The Soulsborne combat debate

I remember co-oping the first game with a friend albeit with difficulty getting summoned and a few solo sections but it was a blast.

I missed that aspect in Sekiro, helping people overcome difficult parts or the reward that comes from it or indeed getting help when needed.

I still have people in my friends list that added me from summoning me in DS1 I regularly chat with in parties.

Minime2.5

this is a great guide for people finding ds1 tough

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BJn9tMZzXA&list=PLnyoYBfiQHtaqJ-p7tYHyGZfKP93eOygQ

Exclamation Marc

I really have no problem with people loving or loathing the combat systems. Have at it. Whatever makes you happy. It's the attitude of "if you don't love it you're crap/not skilled enough/unable to 'get' it/not a true gamer/not able for the challenge/don't understand it/clearly into crap games etc." that really pïsses me off.

I'll often hear "oh that's no problem you don't like it and I respect your opinion, but you clearly didn't take the time to learn it" which doubles back to the shïtty attitudes and superiority people mistakenly believe they have.

I hope they make tons of Soulslike games and their fans eat it up and the games get better each time. And if someone loves them, great, go wild. But talking down to people is one of the absolute worst traits a gamer can have. Especially when they're talking out their arşe and are nowhere near the high ground they believe they're on.

johnny_ultimate

I love the series and would always encourage anyone with an interest in trying the games to give them a shot as I think the reputation for relentless, barely surmountable difficulty is somewhat unwarranted.

But i think it’s straight-up embarrassing when I see the phrase ‘git gud’. They’re bloody computer games, no need for any sort of elitism. That goes for every game by the way, not just these ones. It’s just adolescent bull**** that’s putting people off playing some of the best games ever made.

Robert ninja

I don't think there's nearly as much elitism as people are suggesting. Players just wish to defend the difficulty and approach of such games because they're a dying breed in AAA world. Demon's Souls was a hit because people were starved for content like that, not because it broke new ground (although it did use PS3 tech very well).

There's been years of yap from users and MSM to casualise games. Give us more easy modes, add more tutorials (that last the entire game), floating button prompts, QTEs, compromise the integrity of multiplayer so people 'feel' like they're good at it. That's where "git gud" came from. It was the response of Demon/Dark Souls players in their glory days. They didn't have the patience left for any more lip about how unfair the game was or how it should be easier. Players didn't want to explain anymore, they just wanted to play and enjoy those types of games with each other. Git gud was essentially "f*ck off". Don't f*ck with our hobby, don't try to dig your filthy casual nails into this one. It worked for a while but now it's just a meme, one that continues to trigger people which is hilarious.

Greyfox

Retr0gamer wrote: »

Can't agree less with you. Triple A games have been very poor this generation with a massive decrease in the amount of quality games. I've also seen a lot of games get highly rated that would be considered mediocre previously because there's a lack of competition. Triple A games all mostly fit into a few templates that publishers know sell well and it's very boring. Also regarding Hard modes, I usually find them unbalanced and not fun. They are arbitrarily difficult as opposed to Dark Souls.

Objectively there hasn't been a decrease in quality, I think its more a case of you getting a little jaded with many AAA games. Theirs also the fact that more games are been made these days which makes people less likely to stick with something that doesn't grab them straight away. Yes hard mode tends to just be tougher enemies etc but it does change how you play the game. Playing the last of us, Resident evil 2 remake or the Witcher 3 on hard is a different experience to easy as you have to make the most of your resources. some people just want to enjoy a story and feel like a beast. The combat does sound like it gets very rewarding although combat cant get any better than the bar set by Zelda BOTW

Potential-Monke

Robert ninja wrote: »

I don't think there's nearly as much elitism as people are suggesting...

Git gud was essentially "f*ck off". Don't f*ck with our hobby, don't try to dig your filthy casual nails into this one.

There it is. Seems to be the trigger is saying Dark Souls is shyte... :pac:

Robert ninja

You realise that was a quasi paraphrased quote from the attitude at the time and not my actual opinion. I don't care who likes Souls games anymore because I stopped playing them after DS2 which was meh to me and the AAA industry is beyond saving. I'd rather just play Blade of Darkness. Still got it in my GOG library... I think it's time for a reinstall.

johnnysmack

Played them all, beat them all, hate them all. Most overhyped biggest load of shìt games I've ever come across. I foolishly believed the hype so when they were on sale bought the lot only to find the utter nonsense within but by god I get my money's worth no matter how crap a game is.

Taltos

Love them all.
From Demon’s Souls which I brought in as an import from Canada at the time all the way to Bloodborne, which was different enough it jarred me at first but I got to enjoy it too.

Only recently went back to Demons Souls again and with the servers offline its a very different experience - I miss the hints, and oddly I miss the invasions that the first time around really bugged me, to the point where at times I disconnected my PS from the network just to try to get some gaming in without someone charging in at the worst possible moment.

The mechanics with the shield. Nope - Will never ever master that in any of the games, I just am forced to learn different ways to survive, might die a bit more as a result but makes it no less fun, just more challenging.

Did find huge support in this forum when I was stuck in some of the other games, and between the tips here and getting others to help me as I helped others made progress through some bosses really achievable.

Doctor Nick

If I can beat the Souls games anybody can. I'm probably one of the most unskilled players there is and I adore the Soulsborne games. That feeling of satisfaction at defeating a boss that's kicked your arse for so long cannot be beat.

Case in point, I started a new game of Bloodborne a fortnight ago. I'd beaten it before but Laurence the First Vicar was impossible for me at that time and I ended up summoning another player to beat him. So on this play through I vowed to beat him solo. Initially was still getting my arse kicked. Thought about different tactics I could use so decided to play without locking on and dodge rolling instead of quick step. It worked, I actually beat him. My heart was pounding with the adrenaline and my chest must have swelled up with that sense of pride when it finished. Not to mention the roar I let out. No other games give me that feeling.

First time I played Bloodborne it took me 80-100 hours to beat without the DLC. This playthrough took 40 hours, all bosses solo, DLC and some chalice dungeons. Its great to see yourself improve as a player.

From Software is my favourite developer at the moment. No other developers can build worlds like they do. I do understand people who can't get into them. I was the same the first time I played Bloodborne. Couldn't get past first area and traded it. But I kept thinking about the atmosphere in the game so bought it again. I'm so happy I persevered as it introduced me to my favourite ever series of games.

Retr0gamer

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

But i think it’s straight-up embarrassing when I see the phrase ‘git gud’.

I think the vast majority of people use git gud sarcastically, I know I do. I definitely don't use it as an insult. I have used it jokingly before and people have lost their **** but that's more a reflection of their personality type as it was quite obviously a joke.

Greyfox wrote: »

Objectively there hasn't been a decrease in quality, I think its more a case of you getting a little jaded with many AAA games.

I'm not Jaded with triple A games, just a lot of them are objectively poor games. There is far too much leniency given to games that replace actual focused design with Skinner box mechanics. It's low hanging fruit for game developers, these games aren't fun at all and even the people that say they are enjoying them aren't, it's more just satisfying a primal instinct, the same one that hooks gamblers. I actually think it's very dangerous to make games that play to what can essentially develop into a personality disorder or addiction.

It's another reason why I love the Souls games. It doesn't rely on skinner box mechanics to keep it compelling. It relies on the lost art of good design. Every thing in the game, the levels, the enemies, the bosses, the combat mechanics has been hand crafted to be as good as it can be. Sure there are sections in every game where the budget was stretched and the design isn't as tight but for the vast majority of each game it's a carefully and masterfully crafted videogame. The kind of games you'd get from the 8-bit generation on wards that we started to lose last generation.

petes

For me it was the exploration of the worlds they are set in. I couldn't wait to see what's in the next area.

First time I beat DS3 was solo as had no internet. It was a challenge but I kept fighting that boss to get by and see the next area.
Finished it again last week, did have some help with a couple of the bosses, some of them I probably didn't need the help but seen the summon signs and just did it.
Favorite boss to beat was The Watchers of Farron for some reason although I do like the dancer fight.

Playing through the DLC at the minute.

Sekiro was the same, just couldn't wait to see the next area.

That being said they pissed me off no end. Still die in the most stupid of places. Rolling off a cliff was my favorite and not an enemy in sight :pac:

TitianGerm

Doctor Nick wrote: »

If I can beat the Souls games anybody can. I'm probably one of the most unskilled players there is and I adore the Soulsborne games. That feeling of satisfaction at defeating a boss that's kicked your arse for so long cannot be beat.

Case in point, I started a new game of Bloodborne a fortnight ago. I'd beaten it before but Lawrence the First Vicar was impossible for me at that time and I ended up summoning another player to beat him. So on this play through I vowed to beat him solo. Initially was still getting my arse kicked. Thought about different tactics I could use so decided to play without locking on and dodge rolling instead of quick step. It worked, I actually beat him. My heart was pounding with the adrenaline and my chest must have swelled up with that sense of pride when it finished. Not to mention the roar I let out. No other games give me that feeling.

First time I played Bloodborne it took me 80-100 hours to beat without the DLC. This playthrough took 40 hours, all bosses solo, DLC and some chalice dungeons. Its great to see yourself improve as a player.

From Software is my favourite developer at the moment. No other developers can build worlds like they do. I do understand people who can't get into them. I was the same the first time I played Bloodborne. Couldn't get past first area and traded it. But I kept thinking about the atmosphere in the game so bought it again. I'm so happy I persevered as it introduced me to my favourite ever series of games.

I definitely get more satisfaction beating tough areas or bosses in BB/Souls/Sekiro than any other game. In BOTW the bosses were easy enough, same with Odyssey. Haven't completed Borderlands 3 but the same story.

The only other two games that I've felt similar satisfaction was in Cuphead or Hollow Knight.

I think boss fights in a lot of games are very easy now.

On another note there were people saying that Days Gone is worth playing, that it really comes into its own after 20-30 hours. It was probably one of the games I was most looking forward to getting my hands on but if you're willing to put that time into that game then putting half or a quarter of that time into dark souls to learn the combat will give you access to a far better game/series.

petes

TitianGerm wrote: »

On another note there were people saying that Days Gone is worth playing, that it really comes into its own after 20-30 hours. It was probably one of the games I was most looking forward to getting my hands on but if you're willing to put that time into that game then putting half or a quarter of that time into dark souls to learn the combat will give you access to a far better game/series.

Finished Days Gone, I enjoyed it all the way through but it does get better later on, has it's critics but enjoyable none the less.

Having been a massive fan of Metroid on the Snes I tried to get in to Hollow Knight and Salt and Sanctuary but not sure they are for me.


On the other end I do enjoy the triple A games on the PS4, a lot of hand holding in some of them but decent stories.

I usually go back to something that offers more of a challenge.

On topic, the combat in Sekiro is fantastic. Yes it takes time to learn even for Soulsbourne players but there is a definite reward.

Penn

Bought Sekiro last night. Full price too, so if I don't like it I'm blaming all of you and I hope you feel bad.

Played a bit. Seems alright. Got killed maybe twice by I guess the second boss (not counting the one you're not supposed to beat) in front of a gate after getting the first arm upgrade before I had to give up for the night anyway.

Doctor Nick

Penn wrote: »

Bought Sekiro last night. Full price too, so if I don't like it I'm blaming all of you and I hope you feel bad.

Played a bit. Seems alright. Got killed maybe twice by I guess the second boss (not counting the one you're not supposed to beat) in front of a gate after getting the first arm upgrade before I had to give up for the night anyway.

Sekiro is fantastic. Probably my favourite of the From games. It is, in my opinion, the most punishing of their games. I hope you enjoy it.

Hollow Knight is excellent though I did not like Salt and Sanctuary. I was terrible at Cuphead.

TitianGerm

Penn wrote: »

Bought Sekiro last night. Full price too, so if I don't like it I'm blaming all of you and I hope you feel bad.

Played a bit. Seems alright. Got killed maybe twice by I guess the second boss (not counting the one you're not supposed to beat) in front of a gate after getting the first arm upgrade before I had to give up for the night anyway.

They're only mini bosses.

Retr0gamer

Penn wrote: »

Bought Sekiro last night. Full price too, so if I don't like it I'm blaming all of you and I hope you feel bad.

Played a bit. Seems alright. Got killed maybe twice by I guess the second boss (not counting the one you're not supposed to beat) in front of a gate after getting the first arm upgrade before I had to give up for the night anyway.

Just remember, it's not about damage, it's about stamina. You'll be doing bugger all damage initially but once their stamina goes down they will be hemorrhaging health. I'd advise on picking up Mikiri counter as an essential upgrade as well as it makes spear enemies a whole lot more manageable.

johnny_ultimate

While Bloodborne is my favourite Soulsborne overall for a plethora of reasons, Sekiro truly was masterful in the way it combined the formula with such a fast-paced, dynamic fighting style. It feels as good (heck, far better) to play as any 3D action title, but without losing that From Software challenge. Playing the considerably less appealing Fallen Order highlighted just how right From got it: fast, brutal, demanding combat that just happens to boast the perfect video game parry.

Doctor Nick

Retr0gamer wrote: »

Just remember, it's not about damage, it's about stamina. You'll be doing bugger all damage initially but once their stamina goes down they will be hemorrhaging health. I'd advise on picking up Mikiri counter as an essential upgrade as well as it makes spear enemies a whole lot more manageable.

Not always. Some enemies recover Posture too quickly therefore it is essential to reduce their health. The lower the health the slower the Posture regen.

Retr0gamer

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

fast, brutal, demanding combat that just happens to boast the perfect video game parry.

Street Fighter 3: 3rd Strike just called to say.... fair enough.

Stone Deaf 4evr

The biggest enemy you'll face in soulsborne games ( I cant speak to sekiro as I haven't played it) is patience. You'll be punished for being greedy and taking one last swipe at a boss or enemy. You wont know the story if you haven't taken time to read things like item descriptions, you'll make areas more difficult also (rusty iron ring or the music box for example) by missing the importance of equipping certain items.

And the funny thing is, being leveled up a long way only helps so much, if you're not patient, you're still gonna get stomped.

Id be very slow to use the phrase 'masterpieces', but they're certainly as close as most games get.

Potential-Monke

The point stands, these games are perfect in your own eyes. Yes, that view is shared with millions of people, just like millions of people don't agree. It's the looking down on others, the constant bashing of games that are not of that type, Retr0 above says that people who enjoy other games mentioned are actually not enjoying it, but are only ticking boxes in a habit feeding game. Sorry like, but that's a very big jump to be making, and is just as bad as someone legitimately saying 'git gud' (not in the ironic way). Not having a go directly at you Retr0, but it's an example of the mentality of the fans of the Souls games, that anyone who doesn't like these games are inferior, sheeple who can't think for themselves, who need to be hand held and fed with dopamine inducing but "shallow" effects/rewards.

Why can ye not acceot that those games are not for everyone, and it's not because they're not proper gamers, or are inferior to ye in some way? That's the issue, not the difficulty of the games, not the learning time or patience required, it's the elitist attitude towards non-followers. Don't get me wrong, i'm not sat here in my underwear 15st overweight getting genuinely emotionally affected by it, just don't like elitist attitudes in general, and gamers can add that toxicity to it. It does no one any good.

_CreeD_

I played and finished Dark Souls 1 , thought it had an original and interesting world that was barely fleshed out. I went i'd say about 2/3 through no 2 (including the same on it's DLCs as I swapped between zones) and then quit, I was just bored. We all have different tastes so I won't argue with anyone who loves them but one thing I do take issue with is the majority seeming to think that if someone doesn't like them it's because of the difficulty. To be fair the base difficulty is higher than the average RPG but I don't think it requires anywhere near the skill it's often made out to. It's more about repetition, learning and countering attack patterns in a game of patient rock-paper-scissors with extreme punishment for failing thrown in so the tension somewhat counters that repetitiveness. For me it just wasn't worth it, the same enemies in the same spots with essentially the same moves. Some people love that, learning the perfect responses so they can do zero hit takedowns and so on, which is fine but again it's not super-human skill, it's patience and inevitable muscle memory (IMHO).

Retr0gamer

Potential-Monke wrote: »

The point stands, these games are perfect in your own eyes. Yes, that view is shared with millions of people, just like millions of people don't agree. It's the looking down on others, the constant bashing of games that are not of that type, Retr0 above says that people who enjoy other games mentioned are actually not enjoying it, but are only ticking boxes in a habit feeding game. Sorry like, but that's a very big jump to be making, and is just as bad as someone legitimately saying 'git gud' (not in the ironic way). Not having a go directly at you Retr0, but it's an example of the mentality of the fans of the Souls games, that anyone who doesn't like these games are inferior, sheeple who can't think for themselves, who need to be hand held and fed with dopamine inducing but "shallow" effects/rewards.

Why can ye not acceot that those games are not for everyone, and it's not because they're not proper gamers, or are inferior to ye in some way? That's the issue, not the difficulty of the games, not the learning time or patience required, it's the elitist attitude towards non-followers. Don't get me wrong, i'm not sat here in my underwear 15st overweight getting genuinely emotionally affected by it, just don't like elitist attitudes in general, and gamers can add that toxicity to it. It does no one any good.

I'm not saying it's every game or every game you like but I can point to finger at a lot of shlooters, mobile games and a few triple A games that well outstay their run time.

Penn

Retr0gamer wrote: »

Just remember, it's not about damage, it's about stamina. You'll be doing bugger all damage initially but once their stamina goes down they will be hemorrhaging health. I'd advise on picking up Mikiri counter as an essential upgrade as well as it makes spear enemies a whole lot more manageable.

Good shout. Although I bought the skill, got killed by the spear mini-boss in the something estate, then it brought me back to the Temple and it then said the skill was now unlocked. Took him down on second fight though.

Anyway, mostly grinding the early areas by not travelling via idol and instead taking out the enemies between the temple and the old woman with the bell. Doesn't take too long once you know their patterns and positions. Had to go back and forth a bit due to dragonrot thing.

Enjoying the game, but far more for the stealth side than the combat. The combat is okay, but can still be frustrating. The stealth though, as many others have said, give me serious Tenchu vibes, and I f*cking loved Tenchu 2.

Retr0gamer

It gets tougher. The first bosses can be a roadblock but stick with it.

Arcadeheroes

Penn wrote: »

Good shout. Although I bought the skill, got killed by the spear mini-boss in the something estate, then it brought me back to the Temple and it then said the skill was now unlocked. Took him down on second fight though.

Anyway, mostly grinding the early areas by not travelling via idol and instead taking out the enemies between the temple and the old woman with the bell. Doesn't take too long once you know their patterns and positions. Had to go back and forth a bit due to dragonrot thing.

Enjoying the game, but far more for the stealth side than the combat. The combat is okay, but can still be frustrating. The stealth though, as many others have said, give me serious Tenchu vibes, and I f*cking loved Tenchu 2.

Sekiro was originally suppose to be a new Tenchu game but they added too much new things into the game during the development so they ended up calling it Sekiro instead

Penn

Arcadeheroes wrote: »

Sekiro was originally suppose to be a new Tenchu game but they added too much new things into the game during the development so they ended up calling it Sekiro instead

Oh cool. If I'd known that I might have picked it up earlier

Penn

One thing I'd say based on my experience so far though, I know Jedi Fallen Order is seen as Soulsborne-lite, but to me I'm glad I've played it as a stepping stone to Sekiro. It's gotten me used to the idea of the Idols/Meditation points refilling your health but respawning enemies (so weighing up whether or not to rest), and a fairly similar combat style (minus stealth, force powers etc).

Chris_Heilong

The games are all about how much time you put in to learn them, some people hate the should games until they realise they can be social games and are much easier with friends helping out. I finished all 3 Should games by myself but found enjoyment going back to them with friends years later, There are loads of games that if I dont click with it in the first hour then I will abandon them even if I know they are probably great games unless I see some potential, but I know my time is limited and there is so many more games out there to play.

Penn

Chris_Heilong wrote: »

The games are all about how much time you put in to learn them, some people hate the should games until they realise they can be social games and are much easier with friends helping out. I finished all 3 Should games by myself but found enjoyment going back to them with friends years later, There are loads of games that if I dont click with it in the first hour then I will abandon them even if I know they are probably great games unless I see some potential, but I know my time is limited and there is so many more games out there to play.

The notes from other players in Bloodborne annoyed the hell out of me though, especially because for the first while, I didn't know they were from other players. And even then I didn't understand why they were so poorly written and ambiguous until I learned they weren't typed and you could only select certain words or something.

So bar a few which were a little helpful, most of them just annoyed me. I think I did summon help one time but I died in the fight anyway and just felt like a waste of the other player's time.

Mr Crispy

This entire thread has just made me hungry for Elden Ring news. From sent out a tweet yesterday, giving me hope, but it was just about total sales figures for the Souls trilogy.

Goddammit. :mad:


https://twitter.com/fromsoftware_pr/status/1262628410079080453?s=20

gimli2112

Personally I loved Bloodborne but couldn't get into Demon Souls or Dark Souls 3. That's not to say they're bad games but for whatever reason BB just hooked me and I ended up platinuming it.
I know people have criticisms of BB but when they speak to me about them all I hear is white noise.

Retr0gamer

The only criticism I have of BB is the frame rate is criminal and as a result the multiplayer is broken. Would love to see it on PC or a remaster on a next gen console.

gimli2112

I would pay a lot of money for a remaster. A fool and his money...…..

TitianGerm

Retr0gamer wrote: »

The only criticism I have of BB is the frame rate is criminal and as a result the multiplayer is broken. Would love to see it on PC or a remaster on a next gen console.

It's not the frame rate it's the frame pacing. Digital Foundry had a new video up the other day on someone fixing the pacing and bumping it to 60fps.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hDIvDPRcPA

Rob2D

Mr Crispy wrote: »

This entire thread has just made me hungry for Elden Ring news.

Well there was a lot of info recently from a leak. Do we have an Elden Ring thread?

Retr0gamer

TitianGerm wrote: »

It's not the frame rate it's the frame pacing. Digital Foundry had a new video up the other day on someone fixing the pacing and bumping it to 60fps.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hDIvDPRcPA

It doesn't hold a steady 30 anyway. And multiplayer is a laggy slide show.

TitianGerm

Retr0gamer wrote: »

It doesn't hold a steady 30 anyway. And multiplayer is a laggy slide show.

It does drop down FPS wise but it's not as big an issue as the frame pacing.

Mr Crispy

Rob2D wrote: »

Well there was a lot of info recently from a leak. Do we have an Elden Ring thread?

Yup.

How reliable is this leak? I'd be hesitant at calling it "info" if it was just some randomer on reddit! :pac:

johnny_ultimate

Bloodborne is so astoundingly good that the undeniable FPS issues barely factor into my memories of the game. It's the perfect From game for me, mainly because it's horrifyingly bleak world is a few steps beyond those in Sekiro or Souls. That and the sheer visceral aggression of the gameplay, which demands you play in the way From has always sort of being nudging you towards.

Would love a PC version (or PS5 if that's not to be) to see it soar, but regardless it will always stand as one of the great artistic accomplishments in modern gaming.

Retr0gamer

Lets just all agree it's a cluster**** and pray for a remaster

sweetie

I'd happily just take a sequel. more Yarnham please!

Doctor Nick

I'm currently running a SL1 toon on DS1. Been saying for years I'd try it but didn't think I'd be able to. Anyway I'm up to the Gruesome twosome now. O&S may take a while. Been grand so far. Was expecting Capra Demon to be my wall but ended up only taking three or four attempts. Not the plunge attack tactic either. Once I manage to kill those poxy dogs I face Capra head on.

Quaelaag took me an hour and was the biggest road block so far. Getting caught between her legs (ha) when she does that AOE attack is a one shot. I can imagine Four Kings will be next road block once (if) I get past O&S.

So games are difficult alright but not insurmountable.

In relation to Bloodborne performance issues, I did notice a lot of FPS drops when playing recent game. With the exception of Blighttown on original DS, I'd never really noticed before. Did drive me a bit mad at certain points and can now understand the problems people mentioned.

Doctor Nick

TitianGerm wrote: »

It's not the frame rate it's the frame pacing. Digital Foundry had a new video up the other day on someone fixing the pacing and bumping it to 60fps.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hDIvDPRcPA

If that's Lance McDonald you should definitely check out his channel. He has amazing Soulsborne content with regards to cut content.

TitianGerm

Doctor Nick wrote: »

If that's Lance McDonald you should definitely check out his channel. He has amazing Soulsborne content with regards to cut content.

His channel was in my recommended feed on YouTube today.

Vaati is great for lore stuff.

Penn

Have to admit, now that I'm getting to places in Sekiro where there are bigger bosses who hit a lot harder, I'm enjoying the game less. I was enjoying the stealth side of the game, and some of the mini-bosses. But now there are bosses (and even some regular enemies) whose hits are pretty much insta-kills, and that's not helped by the fact that when they wind up for an attack and you dodge to their side, they completely pivot while standing in place and still hit you. That's just f*cking cheap.

I get that it takes patience, it takes trying and trying again, it takes perserverence. It's also taking the fun out of the game and I don't know if finally beating the boss will offset that when I know there'll soon be another boss and it starts again. But I'll keep belting on anyway.

TitianGerm

Penn wrote: »

Have to admit, now that I'm getting to places in Sekiro where there are bigger bosses who hit a lot harder, I'm enjoying the game less. I was enjoying the stealth side of the game, and some of the mini-bosses. But now there are bosses (and even some regular enemies) whose hits are pretty much insta-kills, and that's not helped by the fact that when they wind up for an attack and you dodge to their side, they completely pivot while standing in place and still hit you. That's just f*cking cheap.

I get that it takes patience, it takes trying and trying again, it takes perserverence. It's also taking the fun out of the game and I don't know if finally beating the boss will offset that when I know there'll soon be another boss and it starts again. But I'll keep belting on anyway.

Have you been upgrading your Prayer Beads? I don't think any boss should be inst killing you.

Also is there a kanji flashing on the ones your trying to dodge?