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Madeleine McCann

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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,383 ✭✭✭tigger123


    FVP3 wrote: »
    not the same guy?, I stopped following this when the English press convinced me that it was Murat. That was over I thought. I mean the friends of the McCanns saw him and pointed him out. How could they be wrong?

    Really, really hope I'm never facing you in a jury...


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭Sin City


    [HTML][/HTML]
    tigger123 wrote: »
    This guy has been semi identified as Christian H.

    Thought it was Christian B

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-52916137
    The suspect, who has been named in German media as Christian B, is currently serving a prison sentence.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,383 ✭✭✭tigger123


    Sin City wrote: »
    [HTML][/HTML]

    Thought it was Christian B

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-52916137

    Then let's hope I'm never sitting on a jury facing a man named Christian.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,136 ✭✭✭✭Beechwoodspark


    If they do actually solve it I’ll be amazed.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,187 ✭✭✭FVP3


    tigger123 wrote: »
    Really, really hope I'm never facing you in a jury...

    Why? The evidence was there according to the English media, as it is here. Well its all a bit circumstantial in both cases but that's enough for me. Now that i know it wasn't Murat I can be assured it was Christian H B

    EDIT:

    And since it doesn't appear clear to the defenders of the McCanns I am mocking them. So yeh, you wouldnt want to face the kind of persona I am mocking on a jury, nor in fact the kind of people who have taken this latest circumstantial evidence as proof of guilt either.

    I personally have no idea who did it.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,625 ✭✭✭✭ACitizenErased


    That face mock-up they released looks eerily similar to his picture in the Daily Mail.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,845 ✭✭✭Antares35


    Oh they're still around...just wailing on them for negligence instead of murder now.

    There's some kind of theory behind the stone throwing behaviour I remember reading about. It's something to do with people's fears that the same thing could happen to them so they feel compelled to put some kind of distinguishing marker on what's happened to set themselves apart. Hence the "well I would never do that to my children" etc. They are actually just trying to convince themselves that such a tragedy would never befall them because they are different. Most parents have f*cked up. Most also just got lucky. But you can't say that because of this need they have to set themselves apart from those who also f*cked up but weren't lucky.

    It's similar to people who victim blame. Well she shouldn't have been walking alone or wearing that skirt etc. What they mean is "I can keep myself from being her by not walking alone or wearing that skirt".


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,982 ✭✭✭MeMen2_MoRi_


    Anyone else wondering how phone records from 13 years ago are still on record? EU law says no longer then 2 years.

    *If it's the guy that abducted her great* the family get closure on this, can move on some what, if she is dead hopefully the body can be found and they can lay her to rest.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,314 ✭✭✭paw patrol


    Strumms wrote: »
    The parents, left two two year olds and a three year old, asleep and alone, in a ground floor apartment, in a public holiday block of apartments while they went to the restaurant with friends...

    If I’m a friend I’m thinking that’s fücking weird and irresponsible.. to the point where I’d even be questioning it, to the point where I’m saying...

    “hey just so you guys aren’t worrying why don’t one of us take a rain check on food, sit in with your kids, you can relax, eat with the others, not be worrying about the clock and the kids and get back when you like, we don’t know the lye of the land round here but this way you get to relax and the kids are being watched and you guys don’t have to be getting up constantly and worrying”. 99% of people would accept that offer.

    The weird thing is, Kate and Gerry McCann are intelligent people. You cannot become a doctor and not be. They will in their careers especially when learning their trade , been placed in a&e, been taught about abuse, and various psychological parameters and behaviors of people who are of the mind to carry out abductions , sexual crimes on children etc...would or could they BOTH be that careless ? It just seems strange, very strange that on the face of it that ‘caring’, ‘professional’ and ‘intelligent’ people would just fûck off with their mates for a couple of hours, leaving their kids unsupervised in a ground floor location, 2 year old twins and a 3 year old, alone, in a ground floor apartment.... that’s FÛCKING NUTS... no parent would do that, NOBODY.

    They were doctors, smart, intelligent people... it’s the weirdest story ever... the most bizarre unsolved crime that may end up just remaining unsolved unless her body is discovered or a deathbed confession from whichever psychopath is responsible.

    iit's not something I'd have done but I also think it's not neglect either - but it should be clarified the restaurant was about 100m away.
    It wasn't that far away.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 379 ✭✭Mike3287


    Anyone else wondering how phone records from 13 years ago are still on record? EU law says no longer then 2 years.

    *If it's the guy that abducted her great* the family get closure on this, can move on some what, if she is dead hopefully the body can be found and they can lay her to rest.

    They might have the phone?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,383 ✭✭✭tigger123


    Antares35 wrote: »
    There's some kind of theory behind the stone throwing behaviour I remember reading about. It's something to do with people's fears that the same thing could happen to them so they feel compelled to put some kind of distinguishing marker on what's happened to set themselves apart. Hence the "well I would never do that to my children" etc. They are actually just trying to convince themselves that such a tragedy would never befall them because they are different. Most parents have f*cked up. Most also just got lucky. But you can't say that because of this need they have to set themselves apart from those who also f*cked up but weren't lucky.

    It's similar to people who victim blame. Well she shouldn't have been walking alone or wearing that skirt etc. What they mean is "I can keep myself from being her by not walking alone or wearing that skirt".

    There's also an element of a good old fashioned internet pile in. This time directed at two people who had their kid abducted, and probably sexually abused and murdered.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,987 ✭✭✭c.p.w.g.w


    Anyone else wondering how phone records from 13 years ago are still on record? EU law says no longer then 2 years.

    *If it's the guy that abducted her great* the family get closure on this, can move on some what, if she is dead hopefully the body can be found and they can lay her to rest.

    If the records had been illegally retained, can they be used lawfully?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,449 ✭✭✭✭pwurple


    batman75 wrote: »
    1. How on earth does a parent/s leave their children without adult supervision in a hotel room while going out for a meal.

    I keep seeing this... have you seen the apartment and the place they were eating? They had a groundfloor apt. They were about 30m away, outside, within eyeline. Basically, across a garden / pool.

    My house is down the end of a gravel laneway. When I put my bins out after my children are in bed, it's about 3 times the distance the parents were. Or if I check the post, before they wake up, it's that distance.

    I don't kneel at the edge of their beds all night praying wakefully over them, I go to my own bedroom and sleep. Or I put them to bed and I go downstairs and do some other stuff. No parent keeps 24x7 surveillance on their children, it is simply unreasonable.


    A pedophile breaking into your apartment and stealing your children is so unbelievably unlikely. That's why it's on the news. And it's also possible that this may STILL have happened even if they were there. In through a child's window when you are in another room watching TV, or in your own bedroom and out they go again. Or another child taken instead.

    This suspect was apparently a burglar and sex offender. If that's the case, it fits exactly their story of what happened. Let's see.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,982 ✭✭✭MeMen2_MoRi_


    c.p.w.g.w wrote: »
    If the records had been illegally retained, can they be used lawfully?

    I've just caught the story a few minutes ago, the phone records thing stood out for what ever reason.
    I'm guessing, if they don't have the actual phone from the time, then illegally held records wouldn't be allowed to be used, police can't commit crimes to get evidence?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,142 ✭✭✭Babooshka


    I've just caught the story a few minutes ago, the phone records thing stood out for what ever reason.
    I'm guessing, if they don't have the actual phone from the time, then illegally held records wouldn't be allowed to be used, police can't commit crimes to get evidence?

    I would imagine that police and detectives are very well versed in what can and can't be used and they will have a handle on it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,528 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    batman75 wrote: »
    Two points strike me about this case

    1. How on earth does a parent/s leave their children without adult supervision in a hotel room while going out for a meal.
    2. I think the McCann's being doctors have lent them a more favourable coverage than if they had been two unemployed people. Two unemployed people would have been destroyed in the media as the dregs of society for daring to leave their children unsupervised. Doctors are afforded, understandably, respect by society but the basic lack of care is the bottom line.

    Irrespective of the negligence of the parents I hope they get a resolution to this tragic case. By their own actions they have sentenced themselves to a lifetime of guilt.


    That’s the thing. As doctors they are by default very intelligent, caring people who would have as part of their training and experience have been showered with information that included the psychology and psychological profiles of the types of people who can commit these crimes. They were tuned to the dangers, risks through supposed intelligence, social training... but still, young children, not nearly in their teens, left together alone... in a strange and quite public location, accessible to a point and dangerous by definition... doctors, intelligent people, the influence of peers and trusted people around them, it’s just too odd, it really is... so many holes HAD to line up for this to happen, be possible, be successful and for the truth to not only be never uncovered, years later not close, yet, to be provable anyway....

    Nothing makes sense, it’s beyond mysterious, weird, sad and not plausible going on what we know.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,982 ✭✭✭MeMen2_MoRi_


    Mike3287 wrote: »
    They might have the phone?

    Yeah thinking about it now, did he get caught committing a crime not long after leaving Portugal and the phone was confiscated off him and now they've had other evidence that linked him to Madeline's abduction/murder and the phone was checked.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,906 ✭✭✭Banana Republic.


    If they do actually solve it I’ll be amazed.

    Agreed, would need to convince the world but I bet it’ll be a close case away from the media. I’m sure there’s many a strange twist left in this.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,943 ✭✭✭✭the purple tin


    Am I missing something here.

    On the news they are saying she is dead but they haven't got a body or a confession.
    They are investigating this german guy on suspicion, so they haven't actually charged him with anything yet his name is being released to the press.
    The official statement is that he is guilty of 'crimes against little girls' wtf does that mean? If he is a rapist/paedo why not just say it.


    I think this will be another red herring. God knows there have been enough of them connected to this case over the years.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,046 ✭✭✭silver2020


    Strumms wrote: »
    The parents, left two two year olds and a three year old, asleep and alone, in a ground floor apartment, in a public holiday block of apartments while they went to the restaurant with friends...

    If I’m a friend I’m thinking that’s fücking weird and irresponsible.. to the point where I’d even be questioning it, to the point where I’m saying...

    .

    This is the type of bullsh1t thinking that comes from reading the utter sh1te that is written in tabloids especially the daily mail.

    It was a gated holiday complex and they were a about 80 metres away and it had good security.
    MOST people would feel comfortable leaving kids safely in a bedroom. It is actually quite normal.

    You simply cannot live life worrying about every possible issue - otherwise you'd never get into a car, cross the road, smoke a cigarette, take a glass of wine etc etc etc etc etc etc

    In the modern world - how many children are abducted by total strangers.

    It is so rare that it makes massive worldwide headlines when it does happen. - About once in a blue moon.


    People reading rubbish in tabloids and coming to conclusions about suitabilty of the parents need to wake up to reality


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,759 ✭✭✭jimmytwotimes 2013


    Kids unsupervised

    Patio doors unlocked

    A lot can happen with 3 small kids in 30 mins. Even without an abductor about.


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    silver2020 wrote: »
    It was a gated holiday complex and they were a about 80 metres away and it had good security.
    MOST people would feel comfortable leaving kids safely in a bedroom. It is actually quite normal.


    I totally disagree - I couldn't name any one of my acquaintances or relations that I think would do this, even before MM went missing. It's very abnormal to leave unattended kids alone. Even leaving abduction aside, what if they woke up or a fire started... Normal, nope.


  • Registered Users Posts: 827 ✭✭✭Dontfadeaway


    silver2020 wrote: »
    This is the type of bullsh1t thinking that comes from reading the utter sh1te that is written in tabloids especially the daily mail.

    It was a gated holiday complex and they were a about 80 metres away and it had good security.
    MOST people would feel comfortable leaving kids safely in a bedroom. It is actually quite normal.

    You simply cannot live life worrying about every possible issue - otherwise you'd never get into a car, cross the road, smoke a cigarette, take a glass of wine etc etc etc etc etc etc

    In the modern world - how many children are abducted by total strangers.

    It is so rare that it makes massive worldwide headlines when it does happen. - About once in a blue moon.


    People reading rubbish in tabloids and coming to conclusions about suitabilty of the parents need to wake up to reality

    Gated? Anyone could walk off the street into their apartment.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,990 ✭✭✭Shelga


    If it was the German guy, the sad truth is that something like this was always, by far and away, the most likely explanation.

    Yes I also believe that the McCanns made a mistake, but I feel deep sympathy. It achieves absolutely nothing to constantly berate them for this error- it only allows the accuser to feel smug and self-satisfied, basking in a false sense of security that they have never made a mistake or done something stupid. Don't these people think that the McCanns have paid the ultimate price? Let he who is without sin cast the first stone, etc.

    The aspect of the case that makes me feel uneasy is the fact that so much time and resources were dedicated to investigating this because her parents were middle-class white doctors. We all know it. Whilst it makes sense for the McCanns to do everything in their power to find their child, I do think that if this man is found guilty, it would be much more beneficial now for them to redirect their profiles and charitable foundations towards helping all missing children, not just their own.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,906 ✭✭✭Banana Republic.


    silver2020 wrote: »
    This is the type of bullsh1t thinking that comes from reading the utter sh1te that is written in tabloids especially the daily mail.

    It was a gated holiday complex and they were a about 80 metres away and it had good security.
    MOST people would feel comfortable leaving kids safely in a bedroom. It is actually quite normal.

    You simply cannot live life worrying about every possible issue - otherwise you'd never get into a car, cross the road, smoke a cigarette, take a glass of wine etc etc etc etc etc etc

    In the modern world - how many children are abducted by total strangers.

    It is so rare that it makes massive worldwide headlines when it does happen. - About once in a blue moon.


    People reading rubbish in tabloids and coming to conclusions about suitabilty of the parents need to wake up to reality

    If you watch their interviews they are washy at best, you don’t need to be a detective to see their behavior is suspect and how they reacted after it was crazy. There’s something so fishy about all this. Surely you don’t think it’s all cut and dried?


  • Registered Users Posts: 35,168 ✭✭✭✭BorneTobyWilde


    SusieBlue wrote: »
    In fairness Sky News among a myriad of other international media were outside their apartment within hours of Madeleine disappearing. Their every move was followed, analysed, and reported on.

    If they had done anything remotely suspicious I’m sure it would have been immediately picked up one by the press who wouldn’t give them a minutes peace until they left Portugal a few months later.




    The clocked up 11,000 kms in a rental car, driving deep into the portuguese countryside. The rental car became a focal point of the investigation after a specialist cadaver dog alerted in the vehicle that a body was present.
    Seems weird to go '' sight seeing'' after your kid goes missing, so much of it at night too.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,449 ✭✭✭✭pwurple


    The clocked up 11,000 kms in a rental car, driving deep into the portuguese countryside. The rental car became a focal point of the investigation after a specialist cadaver dog alerted in the vehicle that a body was present.
    Seems weird to go '' sight seeing'' after your kid goes missing, so much of it at night too.

    Sight-seeing? Or maybe... just guessing here.... searching for their child?

    Your daughter goes missing... do you go looking for her, or you stay indoors wringing your hands?


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,726 ✭✭✭sxt


    It has the appearance of a last dittch attempt by the police to hope someone from the public brings forward new evidence .All the evidence so far is circumstantial. Both of those vehicles were forensically examined in a lab.

    https://mobile.twitter.com/metpoliceuk?

    [URL]


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,693 ✭✭✭2u2me


    pwurple wrote: »
    Sight-seeing? Or maybe... just guessing here.... searching for their child?

    Your daughter goes missing... do you go looking for her, or you stay indoors wringing your hands?

    I think the point being challenged was that

    "Their every move was followed, analysed, and reported on."

    So is this true or not? I haven't been following this case in the last 13 years like many of you.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 776 ✭✭✭Clarence Boddiker


    2u2me wrote: »
    I think the point being challenged was that

    "Their every move was followed, analysed, and reported on."

    So is this true or not? I haven't been following this case in the last 13 years like many of you.

    Bit of a fcuked up coincidence that they stayed with the paedophile Clement Freud immediately after Madeline was abducted. Lots of bizzare things about this case.


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