Masks

khalessi

Yes: surgical

I got fun looking masks that you add a filter to, and I generally put med mask inside, so when people look, they generally compliment the mask rather than oh shes got a mask on. If I need to wear them might as well have fun with them

ginoginelli

Yes: surgical

fr336 wrote: »

What's up with Scotland making face coverings compulsory in shops? It's almost like they want to get rid of the virus and return to fully normal life rather than stop and start local lockdowns, social distancing and all the other crap England seems determined to carry on with because they they're above the whole mask thing. England's policy: "Why think about tomorrow when there's a pint in it today?"

Its bonkers they are not making them mandatory indoors here. I suspect they will eventually, but only after another spike and more lives lost.

Wibbs

Yes: other

dfx- wrote: »

if we had a cent for every "in two weeks it will be worse" and "the second wave", the streets could be paved with gold.

It's the bogeyman that never has to go away. No matter what happens, "in two weeks" it will be worse.

I suspect and have since way back that the "second wave" won't materialise to nearly the same extent as some are predicting(mostly on extrapolating how the 1918 pandemic panned out). Maybe in some small cluster areas but overall no. Though the anxiety over this virus could come back alright when the usual coughs and sniffles return in the winter. I never believed the tens of thousands in Ireland dead precautions either, the fancier the "modelling" involved the dafter the predictions, or they were so vague as to be useless. Then again such modelling and projections are catnip to middle management types who get the horn for meetings and powerpoint and want to appear to be doing something and have some budget left over. You may as well read horoscopes otherwise.

My personal take and again for a goodly while is that this virus already finds a large chunk of the population already immune to it. It was and is acting very strangely for a virus. Some get it very bad, some don't even notice, it's affecting different groups differently and in some households where one case is confirmed not everyone gets it(unlike flu or the common cold). It was the smokers being less affected that swung it for me, given they already have compromised lungs and touch their faces all the time. Just my take now, but I suspect that immunity or resistance to Covid19 has been conferred on much of the population because of a common cold/"there's a bug going" around that spread through much of the population in the last three or so years. This rather than nicotine could explain the smokers. They get respiratory illnesses far more often than non smokers, so were more likely to get this possible bug in the last few years. Plus the elderly are less prone to seasonal colds.

fr336 wrote: »

As someone who suffers from extreme anxiety myself, I find the we can't wear masks because people may get anxious argument laughable. Sure if it's coming from anxious people themselves, but 80-90% of society is not anxious at all. Probably more. So what's their excuse? It's all about the herd and not wanting to stand out - I guarantee if mask wearing reached a certain %, the rest of the population would fall in line. It is tragic that even in a once in a lifetime pandemic what scares people more than anything else is looking strange. So much for the western notion of the individual

True and like I said earlier while this has been a worldwide disaster of a dose, thank the fates or whichever god you pray to that it wasn't something like a new strain of smallpox that emerged from a Chinese wet market. It laid bare how unprepared we are for such things, even the Asians were caught napping, but the West really dragged heels. That and the way many people have reacted even when this was seen as a major threat to health. If a smallpox type virus came back.... Jesus.

Seanergy

Yes: valved

tonysopprano wrote: »

Effectiveness against WHAT?

Particles.

The study that I was so kind to show you was from an International Society for Aersols in Medicine webinar "Face mask and respirator effectiveness: Limiting exposures to airborne pathogens during COVID-19 and beyond".

Webinar slides(pdf) are aextremly thorough and can be viwed here http://isam.org/covid. Can't link to PDF as it auto downloads.

If you do visit this page you will also come acrosS a letter published on June 30th which I am still reading(very busy at pres) titled Breathing Is Enough: For the Spread of Influenza Virus and SARS-CoV-2.

Boggles

Wibbs wrote: »

Maybe in some small cluster areas but overall no.

That solely depends on the ability and preparedness of the country to deal with it.

If a country / region is playing whack a mole with a fúcked hammer they won't have a great outcome.

It's a weird virus in how it effects people - this is actually it's strength.

My feeling on it is it swirls relatively undetected and then surges.

Either way we should know the 2nd half of September / October how we will fair.

Looking at the Data, parts of America are in for a grim August, will be interesting to see how things pan out and how we can learn from them.

AlekSmart

No: other

Wibbs wrote: »

I suspect and have since way back that the "second wave" won't materialise to nearly the same extent as some are predicting(mostly on extrapolating how the 1918 pandemic panned out). Maybe in some small cluster areas but overall no. Though the anxiety over this virus could come back alright when the usual coughs and sniffles return in the winter. I never believed the tens of thousands in Ireland dead precautions either, the fancier the "modelling" involved the dafter the predictions, or they were so vague as to be useless. Then again such modelling and projections are catnip to middle management types who get the horn for meetings and powerpoint and want to appear to be doing something and have some budget left over. You may as well read horoscopes otherwise.

My personal take and again for a goodly while is that this virus already finds a large chunk of the population already immune to it. It was and is acting very strangely for a virus. Some get it very bad, some don't even notice, it's affecting different groups differently and in some households where one case is confirmed not everyone gets it(unlike flu or the common cold). It was the smokers being less affected that swung it for me, given they already have compromised lungs and touch their faces all the time. Just my take now, but I suspect that immunity or resistance to Covid19 has been conferred on much of the population because of a common cold/"there's a bug going" around that spread through much of the population in the last three or so years. This rather than nicotine could explain the smokers. They get respiratory illnesses far more often than non smokers, so were more likely to get this possible bug in the last few years. Plus the elderly are less prone to seasonal colds.

True and like I said earlier while this has been a worldwide disaster of a dose, thank the fates or whichever god you pray to that it wasn't something like a new strain of smallpox that emerged from a Chinese wet market. It laid bare how unprepared we are for such things, even the Asians were caught napping, but the West really dragged heels. That and the way many people have reacted even when this was seen as a major threat to health. If a smallpox type virus came back.... Jesus.

Some might say Smallpox never went away,y'know !

It is heartening to see a poster confident enough to cast a withering gaze on some of the wild eyed predictions made by eminent medical people at the beginning of CV-19.

https://www.thesun.ie/news/5181665/coronavirus-ireland-kill-transform-scoiety/

Prof Sam McConkey for example,back in March...(when ?...wow seems an age)

Speaking on RTE, the infections expert said: “This is not just on our health service. Unfortunately, I think this is going to be a transformation of our society.

“The best metaphor I can think of is the Spanish Flu mixed up with the Irish Civil War which was 100 years ago mixed up with the 1929 stock market crash — ­altogether at the same time.

The medical expert, who is Head of the Department of International Health and Tropical Medicine, said a worse case scenario could see up to 120,000 people die in Ireland with up to four million infected.

Thankfully,and in no small measure due to a realistic and voluntary response Ireland has'nt reached Prof McConkey's median figure......

"My median scenario is that we’d have a 20 per cent attack rate and 20,000 deaths.

As you allude to,and many people on reflection recall,the October-December 2019 period saw many people fall ill with a debilitating flu-like 'Bug' which,from speaking with some who had it,completely floored them,to the extent of spending Christmas shivering in bed.

Whether or not that transfers into immunity to CV-19 is open to debate,but it does indicate that everybody was happily interacting and high-fiving for many months before the WHO's snappy title department came up with Covid-19 as a title to focus our attention on.

Whatever Ireland and it's people have done has,largely worked in containing and controlling this virus.

If further confirmation was required then today's HIQUA review lays it out in bare numbers.

https://www.rte.ie/news/health/2020/0703/1151127-virus-report/

Excess deaths in Ireland from March to June were "substantially" less than the officially reported Covid-19 figures, analysis from the Health Information and Quality Authority has found.....

HIQA's Chief Scientist, Dr Conor Teljeur, said: "Based on an analysis of the death notices reported on RIP.ie since 2010, there is clear evidence of excess deaths occurring since the first reported death due to Covid-19 in Ireland.

"There were about 1,100 to 1,200 more deaths than we would expect based on historical patterns; a 13% increase between 11 March to 16 June. However, the number of excess deaths is substantially less than the reported 1,709 Covid-19-related deaths over the same period."

This is not to challenge anything about the reality of the Corona virus,but rather to underline the essential good practice which Irelands response utilised.

Nothing like this has ever occured before and we now know a lot more about a lot of things,but remain largely ignorant about the Corona Virus mutation known as Covid-19,so an abundance of caution is still required as we strive to get back up off our knees,something which requires some positive forward thinking as opposed to the preparations for a winter of trench-warfare which many appear to relish !

Bit cynical

fr336 wrote: »

As someone who suffers from extreme anxiety myself, I find the we can't wear masks because people may get anxious argument laughable. Sure if it's coming from anxious people themselves, but 80-90% of society is not anxious at all. Probably more. So what's their excuse? It's all about the herd and not wanting to stand out - I guarantee if mask wearing reached a certain %, the rest of the population would fall in line. It is tragic that even in a once in a lifetime pandemic what scares people more than anything else is looking strange. So much for the western notion of the individual

Another aspect is that during the peak of infections the general advice was that masks were of little use for the general public, possibly worse than not wearing one, not effective unless trained in their use, and so forth.

Now with infections reduced after more economically damaging measures, and with pubs opening and a lot of the fear gone, there is little chance that the majority are going to start wearing them now. "Sure haven't we beaten the virus, why would we be wearing masks now?"

Boggles

Bit cynical wrote: »

Another aspect is that during the peak of infections the general advice was that masks were of little use for the general public, possibly worse than not wearing one, not effective unless trained in their use, and so forth.


Now with infections reduced through more economically damaging measures, pubs opening and a lot of the fear gone, there is little chance that the majority are going to start wearing them now.

The masks are less than useless advice was simply an outright sustained lie.

Very hard go full reverse on that now, if not impossible until/if it surges again.

Of course is has more chance of surging without widespread mask usage.

But hey, when they were spouting they were going to be 100% honest from the start and they weren't, these are the things that happen.

I guess we can all wash our hands faster for 30 seconds.

Boggles

AlekSmart wrote: »

As you allude to,and many people on reflection recall,the October-December 2019 period saw many people fall ill with a debilitating flu-like 'Bug' which,from speaking with some who had it,completely floored them,to the extent of spending Christmas shivering in bed.

Whether or not that transfers into immunity to CV-19 is open to debate,but it does indicate that everybody was happily interacting and high-fiving for many months before the WHO's snappy title department came up with Covid-19 as a title to focus our attention on.

There is zero evidence the virus was in Europe before mid December, apart from people claiming they had a bad dose, which could have just been a bad dose.

khalessi

Yes: surgical

Boggles wrote: »

There is zero evidence the virus was in Europe before mid December, apart from people claiming they had a bad dose, which could have just been a bad dose.

No but there were French army athletes who attended the World War games in October in Wuchan, China along with Ireland and other countries who became sick as a result

Boggles

khalessi wrote: »

No but there were French army athletes who attended the World War games in October in Wuchan, China along with Ireland and other countries who became sick as a result

But that isn't evidence.

That just means some people got sick, we don't know what made them sick. It's very easy determine and as far as I know, no athletes that attended tested positive for it or have shown antibodies until they arrived home and were tested after spending time in heavily infected areas.

They are actively retro testing sewage samples and blood samples from last year, the earliest it has been found is the 18th of December. The earliest confirmed case is the end of December in France.

It's not a coincidence that the places it took off in first in Europe are some of the most visited places on the planet.

dfx-

No: other

With what seems to be emerging as the long term effects of those who have 'recovered' from the virus - prolonged tiredness, gaunt appearance, low energy, occlusions in the lungs - it's more than being sick and was not around before December.

Wyldwood

Yes: surgical

Was in the supermarket today and was pleasantly surprised to see more than 50% of people masked and along comes a guy shouting at people that masks were useless, there's no virus and the whole world was shut down for nothing. Nor did he keep his distance. Intimidating those of us wearing masks.

This time with style

Wyldwood wrote:

Was in the supermarket today and was pleasantly surprised to see more than 50% of people masked and along comes a guy shouting at people that masks were useless, there's no virus and the whole world was shut down for nothing. Nor did he keep his distance. Intimidating those of us wearing masks.

Oh. One of the enlightened...

xhomelezz

Yes: valved

This time with style wrote: »

Oh. One of the enlightened...

Pubs are open, there's gonna be more prophets coming

railer201

Yes: valved

xhomelezz wrote: »

Pubs are open, there's gonna be more prophets coming

........when the alcohol inspired 'super logic' sets in.

AUDI20

No: other

Wyldwood wrote: »

Was in the supermarket today and was pleasantly surprised to see more than 50% of people masked and along comes a guy shouting at people that masks were useless, there's no virus and the whole world was shut down for nothing. Nor did he keep his distance. Intimidating those of us wearing masks.

Theres a few of those prophets on boards as well

xhomelezz

Yes: valved

railer201 wrote: »

........when the alcohol inspired 'super logic' sets in.

Should be simple enough for them

dfx-

dfx- wrote: »

if we had a cent for every "in two weeks it will be worse" and "the second wave", the streets could be paved with gold.

It's the bogeyman that never has to go away. No matter what happens, "in two weeks" it will be worse.

The people continously posting this seem oblivious to the fact that this has been trotting out for about 2 months now, yet cases decline..

MipMap

Yes: homemade

"Winter is Coming"
Ned Stark

McGiver

No: I don't care enough

AdamD wrote:

The people continously posting this seem oblivious to the fact that this has been trotting out for about 2 months now, yet cases decline..

What two months?
The lock-down was really loosened only on 29 June. We're now too business as usual. We'll see how it goes.

Seanergy

Yes: valved

Pre 2020 pretty much the only time I saw public mask wearing was by commuters in polluted/smoggy Asian captials via Media.

What opinion did punters on this thread have of public wearing masks pre 2020?

Living Off The Splash

Yes: homemade

Saw an elderly couple walking through Stillorgan Shopping Centre yesterday. She was wearing a mask. He was walking along beside her with no mask. I am trying to figure out the logic of this?

is_that_so

No: other

Living Off The Splash wrote: »

Saw an elderly couple walking through Stillorgan Shopping Centre yesterday. She was wearing a mask. He was walking along beside her with no mask. I am trying to figure out the logic of this?

I see this fairly often although it can be either. I suppose it could down to them feeling very nervous or having a condition that puts them potentially at risk.

Seanergy

Yes: valved

Maybe she was having a bad teeth day. Who knows.

Seanergy

Yes: valved

is_that_so wrote: »

I see this fairly often although it can be either. I suppose it's could down to them feeling very nervous or having a condition that puts them potentially at risk.

Who knows. Maybe he bashed her on on the smoocher that morning, maybe his elastic snapped off when he went to put his mask on that morning, who knows.

Stark

No: other

Maybe they function as independent minds and she's pro mask while he's of a more stubborn disposition.

Living Off The Splash

Yes: homemade

is_that_so wrote: »

I see this fairly often although it can be either. I suppose it could down to them feeling very nervous or having a condition that puts them potentially at risk.

But he wasn't wearing a mask.....he picks up Covid…..then passes it on to the wife when he goes home when she takes off her mask.

Boggles

Living Off The Splash wrote: »

But he wasn't wearing a mask.....he picks up Covid…..then passes it on to the wife when he goes home when she takes off her mask.

How do you know they were married or a couple?



Either way it's hardly a huge deal worthy of debate.

jackboy

Was at Aldi today. Packed, no social distancing and maybe about 5% wearing masks. I’ve no issue with this as I was there also but I was surprised that almost all precautions against the virus are now finished.

Passed through a tourist town on the way home and a similar story. Restaurants and cafes were limiting the amount of people inside but this led to large queues on the footpaths around the town with no social distancing and few masks.

The government and Tony Holohan have only themselves to blame for this after lying about the effectiveness of masks.