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Syrian refugee student wins state scholarship

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  • Options
    #452
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    jmreire wrote: »
    their support for Assad is well known, as is their influence in Lebanon via Hezbollah. They are also engaged in a proxy war with Saudi Arabia, via Yemen.
    Iran supported Assad and opposed the brutal Islamic State caliphate which was set up in Syria and Iraq, yes. You say it like that is a bad thing. Obviously you have swallowed the narrative that the Syrians, Russians and Iranians are the bad guys.
    Its not Iran that is bombing civilians in Yemen, its Saudi Arabia.
    As you know, the Iranians are mostly Shia muslims, and the Saudis are sunni.
    When was the last time a Shia muslim walked into a sunni mosque and blew up the congregation? Plenty of examples the other way round.
    All the muslim terrorist attacks/bombings/stabbings/lorry attacks/van attacks perpetrated in Europe against Europeans were carried out by Salafists/radical Sunnis, not by Shia muslims.


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    #453
    jmreire
    Registered Users Posts: 8,324 ✭✭✭jmreire


    recedite wrote: »
    Iran supported Assad and opposed the brutal Islamic State caliphate which was set up in Syria and Iraq, yes. You say it like that is a bad thing. Obviously you have swallowed the narrative that the Syrians, Russians and Iranians are the bad guys.
    Its not Iran that is bombing civilians in Yemen, its Saudi Arabia.
    As you know, the Iranians are mostly Shia muslims, and the Saudis are sunni.
    When was the last time a Shia muslim walked into a sunni mosque and blew up the congregation? Plenty of examples the other way round.
    All the muslim terrorist attacks/bombings/stabbings/lorry attacks/van attacks perpetrated in Europe against Europeans were carried out by Salafists/radical Sunnis, not by Shia muslims.

    What we were discussing was the effect of Sanction's, not the Shia / Sunni divide. This has been ongoing since after the death of Mohammad.And Teheran has interfered ( a lot ) in Lebanon, Syria and Iraq, do you think that Hezbollah has not committed atrocities in Sunni area's?? Of course they attacked isis...If the war had taken a different course, and isis were still in existence, then Iran would have had to fight them anyway,,,they would have been a thorn in the side of Iran, and interfered with their plan's to control or at least influence the Governments of that region. Iran wants to be the kingpin and power broker there.


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    #454
    jmreire
    Registered Users Posts: 8,324 ✭✭✭jmreire


    recedite wrote: »
    Iran supported Assad and opposed the brutal Islamic State caliphate which was set up in Syria and Iraq, yes. You say it like that is a bad thing. Obviously you have swallowed the narrative that the Syrians, Russians and Iranians are the bad guys.
    Its not Iran that is bombing civilians in Yemen, its Saudi Arabia.
    As you know, the Iranians are mostly Shia muslims, and the Saudis are sunni.
    When was the last time a Shia muslim walked into a sunni mosque and blew up the congregation? Plenty of examples the other way round.
    All the muslim terrorist attacks/bombings/stabbings/lorry attacks/van attacks perpetrated in Europe against Europeans were carried out by Salafists/radical Sunnis, not by Shia muslims.

    I'm not swallowing anything. I don't have any particular like or dislike for any of them. You think that the Syrian, Russian and Iranian regimes are Saint's ? Would you like to live under them? Sure they fought isis,,,the whole World fought isis. But I'm not under any illusions about their " Humanitarian Motivation" . What we were discussing was the effect of Sanction's, not the Shia / Sunni divide. This has been ongoing since after the death of Mohammad.And Teheran has interfered ( a lot ) in Lebanon, Syria and Iraq, do you think that Hezbollah has not committed atrocities in Sunni area's?? Of course they attacked isis...If the war had taken a different course, and isis were still in existence, then Iran would have had to fight them anyway,,,they would have been a thorn in the side of Iran, and interfered with their plan's to control or at least influence the Governments of that region. Iran wants to be the kingpin and power broker there.


  • Options
    #455
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    jmreire wrote: »
    What we were discussing was the effect of Sanction's, not the Shia / Sunni divide.
    The current US administration is pro-Saudi, and against Iran, and paints Hezbollah as an international terrorist threat. When Lebanon was invaded by the Israeli army, it was primarily Hezbollah that defended the country and repulsed the invaders, not the Lebanese Army. In general I see Shia militant groups as defensive in nature. If Trump wants to find the sponsors of aggressive international Muslim terrorism, he should look closer at his Saudi buddies.
    No doubt individual Hezbollah units have committed atrocities when recapturing Syrian territory from IS. But then war is an atrocity in itself. There is no "clean" war.



    On the sanctions, I disagree with your suggestion that economic sanctions hurt the regime without making any difference to the ordinary people. Sanctions hurt both. As an EU citizen, I am aware that I am engaged in sanctions against the Syrian people, but all I can do is apologise to them and say "not in my name".


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    #456
    jmreire
    Registered Users Posts: 8,324 ✭✭✭jmreire


    recedite wrote: »
    The current US administration is pro-Saudi, and against Iran, and paints Hezbollah as an international terrorist threat. When Lebanon was invaded by the Israeli army, it was primarily Hezbollah that defended the country and repulsed the invaders, not the Lebanese Army. In general I see Shia militant groups as defensive in nature. If Trump wants to find the sponsors of aggressive international Muslim terrorism, he should look closer at his Saudi buddies.
    No doubt individual Hezbollah units have committed atrocities when recapturing Syrian territory from IS. But then war is an atrocity in itself. There is no "clean" war.



    On the sanctions, I disagree with your suggestion that economic sanctions hurt the regime without making any difference to the ordinary people. Sanctions hurt both. As an EU citizen, I am aware that I am engaged in sanctions against the Syrian people, but all I can do is apologise to them and say "not in my name".
    When sanctions were imposed on the Syrian Regime, they should have had the desired effect of limiting the regime's ability to attack it's own citizen's. But they did not, because Russia and Iran filled the gap.....and in Iran's case some of this money came from cash which flowed into Iran when their sanction's were lifted. This cash was not used for the benefit of the ordinary Syrian's however. They suffered on, but what ever benefit did filter down, was strictly limited to regime supporter's. Now you can apologize all you like, fair play to you, and if you happen to win the Euro Million's, you can take it a step further by donating a sizable amount the Syrian Govt to help their ordinary Citizen's....and guess how much do you think that they will actually receive??


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    #457
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 20,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Eric Cartman wrote: »
    and I don't think youre grasping that there wasn't a need for them to claim asylum here as the UAE is safe and they were not fleeing war or persecution.

    How do you know they could stay in the UAE?

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




  • Options
    #458
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Brian? wrote: »
    How do you know they could stay in the UAE?
    Why were they kicked out. Are you saying they are criminals?


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    #459
    osarusan
    Registered Users Posts: 16,562 ✭✭✭✭osarusan


    recedite wrote: »
    Why were they kicked out. Are you saying they are criminals?


    What a pathetic strawman argument.


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    #460
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Clash of the Strawmen ;)

    Other than Brian? here, trying to sow the seeds of doubt, there is no suggestion that they were kicked out of UAE.


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    #461
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 20,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    recedite wrote: »
    Why were they kicked out. Are you saying they are criminals?

    I never said they were kicked out. Do you know anything about why they left the UAE? I don’t.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




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    #462
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 20,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    recedite wrote: »
    Clash of the Strawmen ;)

    Other than Brian? here, trying to sow the seeds of doubt, there is no suggestion that they were kicked out of UAE.

    I’m not sowing any seeds, except for the scotch bonnet peppers for next year.

    I asked a straightforward question.

    Evidence that they are genuine refugees exists. They were in direct provision and processed appropriately. They were granted asylum.

    There is no evidence they are not genuine refugees. There is plenty of conjecture. Mostly nonsense.

    There’s also conjecture about whether the girl qualified properly for the RCSI. Despite the fact there is no other mechanism for her to qualify.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




  • Options
    #463
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    I never said they were kicked out. Do you know anything about why they left the UAE? I don’t
    Why did you bring it up then?


  • Options
    #464
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 20,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    recedite wrote: »
    Why did you bring it up then?

    See my edit above. You and others are speculating based on nothing but your own biases.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




  • Options
    #465
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Brian? wrote: »
    Evidence that they are genuine refugees exists.
    Where is it?
    Brian? wrote: »
    They were in direct provision and processed appropriately. They were granted asylum.
    That's not evidence.
    A woman and child arriving from the war in Syria with only the clothes on their back are going to go straight into DP.

    Priority cases, vulnerable persons, a known war zone. Very easy.


  • Options
    #466
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 20,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    recedite wrote: »
    Where is it? That's not evidence.
    A woman and child arriving from the war in Syria with only the clothes on their back are going to go straight into DP.

    Priority cases, vulnerable persons, a known war zone. Very easy.

    Where is the evidence that they were genuine refugees? In their asylum applications, which were accepted.

    Everything else is nonsense conjecture. Maybe do a FOI application to take a look.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




  • Options
    #467
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Brian? wrote: »
    Maybe do a FOI application to take a look.
    If you had ever made a FOI request (I have) you would know that you get zero personal info on anyone else. Its all redacted except for your own communications to them, which they allow you to see.


  • Options
    #468
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 20,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    recedite wrote: »
    If you had ever made a FOI request (I have) you would know that you get zero personal info on anyone else. Its all redacted except for your own communications to them, which they allow you to see.

    So you have no way of knowing if their asylum claim was invalid?

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




  • Options
    #469
    Donald Trump
    Registered Users Posts: 19,119 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    recedite wrote: »
    Why were they kicked out. Are you saying they are criminals?


    Jaysus, do you still not understand the difference between having a work visa and being a citizen?

    Lets assume for a minute that you can't get your head around that.
    Suppose the family are there on the man's work visa. I don't think you'll have a problem admitting that was likely. Give us your thoughts on what happens under the following scenarios:
    1) The daughter grows up and becomes 18. Then she becomes 21. Then she becomes 30. Do you think she can still stay in UAE as an adult child of a man there on a work visa?
    2) The man and wife are not getting on and they want to split up. If they get divorced will the UAE allow an ex-wife to stay there because her ex-husband is employed?
    3) The man walks out in front of a bus and gets killed. Will the UAE keep renewing his work visa so that his wife and child can stay there?


  • Options
    #470
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Donald Trump wrote: »
    Jaysus, do you still not understand the difference between having a work visa and being a citizen?

    Lets assume for a minute that you can't get your head around that.
    Suppose the family are there on the man's work visa. I don't think you'll have a problem admitting that was likely. Give us your thoughts on what happens under the following scenarios:
    1) The daughter grows up and becomes 18. Then she becomes 21. Then she becomes 30. Do you think she can still stay in UAE as an adult child of a man there on a work visa?
    2) The man and wife are not getting on and they want to split up. If they get divorced will the UAE allow an ex-wife to stay there because her ex-husband is employed?
    3) The man walks out in front of a bus and gets killed. Will the UAE keep renewing his work visa so that his wife and child can stay there?
    In any of those situations, the wife and daughter might (in theory) have been kicked out of UAE.

    But that didn't happen, did it. They trotted over here, while he maintained their safe home in Dubai and looked after the highly paid job.


    Do you still not understand the difference between being a war refugee and somebody who chooses to relocate for whatever reasons?
    I know RCSI Dubai is expensive to attend, but surely they could have made a few cutbacks.


  • Options
    #471
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 81,864 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    recedite wrote: »
    Where is it? That's not evidence.
    A woman and child arriving from the war in Syria with only the clothes on their back are going to go straight into DP.

    Priority cases, vulnerable persons, a known war zone. Very easy.

    You need proof a Syrian is a refugee.

    Here:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syrian_Civil_War


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    #472
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Overheal wrote: »
    You need proof a Syrian is a refugee.

    Here:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syrian_Civil_War
    I repeat what I said earlier...
    recedite wrote: »
    A woman and child arriving from the war in Syria with only the clothes on their back are going to go straight into DP.
    Priority cases, vulnerable persons, a known war zone. Very easy.

    Proper order, too. I have no problem with that.


  • Options
    #473
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 81,864 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    recedite wrote: »
    I repeat what I said earlier...

    Proper order, too. I have no problem with that.

    Do you believe it is safe for this family to return to Syria?


  • Options
    #474
    Donald Trump
    Registered Users Posts: 19,119 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    recedite wrote: »
    I know RCSI Dubai is expensive to attend, but surely they could have made a few cutbacks.

    Please do tell how much you know about it. :pac:

    Given that a link posted to it earlier clearly shows it only does postgraduate training courses.


  • Options
    #475
    Donald Trump
    Registered Users Posts: 19,119 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    recedite wrote: »
    Where is it? That's not evidence.
    A woman and child arriving from the war in Syria with only the clothes on their back are going to go straight into DP.

    Priority cases, vulnerable persons, a known war zone. Very easy.


    You are still confusing the concept of asylum with Social welfare / direct provision.

    To be fair, you must be trolling at this stage.


  • Options
    #476
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Overheal wrote: »
    Do you believe it is safe for this family to return to Syria?
    I have no idea. It depends whether they are on a wanted list or not. If they have no particular argument with the government, then yes most parts of Syria are safe. It needs rebuilding so it needs engineers. And it doesn't needs our sanctions directed against it.
    But that's not even the question, is it?
    The question is why they left their home in UAE, where they have lived and worked for years. Is it safe to return there?


  • Options
    #477
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 81,864 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    recedite wrote: »
    I have no idea. It depends whether they are on a wanted list or not. If they have no particular argument with the government, then yes most parts of Syria are safe. It needs rebuilding so it needs engineers. And it doesn't needs our sanctions directed against it.

    So you’re packing your bags now to go put your money where your mouth is?
    But that's not even the question, is it?
    The question is why they left their home in UAE, where they have lived and worked for years. Is it safe to return there?

    Relevance? You can’t deport them to the UAE..


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    #478
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Syrian..check.
    Refugee...check.
    Student...check.
    wins scholarship...check.

    Everything else is ignorant sh*te talk.


  • Options
    #479
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Overheal wrote: »
    So you’re packing your bags now to go put your money where your mouth is?
    Why would I pack my bags? I grew up on an island that was a war zone in parts. I'm still here.


    Overheal wrote: »
    Relevance? You can’t deport them to the UAE..
    Not one person on this thread has suggested deporting them. It has come up a few times as a strawman though.


  • Options
    #480
    Graces7
    Registered Users Posts: 32,634 ✭✭✭✭Graces7


    recedite wrote: »
    In any of those situations, the wife and daughter might (in theory) have been kicked out of UAE.

    But that didn't happen, did it. They trotted over here, while he maintained their safe home in Dubai and looked after the highly paid job.


    Do you still not understand the difference between being a war refugee and somebody who chooses to relocate for whatever reasons?
    I know RCSI Dubai is expensive to attend, but surely they could have made a few cutbacks.

    they would have got free education in the UAE at that level for the girl. Look up Kingdom law?


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    #481
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    Syrian..check.
    Refugee...check.
    Student...check.
    wins scholarship...check.

    Everything else is ignorant sh*te talk.
    Does that include the job in Dubai probably paying €50-100K?
    Or is that sh*te money to you?


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