UFC 249 - Ferguson v Gaethje Sat May 9th

walshb

EagererBeaver wrote: »

https://twitter.com/Dan_Lovelady/status/1259587560734679043?s=19

Bit more this respect needed in the sport.

The OTT hostility and in your face loutish behavior is pathetic to see....

It happens in boxing, too, but in MMA they really overdo it....

And this excuse that it's to sell the fights is rubbish.....

A decent face off and a strong case for why you win is all that is needed. A firm and fair handshake, and away you go.....there is no absolute no need for some of the scummier elements in the build up...

fitzparker

I agree with you, and I'm not getting into a back and forth over which is worse but boxing is just as cringy with it, so the "MMA overdo it" comment isnt needed

Saunders/Wilder in Nandos
Haye smashing bottle over chisora
The whole Wilder/Fury saga

I agree some of it is genuine hatred Ali/Frazier, Conor/Khabib but bottom line, doesn't matter if its boxing/MMA or snooker, it is to sell and add more "0's"

MrStuffins

walshb wrote: »

Bit more this respect needed in the sport.

The OTT hostility and in your face loutish behavior is pathetic to see....

It happens in boxing, too, but in MMA they really overdo it....

And this excuse that it's to sell the fights is rubbish.....

A decent face off and a strong case for why you win is all that is needed. A firm and fair handshake, and away you go.....there is no absolute no need for some of the scummier elements in the build up...

While what you're saying is true (well, apart from the boxing v MMA thing which is frankly ridiculous), this is the real world. People like spectacle, they like controversy, they like sh*t-talk and rivalry.

Fights feel like they mean a little more when there is a personal dislike between the two men fighting. It's just the way it is.

I 100% agree that there's no need for some of the over-the-top stuff that goes on (especially from a certain Irishman) but, for the most part, a bit of needle between two men is good.

You might see yourself as a connoisseur of the martial arts who just wants to see two gentlemen shake hands and put up their dukes, but most people aren't like that. In fact, most people who say they are like that aren't like that either.

It's not a sin to like a bit of a rivalry.

Homelander

The difference is as well, is that Conor was genuinely good at it (to a point, before all the pathetic Mayweather/Khabib stuff) and had real charisma. Other people now try to emulate what he did so successfully and it comes off painfully cringy and try-hard.

EagererBeaver

walshb wrote: »

Bit more this respect needed in the sport.

The OTT hostility and in your face loutish behavior is pathetic to see....

It happens in boxing, too, but in MMA they really overdo it....

And this excuse that it's to sell the fights is rubbish.....

A decent face off and a strong case for why you win is all that is needed. A firm and fair handshake, and away you go.....there is no absolute no need for some of the scummier elements in the build up...

You realise that it's a joke from some random lad on the internet and that Gaethje didn't organise a fake funeral, burial and headstone for Khabib Vs Tony, yes?

Homelander

EagererBeaver wrote: »

You realise that it's a joke from some random lad on the internet and that Gaethje didn't organise a fake funeral, burial and headstone for Khabib Vs Tony, yes?

He was talking about Khabibs message to Tony.

walshb

EagererBeaver wrote: »

You realise that it's a joke from some random lad on the internet and that Gaethje didn't organise a fake funeral, burial and headstone for Khabib Vs Tony, yes?

Yes

My point was an add on. In the more general overall sense.

Didn't think I needed to specifically say this..

cletus

So we can overlook Khabib's actual scummy behaviour as long as he makes nice tweets, and doesn't **** talk

walshb

Homelander wrote: »

He was talking about Khabibs message to Tony.

Yes, I was

I then added on about the ridiculous scummy element in MMA with some of the contrived and OTT hostility....

Yes, they are tough and hard men, but they really seem to think that they need to portray this in the most loutish and scummy ways....it does the sport no real favors...No wonder many see it as barbaric and vile....

If I was running it I'd be pushing far more for a more respectable element. Hard, tough, firm....but with just a push back on all the OTT scummy behavior.

walshb

cletus wrote: »

So we can overlook Khabib's actual scummy behaviour as long as he makes nice tweets, and doesn't **** talk

No.......

cletus

walshb wrote: »

No.......

So, I would suggest that Khabib's actions are more indicitive of his character than some words in a tweet. As a result, I'd be hesitant in holding him up as a bastion of respect in the face of "loutish" behaviour.

lawrencesummers

Homelander wrote: »

The difference is as well, is that Conor was genuinely good at it (to a point, before all the pathetic Mayweather/Khabib stuff) and had real charisma. Other people now try to emulate what he did so successfully and it comes off painfully cringy and try-hard.

Conor and charisma don’t go in the same sentence. He had a lot of something but if you think that’s charisma you need to check a few things.

eagle eye

lawrencesummers wrote:

Conor and charisma don’t go in the same sentence. He had a lot of something but if you think that’s charisma you need to check a few things.

Based on the first line of this post it's quite obvious you haven't a clue what charisma is.
McGergor has bucket loads of charisma. It's why he's s the biggest selling MMA fighter in history and one of the biggest sellers in all of combat sports.

simongurnick

I hate to piss on Tony's win streak right after the loss but as I look at his record on paper, there are a lot of journeymen there...cowboy, pettis, Barbosa etc.
Also a 6 month camp surely didn't help.

eagle eye

Just on Tony, I was saying in advance of the fight somebody what he said afterwards. He was very Frank and the main points were how long his camp was, since November, and that he was preparing for a non-striker for most of that time.
The camp was far too long and he should never have took that fight at short notice given how much he had to lose against a guy getting a free shot to nothing. Basically a loss didn't hurt Gaethje's ranking, Tony had a long win streak and a title shot on the line.

I believe that if Tony had a regular camp preparing for Gaethje that he beats him and easily enough.

MrStuffins

eagle eye wrote: »

I believe that if Tony had a regular camp preparing for Gaethje that he beats him and easily enough.

Classic!

ricero

fitzparker wrote: »

Bigging up Cejudo, Gaethje and Khabib and puts down McGregor.....

Is that you Ali?

This made me lol

Mcgregor was a fantastic athlete and perhaps still is, but beating up a tin can has-been in Cowboy Cerrone doesn't do it for me.

Don't think he has the hunger or desire anymore to go with killers like Gaethje and overcome Khabib.

PyreOfHellfire

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Conor and charisma don’t go in the same sentence. He had a lot of something but if you think that’s charisma you need to check a few things.

Look, I hate Conor just as much as the next person, I've been banned on this forum for using certain harsh words to describe him. But to dispute the man having charisma is beyond silly and just flat out wrong. He clearly does have charisma. The defintion of charisma is "compelling attractiveness or charm that can inspire devotion in others". It's an apt description of Conor whether we like him or not. Just because we don't like the man doesn't mean we get to change the meaning of words that describe him. I still hope he gets the head hammered off him though

lawrencesummers

PyreOfHellfire wrote: »

Look, I hate Conor just as much as the next person, I've been banned on this forum for using certain harsh words to describe him. But to dispute the man having charisma is beyond silly and just flat out wrong. He clearly does have charisma. The defintion of charisma is "compelling attractiveness or charm that can inspire devotion in others". It's an apt description of Conor whether we like him or not. Just because we don't like the man doesn't mean we get to change the meaning of words that describe him. I still hope he gets the head hammered off him though

eagle eye wrote: »

Based on the first line of this post it's quite obvious you haven't a clue what charisma is.
McGergor has bucket loads of charisma. It's why he's s the biggest selling MMA fighter in history and one of the biggest sellers in all of combat sports.

Charisma is not ability to insult others, and behave like you have the biggest dick in the world, its not how much you sell or how successful you are, Iron mike was successful and had the charisma of a turnip. Its about being outgoing sure, but in a positive way towards people not a negative way. Charisma involves humility and manners, neither of which McGregor portrays in any sizable quantity. Ali had charisma, GSP lots of it, Anderson Silva plenty.

walshb

I never saw charisma with Conor. Everything too forced.

I guess it’s all down to tastes, standards and interpretations..

Ali, now he had bags of it....and yes, was far from perfect...

Usain Bolt another...Bags charisma..

Beersmith

simongurnick wrote: »

I hate to piss on Tony's win streak right after the loss but as I look at his record on paper, there are a lot of journeymen there...cowboy, pettis, Barbosa etc.
Also a 6 month camp surely didn't help.

The title contender cerrone and former champ pettis. Jesus some peoples. Definition of journeymen is bizarre!

mdwexford

So many silly posts. Justin Gaethje an ordinary fighter. Hope there was alcohol involved there.

Was great to have fights back but tests should have been done before the fighters left for Florida. How Jacare was going round the venue and face offs while positive is crazy.

Haven’t been more impressed with a title fight win since Cody destroyed Cruz. Gaethje put in an almost flawless performance. Since the two defeats he has been much more composed and is a totally different proposition. Would not fancy Alvarez or Poirier chances against him now.

He poses a lot of problems for Khabib and I would love to see that fight next. Is his much heralded but never seen wrestling enough to stop Khabib from taking him down and keeping him there, who knows. If it is he will take Khabib apart on the feet.

Him vs Conor is also a savage match up. He is hittable but Conor would need to be at the top of his game and use his distance management and accuracy well. Justin will chew up that lead leg fast and has a lot of power in his shots. Could be a classic.

Henry had a good gameplan chopping the leg to slow down the movement in the first. Cruz was doing a bit better in the second round until the finish which I didn’t like. I disagree with the 11 unanswered shots argument. He was trying to get to his feet. You can either block shots or try and stand up. Nearly impossible to do both. It’s a title fight with two experienced fighters. I think it should have been let continue. Left a sour unfinished taste in my mouth and was very similar to the TJ fight which I also felt was early.

Francis power is unbelievable. Still don’t know if he has learned much since the Stipe fight though. Can he do anything to get back to his feet if he is taken down. If he connects with even 50% power it’s lights out for everyone though.

Kattar looked slick and is dangerous for anyone in the division.

Bryce Mitchell was the other fighter to make a big impression. Still only 25 he looks to be going places fast.

mdwexford

eagle eye wrote: »

Just on Tony, I was saying in advance of the fight somebody what he said afterwards. He was very Frank and the main points were how long his camp was, since November, and that he was preparing for a non-striker for most of that time.
The camp was far too long and he should never have took that fight at short notice given how much he had to lose against a guy getting a free shot to nothing. Basically a loss didn't hurt Gaethje's ranking, Tony had a long win streak and a title shot on the line.

I believe that if Tony had a regular camp preparing for Gaethje that he beats him and easily enough.

I believe you have no idea what you are talking about.

PyreOfHellfire

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Charisma is not ability to insult others, and behave like you have the biggest dick in the world, its not how much you sell or how successful you are, Iron mike was successful and had the charisma of a turnip. Its about being outgoing sure, but in a positive way towards people not a negative way. Charisma involves humility and manners, neither of which McGregor portrays in any sizable quantity. Ali had charisma, GSP lots of it, Anderson Silva plenty.

Jesus christ lad are you honestly trying to make out like your interpretation of a word is the actual definition of it? Conor has charisma. Whether you like it or not. Even idiots have charisma. Ironically,Muhammad Ali had a hell of a lot worse to say than Mcgregor ever had but something tells me you don't care about that. He used to complain about segregation but believed that mixed race marriage shouldn't be allowed. Does that abhorrant view he held affect his charisma? No. But it undermines your point about only nice people are charismatic. Nonsense.

derfderf

eagle eye wrote: »

Just on Tony, I was saying in advance of the fight somebody what he said afterwards. He was very Frank and the main points were how long his camp was, since November, and that he was preparing for a non-striker for most of that time.
The camp was far too long and he should never have took that fight at short notice given how much he had to lose against a guy getting a free shot to nothing. Basically a loss didn't hurt Gaethje's ranking, Tony had a long win streak and a title shot on the line.

I believe that if Tony had a regular camp preparing for Gaethje that he beats him and easily enough.

He may have been burned out from the long camp, but the training for a non-striker is bull. He's was training for Gaethje for as long as Gaethje was training for him.

JoeyJJ

Some people listening too many lazy excuses Justin was a bad match up for Tony on short notice or not. However Tony may have been a worse matchup for Khabib than Justin is however I would have more confidence the fight might actually happen if it is booked with Justin than Tony.

Love to see a quick enough turnaround there July / August, Justin didn't take too much damage unless fingers and fists are sore, certainly looked to be bothering him post fight.

Next few weeks after these cards will tell alot if they can continue with covid.

JoeyJJ

Very enjoyable fight, Justin has a strong corner and he listened and implemented what they wanted. 2nd round he got a bit cocky with that uppercut attempt where Tony clipped him, he was told to take some power off and he did and he used his energy better after that. Later if the fight he was told to focus and he came out more focused and eye on the prize and not rushing in for the finish which was there from R4.

lawrencesummers

PyreOfHellfire wrote: »

Jesus christ lad are you honestly trying to make out like your interpretation of a word is the actual definition of it? Conor has charisma. Whether you like it or not. Even idiots have charisma. Ironically,Muhammad Ali had a hell of a lot worse to say than Mcgregor ever had but something tells me you don't care about that. He used to complain about segregation but believed that mixed race marriage shouldn't be allowed. Does that abhorrant view he held affect his charisma? No. But it undermines your point about only nice people are charismatic. Nonsense.

So your objecting to someone having an opinion of something then having your own.

Good one, but your post turned to cow**** when you decided to a pledge that Ali spoke worse than McGregor.

If you find Conor charismatic then that’s your outlook on life, if you want to admire his personality that’s your call. I see a difference between charisma and ignorance, between manners and rudeness, between humility and hubris.

Let’s agree to disagree.

sonofenoch

PyreOfHellfire wrote: »

Look, I hate Conor just as much as the next person, I've been banned on this forum for using certain harsh words to describe him. But to dispute the man having charisma is beyond silly and just flat out wrong. He clearly does have charisma. The defintion of charisma is "compelling attractiveness or charm that can inspire devotion in others". It's an apt description of Conor whether we like him or not. Just because we don't like the man doesn't mean we get to change the meaning of words that describe him. I still hope he gets the head hammered off him though

Is that the Royal we or just this forum we

cletus

"A black man should be killed if he’s messing with a white woman"
"We’ll kill anybody who tries to mess around with our women"

On being asked about a black woman being with a white man
“Then she dies. Kill her too.”

All direct quotes from Ali.

This on top of refering to Joe Fraiser as "Uncle Tom” and a “gorilla” as well as “ignorant, stupid, ugly, and smelly.”