Formula 1 2020 - General Discussion Thread (See MOD warning on first post)

vectra

chicorytip wrote: »

Fred Vasseur likes him which could be significant. I think Raikkonen is gone completely. He should have retired upon leaving Ferrari. Giovinazzi will retain a seat as long as Ferrari are supplying the engines.

I think you might have your story ar$eway$

Frédéric Vasseur says he would like Kimi Räikkönen to continue with the Alfa Romeo Racing ORLEN team in 2021, especially if one of the Ferrari Driver Academy drivers linked to the team comes in.

Antonio Giovinazzi looks set to depart the team after two seasons after failing to set the world alight, although the Italian has scored both of Alfa Romeo’s points in 2020 thanks to his ninth place finish in the season-opening Austrian Grand Prix.

Mick Schumacher is the name being linked most to the team for 2021, but fellow Ferrari Driver Academy drivers Callum Ilott and Robert Shwartzman are also in contention should Giovinazzi depart.

However, Vasseur, the Team Principal of Alfa Romeo, says he would want to have Räikkönen in the team and it will be up to the Finn whether or not he wants to continue in the sport in 2021, twenty years after he made his debut for the Sauber F1 Team.

PukkaStukka

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Another howler from Vettel. At least it didn't cost him many places as he was unlikely to make it out of Q2. The nightmare continues.

I put that accident down to the characteristics of that car. It's a pig on four wheels.

This is the big irony here though,: Vettel crashes and there's a big fuss over his ability and his bottle, and whether he has lost the plot, or is the team favouring his teammate. Meanwhile Leclerc binned it big time at Monza and everyone excused him and blamed the underlying behaviour of the car. Consistency is a two way street

chicorytip

vectra wrote: »

I think you might have your story ar$eway$

What he says and thinks may not be the same. Gio has not set the world alight but neither has Kimi and Kimi is running out of time and really starting to show his age.
Perez and Gio would be the strongest line up.

El_Duderino 09

PukkaStukka wrote: »

I put that accident down to the characteristics of that car. It's a pig on four wheels.

This is the big irony here though,: Vettel crashes and there's a big fuss over his ability and his bottle, and whether he has lost the plot, or is the team favouring his teammate. Meanwhile Leclerc binned it big time at Monza and everyone excused him and blamed the underlying behaviour of the car. Consistency is a two way street

Yeah but you mentioned the word consistency while expressing that sentiment. Which driver has been more consistent at crashing into barriers and other drivers, over the course of this year and last year?

When one driver does it for the third time and the other does it for the 10th time, you don't treat them the same and pretend they're equally likely to crash.

vectra

chicorytip wrote: »

What he says and thinks may not be the same. Gio has not set the world alight but neither has Kimi and Kimi is running out of time and really starting to show his age.
Perez and Gio would be the strongest line up.

Well,
You only know what he says and not what he is thinking. Unless you are a mind reader?

Also
What you think makes no difference to what he says.:D

PukkaStukka

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Yeah but you mentioned the word consistency while expressing that sentiment. Which driver has been more consistent at crashing into barriers and other drivers, over the course of this year and last year?

When one driver does it for the third time and the other does it for the 10th time, you don't treat them the same and pretend they're equally likely to crash.

I'm talking about the consistency of how fans and commentators perceive drivers performances. Both are battling with a dreadful car that is actually mitigation in itself for a number of incidents this year, yet a more benign view is taken when things happen to LeClerc than Vettel. This is the inconsistency to which I refer.

El_Duderino 09

PukkaStukka wrote: »

I'm talking about the consistency of how fans and commentators perceive drivers performances. Both are battling with a dreadful car that is actually mitigation in itself for a number of incidents this year, yet a more benign view is taken when things happen to LeClerc than Vettel. This is the inconsistency to which I refer.

Yeah. Why would fans, or anyone else, treat crashes the same when so many fewer "things happen" to LeClerc?

There's such a difference between how Hamilton and Danny Ric responded to their penalties.

Hamilton: That's ridiculous, where does it say that in the rule book? (clearly hasn't read the rule book) and starts whinging about the tyres.
DRic: Yeah, My bad. I'll just drive faster. My mistake.

Hamilton will probably never understand why he's not generally liked but this sums it up.

q85dw7osi4lebg

Hamilton's post race interview - he is pathetic. Sooner he leaves the sport the better.

This is it

Does himself no favours

PukkaStukka

Alexa Thankful Fullback wrote: »

Hamilton's post race interview - he is pathetic. Sooner he leaves the sport the better.

This is it wrote: »

Does himself no favours

Unfortunately I missed that. What did he say?

I see in Autosport, he is quoted as saying that the race officials were "trying to stop me". :rolleyes:

chicorytip

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Yeah. Why would fans, or anyone else, treat crashes the same when so many fewer "things happen" to LeClerc?

There's such a difference between how Hamilton and Danny Ric responded to their penalties.

Hamilton: That's ridiculous, where does it say that in the rule book? (clearly hasn't read the rule book) and starts whinging about the tyres.
DRic: Yeah, My bad. I'll just drive faster. My mistake.

Hamilton will probably never understand why he's not generally liked but this sums it up.

I don't blame Hamilton for whining. He would have won in a canter if unpenalised. What on earth were his pit crew doing though? It's part of their job to fully understand the regulations and what is or is not permitted. As far as I know, it appears Hamilton was instructed to take the extra practice start at the pit lane exit.

jammiedodgers

While I can understand his frustration, not sure it's the best idea to accuse the stewards like this. Even Verstappen was sticking up for Lewis in the press conference saying the the time penalty was harsh enough but the penalty points on his licence were too much.
As said above it's the team where the fault lies. Hamilton asked on the radio if it was ok to do his practice start up further and he was given the all clear. That's a couple of times in the last few races his race has been screwed through not much fault of his own really (Monza pit entry fcuk up).

Edit: The 2 points on his licence have been cancelled

Burkie1203

chicorytip wrote: »

I don't blame Hamilton for whining. He would have won in a canter if unpenalised. What on earth were his pit crew doing though? It's part of their job to fully understand the regulations and what is or is not permitted. As far as I know, it appears Hamilton was instructed to take the extra practice start at the pit lane exit.

Come off it.

He is in F1 14 (?) Year's. It's upto him to know where he can do these practice starts. Merc pay him £40,000,000 a year, the least he could do is do some homework instead of being babysat. The other 19 drivers knew where they can do them.

the_pen_turner

jammiedodgers wrote: »

While I can understand his frustration, not sure it's the best idea to accuse the stewards like this. Even Verstappen was sticking up for Lewis in the press conference saying the the time penalty was harsh enough but the penalty points on his licence were too much.
As said above it's the team where the fault lies. Hamilton asked on the radio if it was ok to do his practice start up further and he was given the all clear. That's a couple of times in the last few races his race has been screwed through not much fault of his own really (Monza pit entry fcuk up).

Edit: The 2 points on his licence have been cancelled

time penalty is perfectly fair. is did something outside the rules and gained an advantage from it.
points is over kill though. and rightly overturned

as for the pit entry mishap that 100% on hamilton (and magnison as well i think) the crew make the call but he is the one driving. as soon as the call is made he should be looking out for those lights to tell him its safe to enter the pit lane. he didnt see 2 very obvious lights telling him the pit lane was closed

El_Duderino 09

chicorytip wrote: »

I don't blame Hamilton for whining. He would have won in a canter if unpenalised. What on earth were his pit crew doing though? It's part of their job to fully understand the regulations and what is or is not permitted. As far as I know, it appears Hamilton was instructed to take the extra practice start at the pit lane exit.

It's part his pit crew (he only spoke to Bono) to know the rules, but surely it's his job to know the rules too. Why did he think everyone else does their starts in that spot and not further up on the pit exit? Did he think he was the only one who thought about going further up the road?

My understanding is that they can do practice starts in the pitlane, at the end of the pitlane just before the line that signifies the end of the pitlane. The reason is that the cars behind are limited by the pitlane speed where after the pitlane they can go as fast as they like. So obviously it's dangerous to stop on the track for a practice start.

The man just doesn't think and he certainly doesn't think ALL the rules apply to him and certainly not the rules he hasn't bothered to learn about yet. It's really disappointing to see a guy in the best car by a mile, complain about how he's on the back foot and they're all trying to stop him. He has no idea how unlikable he is.

jammiedodgers

the_pen_turner wrote: »

time penalty is perfectly fair. is did something outside the rules and gained an advantage from it.
points is over kill though. and rightly overturned

Time penalty is probably fair. Would he have gained much an advantage from what he did?

as for the pit entry mishap that 100% on hamilton (and magnison as well i think) the crew make the call but he is the one driving. as soon as the call is made he should be looking out for those lights to tell him its safe to enter the pit lane. he didnt see 2 very obvious lights telling him the pit lane was closed

Think it was Giovanazzi?
Not sure it's fair to put 100% of the blame on Hamilton for that one, he could shoulder some blame though even though the pit entry signs were on the other side of the track afair. I think Sainz said after that race that he was going to pit until his crew told him not to, I'm sure he wasn't the only one.

Man with broke phone

Hamilton thinks the rules dont apply to him. I cant wait until he has to spend a season in a car thats not a second a lap faster than all the others.

Id pay premium to any TV channel thats airing it.

the_pen_turner

jammiedodgers wrote: »

Time penalty is probably fair. Would he have gained much an advantage from what he did?



Think it was Giovanazzi?
Not sure it's fair to put 100% of the blame on Hamilton for that one, he could shoulder some blame though even though the pit entry signs were on the other side of the track afair. I think Sainz said after that race that he was going to pit until his crew told him not to, I'm sure he wasn't the only one.

he was trying out the settings and getting used to the feel of it. so he did gain. he wouldnt be doing it otherwise.


it was giovanazzi. the lights are pritty obvious and they should be looking out for the lights so its his fault

donspeekinglesh

When the drivers renew their licences i'm sure they sign to say they understand and will follow the Sporting Code. It's part of the job to know if, and while mistakes will be made under pressure, it's inexcusable for a driver at the level of F1 not to know the regulations inside out. Any driver that admits that should have their Super License withdrawn.

chicorytip

Burkie1203 wrote: »

Come off it.

He is in F1 14 (?) Year's. It's upto him to know where he can do these practice starts. Merc pay him £40,000,000 a year, the least he could do is do some homework instead of being babysat. The other 19 drivers knew where they can do them.

He did seek clarification from Bonnington on whether it was permitted to move forward out of the heavily rubbered in section and was informed, erroneously, that it was allowed as long as you don't impede other cars. So, it was not just a spur of the moment decision by Hamilton.

Burkie1203

chicorytip wrote: »

He did seek clarification from Bonnington on whether it was permitted to move forward out of the heavily rubbered in section and was informed, erroneously, that it was allowed as long as you don't impede other cars. So, it was not just a spur of the moment decision by Hamilton.

But he still should have known where he can and can't do them. Bonnington isn't the race director. This is 100% on Hamilton. He should not be having to ask his race engineer something like this if he himself had done his homework properly.

It's amazing how the other 19 drivers all knew though.


When i was watching his interview with Natalie Pinkham after the race i was half expecting him to play the race card when she was telling him it was all very unfair.

vectra

Man with broke phone wrote: »

Hamilton thinks the rules dont apply to him. I cant wait until he has to spend a season in a car thats not a second a lap faster than all the others.

Id pay premium to any TV channel thats airing it.

I would spend my last cent on a service to watch that.

Hyzepher

Be careful what you wish for as he might prove you wrong

mickdw

vectra wrote: »

I would spend my last cent on a service to watch that.

He already had a season or 2 tangling in the Mclaren when it wasnt the class of the field and he didnt exactly cover himself in glory - spent much of a season bumping into and falling out with massa if i remember rightly.

elperello

mickdw wrote: »

He already had a season or 2 tangling in the Mclaren when it wasnt the class of the field and he didnt exactly cover himself in glory - spent much of a season bumping into and falling out with massa if i remember rightly.

He won races each year he was with McLaren and was never out of the top 5 in WDC.

mickdw

elperello wrote: »

He won races each year he was with McLaren and was never out of the top 5 in WDC.

It wasnt the class of the field and when running in the mid pack he had more than a fair share of crashes imo.

SMC92Ian

What a terrible race today, so boring.

quokula

mickdw wrote: »

He already had a season or 2 tangling in the Mclaren when it wasnt the class of the field and he didnt exactly cover himself in glory - spent much of a season bumping into and falling out with massa if i remember rightly.

Yeah it's amazing how people have forgotten the extent to which he underperformed when he had the joint best / second best car for most of his McLaren career.

vectra

quokula wrote: »

Yeah it's amazing how people have forgotten the extent to which he underperformed when he had the joint best / second best car for most of his McLaren career.

6 years in McLaren and only one title.
Not saying much for his "brilliance" :rolleyes:

flazio

vectra wrote: »

6 years in McLaren and only one title.
Not saying much for his "brilliance" :rolleyes:

He's still McLarens last World Champion and they've had two other World Champions from other teams.
Look, we could go on forever trying to destroy Lewis Hamilton but it won't make much difference in the course of history.