Bride and groom getting fired on Monday

Hector Savage

Feisar wrote: »

To them Pope = Catholics = Tadhg's = Fenian's = Nationalist's = Mick's

It's not the Pope they are funking off.

That maybe so , but we can only judge this on the actual content.

blanch152

Matt Barrett wrote: »

Blanch you're just popping in to defend their behaviour by saying, 'the others do it too'. Typical fare.
Next time you get outraged about something I expect you'll have a more even keeled approach...nah, only joking, you'll shoe horn in the Troubles and the usual.

Matt,

You are often guilty of misrepresenting others, but this is outrageous even by your standards. Which bit of "in this case, the beliefs expressed are abhorrent, sectarian and disgusting" is defending their behaviour?

Which bit of suggesting "a formal written warning, and some education and training in conflict resolution etc" is defending their behaviour?

Get off the high horse, Matt, and actually read what I wrote. You should be better than that response.

If a public figure engages in such behaviour, they should resign or be fired, but this is an ordinary teacher, not a public figure. When a public figure did get involved in this sort of thing - Councillor McElduff - I did call for him to resign from public life. I am nothing but consistent on sectarian behaviour.

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

Matt,

You are often guilty of misrepresenting others, but this is outrageous even by your standards. Which bit of "in this case, the beliefs expressed are abhorrent, sectarian and disgusting" is defending their behaviour?

Which bit of suggesting "a formal written warning, and some education and training in conflict resolution etc" is defending their behaviour?

Get off the high horse, Matt, and actually read what I wrote. You should be better than that response.

If a public figure engages in such behaviour, they should resign or be fired, but this is an ordinary teacher, not a public figure. When a public figure did get involved in this sort of thing - Councillor McElduff - I did call for him to resign from public life. I am nothing but consistent on sectarian behaviour.

I am nae.
Blanch you constantly infer your own views on a comment then proceed as if your inferences are direct quotes. I've pointed this out to you a lot because you do it a lot. Nobody buys your, 'Hey, when the monocle is on I'm being earnest' routine.

The fact that you came in to say it was an over reaction on anyone's part who was annoyed by it or didn't like it.

The outraged are really out in force on this one.

Dismissive.

Then the whatboutry...

Imagine a teacher wearing a pink ribbon to school, but works in a Catholic school

Then the disclaimer followed by more whataboutery...

In this case, the beliefs expressed are abhorrent, sectarian and disgusting, but why single out this case? I am sure there are teachers on the Tyrone GAA panel. We saw their private video earlier. Should they be sacked as well?

I'm sure if it were a wedding with the Bride and Groom singing 'F*** the Queen and the SAS' you'd have the same comment... :rolleyes:

blanch152

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

How is it right-wing propaganda?
People on social media with agendas construct outrage when it does not suit thier views. But they never look at how thier own actions are viewed by others.

Do you not see the point I am making?
Many here on this very thread would have enthusiastically shouted 'IRA' for the craic during the fields of athenry. Thinking nothing of it - great craic
Yet they jump on these two at the wedding because they are the 'others'

John Delaney singing Republican songs put him up in the estimate of some people a legend. :cool:
Yet he was CEO of an organisation that was not sacked or even reprimanded properly for it.
But if the 'others' do it suddenly there is outrage - think of the children - they are teachers etc. :eek:

The hypocrisy stinks in my view.
It is part of the reason stormont has being idle for years each side looking for an excuse to find fault with the other. Playing games. Rather than looking at thier own actions.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/sinn-f%C3%A9in-councillor-says-shankill-bomber-was-highly-regarded-1.3678361


You don't have to go back 20 years to find even more nauseating celebrations of sectarianism than a song at a wedding.

"He described Begley as a “highly respected and highly regarded Oglach” who had “died tragically on active service”."

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/sinn-f%C3%A9in-councillor-says-shankill-bomber-was-highly-regarded-1.3678361


You don't have to go back 20 years to find even more nauseating celebrations of sectarianism than a song at a wedding.

"He described Begley as a “highly respected and highly regarded Oglach” who had “died tragically on active service”."

The outraged are really out in force on this one, huh Blanch?

blanch152

Matt Barrett wrote: »

I am nae.
Blanch you constantly infer your own views on a comment then proceed as if you inferences are direct quotes. I've pointed this out to you a lot because you do it a lot. Nobody buys your, 'Hey, when the monocle is on I'm being earnest' routine.

The fact that you came in to say it was an over reaction on anyone's part who was annoyed by it or didn't like it.



Dismissive.

Then the whatboutry...



Then the disclaimer followed by more whataboutery...



I'm sure if it were a wedding with the Bride and Groom singing 'F*** the Queen and the SAS' you'd have the same comment...
It's be SF/Gerry Adams in the 'RA and Jean McConville in no time.

I never said people were wrong to be annoyed by it or not to like it. I commented on the permanently outraged that piled on the bandwagon. I am annoyed by the video, I dislike the video, hence I called for an appropriate penalty to reflect the nature of the offence and the status of the individual.

What I did criticise was the kneejerk hang 'em and flog 'em from the permanently outraged who jumped on the bandwagon and overreacted. They are ordinary public servants, not Councillor McElduff or any other public figure. They shouldn't be fired, they should be disciplined, and they should undergo education and training. That is the appropriate, even-handed approach. The only ones who disagree are those who have let the red mist rise behind their green-tinted glasses.

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

I never said people were wrong to be annoyed by it or not to like it. I commented on the permanently outraged that piled on the bandwagon. I am annoyed by the video, I dislike the video, hence I called for an appropriate penalty to reflect the nature of the offence and the status of the individual.

What I did criticise was the kneejerk hang 'em and flog 'em from the permanently outraged who jumped on the bandwagon and overreacted. They are ordinary public servants, not Councillor McElduff or any other public figure. They shouldn't be fired, they should be disciplined, and they should undergo education and training. That is the appropriate, even-handed approach. The only ones who disagree are those who have let the red mist rise behind their green-tinted glasses.

So depends on who you consider outraged and if you feel it's legitimate.
Seems to me people were saying the didn't like it and thought it was disgusting. That's fair. You even seem to agree.

Ah, near the end you seemed to have a decent point then you get the drum and fife out. Close Blanch. You'll be hard pressed to find any poster who says it never happens elsewhere, but if it helps your bias..

Strumms

Feisar wrote: »

To them Pope = Catholics = Tadhg's = Fenian's = Nationalist's = Mick's

It's not the Pope they are funking off.

I get that but either way, would you not be just for the day that’s in it, forget about those you supposedly ‘hate’ and get on with enjoying a love filled day ? Weirdos.

Plumbthedepths

Strumms wrote: »

I get that but either way, would you not be just for the day that’s in it, forget about those you supposedly ‘hate’ and get on with enjoying a love filled day ? Weirdos.

Hate, sectarianism, bigotry never takes a day off.

steddyeddy

blanch152 wrote: »

Could you not express it more simply as our lot are not as bad as their lot?

That would capture the essence of your post in a better way.

Hey Blanch I can certainly give it a go.

Yes the dominance of the Catholic church in Ireland was definitely sectarian in nature and something I am deeply opposed to.

The loyalist/unionist dominance of Protestantism in Northern Ireland expressed itself in terms of terrorist violence and pogroms against the native Catholics, vote rigging and denial of jobs and housing to those of a different religion. In extreme cases they threw urine at Catholic school children who passed through a loyalist area to get to school during the Holy Cross dispute. So yes, in terms of sectarianism, loyalists were far worse.

Strumms

Strumms wrote: »

I get that but either way, would you not be just for the day that’s in it, forget about those you supposedly ‘hate’ and get on with enjoying a love filled day ? Weirdos.

Yeah it’s bizarre - what do they do at baptisms I wonder, stick pins in pictures of The Taoiseach of the day and then off to the non-gay bakery for tea and scones?

Fionn1952

A pair of gobsh*tes and a pile of overreaction as far as I can see.

Should they lose their jobs? No. Wouldn't be many left in jobs back home if we fired everyone who sang a Republican or Loyalist song.

In saying that all, I'd imagine plenty of those condemning it would have had no problem with my own wedding, where the missus walked down the aisle to a very nice uillean pipe version of Grace. I'd also imagine there's a fair few out there who are defending it who would want me raked over the coals for having an 'IRA' song at my wedding.

Hate to agree with Blanch, but certainly a bit of red mist and green glasses going on.

deise08

Police have ended their investigation into an incident at a wedding reception in County Antrim where the bride and groom led their guests in chants of "f*** the Pope and the IRA".
Police closed their investigation after seeking legal advice according to Chief Inspector Michael Simpson.

A video of the bride and groom singing the chant to the tune of Tina Turner's 'Simply the Best' has been viewed over one million times since it emerged online.

The incident occurred at their wedding reception in the Loughshore Hotel in Carrickfergus on Friday, October 4.

A statement from Simpson reads: "Each and every incident we deal with is treated on its own merits.

"The incident in Carrickfergus was investigated as a hate incident

"Legal advice was sought as to whether any of the actions constituted a criminal offence. No offences relating to the incident were identified."

Came up on my feed from buzz.ie

joeguevara

There are actual hate crimes happening every day....police resources are stretched and can't be allocated to real crimes because they are investigating sh1te like this at the behest of people who are offended on behalf of others.

Money was spent on legal advice here when there isn't enough state money to pay for accommodation for homeless people, food for soup kitchens or medical intervention for people suffering from mental health issues.

Think about that....there are ongoing cases where not enough police resources are involved in investigating missing persons, victims of assault, victims of rape and murder and representatives of the PSNI are commenting on a case where a bit of anti Provo music was sung...instead of northern Ireland state solicitors working on real cases they had to take time to research the fact that no hate crime occurred.

Is this fcucking real life....are the people who vociferously condemned a rangers tune happy? Why not report Gary og to the FBI for singing snipers promise in Yonkers or for every pub in the country for belting out IRA in the chorus of athenry when we play Samoa on saturday.

fred funk }{

Feisar wrote: »

To them Pope = Catholics = Tadhg's = Fenian's = Nationalist's = Mick's

It's not the Pope they are funking off.

This is the nub of it. They might as well be singing "fcuk the irish the catholic scum".

Hope they get sacked.

Stoner

gormdubhgorm wrote:

If someone called me a Tadhg or a Mick I would just laugh. If someone insulted me for being a Catholic I would not care I don't believe in it or go to mass.

Ahh come on gurmdubhgurm.

Walk a mile in my shoes and all that.
That's like saying you don't mind gay jokes because you are not gay.

Or you don't care about free speech because you've nothing to say yourself.

Songs in a pub or recalling old battles from any side is at a different level to organised parades and other prearranged planned activities.

Imo either side singing about a war is completely different to a side celebrating oppression, in a society where scetatisism has been deployed and rolled out into local politics, where one's religion determined if you received social housing, a vote and before that if you were fed in a famine.

That came from largly from one direction. Only one side can sing about lack of civil rights and what happened in a famine.

IMO this is not a case of balancing one singsong versus another.


Only a few have an issue with a proud British Irish person, this is different. For example I couldn't see Rory Best taking part in this. I'd imagine he'd run a mile from it while still being his own man.

Being aligned to Britain is fine and can be respected and achieved without hatred.

There is a reason why you have moved past religion, can vote, have somewhere to live and can be dismissive of this type of behaviour.

It was not handed over though.

We've seen what this type of thinking can lead to in this country. What it ultimately leads to.

Its wrong, it might not be outrageous to you, but I've seen you (like me) get upset about sport.

I also don't believe that half the population in NI think like this, far from it.

I wouldn't like to see anyone lose their jobs over it, but it's not nothing or a bit of fun either.

Hector Savage

fred funk }{ wrote: »

This is the nub of it. They might as well be singing "fcuk the irish the catholic scum".

Hope they get sacked.

But they didn't sing that.
- You are standing up for an organisation that raped kids and a TERRORIST organisation that murdered 1000s.

We can all stretch it.

fred funk }{

Hector Savage wrote: »

But they didn't sing that.
- You are standing up for an organisation that raped kids and a TERRORIST organisation that murdered 1000s.

We can all stretch it.

The connotation is clear, as I said earlier. If you can't/don't see that then you need to educate yourself on the history in the North.

One eyed Jack

fred funk }{ wrote: »

The connotation is clear, as I said earlier. If you can't/don't see that then you need to educate yourself on the history in the North.

Next time anyone takes a pop at Irish Catholics on Boards, will you be front and centre leading the charge to have their employers fire them? :rolleyes:

Don’t put yourself out on my behalf.

buried

Any person that is from Northern Ireland, a province that witnessed literally over 3000 murders due to sectarianism, 3000 murders of people from their own neighbourhood, if that person revels in such levels of sectarianism, well that person is either one of two things.

A. A psychopath

B. Deeply deeply ignorant to a dangerous level.

Neither one should be in a position to teach a dog, never mind children.

Because their precious 'belief' this sick twisted belief in sectarianism was the ultimate cause of thousands of bloody murders. They know it too. They champion it. They want it back. Thousands of murders. That's where it leads to.
That's the mindset of a psychopath.

facehugger99

When you see the kind of stuff that goes on in Nordieland from both sides, you can only give heartfelt thanks that it's the UK's problem to deal with.

Charles Babbage

The main defence in this thread seems to be that this is analogous to singing Roddy McCordy in the pub, which is it not, or that the poster hates the Catholic Church so this makes it OK, which it does not.

One eyed Jack

Charles Babbage wrote: »

The main defence in this thread seems to be that this is analogous to singing Roddy McCordy in the pub, which is it not, or that the poster hates the Catholic Church so this makes it OK, which it does not.

The main reasons for offence being taken by pearl clutchers appears to amount to nothing more than pearl clutching and taking offence for the purposes of spewing their own brand of hatred (like they’re not just the second cheek of the same arse).

Akabusi

Its obvious that one or two posters are trolling here stating that the singing is clearly aimed at the catholic church. My advice is to not engage with them.

Its a simple case of the bridge and groom being bigots. It just shows them up to be ignorant and backwards.

I don't know what their jobs are but unless they are cross community peace workers i think calling for them to be sacked is a bit over the top.

Let them continue in their ways, all they are doing is showing the outside world what a toxic little place N Ire is. Is it any wonder there is little to no investment up there.

Balf

Akabusi wrote: »

Its obvious that one or two posters are trolling here stating that the singing is clearly aimed at the catholic church.

In fairness, I don't think that's quite what some of us have said.

I'd guess the folk singing that song would regard me as a Catholic, and probably think their song is yanking my chain.

But I'm actually an atheist, and laughing because there's actually nothing in the words they are singing that I particularly give a hoot about.

As you say, leave them at it. Hopefully, some day they'll wake up. In the meantime, let's not be like them.

dabestman1

Hope they both get fired, bigots that they are. How people cannot understand that what they were singing was aimed at irish people baffles me and to defend it is complete BS.

krissovo

I think the couple have suffered enough at the hands of social media. What is supposed to be wonderful honeymoon period has been drastically cut short due to the nightmare of viral video and the follow up stress. That is punishment enough.

They are guilty of not much more than being idiots, bad parenting and being bigoted chav’s.

maccored

Hector Savage wrote: »

But they didn't sing that.
- You are standing up for an organisation that raped kids and a TERRORIST organisation that murdered 1000s.

We can all stretch it.

i think what they were singing and why went over your head

Balf

maccored wrote: »

i think what they were singing and why went over your head

It really didn't.

The actual point is going right over your head.

Odin, you suck! Vikings, bunch of pussies! There, that's all of Scandinavia outraged.

gormdubhgorm

Akabusi wrote: »

Its obvious that one or two posters are trolling here stating that the singing is clearly aimed at the catholic church. My advice is to not engage with them.

Its a simple case of the bridge and groom being bigots. It just shows them up to be ignorant and backwards.

I don't know what their jobs are but unless they are cross community peace workers i think calling for them to be sacked is a bit over the top.

Let them continue in their ways, all they are doing is showing the outside world what a toxic little place N Ire is. Is it any wonder there is little to no investment up there.

This post is completely contradictory.

If it is not clearly aimed at the Catholic Church why is there mention of The Pope?
The Pope the fella who happens to be the head of thing.
The Pope has long being linked to Catholic Ireland - Home Rule = Rome Rule etc.
The likes of the Ne Temere Decree in 1907 and the Special position of the Catholic Church until 1972 in the Irish Constitution would not have helped this thought process. The running of Protestants from Cork during the 1920's would not have helped much either - in the Protestant NI mind.

Also if you look at NI what do they constantly mention as a divide? Protestants v Catholics.
Why are they bigots in your view? = because they attack one religion over another.

Why do they call schemes 'Cross Community' because they want to bring together Protestants and Catholics. Again coming back to religion.