Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

MickeyLeari

vid36 wrote: »

575 is the largest daily increase since the start of the crisis.

Perhaps it could be a backlog of tests? Or ramping up is tests? Or perhaps meat plants? It is the equivalent of 60 confirmed cases in Ireland.

manniot2

CruelSummer wrote: »

Looks like our esteemed 'experts' have let the mask slip finally. One of the most frequent questions asked on this thread during the course of the roadmap was - What / Where was 'there', that the experts kept referring to. This enigmatic place we hadn't reached yet despite cases and deaths tumbling daily.
According to this Independent article, 'there' was complete eradication of the virus like New Zealand. Conveniently forgotten in this is our Common Travel Area agreement with the U.K., our membership of the EU and it's travel arrangements, and the 'virus disappearing so fast they've to ship the Oxford vaccines from the U.K. to Brazil for trials'.
'There' would have translated into weeks more of lockdown, no matter what the cost to us as a people, our children, society, other medical issues that are growing by the day, country needing an IMF bailout with certainty if we continued down this path, and social unrest.
I have no words...these people have been given far too much of a say in how to govern since our curve was flattened, and they don't like it when they've been over-ruled. They should be leading examples of good hand hygiene, social distancing, etc. I've lost a lot of respect for some of the signatories of this letter..

https://www.independent.ie/world-news/coronavirus/ireland-at-the-crossroads-we-must-completely-eliminate-coronavirus-to-return-to-normal-scientists-warn-39268163.html

The signatories:
It is signed by :

Professor Anthony Staines; Epidemiologist, Dublin City University

Professor Gerard Killeen; Infectious Disease Ecologist, Epidemiologist and Control Specialist, University College Cork

Dr Tomás Ryan; School of Biochemistry & Immunology, Trinity College Dublin and Chair of FENS-Kavli Network

There have been over 1,000 signatories to date, including:

Prof. Luke O’Neill; Professor of Biochemistry, Trinity College Dublin

Prof. Cliona O’Farrelly; Professor of Comparative Immunology, Trinity College Dublin

Prof. Sam McConkey; Infectious Disease Specialist, Vice-Dean, Royal College of Surgeons in Ireland

Prof. Jane Ohlmeyer; Director of Trinity Long Room Hub Arts & Humanities Research Institute, Trinity College Dublin; and Chair of Irish Research Council

Prof. Kingston Mills; Professor of Experimental Immunology, Trinity College Dublin

Prof. David McConnell; Fellow Emeritus in Genetics, Trinity College Dublin

Dr. Lydia Lynch; Immunologist, Trinity College Dublin and Harvard Medical School

A group of lads sitting in a University pontificating nonsense. They can **** off.

skelly22

hmmm wrote: »

Every society has a certain amount of rules or it just becomes a free for all. We don't let people decide whether they need to wear a seatbelt, or drve over the speed limit, or serve chlorinated chicken to people. This is no different - we don't want amateurs using their "common sense" to try and decide what the appropriate response is to a new virus, not matter how much smarter than everyone else they think they are.

I'm sorry but questioning elements of the lockdown that don't make sense is not akin to driving without a seatbelt or serving up chlorinated chicken for people to eat. I'm not encouraging anarchy here but, by the same token, I didn't get up this morning & check Simon Harris' twitter feed before deciding how I was going to spend my day.

vid36

Study indicates lockdowns may have averted 3 million deaths in Europe.There is a seperate study also publishing today examining effects in the USA, China etc and finding similar outcomes.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-lockdowns/lockdowns-may-have-averted-3-million-deaths-in-europe-by-curbing-covid-19-study-idUSKBN23F1G3

Benimar

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

Exactly. And as I stated earlier they will be the first to moan and whinge if the Government are too slow in reintroducing restrictions.

If there is one certainty in all of this, it’s that those who want everything opened, 1m Social distance and no masks will throw all the blame on whatever Government we have if we have to reimpose any restrictions.

MickeyLeari

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

I think you are quite aware of what my position is at this stage. It hasn`t changed and I suspect that if there is another wave next autumn/winter your camp may well be the ones who have to do some serious back pedaling.

Do we stay locked down until then? If there is a second wave then we cross that bridge when it comes.

Wash your hands.
Avoid touching your face
Wear a mask in more crowded indoor places
Stay at home when you are sick

is_that_so

the kelt wrote: »

Ive no idea, i think ive seen maybe 2 or 3 say they would have issues wearing masks.

I just thought it was curious thing to say that a large number also didn't want masks?

I think the numbers claim may come from the poll with the Masks thread. Quite a few would only wear if mandatory and some won't wear masks at all.

Cork Boy 53

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Will we get what we want? no.

Is our lockdown essentially over?

Yes.

For now maybe. Whether or not the strictest restrictions will have to be reimplemented in the autumn/winter will largely be down to the actions of the people of Ireland as a whole.

Ginger n Lemon

vid36 wrote: »

Study indicates lockdowns may have averted 3 million deaths in Europe.There is a seperate study also publishing today examining effects in the USA, China etc and finding similar outcomes.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-lockdowns/lockdowns-may-have-averted-3-million-deaths-in-europe-by-curbing-covid-19-study-idUSKBN23F1G3

:D:D:D:D:D:D

In a modelling study of lockdown impact in 11 nations, Imperial College London scientists said the draconian steps, imposed mostly in March, had “a substantial effect” and helped bring the infection’s reproductive rate below one by early May.

Same Imperial college that predicted 96 000 dead Swedes by start of this month? When 4k died?

This gotta be the funniest stuff posted in this thread for many weeks to come

Cork Boy 53

Benimar wrote: »

If there is one certainty in all of this, it’s that those who want everything opened, 1m Social distance and no masks will throw all the blame on whatever Government we have if we have to reimpose any restrictions.

As sure as night follows day.

tobefrank321

He might have been out by a couple of weeks, but it looks like Professor Levitt was not far off the mark.

https://www.independent.ie/world-news/coronavirus/nobel-scientist-predicts-virus-will-burn-out-in-next-two-weeks-39194015.html

Provided we maintain good hygiene, social distancing, workplace controls, and most importantly controls on visitors from hotspots such as the UK, covid 19 should burn itself out soon. We do seem to have an R0 of about 0.5, which means next week, we should see less than 10 cases a day some days and may even see 0 deaths per day for some days. When we reach that point it will be hard for covid 19 to make a comeback, unless of course we have superspreaders spreading it in confined spaces. We will have to be hugely on the ball with contact tracing if that does happen. Basically anyone who goes into a pub will have to give their mobile number for example to be contactable at a later stage.

vid36

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

:D:D:D:D:D:D

In a modelling study of lockdown impact in 11 nations, Imperial College London scientists said the draconian steps, imposed mostly in March, had “a substantial effect” and helped bring the infection’s reproductive rate below one by early May.

Same Imperial college that predicted 96 000 dead Swedes by start of this month? When 4k died?

This gotta be the funniest stuff posted in this thread for many weeks to come

It is a peer reviewed study and one exception does not disprove their findings,

Cork Boy 53

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

:D:D:D:D:D:D

In a modelling study of lockdown impact in 11 nations, Imperial College London scientists said the draconian steps, imposed mostly in March, had “a substantial effect” and helped bring the infection’s reproductive rate below one by early May.

Same Imperial college that predicted 96 000 dead Swedes by start of this month? When 4k died?

This gotta be the funniest stuff posted in this thread for many weeks to come

I fail to see anything even remotely funny about people dying as a result of contracting the virus regardless of the numbers involved. It appears you have a different view.

vid36

vid36 wrote: »

Study indicates lockdowns may have averted 3 million deaths in Europe.There is a seperate study also publishing today examining effects in the USA, China etc and finding similar outcomes.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-lockdowns/lockdowns-may-have-averted-3-million-deaths-in-europe-by-curbing-covid-19-study-idUSKBN23F1G3

Haven't Imperial College London's models been utter trash since this began?

Flickerfusion

My concern is that if we join the likes of the US and UK as countries that aren’t capable of managing this due to taking notions, does it mean investors start wondering if it’s safe to locate businesses in those countries?

We can’t afford to have repeating waves of this as it will literally make us look like a bunch of feckless idiots who couldn’t manage a bit of social distancing and hand washing after the reopening.

Hopefully we do manage to keep control of this virus as we just can’t afford not to from either a social or economic point of view and some of us need to stop taking our cues from the two countries that are completely lost down the rabbit hole of populism, anti science and conspiracy theories.

For example, in the USA, polling indicate that when a vaccine becomes available the anti vaxxer issue means that they’ll be very unlikely to even get 50% uptake. So COVID 19 may well be a chronic problem over there that keeps mutating and becomes endemic instead of ultimate rapid herd immunity and eradication.

Allinall

manniot2 wrote: »

A group of lads sitting in a University pontificating nonsense. They can **** off.

As opposed to what- A group of lads sitting in front of their keyboards pontificating nonsense on boards.ie?

Ginger n Lemon

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

:D:D:D:D:D:D

In a modelling study of lockdown impact in 11 nations, Imperial College London scientists said the draconian steps, imposed mostly in March, had “a substantial effect” and helped bring the infection’s reproductive rate below one by early May.

Same Imperial college that predicted 96 000 dead Swedes by start of this month? When 4k died?

This gotta be the funniest stuff posted in this thread for many weeks to come

Because what was predicted to happen with no action, did not happen following action, it can be concluded the action was unnecessary and achieved nothing?

Ginger n Lemon

vid36 wrote: »

It is a peer reviewed study and one exception does not disprove their findings,

Its a modelling study. :rolleyes:

Did you even read the bloody thing they are coming out with ??

The Imperial team estimated that by early May, between 12 and 15 million people in the 11 countries - Austria, Belgium, Britain, Denmark, France, Germany, Italy, Norway, Spain, Sweden and Switzerland - had been infected with COVID-19.

A second study by scientists in the United States, published alongside the Imperial-led one in the journal Nature, estimated that anti-contagion lockdown policies implemented in China, South Korea, Italy, Iran, France and the United States prevented or delayed around 530 million COVID-19 cases.

this is just speechless stuff :rolleyes:

stephenjmcd

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

I think you are quite aware of what my position is at this stage. It hasn`t changed and I suspect that if there is another wave next autumn/winter your camp may well be the ones who have to do some serious back pedaling.

And if there isn't another wave will you be back pedaling ?

Sorry but it works both ways, those saying there will be a 2nd wave and those saying there won't be. If there isn't will you be back here back pedaling?

You suspect there will be a 2nd wave others suspect there won't be, its an opinion at the end of the day. But if your expecting people to back peddle if there is a 2nd wave then surely you'll have to do the same if there isn't.

Ginger n Lemon

Deleted User wrote: »

Because what was predicted to happen with no action, did not happen following action, it can be concluded the action was unnecessary and achieved nothing?

Sweden were predicted to have 96,000 dead by June (this month).

Reality = 4000 deaths.

It can be concluded that Imperial college models are a load of rubbish.

If you think thats "1 exception" you must be deluded, didnt you hear same crowd predicting 65,000 dead in UK off Swine flu 9 years ago? 362 people died.

Listen this isnt a serious conversation is it? Models? :rolleyes:

moonage

.

GeorgeBailey

stephenjmcd wrote: »

And if there isn't another wave will you be back pedaling ?

Will be delighted to back pedal, personally. I'll back pedal my way gratefully into having work and money and a life again.

Cork Boy 53

stephenjmcd wrote: »

And if there isn't another wave will you be back pedaling ?

Sorry but it works both ways, those saying there will be a 2nd wave and those saying there won't be. If there isn't will you be back here back pedaling?

You suspect there will be a 2nd wave others suspect there won't be, its an opinion at the end of the day. But if your expecting people to back peddle if there isn't a 2nd wave then surely you'll have to do the same if there isn't.

Well as you say at the end of the day it`s all opinions on both sides of the issue. Anyway the autumn isn`t that far away so we don`t have too long to find out what the outcome will be. The clock is ticking.

stephenjmcd

GeorgeBailey wrote: »

Will be delighted to back pedal, personally. I'll back pedal my way back gratefully into having work and money and a life again.

See its all a matter of opinion really, I hate the whole thing of "oh you'll be sorry if there's a 2nd wave you'll have to eat your words" when if there isn't that applies to the person who's making the statement.

At the end of the day opinion on the whole thing is very much divided

uli84

How are they figuring out the number of people allowed in the shop at one time i wonder.? Was in one of the stores today that could fit easily 100 people more and they would still be more than 2m from each other but there was a queue instead.

Ginger n Lemon

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Its a modelling study. :rolleyes:

Did you even read the bloody thing they are coming out with ??

The Imperial team estimated that by early May, between 12 and 15 million people in the 11 countries - Austria, Belgium, Britain, Denmark, France, Germany, Italy, Norway, Spain, Sweden and Switzerland - had been infected with COVID-19.

A second study by scientists in the United States, published alongside the Imperial-led one in the journal Nature, estimated that anti-contagion lockdown policies implemented in China, South Korea, Italy, Iran, France and the United States prevented or delayed around 530 million COVID-19 cases.

this is just speechless stuff :rolleyes:

What is so wrong there? And why do you believe it is wrong?

is_that_so

uli84 wrote: »

How are they figuring out the number of people allowed in the shop at one time i wonder.? Was in one of the stores today that could fit easily 100 people more and they would still be more than 2m from each other but there was a queue instead.

Teething problems! Compare supermarkets now to when they started with restrictions. Still doing it properly but we and they have got used to it.

Ginger n Lemon

Deleted User wrote: »

What is so wrong there? And why do you believe it is wrong?

Are you asking me to justify why I believe imperial college models are "so wrong"?

pgj2015

if anyone asks me to wear a mask in their shop, I will go elsewhere. shop owners should be very careful here, it is not a requirement from the government to wear one, so they will risk driving customers away to shop at other shops or online if the shop owners make it a requirement to enter their shop. I think the majority of Irish people don't want to wear masks.

I was asked to wear gloves entering a shop back in March, I just went somewhere else.

the kelt

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

I fail to see anything even remotely funny about people dying as a result of contracting the virus regardless of the numbers involved. It appears you have a different view.

Yet you saw nothing wrong in telling another poster you had no issue if a barber used a cut throat razor on him because you disagreed with his view about him getting a hair cut.

Such compassion!!