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Galway traffic
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Vapourware. Good God. This is the solution they're proposing? Come back in 10 years when Coventry has provided a working solution.
Furthermore, the capacity is 56 passengers? As in, the same as a bus? Actually it's worse than a bus, as they are only provding for 20 seated passengers.
The proven technology known as a bus, is all that will be offered to Galway for the next several decades, and the quicker we stop talking about this nonsense and get on with advocating for the soonest implementation of Bus Connects for Galway the better.
And the gas thing is that in that presentation, they talk about the prohibitive cost of "normal" light rail systems, yet not very long ago, that was what was being proposed. They were wrong then, they're wrong now, and it won't be happening.
NEVER, NO, NO WAY. Why so narrow-minded and why do you discourage pluarity of opinions? That's not healthy.
Your "proven bus technology" is a failure...the blast from the past. No really, any modern city doesn't consider buses seriously. It's the least preferred option. And those that do certainly do not use double-deckers and manual and/or cash payments at entry! :pac:
Watch that presentation please, especially the slide from the German guy where he says:
Densities aren't given, they are made!
This is the critical point that separates the grain (Continental Europe) from the sand (Galway/Ireland).
Firstly, this is what I've been saying all the time. You first build urban train/tram and then you build around it - the density will appear along it as you move on. You must plan future development and future density when building PT. Building PT must go together with city planning. This critical point is even more important for train/light rail planning but applies to any PT.
Secondly, The "low density" argument used in Galway (and Ireland in general) is a total nonsense, as I described previously, the city I'm from has only marginally higher density (1700) compared to Galway (1450) which doesn't prevent it from having an extensive light rail & PT system. It started with 1 line for 100k people and grew to 13 lines for 400k people. But most importantly, PT is a strategic matter, so you should build strategically where you want to grow, not just reacting ex-post, as mentioned above.
That's the thought process all the liveable cities went through - building PT and planning the city growth together. Whereas here, you build randomly, and then only years later you start thinking about the infrastructure, then you only try catching up, quickly botch something up and by the time you build something it's already insufficient and outdated.
Thirdly, The current Galway PT modelling based around buses is wrong as it assesses the current situation, not the future population growth and doesn't integrate with city planning/development/expansion properly. You are essentially bound to be stuck in an ever repeating cycle of "trying to catch up" with a city sprawl disconnected from strategic PT planning. Unless the culture and outlook changes in the GCC.
The predicted population growth is 30-40% in next 15 years, that's a 150k city (+suburbs). So let's say you build this BusConnect in a few years (if lucky), by the time you will have 100k+ population, which means even more cars than now, so then the BusConnect won't cut it, and then absolutely won't cut it as the population grows further beyond 100k, the road network won't cope with extra cars and buses, what will you do then? Try expanding a non-expandable system with low throughput? Back to square one...15 years behind trying to catch up something you can't. This is the reason why reasonably/properly governed cities plan ahead.
Now, you can mock Coventry as much as you like, but their mental state & outlook is leagues ahead of here and they have a vision - light-rail, automation, 5G, driver-less PT, EV taxis, wireless EV charging, e-scooters, and all that is part of the overall strategy. And the Coventry PT Project Manager's statements are gold:
"We are a small city, but we are an ambitious city. We want to make sure it's an attractive place to live, work and study."
These two sentences are realy all what you need to have in place to make progress. It's all what counts and it's all about vision/outlook.
GCC and most of the population here lack any similar ambition, interest and modern outlook (it's indeed visible even in this thread despite being more favourable to PT and modern city thinking). I don't actually think that money is an issue, money can be found via various ways, PPE etc. The issue is almost entirely cultural and then poor governance stemming largely from the cultural issue itself. Little to do with money.
If I were you, I would take my opinion based on broader experience on board. Else you risk patting yourselves on shoulders happily in your insularism mocking outsiders as eejits who think they know better while Galway City completely misses the train compared to Europe and even to Limerick & Cork too. It's already 2 decades behind and you can't afford further delays.
Back to you :cool:
PS: The Galway Transport Strategy is poor as is, it is 5 years old and nothing substantial happened since it was created.
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Deleted User wrote: »Evidence for the school zones? None, but I refer you to the existing research on traffic calming measures
Evidence for the school streets, again I refer to existing evidence on what happens when it become safer to cycle
Spotted this on Facebook a couple of days ago: real feedback from people who actually walk / cycle / drive near these school "zones" (sic), not just ones who quote press-releases.
I've scored out the names / faces in the screengrab below, but you can see the original comments here.
I've had similar experiences as a pedestrian in a public building in the Newcastle area, which has a large expanse of paint outside it. These days,when it's wet I step off the paint and onto the tarmac.
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Mrs OBumble wrote: »Spotted this on Facebook a couple of days ago: real feedback from people who actually walk / cycle / drive near these school "zones" (sic), not just ones who quote press-releases.
I've scored out the names / faces in the screengrab below, but you can see the original comments here.
I've had similar experiences as a pedestrian in a public building in the Newcastle area, which has a large expanse of paint outside it. These days,when it's wet I step off the paint and onto the tarmac.
Sounds like good feedback to give to the council, let us know what their response is0 -
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Funnily enough I don't say never - light rail may indeed come to Galway at some stage in the future. However, I might remind you that light rail only came to Dublin when it had more than a million inhabitants. Might be a while before Galway gets to that stage ...NEVER, NO, NO WAY. Why so narrow-minded and why do you discourage pluarity of opinions? That's not healthy.
OK. So what you don't like about buses is that they are old-fashioned. Right.Your "proven bus technology" is a failure...the blast from the past.
Any evidence to back that up?No really, any modern city doesn't consider buses seriously.
Hang on - I thought you just said that none do. Hmmm ...And those that do
I don't disagree here, and I'm not advocating it. But it shows your own "narrow-minded"ness when you think that if I'm advocating buses, it must be only double-deckers with cash payments at entry that I'm advocating :rolleyes:certainly do not use double-deckers and manual and/or cash payments at entry!
Indeed. But unlike you, I don't believe that public transport is steel wheels or nothing.You must plan future development and future density when building PT. Building PT must go together with city planning.
I never made any such argument so I won't be responding further to this point.Secondly, The "low density" argument used in Galway
Ah jaysus, you don't know how things work here at all. We don't build randomly - we buy cheap agricultural land on the outskirts of cities and then bribe/lobby politicians to change the zoning to residential. Job doneWhereas here, you build randomly
Agree 100%. Build first. Plan later. It's the Irish way. Or it was. Maybe it's coming to an end? We can only hope.and then only years later you start thinking about the infrastructure, then you only try catching up, quickly botch something up and by the time you build something it's already insufficient and outdated.
Which actually won't be a problem if they're not allowed on city streets.The predicted population growth is 30-40% in next 15 years, that's a 150k city (+suburbs). So let's say you build this BusConnect in a few years (if lucky), by the time you will have 100k+ population, which means even more cars than nowso then the BusConnect won't cut it, and then absolutely won't cut it as the population grows further beyond 100k, the road network won't cope with extra cars and buses, what will you do then? What are you on about?
First, if we do Bus Connects properly, there won't be more cars on the streets, because they will be banned. Are you seriously telling me that we are going to have so many buses in Galway that there won't be room for them on the bus-only streets? I'm delighted to hear it ... but you (should) know well that won't happen.
Before I mocked Coventry I did look at (some of) their presentation until I realised they were talking about a sub-optimal system that doesn't yet exist.Now, you can mock Coventry as much as you like
I mocked them because it had all the hallmarks of sales people making a pitch - I said let's see where they are in ten years time, when the bloody thing has actually been rolled out.
I also said that I think that a public transport vehicle that that only has twenty seats is a poor offering.
And again we're back to tram = modern, bus = "old-fashioned". It's a nonsense argument, not to mention extremely "narrow-minded".GCC and most of the population here lack any similar ambition, interest and modern outlook (it's indeed visible even in this thread despite being more favourable to PT and modern city thinking).
Tell me of this "outside world" you speak of - since (in your mind) I've never left Galway ... :rolleyes:If I were you, I would take my opinion based on broader experience on board. Else you risk patting yourselves on shoulders happily in your insularism
Nope - I don't restrict my mocking of sub-optimal solutions to outsiders - Galway people like Niall O'Brolochain are a target for mockery too. And mostly because they are part of the "train-loving, bus-hating" brigade - any solution involving a train (train, light rail, very light rail :rolleyes:) is good, any solution involving a bus is bad. Steel wheels good, rubber wheels bad.mocking outsiders as eejits who think they know better
No disagreement there. We all want them to get on with it.PS: The Galway Transport Strategy is poor as is, it is 5 years old and nothing substantial happened since it was created.
And here's a final one for you, not in your post - where are you going to put this tram in Galway? Do you agree with the proposed alignment? Because if so, let's put a tram-like QBC (raised platforms, single-decker, traffic-light changing, cashless multi-axle buses), along that alignment to get an indicator of its usefulness, without incurring the light rail (or "very" light rail) expense.0 -
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More cycle buses kicking off around the city
https://twitter.com/RoryCarrollIRL/status/1394390589358104578?s=20
https://twitter.com/josephmcginley/status/1394259979499151363?s=20
And in the county too, with the one starting in Gort
and this one in Clarinbridge which was on the news last year
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An Pucan must have asked for that addition!
Is Forster street closed for all traffic or will the buses still be able to run through it? College road would be a fairly busy route for buses. I guess there could de diversions via Lough Atalia + Station Rd0 -
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An Pucan must have asked for that addition!
Is Forster street closed for all traffic or will the buses still be able to run through it? College road would be a fairly busy route for buses. I guess there could de diversions via Lough Atalia + Station Rd
You've answered your own question there.0 -
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![[Deleted User]](/applications/dashboard/design/images/defaulticon.png)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJkrGBzSieA
This discussion has been closed.
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