A 30 KPH limit for Dublin

magicbastarder

what exactly is difficult about it?

Hamsterchops

Gets into car, test drive @30km/h, back in five .....

magicbastarder

anyone used to driving around dublin city is well used to driving at speeds much lower than 30km/h.

kenmm

Hamsterchops wrote: »

You obviously haven't been behind the wheel for a long time, if ever?

Obviously :pac: :pac:

The pigeon man

Hamsterchops wrote: »

You obviously haven't been behind the wheel for a long time, if ever?

It's not that hard really. Just position your right heel comfortably on the floor mat and it should be easy to maintain that speed.

It takes alot of patience to commute in Dublin city in a car and obey a 30 km/h limit.

If you want to get around the city quickly I'd recommend a road bike or an ebike if you need a bit of help on the hills.

Personally I've given up on public transport and the car in the city because it's too slow.

Hamsterchops

OK, my findings in my diesel engined people carrier ....

1st gear take off, 2nd gear @20km/h, 3rd at 28 or 30km/h.

Mechanically she's on the cusp of wanting to change up to 3rd, I can of course get into 3rd, but speed creeps up over 30, drop back to 2nd maybe, but it's a balancing act.

Depends on car too I guess, Petrol engined cars may well (mechanically) be happy at 30km/h in 3rd or top gear? I don't know, but what I do know is that 30km/h equates to just 18 MPH which is terribly slow for a main road/thoroughfare.

Seth Brundle

Hamsterchops wrote: »

You obviously haven't been behind the wheel for a long time, if ever?

Has driving under 30km/h changed recently?

Face it, there's absolutely nothing difficult about driving slowly (people manage it every day). It's just a pain to have to do so. But if someone believes that it's difficult then they really should not be driving. To those claiming that it will increase pollution or make the roads more dangerous because drivers are looking at their speedos more often then they are making spurious claims to suit their argument. The claims have absolutely no merit.

kenmm

Hamsterchops wrote: »

You obviously haven't been behind the wheel for a long time, if ever?

I've driven all over Europe, and most 'proper' cities have 30/40 km limits all over. In a variety of rental cars, different engine sizes, petrol and diesel. I've been driving for decades and passed my test in a country that actually does driving lessons and tests (remember when Ireland didn't bother with them??). If you are telling me you find this difficult to drive a few kms at slower speed, then the only thing obvious is that you should hand back your licence (if you have one).

As I say, its a bit of a pain in the hole, it feels unconformable at times, but I cannot accept someone saying its difficult/impossible.

CramCycle

Hamsterchops wrote: »

You obviously haven't been behind the wheel for a long time, if ever?

Over 20 years, in case this makes my view more valid.

magicbastarder wrote: »

anyone used to driving around dublin city is well used to driving at speeds much lower than 30km/h.

This, there are times where the average speed for a car is under 10kmph

The pigeon man wrote: »

It's not that hard really. Just position your right heel comfortably on the floor mat and it should be easy to maintain that speed.

Automatics are even easier, I am honestly unsure why anyone who commutes alot by car, particularly in heavy traffic would drive manual if they have a choice.

Hamsterchops wrote: »

OK, my findings in my diesel engined people carrier ....

1st gear take off, 2nd gear @20km/h, 3rd at 28 or 30km/h.

Mechanically she's on the cusp of wanting to change up to 3rd, I can of course get into 3rd, but speed creeps up over 30, drop back to 2nd maybe, but it's a balancing act.

Depends on car too I guess, Petrol engined cars may well (mechanically) be happy at 30km/h in 3rd or top gear? I don't know, but what I do know is that 30km/h equates to just 18 MPH which is terribly slow for a main road/thoroughfare.

The fact that you presume all cars behave and expect gear changes at the same speed says more about your lack of driving experience than anythng else. Nothing you have described sounds difficult. In fact, it just sounds like driving.

Seth Brundle wrote: »

Has driving under 30km/h changed recently?

Face it, there's absolutely nothing difficult about driving slowly (people manage it every day). It's just a pain to have to do so. But if someone believes that it's difficult then they really should not be driving. To those claiming that it will increase pollution or make the roads more dangerous because drivers are looking at their speedos more often then they are making spurious claims to suit their argument. The claims have absolutely no merit.

Anyone who needs to stare at the speedo to constantly maintain a given speed should not be driving. It should take a quick glance occasionally, if you need more than that their perception of the world around them makes them unsuitable for driving in general.

Hamsterchops

kenmm wrote: »

I've driven all over Europe, and most 'proper' cities have 30/40 km limits all over. In a variety of rental cars, different engine sizes, petrol and diesel. I've been driving for decades and passed my test in a country that actually does driving lessons and tests (remember when Ireland didn't bother with them??). If you are telling me you find this difficult to drive a few kms at slower speed, then the only thing obvious is that you should hand back your licence (if you have one).

As I say, its a bit of a pain in the hole, it feels unconformable at times, but I cannot accept someone saying its difficult/impossible.

You obviously haven't got a clue if you think it's ok to drive on the open road @30km/h for any length of time!

Back in the day I remember when 30 MPH was considered slow, and now it's going to be 18 MPH.

It all depends on they type of road were talking about. Makes total sense on small roads, built up areas & housing estates, but what I'm going on about is the open road & dual carriageways, big roads that usually cater for much greater speeds.

Seth Brundle

Hamsterchops wrote: »

You obviously haven't got a clue if you think it's ok to drive on the open road @30km/h for any length of time!

Where exactly within the DCC area will you find an "open road" that will be affected by the new speed limits?

Grassey

Hamsterchops wrote:

It all depends on they type of road were talking about. Makes total sense on small roads, built up areas & housing estates, but what I'm going on about is the open road & dual carriageways, big roads that usually cater for much greater speeds.

Does the city centre not count as a built up area?

kenmm

Hamsterchops wrote: »

You obviously haven't got a clue if you think it's ok to drive on the open road @30km/h for any length of time!

Back in the day I remember when 30 MPH was considered slow, and now it's going to be 18 MPH.

It all depends on they type of road were talking about. Makes total sense on small roads, built up areas & housing estates, but what I'm going on about is the open road & dual carriageways, big roads that usually cater for much greater speeds.

I don't have a clue.. ok - do I need to publish my hertz and enterprise receipts going back 5 years??

No one is talking about dual carriage ways - get real - more like Rathmines road, the Quays etc. 'Biggest' road would probably be the section of Leeson St Upper to Donnybrook. A wide enough road, peppered with traffic lights and a ton of traffic.

Think its time to consider giving up driving if that's a struggle. The day comes to us all. Both my Grandfathers hated it approaching their 70s, but its the way it goes.

magicbastarder

Hamsterchops wrote: »

You obviously haven't got a clue if you think it's ok to drive on the open road @30km/h for any length of time!

what do you mean by 'ok'?
all the roads affected are within the dublin *city* council boundaries. this is a DCC initiative. and as above, it does not affect all roads within DCC boundaries.

Patrick2010

I'll be driving the length of Sundrive road this evening, I'll see what it'll be like driving on an open road at 18 mph. I suspect I'll have a line of traffic building up behind. Its mad having a 30 km limit on a wide open road like this.

M256

M256 wrote: »

Either they are forced to suffer long commutes on public transport, or find parking somewhere quite far away and walk (which costs you at least 10 euro a day) or rent expensive apartments near by. None of those options are particularly pleasant. Commute to the docks is just monumental waste of time.

What in the name of all that is holy are you smoking?

"commuting to the docks is a waste of time, so everyone has to drive".......really?

The docklands is probably the best served area by public transport of any area in the entire country:
Pearse, Connolly and Docklands for commuter belt trains
Connolly, Tara, Pearse and GCD for DART trains
Two separate LUAS lines with maybe 10 stops within walking distance
Countless bus stops served by probably 50%+ of the routes Dublin Bus provide

Out of anywhere in literally the whole state, I struggle to find somewhere better serviced than the square kilometre or two surrounding the IFSC.

Seth Brundle

Patrick2010 wrote: »

I'll be driving the length of Sundrive road this evening, I'll see what it'll be like driving on an open road at 18 mph. I suspect I'll have a line of traffic building up behind. Its mad having a 30 km limit on a wide open road like this.

As the speed limit has not yet changed I suspect there will be impatient drivers behind you.

Nonetheless, Sundrive Road is not an "open road". There are many junctions and is used by many vulnerable road users.
A quick google reveals how this road has had many incidents involving both fatalities and serious injuries.
Pensioner rushed to hospital with life threatening injuries after being struck by bus in Dublin
DFB dealing with serious crash at junction of Stannaway/Sundrive Road
Witness appeal after man (20s) killed in 4am Christmas Day crash
Appeal after woman in her 70s struck by car while crossing the road

magicbastarder

Patrick2010 wrote: »

I'll be driving the length of Sundrive road this evening
wide open road

the entire 1.3km of sundrive road?
it's not that wide, anyway:
https://www.google.com/maps/@53.3228383,-6.2948187,3a,75y,154.29h,76.95t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1seccqouXWrItrCm3GYLpTaQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Amirani

Patrick2010 wrote: »

I'll be driving the length of Sundrive road this evening, I'll see what it'll be like driving on an open road at 18 mph. I suspect I'll have a line of traffic building up behind. Its mad having a 30 km limit on a wide open road like this.

Agreed, they should narrow the road and widen the footpaths. Will be much easier to drive at 30km/hr then.

Thelonious Monk

There are some streets in the city centre where drivers really floor it. Baggot Street is one I'm thinking of, and Merrion Row. What makes it worse is that the footpaths are a couple of feet wide in places and leads to people spilling out onto the streets when busy at lunchtime etc.

magicbastarder

the most ludicrously narrow footpath has to be the one on nassau street, given the queues of people waiting on or getting off buses there.

Thelonious Monk

magicbastarder wrote: »

the most ludicrously narrow footpath has to be the one on nassau street, given the queues of people waiting on or getting off buses there.

Given there's like 3 lanes for motor vehicles going one way yes it's ridiculous. I know they widened it in parts on the south side of the street, but not sure about the side where the coaches stop.

jams100

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

There are some streets in the city centre where drivers really floor it. Baggot Street is one I'm thinking of, and Merrion Row. What makes it worse is that the footpaths are a couple of feet wide in places and leads to people spilling out onto the streets when busy at lunchtime etc.

You see this is where the 30km/h limit would make sense, but when you apply the same limit to St. John's Road for example it just makes the majority of people disregard the point of the 30km/h limit, the fact is I already drive at about 30 in the likes of those areas anyway because it makes sense. If the 30km/h limit was targeted to places like that most people probably wouldn't have a problem

magicbastarder

do you realise how much sense the 'we should set a speed limit which accommodates what most drivers will obey' argument makes, though?

jams100

magicbastarder wrote: »

do you realise how much sense the 'we should set a speed limit which accommodates what most drivers will obey' argument makes, though?

I didn't say that. I said we should be setting appropriate speed limits for appropriate locations. You cannot tell me driving on batchelors walk or dame street at 50 for example would be the same as driving on the stillorgan carriageway or con colbert road? (I know batchelors walk is currently 30, its just an example).

As someone who drives, cycles and takes public transport this blanket 30km/h is beyond ridiculous. Segregated cycling lanes and widening footpaths where appropriate is the solution along with a 30km/h limit in residential or the likes of dame street/georges street area.

Our roads are generally speaking safe compared to most cities. I'd personally rather see the current rules enforced re. Cars and cyclists breaking red lights and drivers using mobiles whilst driving

magicbastarder

i think (nearly) everyone here is in agreement that the existing laws are barely policed, and the new ones will be no different.

SC024

jams100 wrote: »

You see this is where the 30km/h limit would make sense, but when you apply the same limit to St. John's Road for example it just makes the majority of people disregard the point of the 30km/h limit, the fact is I already drive at about 30 in the likes of those areas anyway because it makes sense. If the 30km/h limit was targeted to places like that most people probably wouldn't have a problem

someone talking a bit of sense for a change

SC024

magicbastarder wrote: »

do you realise how much sense the 'we should set a speed limit which accommodates what most drivers will obey' argument makes, though?

is this from DCC's public submissions online questionaire?

It kinda shows how much attention they were going to pay to it anyways. was a pure box ticking exercise if there ever was one, lads we have to do this so lets just go through the motions bla bla.

magicbastarder

jams100 wrote: »

You see this is where the 30km/h limit would make sense, but when you apply the same limit to St. John's Road for example it just makes the majority of people disregard the point of the 30km/h limit

you do realise that the section of st john's road with a 30km/h limit will only be 300m long? pretty much just the section past the taxi rank at the side of heuston.
it's 50km/h west of the junction with military road, to just west of the junction with south circular. and then goes to 60km/h and then 80 as you head west.

SC024

magicbastarder wrote: »

you do realise that the section of st john's road with a 30km/h limit will only be 300m long? pretty much just the section past the taxi rank at the side of heuston.
it's 50km/h west of the junction with military road, to just west of the junction with south circular. and then goes to 60km/h and then 80 as you head west.[/

if it's so short why bother at all ?