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Criminal Inquiry launched into the origins of the Trump-Russia investigation

  • 25-10-2019 5:08am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 10,423 ✭✭✭✭ Outlaw Pete


    About time too as now Durham can issue subpoenas. Some had been refusing requests to be interviewed when it was just a 'review':

    https://twitter.com/politico/status/1187547244943290369
    New York Times:

    Justice Department officials have shifted an administrative review of the Russia investigation closely overseen by Attorney General William P. Barr to a criminal inquiry, according to two people familiar with the matter. The move gives the prosecutor running it, John H. Durham, the power to subpoena for witness testimony and documents, to impanel a grand jury and to file criminal charges.

    Mr. Barr began the administrative review of the Russia investigation in May, saying that he had conversations with intelligence and law enforcement officials that led him to believe that the F.B.I. acted improperly, if not unlawfully.

    Mr. Barr is closely managing the Durham investigation, even traveling to Italy to seek help from officials there to run down an unfounded conspiracy that is at the heart of conservatives’ attacks on the Russia investigation — that the Italian government helped set up the Trump campaign adviser who was told in 2016 that the Russians had damaging information that could hurt Clinton’s campaign.

    Mr. Durham has also asked whether C.I.A. officials might have somehow tricked the F.B.I. into opening the Russia investigation.

    Mr. Durham has indicated he wants to interview former officials who ran the C.I.A. in 2016 but has yet to question either Mr. Brennan or James R. Clapper Jr., the former director of national intelligence. Mr. Trump has repeatedly attacked them as part of a vast conspiracy by the so-called deep state to stop him from winning the presidency.

    Some C.I.A. officials have retained criminal lawyers in anticipation of being interviewed.

    Although there is of course issues with the FBI lying (by omission) to the FISA court (in order to obtain a warrant to spy on the Trump campaign) Brennan was the main culprit, even worse than Comey, as he clearly went out of his way to ensure Hillary was elected and then lied to congress about the Steele dossier and what he knew of it and more importantly, when he knew of it. Clapper recently said they were all just doing what Obama told them to do, so he may interviewed at some point, hope so, as his administration was rotten to the core it would seem given the behavior of so many of it's holdovers who just can't seem to stand that after eight years of having a liberal at the helm, Donald Trump strolled in and demanded things be done slightly differently.

    One thing though: I hope they get full due process and republicans treat democrats 100% fairly throughout, if that is, hearings are to follow either of the investigations.


    Here's the view from both sides tonight, first Fox:





    And CNN (who of course are calling it a "right wing fantasy" and a "conspiracy theory"):




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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 10,423 ✭✭✭✭ Outlaw Pete




  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,005 ✭✭✭ BDI


    Lads I can’t follow all this stuff. Are you saying the police are investigating whether the FBI is trying to frame the president by making it look like he is a Russian plant?


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,029 ✭✭✭ Hande hoche!


    Michael Flynn's sentencing seems to be a long time coming compared to others. Will be curious as to where it ends.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 322 ✭✭ SJW Lover


    BDI wrote: »
    Lads I can’t follow all this stuff. Are you saying the police are investigating whether the FBI is trying to frame the president by making it look like he is a Russian plant?


    It's difficult to follow as Fox News are skewed one way and MSNBC/CNN etc are completely skewed the other way. Stick to what the actual quotes are and the actual documents and avoid having your opinion told to you by the talking heads who are there to exaggerate or obfuscate according to their own agenda. A mistake the prominent posters on this site make every day when forming their opinions on US politics.


  • Registered Users Posts: 65,187 ✭✭✭✭ Overheal



    Flynn pled guilty to criminal charges...


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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,423 ✭✭✭✭ Outlaw Pete


    BDI wrote: »
    Lads I can’t follow all this stuff. Are you saying the police are investigating whether the FBI is trying to frame the president by making it look like he is a Russian plant?

    Totally understandable for anyone to be scratching their heads on all this now given that the New York Times and The Washington Post were awarded Pulitzer Prizes for their coverage of the Trump-Russia collusion. Good article here on that aspect of it all and a crucial one it is too as, imo, the mainstream media are as culpable as anyone else in all this:

    https://www.realclearinvestigations.com/articles/2019/04/09/why_last_years_trump-russia_pulitzer_was_no_prize.html

    As for ' Are the Police investigating if Trump was framed?' Yes, and then some. The Attorney General, Bill Barr, appointed John Durham to look into just what it was that led to the FBI launching Crossfire Hurricane (the investigation into the Trump campaign's suspected coordination with Russia to interfere with the 2016 presidential election).

    Up until recently it had been just a review but is now an official criminal investigation. Quite significant given AG Barr & Durham have just come into possession of two BlackBerrys owned by Joseph Mifsud, the professor who approached a member of the Trump campaign (George Papadopoulos) telling him that he had Russian contacts who were in possession of Hillary's hacked emails:

    https://www.theepochtimes.com/misfuds-cell-phones-obtained-by-durham-could-answer-key-russiagate-questions_3120862.html


  • Registered Users Posts: 65,187 ✭✭✭✭ Overheal


    You’re spinning this, Pete.

    Cite where they are investigating “Trump was framed”

    So far all I’ve seen from the WH on this is they are investigating whether the FISA court process was abused. It’s another process argument. Now they are investigating whether anyone broke any applicable laws.

    You’re spinning it up as if every shred of evidence to date was forged and the whole thing was a framing. Seems preposterous no?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,982 ✭✭✭ MeMen2_MoRi_


    Overheal wrote: »
    You’re spinning this, Pete.

    Cite where they are investigating “Trump was framed”

    So far all I’ve seen from the WH on this is they are investigating whether the FISA court process was abused. It’s another process argument. Now they are investigating whether anyone broke any applicable laws.

    You’re spinning it up as if every shred of evidence to date was forged and the whole thing was a framing. Seems preposterous no?

    They're getting good at the process argument, it seems that's all Donald has left them to fight against.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,205 ✭✭✭ Gringo180


    Anybody thats a threat to the status quo in American politics and the establishment is a Russian Stooge or Agent. Its getting tiresome now and laughable some people still swallow it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,264 ✭✭✭✭ Gatling


    Gringo180 wrote: »
    Anybody thats a threat to the status quo in American politics and the establishment is a Russian Stooge or Agent.

    Case in point trump in Syria turned about face and gave Putin what he wanted ........


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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,205 ✭✭✭ Gringo180


    Gatling wrote: »
    Case in point trump in Syria turned about face and gave Putin what he wanted ........

    Do elaborate.


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,264 ✭✭✭✭ Gatling


    Gringo180 wrote: »
    Do elaborate.

    Elaborate it's widely acknowledged russia got involved in US elections ,denied many including trump himself ,now in a single week of work trump Pulls out US troops out of Syria , allowing the Turkish invasion and division of Kurdish lands to turks and russian forces .

    Trump says he did a great job , yeah proving he's putins puppet



    Meanwhile Irish boardsies??? Claim russian interference didn't happen


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,005 ✭✭✭ BDI


    So it’s proven then, we all know absolutely nothing and the CIA or the FBI or Russia or whoever could be making anything and everything up.

    It’s all speculation and made up baloney and it’s about as credible as a Stormy Daniels story.

    Can we just get behind the man now and let him lead the free world as best as he can.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,205 ✭✭✭ Gringo180


    Gatling wrote: »
    Elaborate it's widely acknowledged russia got involved in US elections ,denied many including trump himself ,now in a single week of work trump Pulls out US troops out of Syria , allowing the Turkish invasion and division of Kurdish lands to turks and russian forces .

    Trump says he did a great job , yeah proving he's putins puppet



    Meanwhile Irish boardsies??? Claim russian interference didn't happen

    I would acknowledge Russian intervention if there was some concrete evidence, but there is none because Trump would have long been impeached by now. Trumps has just lived up to his election promises in bringing more troops home from Syria and the middle east in general.


  • Registered Users Posts: 65,187 ✭✭✭✭ Overheal


    Gringo180 wrote: »
    I would acknowledge Russian intervention if there was some concrete evidence, but there is none because Trump would have long been impeached by now. Trumps has just lived up to his election promises in bringing more troops home from Syria and the middle east in general.

    You’re conflating Russian intervention in 2016 election politics with the investigation into whether Trump was conspiring with that effort. Even if the Mueller Report had concluded trump was exonerated (it doesn’t), it doesn’t mean that Russia did not intervene in 2016 election politics. The intelligence community already established that as an matter of record.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,031 ✭✭✭ thecretinhop


    Overheal wrote: »
    You’re conflating Russian intervention in 2016 election politics with the investigation into whether Trump was conspiring with that effort. Even if the Mueller Report had concluded trump was exonerated (it doesn’t), it doesn’t mean that Russia did not intervene in 2016 election politics. The intelligence community already established that as an matter of record.

    yeah, good one... de mighty lisa page and creepy demon strosok did not lie or alter their 302 statements...


  • Registered Users Posts: 65,187 ✭✭✭✭ Overheal


    yeah, good one... de mighty lisa page and creepy demon strosok did not lie or alter their 302 statements...

    Please expand that innuendo so we all might discuss it thanks?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,994 ✭✭✭ mcmoustache


    Will this be like the inquiry into voter fraud?


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,205 ✭✭✭ Gringo180


    Its hard not to break your boll0x laughing when the Americans are criticising other nations for meddling in there elections, there the masters of it, I wouldn't say every nation on the planet combined have interfered in Elections more than the Americans since WW2. Whats good for the goose is good for the gander.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,423 ✭✭✭✭ Outlaw Pete


    Overheal wrote: »
    Even if the Mueller Report had concluded trump was exonerated (it doesn’t), it doesn’t mean that Russia did not intervene in 2016 election politics. The intelligence community already established that as an matter of record.

    Eh, where did I say that Russia did not intervene in 2016 election??

    Give the strawmanning a rest, cheers.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,423 ✭✭✭✭ Outlaw Pete


    Just so nobody can say the other side's views of this are being ignored, here's what Comey had to say last night re the new status of the investigation:


    https://twitter.com/alx/status/1188205947262504960


  • Registered Users Posts: 65,187 ✭✭✭✭ Overheal


    Eh, where did I say that Russia did not intervene in 2016 election??

    Give the strawmanning a rest, cheers.

    Did you read my effing post and who I was talking to? Not everything is about you, Pete.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,619 ✭✭✭✭ ILoveYourVibes


    Yeah this makes trump a good person.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,524 ✭✭✭ Gynoid


    Yeah this makes trump a good person.

    Trump is not a good although I dare to say he has good bits to him.

    In 2016 Americans were given a choice, Trump or Hillary. If forced to spend time locked up with either I would choose Trump a thousand times before Hillary. I imagine he would be a bit of craic, and I think he is humane beneath the gaucheness and bluster. Hillary on the other hand makes my flesh crawl. She is fake, mean, devious, bad tempered, self serving, delusional - she is everything one could imagine a nasty mean woman to be and on top of thay she is dangerously power hungry. I have no idea how women like her especially after the way she treated the women who accused her husband of sexual assault. But her gleeful cackle over the death by knife sodomy of Gadaffi marked her forever in my mind as an evil and completely unsuitable for politics person.

    Trump is not good but if all the Democrats can come up with this time is the hysterical and lying sjw wannabe Warren and the distinctly paedophilic Biden then Trump will likely win again. Unless there is election interference from the Democrat supporters via technology rigging, algorithm abuse, voter fraud etc. At all of which they seem fairly practised.

    Disgusting rigged autocratic system, US politics.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,619 ✭✭✭✭ ILoveYourVibes


    Gynoid wrote: »

    Disgusting rigged autocratic system, US politics.
    True.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,347 ✭✭✭ valoren


    Part of the Mueller investigation was to determine if the Russians interfered in the 2016 election. The other part was to see if there was collusion. It wasn't to discredit Trumps win but to determine whether an ideological enemy of the US interfered in their electoral process which they categorically did. Of course Trump, a flagrant narcissist, deemed it an attack on his win and shot himself in the foot by attempting to obstruct justice on multiple occasions. The only thing keeping him out of prison is that it's the policy of the justice department that you can't indict a sitting president. Now with the impeachment inquiry forging ahead this separate investigation serves as a neat side deflective side show while the goal of it is not to show Trump is innocent but to try and get anything incriminating (legal admin "gotcha" errors etc) about the legal process committed during the Mueller investigation and use it to discredit it completely and keep Trump out of prison on such a technicality whenever he leaves or is removed from office.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 322 ✭✭ SJW Lover


    Gatling wrote: »
    Elaborate it's widely acknowledged russia got involved in US elections ,denied many including trump himself ,now in a single week of work trump Pulls out US troops out of Syria , allowing the Turkish invasion and division of Kurdish lands to turks and russian forces .

    Trump says he did a great job , yeah proving he's putins puppet



    Meanwhile Irish boardsies??? Claim russian interference didn't happen


    Evidence please. "Widely acknowledged" by peddlers of propaganda that you lap up without question EVERY TIME just wont cut it, Mr. Shill.


  • Registered Users Posts: 65,187 ✭✭✭✭ Overheal


    SJW Lover wrote: »
    Evidence please. "Widely acknowledged" by peddlers of propaganda that you lap up without question EVERY TIME just wont cut it, Mr. Shill.

    :rolleyes:


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  • Registered Users Posts: 30,264 ✭✭✭✭ Gatling


    SJW Lover wrote: »
    Evidence please. "Widely acknowledged" by peddlers of propaganda that you lap up without question EVERY TIME just wont cut it, Mr. Shill.

    Lol whaaaaaaaat


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