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What have we come to

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    #2882
    GreeBo
    Registered Users Posts: 27,121 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    Bowie the real issues is, the created a crisis for some, but for themselves, their cronies and the vast majority of the electorate, who are non renters. they have played a blinder... there is the issue. that is the point, morally corrput bastards, but this situation isnt unique to ireland, seems to be all over the english speaking world. If you have a bit of time, watch this, it explains why governments love rip off housing...

    Hang on a second.
    Its now morally corrupt to do what, in your own words is best for the "vast majority of the electorate"?

    Democracy anyone?


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    #2883
    facehugger99
    Registered Users Posts: 7,255 ✭✭✭facehugger99


    Bowie wrote: »
    It's FG making decisions caused the housing crisis to grow among other things, so no they need to stop.

    Returning the country to full employment, the bastards!


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    #2884
    Yurt2
    Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    More credit should be given to the Irish people and less to the likes of Michael Noonan etc for the restored growth in the country.

    FG aren't responsible for the steady global economic growth since 2012 or so, and they should really stop trying to take the credit for it.

    The housing crisis however, was a failure of inaction and dogma in area where the government had competency and did nothing to stop the slowly evolving train crash. They should carry the can for that one. Ditto with health.


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    #2885
    solidasarock
    Registered Users Posts: 334 ✭✭solidasarock


    facehugger99 wrote: »
    Returning the country to full employment, the bastards!

    Everyone has **** paying jobs and high rent.

    Well done lads!


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    #2886
    facehugger99
    Registered Users Posts: 7,255 ✭✭✭facehugger99


    solidasarock wrote: »
    Everyone has **** paying jobs and high rent.

    I don't.


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    #2887
    Yurt2
    Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    facehugger99 wrote: »
    I don't.

    Hooray for you. Let's never change anything ever in that case.

    Case closed lads. We've cracked it.


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    #2888
    Brendan Bendar
    Registered Users Posts: 19,172 ✭✭✭✭Brendan Bendar


    Yurt! wrote: »
    More credit should be given to the Irish people and less to the likes of Michael Noonan etc for the restored growth in the country.

    FG aren't responsible for the steady global economic growth since 2012 or so, and they should really stop trying to take the credit for it.

    The housing crisis however, was a failure of inaction and dogma in area where the government had competency and did nothing to stop the slowly evolving train crash. They should carry the can for that one. Ditto with health.

    You remind me of the guy who loses his well paid job and instead of pumping all available effort into establishing replacement income and reducing expenditure, borrows to upgrade the two cars immediately and borrows more for a three week break in Dubai.


    :rolleyes:


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    #2889
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users Posts: 36,236 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    facehugger99 wrote: »
    Returning the country to full employment, the bastards!

    People understand this, believe me. So they say: ‘if I cannot get a house now, if my parent cannot get a scan now, but when?’


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    #2890
    quokula
    Registered Users Posts: 3,582 ✭✭✭quokula


    Yurt! wrote: »
    FG aren't responsible for the steady global economic growth since 2012 or so, and they should really stop trying to take the credit for it.

    503448.png


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    #2891
    storker
    Registered Users Posts: 5,646 ✭✭✭storker


    quokula wrote: »
    503448.png

    Source?

    Assuming that this chart does in fact indicate comparative growth, please outline, being specific and with explanations of cause-and-effect, which of FG's policies brought about Ireland's greater rate of growth.


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    #2892
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,048 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Here's a couple of other graphs...

    1.jpg



    2.jpg


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    #2893
    GreeBo
    Registered Users Posts: 27,121 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    storker wrote: »
    Source?

    Assuming that this chart does in fact indicate comparative growth, please outline, being specific and with explanations of cause-and-effect, which of FG's policies brought about Ireland's greater rate of growth.

    Well if it wasnt the government policies of the time, what was it?


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    #2894
    storker
    Registered Users Posts: 5,646 ✭✭✭storker


    GreeBo wrote: »
    Well if it wasnt the government policies of the time, what was it?

    It could have been a rising tide that was happening anyway and lifted the Irish boat with it. It's a bit mysterious that so many seem to be convinced that FG brought about growth, but when pressed are never able to explain how. If someone is so sure that FG caused something, then they must know what FG did to cause it. Otherwise it suspiciously looks like they're just believing what they were told by, er...FG.

    What's your explanation?


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    #2895
    GreeBo
    Registered Users Posts: 27,121 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    storker wrote: »
    It could have been a rising tide that was happening anyway and lifted the Irish boat with it. It's a bit mysterious that so many seem to be convinced that FG brought about growth, but when pressed are never able to explain how. If someone is so sure that FG caused something, then they must know what FG did to cause it. Otherwise it suspiciously looks like they're just believing what they were told by, er...FG.

    What's your explanation?

    The rising tide that brought the Irish boat 2-3 times higher?

    Lets turn the argument on its head.
    During the last 9 years the Irish economy has outgrown the euro area.
    Please explain how this is not due to the policies of the government at the time?


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    #2896
    storker
    Registered Users Posts: 5,646 ✭✭✭storker


    GreeBo wrote: »
    The rising tide that brought the Irish boat 2-3 times higher?

    Lets turn the argument on its head.
    During the last 9 years the Irish economy has outgrown the euro area.
    Please explain how this is not due to the policies of the government at the time?

    (a) It's not possible to prove a negative, and (b) I'm not the one making the claim. I'm saying that I'm not convinced of the claim that's being made. I'm saying that if FG really is responsible for the growth, show me what it did and how it worked, i.e. back up the claim, with fact and numbers, also known as "evidence". Can you do that?


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    #2897
    The Rape of Lucretia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,440 ✭✭✭The Rape of Lucretia


    Oh my God in his himmel ! The former (and maybe current) Chief of Staff of the IRA from the UK is in negotiations about the next government in Ireland.
    What indeed have we come to ?


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    #2898
    Cupatae
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,915 ✭✭✭Cupatae


    facehugger99 wrote: »
    Returning the country to full employment, the bastards!

    Its fantastic most people in full employment, still cant afford basic living people should be ****in buzzing.. unreal! what a time to be alive!


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    #2899
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,048 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Cupatae wrote: »
    Its fantastic most people in full employment, still cant afford basic living people should be ****in buzzing.. unreal! what a time to be alive!

    "Economic growth" doesn't mean shit, if you still cannot afford the basics.

    So you have a crappy job and are productive, working long hours and commuting back and forth to your parents house.

    Great.


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    #2900
    Cupatae
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,915 ✭✭✭Cupatae


    Tony EH wrote: »
    "Economic growth" doesn't mean shit, if you still cannot afford the basics.

    So you have a crappy job and are productive, working long hours and commuting back and forth to your parents house.

    Great.

    It makes me laugh that "full employment" is like the go too stick lol

    https://www.thejournal.ie/minimum-wage-2-1871627-Jan2015/

    Thats what "full employment" and "Economic growth" looks like for alot of people, aside from the car bit.


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    #2901
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,048 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Cupatae wrote: »
    It makes me laugh that "full employment" is like the go too stick lol

    https://www.thejournal.ie/minimum-wage-2-1871627-Jan2015/

    Thats what "full employment" and "Economic growth" looks like for alot of people.

    This is another meaningless mantra.

    "Full employment" doesn't mean shit either, when you can't buy the basics and these days employment is a transitory thing. You certainly cannot plan anything long term, like buying a home, using it as a yardstick.

    Your "employment" might be offshored at the drop of a hat, on the whim of an employer. Redundancy is always lurking over the shoulder of employees today.

    I'd say for a lot of people these days, the average length of time in one job is about 3 or 4 years.


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    #2902
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,347 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »
    Oh my God in his himmel ! The former (and maybe current) Chief of Staff of the IRA from the UK is in negotiations about the next government in Ireland.
    What indeed have we come to ?


    Sinn Fein aren’t serious about government. They are playing a game.


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    #2903
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users Posts: 17,849 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Sinn Fein aren’t serious about government. They are playing a game.

    SF are the final resort of a stick, to try and get FFG to get their useless fingers out! The were a tool used for that purpose


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    #2904
    road_high
    Registered Users Posts: 19,398 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Sinn Fein aren’t serious about government. They are playing a game.

    Outside of social media ranting and likes, there’s little sf are serious about or indeed useful for


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    #2905
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Tony EH wrote: »
    "Economic growth" doesn't mean shit, if you still cannot afford the basics.

    So you have a crappy job and are productive, working long hours and commuting back and forth to your parents house.

    Great.

    FG know this and thankfully the public are beginning to.
    blanch152 wrote: »
    Sinn Fein aren’t serious about government. They are playing a game.

    FG said they are relishing opposition and today in talks with FF. Also the Greens ran their lad for Taoiseach so they wouldn't be expected to side with anyone else. So give over.


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    #2906
    storker
    Registered Users Posts: 5,646 ✭✭✭storker


    road_high wrote: »
    Outside of social media ranting and likes, there’s little sf are serious about or indeed useful for

    And yet they still got more votes and seats than FG. Goes to show how useful FG is... ;)


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    #2907
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users Posts: 17,849 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    why are the FG supporters so angry about SF? FG are the ones that lost votes, because they chose to prioritise those others than the early risers, that they claimed they would help. this is all of FG own making. try to please everyone and they please no one. In fact they were so concerned about the "poor and vulnerable" they forgot, that not one of them likely ever has or ever will vote FG :rolleyes: Shows you how spineless they are! Probably worried one of them would have to go onto the far left RTE and defend rewarding who they said they would, many of them, the working poor (the heartless bastards) :rolleyes:


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    #2908
    GreeBo
    Registered Users Posts: 27,121 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    storker wrote: »
    (a) It's not possible to prove a negative, and (b) I'm not the one making the claim. I'm saying that I'm not convinced of the claim that's being made. I'm saying that if FG really is responsible for the growth, show me what it did and how it worked, i.e. back up the claim, with fact and numbers, also known as "evidence". Can you do that?

    The evidence is that Ireland outperformed the rest of the euro zone.

    What other evidence would you expect? In any country, in any scenario, how would you go about proving cause and effect of economic policy?

    Unless you have some method of resetting to the start, implementing a different policy and observing the difference, it would seem you are just being contrarian.


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    #2909
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,395 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Sinn Fein aren’t serious about government. They are playing a game.

    :D:D:D:D

    FF - We won't form a government with FG

    FG - We will go into opposition.


    Next week - FF and FG go in talks about forming a government.

    But SF are playing a game??? :D:D:D


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    #2910
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    FrancieBrady wrote: »

    FF - We won't form a government with FG

    FG - We will go into opposition.


    Next week - FF and FG go in talks about forming a government.

    But SF are playing a game???


    SF in the mean time are trying to convince everyone they are not run by the IRA :p:p


    Even thou other Garda and PSNI say they are!!! I know who I believe


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    #2911
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    SF in the mean time are trying to convince everyone they are not run by the IRA :p:p


    Even thou other Garda and PSNI say they are!!! I know who I believe

    The Charlie Tan-again appointed former RUC/MI5 employee believes a report from 2015 from MI5. Fair play, I'd expect so.
    Keep it up please :)

    How is this solving the housing and insurance and health crises and how many f***s do the electorate give to it? :)


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