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Trevor Deely case - new witness

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    #752
    andekwarhola
    Registered Users Posts: 4,638 ✭✭✭andekwarhola


    20Wheel wrote: »
    Come up with a better theory consistent with what facts are available then.

    Anyone can criticise. 'Poopooing' I believe its called.

    Right on, Columbo.


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    #753
    Fr Tod Umptious
    Registered Users Posts: 15,029 ✭✭✭✭Fr Tod Umptious


    20Wheel wrote: »
    Come up with a better theory consistent with what facts are available then.

    Anyone can criticise. 'Poopooing' I believe its called.

    The idea that a number of criminals organised themselves to target a young guy that they have observed going working in a "bank" as a robbery target is a bit far fetched.

    If they were that organized, i.e. observed people leave and enter the building, walk home along the roads nearby etc as you suggest then a better target would be a single female or an older male, as the older male would likely have more cash on them than the younger, almost student looking guy.

    Why not target a person that they know works in a actual real retail bank ?
    Or a shop keeper, or a publican going to the night safe ?

    Not to mention the fact that MIB stands in plain view of a camera for 30 mins in the pissing rain.

    The only facts we have is the Trevor was last seen walking down Haddington Rd, the MIB has never been identified, and that the man walking behind Trevor down Haddington Rd may be the MIB


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    #754
    KWAG2019
    Closed Accounts Posts: 834 ✭✭✭KWAG2019


    tdf7187 wrote: »
    I am surprised that she does not take her complaints up with the Press Complaints Commission, as the article in the OP emanated from a media organisation regulated by them.

    If the article alleges that Gardai said there was a “highly significant” witness and that is then denied to the family by the Gardai, the Gardai need to take a look at it too.


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    #755
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,569 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    20Wheel wrote: »
    My hole.

    Im sick of this gatekeeping. I find it sanctimonious and disengenuous. Just for people who want to tell teacher.

    If its closed here it simply moves to reddit.

    They have no problem with people discussing Trevor.
    It’s the mad conspiracy stuff they have problems with.


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    #756
    smelly sock
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,820 ✭✭✭smelly sock


    tayto lover wrote: »
    Yes. I heard the interview and the family are clearly upset with all the budding Sherlock Holmes’s on the internet.

    Thread should be closed. And we should all stop posting about it. Tbf to posters here the lad vanished into think air. With all due respect to Trevors family people will speculate and theorise. We have certain facts and are being given info by the media then.


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    #757
    Fr Tod Umptious
    Registered Users Posts: 15,029 ✭✭✭✭Fr Tod Umptious


    tdf7187 wrote: »
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe it was ever established that it was the same MIB.

    It's a bit inconsistent

    Gardai have said they are "satisfied" that it's the same man, but also a Garda on Prime TV or some other RTE show when the footage came out infers that it may not be the same man


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    #758
    TwoMonthsOff
    Registered Users Posts: 343 ✭✭TwoMonthsOff


    Does anyone believe that he drunkenly fell or was blown over the wall into Dodder ? I seen that theory put forward before. I dont buy it myself.


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    #759
    TheW1zard
    Registered Users Posts: 1,340 ✭✭✭TheW1zard


    tdf7187 wrote: »
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe it was ever established that it was the same MIB.

    It seems the Guards do believe he is, on Wikpedia (which I know isnt gospel, and also that his Sister has a big problem with some facts) it says the guards released a statement believing him to be the same.

    https://www.garda.ie/en/Crime-Prevention/Crimecall-on-RTE/Crimecall-Episodes/2017/April-24/Missing-Person-Trevor-Deely.html

    Thats from the garda website.


    So is it the case then? If it is he is involved.


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    #760
    20Wheel
    Registered Users Posts: 728 ✭✭✭20Wheel


    TwoMonthsOff wrote: »
    Does anyone believe that he drunkenly fell or was blown over the wall into Dodder ? I seen that theory put forward before. I dont buy it myself.

    As far as I can tell there was the Israeli embassy located along the route that leads to the bridge over the dodder at at the time.

    Its still there today, but I can't find if it was always there.

    Anyway the Israeli embassy, any Israeli embassy, would surely have cameras up the ass of anyone within 100 meters. And a library of minor events.


    And there was no reported footage of him going past their building.

    Similar story with the US embassy.

    Putin is a dictator. Putin should face justice at the Hague. All good Russians should work to depose Putin. Russias war in Ukraine is illegal and morally wrong.



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    #761
    tdf7187
    Registered Users Posts: 1,597 ✭✭✭tdf7187


    tuxy wrote: »
    From listening to the interview it's clear his sister monitors online posts closely so just keep that in mind.
    Yes, continue to talk about it as it keeps the topic in peoples minds and it may help but some of the theories on here would puts the lads in the conspiracy theories forum to shame.

    The family can't have it both ways. I am getting the impression that they want Trevor's case kept in the public eye, which of course is to their credit but no more than any family would do, but they only want people saying nice things about what might have happened to him. If my impression is correct, this seems to me not a reasonable approach. Perhaps the mods should review the thread, I personally didn't see anything off-the-wall in any posts in the thread, but don't shoot the messenger. If the article in the OP is wrong, then their grievance is with the newspaper owned by the same proprietor who owns the radio channel they gave the interview to.


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    #762
    Peter Flynt
    Registered Users Posts: 2,812 ✭✭✭Peter Flynt


    The Deely family have gone through incredible hardship and they should be commended, with the Gardaí, for never giving up for finding out what happened to Trevor.

    From the search in Chapelizod it's quite clear that AGS believe that Trevor came to harm with unsavoury characters in an area well known for on the street criminality and where there were suspicious looking people interacting with Trevor in the last known hours of when he was last seen.

    I think that AGS & the Deely family have a very good idea of what happened to Trevor but can never prosecute without more information/evidence and therefore the annual appeal for information on the anniversary of when Trevor went missing is really an appeal to those they believe are withholding information deliberately to look into their consciences.


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    #763
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,569 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    smelly sock wrote: »
    Thread should be closed. And we should all stop posting about it. Tbf to posters here the lad vanished into think air. With all due respect to Trevors family people will speculate and theorise. We have certain facts and are being given info by the media then.

    It’s just the mad conspiracy theory stuff she seems to be upset by.
    They don’t want people to stop talking about their brother.


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    #764
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    20Wheel wrote: »
    As far as I can tell there was the Israeli embassy located along the route that leads to the bridge over the dodder at at the time.

    Its still there today, but I can't find if it was always there.

    Anyway the Israeli embassy, any Israeli embassy, would surely have cameras up the ass of anyone within 100 meters. And a library of minor events.


    And there was no reported footage of him going past their building.

    Similar story with the US embassy.

    Northumberland road also has the Czech embassy and Italian embassy(not sure if this one was there at the time). All embassy would have some level of security which would include cameras as a bare minimum.


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    #765
    KWAG2019
    Closed Accounts Posts: 834 ✭✭✭KWAG2019


    tayto lover wrote: »
    Yes. I heard the interview and the family are clearly upset with all the budding Sherlock Holmes’s on the internet.

    Any of the more outlandish theories have really been demolished by now. The inevitability of speculation was mentioned previously here: quite simply there would be no thread without it. I’ve already pointed out that the key piece of CCTV is in police possession because of the activity of one of the Deely family who took prompt action before the police did.

    On a different note there are interesting developments about where internet researchers can solve some missing persons issues: https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2019/11/when-internet-sleuths-solved-murder-mystery/601636/


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    #766
    STB.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭STB.


    Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »
    The idea that a number of criminals organised themselves to target a young guy that they have observed going working in a "bank" as a robbery target is a bit far fetched.

    If they were that organized, i.e. observed people leave and enter the building, walk home along the roads nearby etc as you suggest then a better target would be a single female or an older male, as the older male would likely have more cash on them than the younger, almost student looking guy.

    Why not target a person that they know works in a actual real retail bank ?
    Or a shop keeper, or a publican going to the night safe ?

    Not to mention the fact that MIB stands in plain view of a camera for 30 mins in the pissing rain.

    The only facts we have is the Trevor was last seen walking down Haddington Rd, the MIB has never been identified, and that the man walking behind Trevor down Haddington Rd may be the MIB

    Have you any idea what type of vermin hang around Dublin city at night time ? This was at a time of poor analogue CCTV and no smart phones.

    Organised criminals is where you are going wrong. Not all of them are organised. Most are/were junkies. Late night attacks like this could have been opportunistic, could have got out of hand, or unplanned evil. There were a lot of headcases around at that time. Stories have appeared in the paper about a notorious Crumlin based criminal family who hung around the Baggot Street area at the time (on foot of statements made to Gardai). They were dealers to the prostitutes from what I have read, some killed for a few hundred quid they owed.

    The family will get upset with what they perceive as amateur detectives. However at least people are talking about that poor lad. You are dependent about it being in the public eye again and upon someone knowing the full story to come forward with what they have known for years as circumstances change, people fall out, people die etc.


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    #767
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    tayto lover wrote: »
    It’s just the mad conspiracy theory stuff she seems to be upset by.
    They don’t want people to stop talking about their brother.

    Yeah just the stuff like he was a target because he worked at a bank, he was entry level in a IT job. And the things said about people from Alaska coming over to get him. He was there for a holiday that he clearly enjoyed and was excited to tell people about.


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    #768
    Fr Tod Umptious
    Registered Users Posts: 15,029 ✭✭✭✭Fr Tod Umptious


    TwoMonthsOff wrote: »
    Does anyone believe that he drunkenly fell or was blown over the wall into Dodder ? I seen that theory put forward before. I dont buy it myself.

    I have always believed that him falling into the Dodder by accident, not necessarily being blown in, was far more likely a scenario that any run-ins with criminals, or other nefarious incidents.

    However in the interview with his sister she is very clear that there has been no DNA with any recovered bodies in the UK or Ireland, so that makes the above a less likely theory.


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    #769
    tara73
    Registered Users Posts: 2,341 ✭✭✭tara73


    .


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    #770
    Muahahaha
    Registered Users Posts: 19,615 ✭✭✭✭Muahahaha


    sugarman wrote: »
    I think a lot of it stems from the crazy amatuer Youtube "documentaries" for lack of better word that are not only filled with dozens of inaccuracies of the basic facts established but completely off the wall conspiracy theories.

    They're all mad Americans with absolutely no clue of not only the case, but the Irish culture in general.. the area the incident happened.. the era in Ireland of when it happened etc.. etc..

    Yet there are people stupid enough to believe their every word and buy into it.

    Yeah I think the crazy Youtube videos are what she is referring to and specifically the Alaska angle. The Cold Case one was only uploaded in October just gone and has 50k+ views and insinuates heavily that Trevor was a computer and financial whizz and therefore got targeted by a criminal gang in Alaska to commit bank fraud. Its a complete red herring already ruled out by the Gardai but these Youtubers make money from views and the wilder theory always sells better to their audiences.

    She referred to reporting to social media companies which I would take to be Youtube and Facebook where there is far more wild speculation to be found that on this thread, which to me is a reasoned discussion of events and any poster coming in throwing already disproven theories quickly gets shot down.


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    #771
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »
    I have always believed that him falling into the Dodder by accident, not necessarily being blown in, was far more likely a scenario that any run-ins with criminals, or other nefarious incidents.

    However in the interview with his sister she is very clear that there has been no DNA with any recovered bodies in the UK or Ireland, so that makes the above a less likely theory.

    Are the bodies that turn up in Wales always people who fell into the sea or are there cases of them being swept a few kilometres down the Dodder and then enter the sea?


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    #772
    TwoMonthsOff
    Registered Users Posts: 343 ✭✭TwoMonthsOff


    Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »
    I have always believed that him falling into the Dodder by accident, not necessarily being blown in, was far more likely a scenario that any run-ins with criminals, or other nefarious incidents.

    However in the interview with his sister she is very clear that there has been no DNA with any recovered bodies in the UK or Ireland, so that makes the above a less likely theory.

    Yeah I've read about people washing up in Wales a lot due to the tides, surely you wouldnt end up anywhere else other than England or Wales if you did end up in the Irish sea?

    A body would hardly end up somewhere on the continent would it?


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    #773
    Fr Tod Umptious
    Registered Users Posts: 15,029 ✭✭✭✭Fr Tod Umptious


    STB. wrote: »
    Have you any idea what type of vermin hang around Dublin city at nightime ? At a time of poor analogue CCTV and no smart phones.



    Organised criminals is where you are going wrong. Not all of them are organised. Most are junkies. Late night attacks like this could have been opportunistic, could have got out of hand, or unplanned evil. There were a lot of headcases around at that time. Stories have appeared in the paper about a notorious Crumlin based criminal family who hung around the Baggot Street area at the time (on foot of statements made to Gardai). They were dealers to the prostitutes from what I have read.



    The family will get upset with what they perceive as amateur detectives. However at least people are talking about that poor lad. You are dependent about it being in the public eye again and upon someone knowing the full story to come forward with what they have known for years as circumstances change, people fall out, people die etc.

    The poster I was replying to was inferring that some criminals had been watching Trevor for some time, knew his route to and from work, then had seen him out on that night and decided to mug him, waited a few hours to actually carry out their plan.

    You talk about opportunistic criminals, junkies etc, the poster I was reply to was not.

    When I was the same age as Trevor in the mid '90 I hung around that area, a lot, drank in Baggot St, Leeson St, walked back through Ballsbridge, Donnetbrook getting home, was well aware of plenty of hookers on Fitzwilliam Sq, Waterloo Rd etc
    But luckily I never encountered anything.


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    #774
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Muahahaha wrote: »
    Yeah I think the crazy Youtube videos are what she is referring to and specifically the Alaska angle. The Cold Case one was only uploaded in October just gone and has 50k+ views and insinuates heavily that Trevor was a computer and financial whizz and therefore got targeted by a criminal gang in Alaska to commit bank fraud. Its a complete red herring already ruled out by the Gardai but these Youtubers make money from views and the wilder theory always sells better to their audiences.

    Yes, these youtube channels are monetised based on views and how long people watch for. So if people actually think about it they should know not to take them too seriously. I'm sure there are some factual ones too but like most things it's the sensationalist ones that usually get more notice.


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    #775
    Fr Tod Umptious
    Registered Users Posts: 15,029 ✭✭✭✭Fr Tod Umptious


    tuxy wrote: »
    Are the bodies that turn up in Wales always people who fell into the sea or are there cases of them being swept a few kilometres down the Dodder and then enter the sea?
    TwoMonthsOff wrote: »
    Yeah I've read about people washing up in Wales a lot due to the tides, surely you wouldnt end up anywhere else other than England or Wales if you did end up in the Irish sea?

    A body would hardly end up somewhere on the continent would it?

    I've no idea.

    People actually end up back on the Irish east coast


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    #776
    Beechwoodspark
    Registered Users Posts: 15,306 ✭✭✭✭Beechwoodspark


    TheW1zard wrote: »
    It seems the Guards do believe he is, on Wikpedia (which I know isnt gospel, and also that his Sister has a big problem with some facts) it says the guards released a statement believing him to be the same.

    https://www.garda.ie/en/Crime-Prevention/Crimecall-on-RTE/Crimecall-Episodes/2017/April-24/Missing-Person-Trevor-Deely.html

    Thats from the garda website.


    So is it the case then? If it is he is involved.

    From reading that, gardai believe it was the same man.


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    #777
    80j2lc5y7u6qs9
    Closed Accounts Posts: 957 ✭✭✭80j2lc5y7u6qs9


    Hego Damask wrote: »
    Anyone got a link to that interview ?
    https://vocaroo.com/hQuwbLK7xgZ


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    #778
    tdf7187
    Registered Users Posts: 1,597 ✭✭✭tdf7187


    tuxy wrote: »
    Yeah just the stuff like he was a target because he worked at a bank, he was entry level in a IT job. And the things said about people from Alaska coming over to get him. He was there for a holiday that he clearly enjoyed and was excited to tell people about.

    He got a cheap deal on the holiday. I'd have done the same at that age.


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    #779
    tuxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »
    I've no idea.

    People actually end up back on the Irish east coast

    Yeah just wondering if anyone does know.
    I just can't see a body being swept a few KM in such a narrow reasonably shallow body of water like the Dodder and not getting snagged on something before it reached the sea. It was raining very heavily that night but even still I can't see it. But I have no knowledge on if it's possible.


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    #780
    TwoMonthsOff
    Registered Users Posts: 343 ✭✭TwoMonthsOff


    tdf7187 wrote: »
    He got a cheap deal on the holiday. I'd have done the same at that age.

    A friend of his that worked for aer lingus got him a free flight.. he didnt just stumble upon a cheap deal for a holiday in Alaska it was obviously planned, and it was clearly because of the girl he had met from there.

    Which leads onto another possible theory that was mentioned on reddit which I wont post here.


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    #781
    TwoMonthsOff
    Registered Users Posts: 343 ✭✭TwoMonthsOff


    tuxy wrote: »
    Yeah just wondering if anyone does know.
    I just can't see a body being swept a few KM in such a narrow reasonably shallow body of water like the Dodder and not getting snagged on something before it reached the sea. It was raining very heavily that night but even still I can't see it. But I have no knowledge on if it's possible.

    Yeah it's a decent enough distance from the possible entry point to the sea.


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