and Order should be the slant they take. Many would be in agreement that a Nigerian pretending to be an asylum seeker should not be getting public housing ahead of a young Irish couple. This is sensible.

But when you start going down the path of ethnic purity and having a go at all immigrants, such as Italians and French working in our Tech sector for example, this is where it gets laughably stupid.

I find it amazing that we don't have a party like that. A lot of people would support them I'm sure. A proper law and order party.

Illegal immigrants removed, no sob stories allowed. I'd remove the Foreign Affairs ministers discretion on these matters.

"Refugees" who holiday in the country they were claiming to flee to be refused entry back into Ireland.

More prisons built. No concurrent sentencing.

Points based immigration.

A cap on the amount of money that could be earned from free legal advice.

A cap on the amount of NGOs. No government funding for NGOs who are not working for the betterment of Ireland.

A cap on the amount of charity licenses in each sector.

Changes to our archaic licensing laws.

Etc

BarnardsLoop

suicide_circus wrote: »

Leaving aside the pro life stuff, this kind of anti immigration party will only get traction once its "too late" ie: once we've fully replicated the issues you see in the UK with parallel societies, ghettoisation etc

Yeah, just look at the likes of Viktor Orbán or Prawo i Sprawiedliwość in Poland. They're turned their respective nations into laughing stocks and that's what we really need here!

Gradius

I struggle to differentiate the current political parties. Perhaps Sinn Fein stand out just a bit. Other than that, it's tweedle dum versus tweedle dee.

A monopolistic political system is bad for the electorate, so more choice is welcome as it might get them to actually compete with each other rather than simply take turns.

For all the red hot topics in the world right now, cost of living, employment, globalisation, immigration, sexuality, housing, education etc...can you distinguish any kind of choice between political options here?

Beyond nauseating detail, I don't. And it is for that same obvious reason that new political entities are going to do gangbusters over the coming years.

ILoveYourVibes

weldoninhio wrote: »

I find it amazing that we don't have a party like that. A lot of people would support them I'm sure. A proper law and order party.

Illegal immigrants removed, no sob stories allowed. I'd remove the Foreign Affairs ministers discretion on these matters.

"Refugees" who holiday in the country they were claiming to flee to be refused entry back into Ireland.

More prisons built. No concurrent sentencing.

Points based immigration.

A cap on the amount of money that could be earned from free legal advice.

A cap on the amount of NGOs. No government funding for NGOs who are not working for the betterment of Ireland.

A cap on the amount of charity licenses in each sector.

Changes to our archaic licensing laws.

Etc

Dude wake up ..do you know how much people make off direct provision??

they made 72 MILLION last year.

They are basically prisons.

End direct provision entirely THEN you would get some politicians against immigration.

I have said to a lot of right wingers ...direct provision is your enemy if you want to halt immigration. But they are naive.

Plus you have the fact that NO business would support that party. they need immigrants.

eldamo

coinop wrote: »

So you're issue lies with your dislike of Barrett rather than National Party policy? Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people. I personally think Barrett is a fantastic speaker. I've linked the following video from the 3:50 timestamp mark. If this doesn't inspire you, you're ignorant of Irish history.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NnmDL65M_bU&t=3m50s

Junkyard Tom

Kiith wrote: »

everyone who doesn't agree with us is a Socialist/Marxist

MUBS. Marxists Under The Bed Syndrome.

It's all over boards.ie lately. I think it's from the US culture war, people watching assorted pseudo-intellectual frauds on YouTube.

CtevenSrowder

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Dude wake up ..do you know how much people make off direct provision??

they made 72 MILLION last year.

They are basically prisons.

End direct provision entirely THEN you would get some politicians against immigration.

I have said to a lot of right wingers ...direct provision is your enemy if you want to halt immigration. But they are naive.

Plus you have the fact that NO business would support that party. they need immigrants.

You are calling other people naive!! You started a thread championing that whole CHAD malarkey, laughably comparing it to the Free Derry movement. How did that turn out? You've claimed that Norway, Denmark and Germany are socialist. I wouldn't be calling other naive if I was you.

irishguitarlad

Varik wrote: »

People are deluding themselves, it likely won't be the national party but people are so far up their own holes on this. There will be some populous/far/hard/radical right party here eventually.

Someone can correct me on this but Ireland seems to be literally the last EU country without one holding any seats. Spain were slapping themselves on the back and talking up lessons learned since Franco, but now Vox are the 3rd largest party. Portugal were there with us but now they've the most unpopular populist party holding a single seat.

Spain was always going to happen, never punished Franco's buddies so it never went away, a bit like Italy. Also, the southern half of Spain and parts of Madrid(where vox gets there support)-Castilla la Mancha, Extremadura, Murcia, Andalucía has many extremely wealthy families that lord it over the rest and want to maintain this. They view supporting bullfighting, wearing spanish pins, being anti feminism and anti-immigration, being staunchly monarchist and Catholic and doing the nazi salute as being a mark of showing your spanishness. They deny the holocaust, want to make gun ownership legal like the U.S, dismantle the autonomous communities and privatize the universal health care service. It's funny how vox supporters rage against immigrants from morocco/maghreb when their anscestors from a few hundred years back were probably from there, the party also got a lot of funding from an iran terrorist group, strangely enough. For Ireland's sake lets hope a party like this never gets popular, they are an absolute cancer.

ILoveYourVibes

CtevenSrowder wrote: »

You are calling other people naive!! You started a thread championing that whole CHAD malarkey, laughably comparing it to the Free Derry movement. How did that turn out? You've claimed that Norway, Denmark and Germany are socialist. I wouldn't be calling other naive if I was you.

And i was right about all of that.


All I am saying is people in this country are making MILLIONS out of illegal and legal immigrants. And even more than that out of asylum seekers.

They are not going to give that up.

Its not the lefties you have to worry about mate.

James Brown

suicide_circus wrote: »

Leaving aside the pro life stuff, this kind of anti immigration party will only get traction once its "too late" ie: once we've fully replicated the issues you see in the UK with parallel societies, ghettoisation etc

You mean after, if it's handled badly.

CtevenSrowder

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

And i was right about all of that.


All I am saying is people in this country are making MILLIONS out of illegal and legal immigrants. And even more than that out of asylum seekers.

They are not going to give that up.

Its not the lefties you have to worry about mate.

No you weren't. As someone else posted in the other thread:

"I know that some people in the US associate the Nordic model with some sort of socialism," he said. "Therefore, I would like to make one thing clear. Denmark is far from a socialist planned economy. Denmark is a market economy."

Now if Denmark isn't, Germany and Norway aren't either.

https://www.vox.com/2015/10/31/9650030/denmark-prime-minister-bernie-sanders

That CHAD rubbish is nothing at all like the Free Derry movement. Bizarre comparison. And I'm not worried about 'lefties'. The basis behind DP is actually a smart one. People are supposed to be coming from War Torn countries or from other such awful circumstances. DP ensures they are sheltered, clothed and fed. The problem is the length of time applications take and the number of appeals that can be made. It should be reformed so that one comes, has their application processed and can appeal once. The whole process shouldn't take more than 6 months, a year at worst.

Gregor Samsa

TomTomTim wrote: »

Why would any right wing party be pro LGBT considering all the trappings that come with it? LGBT stuff isn't simply supporting gays right, it hasn't been for along time.

Whatever about LGBT+, the NP seem to be straight (excuse the pun) anti-gay:

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/national-party-walkout-over-varadkar-gay-slur-gtkbbwkxb

suicide_circus

BarnardsLoop wrote: »

Yeah, just look at the likes of Viktor Orbán or Prawo i Sprawiedliwość in Poland. They're turned their respective nations into laughing stocks and that's what we really need here!

who is laughing?

suicide_circus

Bowie wrote: »

You mean after, if it's handled badly.

of course it's going to be handled badly, it cant even be discussed in polite society.

BarnardsLoop

Well... I admit, most people are abjectly horrified at the fascist (sorry! I know a lot of people don't like anyone using the F-word) hellhole Hungary is turning into, including EU member states.

As for Poland... It's a mix of laughter at voting for such a party given their history viz. WWII and... also abject horror for following Obrán's lead.

TheIrishGrover

Christ, I clicked on the link. Just to check it out. There is some serious abuse of the English language there. Absolute garbage. National Identity (ie, get the for-dinners out), Moral Authority (ie, OUR Morals over all others).

I knew it but I wanted to confirm. You knew it from the very NAME of the party. Every time some regressive homophobic racist bible basher starts another party it's always something like "Real Ireland"or "New Ireland" or "Real Nationalism" or other bullsh*t. The implication being that if you are not a regressive racist homophobe who wants to control every aspect of a woman's body then you are not REALLY Irish and you don't know what Ireland REALLY means.


About the only correct thing on that site is the flyers being in black like cigarette packets: Signifying they are bad for your health and should be avoided.

ancapailldorcha

Just looks like he's peddling Brexit for Ireland with added toxicity and stupidity to be honest.

Barrett himself has always come across to me as an odious, nasty, stupid and greasy little man. You see the far right nationalist groups on the continent evolving their narrative and he's on about abortion, a right women across Europe have had for decades. While I don't see the sorts of people who prioritise voting to limit or eliminate immigration being too bothered with this, I can't see there being much appetite to repeal such a recent constitutional change.

The British Labour party committed to a second EU referendum in 2019 and suffered their worst electoral result since the second world war. That someone purporting to lead a political party is not cognisant of this is baffling but somehow entirely predictable.

Ireland just doesn't have the sort of colonial past for the sort of xenophobic and racist dogwhistling Barrett to yield any sort of result. Net immigration to Ireland is a relatively recent affair. I see the British flailing and embarassing themselves with Brexit and this lad advocating the same for Ireland and just wonder why he's even bothering. Maybe if he dropped the culture war stuff and maybe pushed an Irexit agenda based on farming and fishing quotas or something.

Pherekydes

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

OP, one of the problems with all these new parties is that they 'go national' from the start, straight into general elections and even presidential elections. And seem to expect commensurate coverage on the national stage, media or print.

Why not start at a lower level in the council elections - there are always plenty of wards where its usually 9 candidates chasing 7 seats. Get your name known locally as a hard-worker, put yourself in a position three or eight years later where you can have a serious go at the Dail.

They all seem to want to short-cut the process, and it comes across as lazy and presumptive.

They're not actually in to "serving the people". They're only in to seizing power.

GT89

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Just looks like he's peddling Brexit for Ireland with added toxicity and stupidity to be honest.

Barrett himself has always come across to me as an odious, nasty, stupid and greasy little man. You see the far right nationalist groups on the continent evolving their narrative and he's on about abortion, a right women across Europe have had for decades. While I don't see the sorts of people who prioritise voting to limit or eliminate immigration being too bothered with this, I can't see there being much appetite to repeal such a recent constitutional change.

The British Labour party committed to a second EU referendum in 2019 and suffered their worst electoral result since the second world war. That someone purporting to lead a political party is not cognisant of this is baffling but somehow entirely predictable.

Ireland just doesn't have the sort of colonial past for the sort of xenophobic and racist dogwhistling Barrett to yield any sort of result. Net immigration to Ireland is a relatively recent affair. I see the British flailing and embarassing themselves with Brexit and this lad advocating the same for Ireland and just wonder why he's even bothering. Maybe if he dropped the culture war stuff and maybe pushed an Irexit agenda based on farming and fishing quotas or something.

Barrett is not pro Irexit. The NP are against the idea of an EU army and want to leave the Euro and go back to the punt but they are not in favour of Ireland leaving the EU.

The fact of the matter is the current levels of immigration are too high and unsustainable in the long run. We need to look at introducing an Australian style points system on an EU wide basis in order for immigration to sustainable.

jackboy

BarnardsLoop wrote: »

As for Poland... It's a mix of laughter at voting for such a party given their history viz. WWII and... also abject horror for following Obrán's lead.

Poland did not only suffer at the hands of the Germans during WW2. The Russians took over after the war with permission from the brits and Americans. So, Poland suffered at the hands of fascists, communists and democrats in that war. Technically Poland lost WW2 even though they were with the Allies.

Odhinn

coinop wrote: »

So you're issue lies with your dislike of Barrett rather than National Party policy? Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people. I personally think Barrett is a fantastic speaker. I've linked the following video from the 3:50 timestamp mark. If this doesn't inspire you, you're ignorant of Irish history.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NnmDL65M_bU&t=3m50s

Jaysus spare us.

1641

jackboy wrote: »

Poland did not only suffer at the hands of the Germans during WW2. The Russians took over after the war with permission from the brits and Americans. So, Poland suffered at the hands of fascists, communists and democrats in that war. Technically Poland lost WW2 even though they were with the Allies.

That is a very strange way of framing it.

Stalin in 1944 at Yalta agreed to allow democratic elections in Poland. By the end of the war the Soviet army sat in Poland. Stalin did "allow" elections" but they were completely rigged. Other than wage into a renewed war with Russia there was little the western allies could do.

The Soviets were determined to keep eastern Europe under their dominance. They had a very powerful army there and believed they had earned this - which they saw as a defence against any renewed German resurgence or Western interference.