Will you travel? [Mod Note in Post #1 - Travel Discussion Only! Megathread]

MickeyLeari

Ladylouth wrote: »

Mainland France is 5.73 (French government website). The 11,5 figure includes overseas territories, some of which have high rates still.

Interesting. Wonder have our geniuses figured that out.

BringBackMick

MickeyLeari wrote: »

Interesting. Wonder have our geniuses figured that out.

Good one

faceman

It’s not July 21st. Spain opened her borders to EU citizens on June 21st

Number of outbreaks related to tourists: zero

Despite the fear about opening borders, particularly the Brits, there has been no impact on figures as a result.

What’s interesting is how the Spanish react to outbreaks compared to Ireland. Yesterday ireland was relieved to have only 6 cases. Here in the Valencia region there was 4 cases in a town near Alicante and it was all systems go to control it. (Valencia region has 5m population and stretches down the east coast). There was a day last week with zero cases. Case levels are low here)

We’re just not seeing that same sense of urgency and action in Ireland. It sounds like Ireland is faffing around with face masks

People take it so serious here and you don’t have unions objecting “it’s not our job”. Zero tolerance has been key to stamping it out.

The Irish government, no matter who is in control, seems to get off on pitting people against people. They seem to have been taking their direction on travel from noise on social media.

nc6000

Has anyone been in touch with their travel insurance provider? I find it remarkable that they are stating people who travel outside of Ireland will invalidate their travel insurance even if the country they visit is on the green list. So say I visit France next month (assuming it's on the green list as an example) and a bag containing a laptop is stolen then the travel insurance won't pay out because of Covid-19?

By refusing to cover anyone who travels then surely the insurance providers are invalidating their agreements and making travel insurance irrelevant and should be issuing refunds on policies which are useless now?

Micky 32

Ladylouth wrote: »

Mainland France is 5.73 (French government website). The 11,5 figure includes overseas territories, some of which have high rates still.

. France would be a popular holiday destination and because of that it won’t make the green list regardless of how well they are doing.. The green list is about essential travel.

Micky 32

dodzy wrote: »

Obviously the building site data was not captured. We will see it today.

I think there was approx 20 is cases on the builing site. If the normal cases go back up to the usual 20ish today we could have approx 40+ cases today. I estimate between 35-45 cases.

Del Griffith

faceman wrote: »

What’s interesting is how the Spanish react to outbreaks compared to Ireland. Yesterday ireland was relieved to have only 6 cases. Here in the Valencia region there was 4 cases in a town near Alicante and it was all systems go to control it. (Valencia region has 5m population and stretches down the east coast). There was a day last week with zero cases. Case levels are low here)

We’re just not seeing that same sense of urgency and action in Ireland. It sounds like Ireland is faffing around with face masks

People take it so serious here and you don’t have unions objecting “it’s not our job”. Zero tolerance has been key to stamping it out

Have people totally forgotten that we were told the measures and restrictions were just to flatten the curve so the services could cope?

Zero tolerance as you put it is totally contrary to what we were told all along up until now. Part of opening up is to see new cases, we should absolutely not be going backwards in regard to restrictive measures.

Del Griffith

I'm just back last night from a country with zero cases for ages (2 on Saturday), expecting to see it on the green list yesterday but of course nothing.

I won't be quarantining.

Golf is my Game

Micky 32 wrote: »

. France would be a popular holiday destination and because of that it won’t make the green list regardless of how well they are doing.. The green list is about essential travel.

Yes it's also about the numbers that might go to one of these places. If it's like Faro Islands or Malta then there's not many going anyway so that makes the risk to Ireland low, whereas even if France had a lower R you would have loads going if allowed which overall makes it a higher risk so thats why you shouldn't allow it.

ziedth

We called time on our holiday to Salou/Portaventura in September. I'm glad I didn't tell the kids we had it booked as they were already devestated when we couldn't do to the US for a family in May. Going to Push it to Same time next year and hope for the best.

I still think you would be ok but I went to Dublin Zoo he other day and while it was grand it just wasn't comfortable keeping people/crowd at a distance and half the place closed. I wouldn't like the idea of a week of it. If we were going somewhere to play around on the beach/pool I would have soldiered on I think.

artanevilla

I've come to the conclusion that if you can't afford to lose the money from a cancelled holiday, you can't afford it in the first place.

ZX7R

artanevilla wrote: »

I've come to the conclusion that if you can't afford to lose the money from a cancelled holiday, you can't afford it in the first place.

For some they probably have spent the whole year saving for it so it won't affect there weekly family budget.
A very narrow minded conclusion you have in all fairness

Stephen Gifted Geophysics

Stephen Gifted Geophysics wrote: »

I know what it was they were referring to. They didn't arrive though, it was well written about at the time. :pac:

There were many articles written about how they were going to arrive and infect us all within 10 minutes, but it turned out they didn't arrive at all.

they did. You didnt see them. That doesnt mean they didnt arrive. I met many of them.

I agree they didnt run rampage coughing everywhere but to claim none arrived is simple wrong.

RebelButtMunch

faceman wrote: »

It’s not July 21st. Spain opened her borders to EU citizens on June 21st

Number of outbreaks related to tourists: zero

Despite the fear about opening borders, particularly the Brits, there has been no impact on figures as a result.

What’s interesting is how the Spanish react to outbreaks compared to Ireland. Yesterday ireland was relieved to have only 6 cases. Here in the Valencia region there was 4 cases in a town near Alicante and it was all systems go to control it. (Valencia region has 5m population and stretches down the east coast). There was a day last week with zero cases. Case levels are low here)

We’re just not seeing that same sense of urgency and action in Ireland. It sounds like Ireland is faffing around with face masks

People take it so serious here and you don’t have unions objecting “it’s not our job”. Zero tolerance has been key to stamping it out.

The Irish government, no matter who is in control, seems to get off on pitting people against people. They seem to have been taking their direction on travel from noise on social media.

I agree with your sentiment but wasn't there a case yesterday in Spain ?
https://www.mirror.co.uk/travel/news/breaking-spain-campsite-lockdown-250-22364935

HalloweenJack

faceman wrote: »

What’s interesting is how the Spanish react to outbreaks compared to Ireland. Yesterday ireland was relieved to have only 6 cases. Here in the Valencia region there was 4 cases in a town near Alicante and it was all systems go to control it. (Valencia region has 5m population and stretches down the east coast). There was a day last week with zero cases. Case levels are low here).

Same here in Cordoba. A kid tested positive a few days after going to a graduation party at a nightclub. All the 400 people who had been at the party and the staff were tested within a day. The nightclub has been closed until further notice although no-one wants to go there anyway. 70 positives, iirc, from those tested, most of them asymptomatic. They were caught early on. A little shock for the locals but people are still being cautious. Bars have been open for two months at this stage and this was the first surge here.

I think in some regions, like Murcia and Extremadura iirc, nightclubs are closed and bars are terrace-only. A lot of regions are enforcing masks when in public and fining those who don't wear then. Spain is taking it seriously.

Iirc, facemasks are only mandatory on transport and recommended in public back in Ireland yet I get the feeling Spain is being painted as some free-for-all with people not caring.

lainey_d_123

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

Oh, come on. This is absolute nonsense.

Its nobody's business if their colleague has HIV because you can't get that from casual contact. Ebola is incredibly rare compared to this coronavirus, especially right now. The death rate from Covid is higher than seasonal flu, and it seems to affect quite a large percentage of people quite badly, even if they survive it.

I'm not saying we should all hide at home for the next three years or however long, but this sort of nonsense thinking is just dangerous. It's not 'a bit of flu', it's a horrible, unpredictable, highly contagious disease. I know several people who are seriously ill with it and have been for several months. They're young people who were previously fit and healthy. We shouldn't be hysterical, but the other extreme isn't helpful either, and is part of the reason things got as bad as they did - Western governments going 'ah it's just a bit of flu, it'll be grand'.

did you see the part where I specifically stated this myself?

My comment isnt about being sensible, its about allowing your company to control a totally private aspect of your life and so many people just going along with it. The fact that each disease is in its own way unique doesnt change that. It proves my point.

HIV is contacted via bodily fluids. Does the copmpany have a policy regarding their HIV positive staff in their private lives? No, of course not even though they could sleep with another staff member. Hell, they could cut themselves and get treated by another staff member but they are in the workforce anyway. Im not encouraging such a policy either by the way before anyone reads on isolated sentence and goes nuts.

again, if I was in an Ebola area, my company would not require I isolate even though thats a deadly disease in many cases. The flu kills, are you claiming it doesnt? Yes, I know this is more contagious and at present, more fatal. I understand that but in many ways its pretty similar and yet staff still turn up when they have the flu. I could go on; TB, Hep C.........

there is absolutely not an obligation or a right for a company to dictate in the manner we are seeing now. The claim that its for staffs own good? Cmon now. Anyone sensible knows that refers to reasonable steps in the workplace. Not peoples homes. Providing sanitiser, masks and encouraging distancing is all they need do to have met the standard. prying into and attempting to control what staff do in their own time is a step too far. A step that companies have gotten away with when it comes to social media already.

Del Griffith

artanevilla wrote: »

I've come to the conclusion that if you can't afford to lose the money from a cancelled holiday, you can't afford it in the first place.

Yes, because booking a holiday is exactly like betting, investing or gambling.

bladespin

artanevilla wrote: »

I've come to the conclusion that if you can't afford to lose the money from a cancelled holiday, you can't afford it in the first place.

I honestly can't understand this kind of thinking, grand if you're not short and have money to throw away but there are many who scrimp and save for a holiday (or something else) and to loose it means they not only loose the money itself but any chance of a different holiday; stay-cation, deferral or whatever.

Collie D

Seems likely these green list countries are going to come with the "no non-essential travel" recommendation.

I took a punt on Hungary a couple of weeks ago (due to travel on Friday) which I fully expect to make the list but was also hoping for a travel advisory downgrade of "with caution". I'll probably skip it now.

I just don't get the thinking behind this. If government don't want us to travel why issue a list? Once the non-essential advice is attached there may as well be none.

moritz1234

moritz1234 wrote: »

6th July to 15th July
10 day analysis
Cases per 100,000 people

Rep of Ireland 3.3
UK 9.57
Spain 13.09*
Germany 3.95
Italy 3.13
France 7.88

* Spain includes historical antibody test results as well. If anyone has just the cases only data please let me know.

Analysis 6th - 20th July
14 days
Cases per 100,000 people

Rep of Ireland 4.86
UK 13.81
Spain 25.52 *
Germany 5.85
Italy4.67
France 12.63 **

* Spain includes historical antibody test results as well. Figures can't be correct for true analysis.
**France includes overseas territories, some of which have high rates still

***France and Spain also produce the same figure for a Saturday and a Sunday and World of Meters have not addressed this issue!

Omitting the weekend duplications
Spain 20.80 *
France 11.31**

The French and Spanish figures can't be correct

bladespin

Collie D wrote: »

I just don't get the thinking behind this. If government don't want us to travel why issue a list? Once the non-essential advice is attached there may as well be none.

I would hazard a guess they're doing it so as not to pee the EU off.

facehugger99

artanevilla wrote: »

I've come to the conclusion that if you can't afford to lose the money from a cancelled holiday, you can't afford it in the first place.

I can totally afford to lose it but am going on holiday anyway

facehugger99

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

did you see the part where I specifically stated this myself?

My comment isnt about being sensible, its about allowing your company to control a totally private aspect of your life and so many people just going along with it. The fact that each disease is in its own way unique doesnt change that. It proves my point.

HIV is contacted via bodily fluids. Does the copmpany have a policy regarding their HIV positive staff in their private lives? No, of course not even though they could sleep with another staff member. Hell, they could cut themselves and get treated by another staff member but they are in the workforce anyway. Im not encouraging such a policy either by the way before anyone reads on isolated sentence and goes nuts.

again, if I was in an Ebola area, my company would not require I isolate even though thats a deadly disease in many cases. The flu kills, are you claiming it doesnt? Yes, I know this is more contagious and at present, more fatal. I understand that but in many ways its pretty similar and yet staff still turn up when they have the flu. I could go on; TB, Hep C.........

there is absolutely not an obligation or a right for a company to dictate in the manner we are seeing now. The claim that its for staffs own good? Cmon now. Anyone sensible knows that refers to reasonable steps in the workplace. Not peoples homes. Providing sanitiser, masks and encouraging distancing is all they need do to have met the standard. prying into and attempting to control what staff do in their own time is a step too far. A step that companies have gotten away with when it comes to social media already.

100% agree and it's deeply concerning the amount of people that are seemingly willing to acquiesce to this invasion of rights and privacy with a shrug of the shoulders. The company i work for has zero right to know what I get up to in my private time.

It's a very dangerous road people are traveling down, hard-won rights are being traded away with abandon on the promise of 'safety'- we can already see how difficult it is to wrestle them back.

BobMc

bladespin wrote: »

I honestly can't understand this kind of thinking, grand if you're not short and have money to throw away but there are many who scrimp and save for a holiday (or something else) and to loose it means they not only loose the money itself but any chance of a different holiday; stay-cation, deferral or whatever.

I concur, we're not loaded, my wifes puts money away for a year for each years holidays, thats other sacrifices we've to make to put that spare money into savings

we're 3k in the hole (thats after tax earnings) all thats to be saved is spending money if not travelling, Not much left in pot for staycation now,

If your holiday was in earlier in lockdown you'll be getting or already received your refund for cancelled flights etc. Not so for anyone due out soon with bookings done 7 or 8 months +

faceman

faceman wrote: »

It’s not July 21st. Spain opened her borders to EU citizens on June 21st

Number of outbreaks related to tourists: zero

Despite the fear about opening borders, particularly the Brits, there has been no impact on figures as a result.

What’s interesting is how the Spanish react to outbreaks compared to Ireland. Yesterday ireland was relieved to have only 6 cases. Here in the Valencia region there was 4 cases in a town near Alicante and it was all systems go to control it. (Valencia region has 5m population and stretches down the east coast). There was a day last week with zero cases. Case levels are low here)

We’re just not seeing that same sense of urgency and action in Ireland. It sounds like Ireland is faffing around with face masks

People take it so serious here and you don’t have unions objecting “it’s not our job”. Zero tolerance has been key to stamping it out.

The Irish government, no matter who is in control, seems to get off on pitting people against people. They seem to have been taking their direction on travel from noise on social media.

What does "all systems go to control it" entail?

BringBackMick

Collie D wrote: »

Seems likely these green list countries are going to come with the "no non-essential travel" recommendation.

I took a punt on Hungary a couple of weeks ago (due to travel on Friday) which I fully expect to make the list but was also hoping for a travel advisory downgrade of "with caution". I'll probably skip it now.

I just don't get the thinking behind this. If government don't want us to travel why issue a list? Once the non-essential advice is attached there may as well be none.

It has to be reduced to 'with caution' otherwise it makes completely no sense.

The overall call might remain as no non-essential travel but the travel advice from the department for the green list has to reduce to with caution otherwise it is just a utter joke and makes a complete mockery of the system.

We are the most closed country in Europe at the moment and it is damaging for a lot of people.

fawlty682

RebelButtMunch wrote: »

I agree with your sentiment but wasn't there a case yesterday in Spain ?
https://www.mirror.co.uk/travel/news/breaking-spain-campsite-lockdown-250-22364935

Irish Government have no plan except for the population to continue protective measures, which is fine, but cocooning the whole country from travel is no strategy. Any measures like airport testing, temperature checks are not done because they are not 100% effective. Ridiculous. We spend months discussing things like masks. Our facilities and transport are inadequate. The myth of other countries being irresponsible with the virus is promoted. They enforce as you say. Since FF joined Government it has become silly.

54and56

BringBackMick wrote: »

It has to be reduced to 'with caution' otherwise it makes completely no sense.

Your statement is logical but the mood noise from "sources" and even from ministers over the last few days is that the Greenlist, which was originally floated as being a list of safe travel corridor countries, is now going to be a list of countries from which you won't have to do the 14 day quasi quarantine on return but it will not facilitate the free for all travel originally anticipated, it'll only be for essential travel hence the DFA advisory against all but essential travel is likely to remain in place with all that implies.

Very frustrating.

Micky 32

I see Varadkar is criticizing about the non essential travel advice for the green list of countries saying there’s not much point having a green list if that’s the case.

However Varadkar is all for the green list.

Apparently there’s fewer than 12 countries on it.

Biscuitus

Grueller Baby wrote: »

I can never understand this line of thinking. Whether you go or not o as soon as you booked the flight that money was written off. If you can’t afford to write the cost off then why pay in the first place?

Why could you possible be in financial position to not through away a thousand plus quid the poster asks on a forum dedicated to a global pandemic that has caused mass unemployment and will be the start of a global recession that will take years to recover from.........

facehugger99 wrote: »

In other words you want taxpayers to foot the bill because you're going to be too scared to come out of your fear-cave for the next few years.

Er, no thanks.

Eh no. Are you also unaware that you are posting on a forum dedicated to a global pandemic that will be the start of a global recession that will take years to recover from. Irish people will have to look more into staycations to support the future of Ireland.(Although the cost of some staycations have been more than my holidays abroad so something has to change there).

artanevilla wrote: »

I've come to the conclusion that if you can't afford to lose the money from a cancelled holiday, you can't afford it in the first place.

Work hard. Save money. Global pandemic causes mass unemployment and financial uncertainty with a looming recession. Holiday goer can't afford to lose the money they put towards their holiday because it will be their last for a long time.

No wonder we are heading for another lockdown. How are people so unaware of what is going on when they are on a forum that can keep them up to date.