Greta and the aristocrat sail the high seas to save the planet.

car_radio19834

Tell me how wrote: »

So, what do you think should be done?

Disincentivise having kids. No childrens allowance for more than 1 kid. Lower tax band for people with 1 kid or less.

There's loads of opportunities.

Thelonious Monk

car_radio19834 wrote: »

I was just thinking there.

So there's like 7 billion people in the world now. Lets say they all own a car on average over their lifetime.

That's 7 billion cars that required massive digging, massive resources etc to make. The idea that this many people can easily live on the planet without harming it is naiive.

Just like the afterlife is a fairytale for people who are afraid of the dark, renewables are a fairytale for people who are afraid of the future.

Well maybe we shouldn't all own cars. I've never owned one. If things were planned better we wouldn't need them. There are many things we can do, like changing our diets, our consumption habits etc, that can help the situation before we start trying to stop population growth - and lets face it that's never going to happen so it's a moot point.

gozunda

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Well maybe we shouldn't all own cars. I've never owned one. If things were planned better we wouldn't need them. There are many things we can do, like changing our diets, our consumption habits etc, that can help the situation before we start trying to stop population growth - and lets face it that's never going to happen so it's a moot point.

I do love the whole ignoring the elephant in the room thing - for the reason it's an elephant!

As car_radio says above - there's plenty of opportunities. Education being the main one ...

jackboy

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Well maybe we shouldn't all own cars. I've never owned one. If things were planned better we wouldn't need them.

It’s easy to tell others to give up what you don’t have to give up yourself.

There are endless things that could be stopped before we need to look at cars. Cars make our lives better. The country is overflowing with junk that does not improve our lives.

Thelonious Monk

Well you all admit there's a big problem with consumption and resources but are unwilling to change anything. I assume none of you have kids.

Eric Cartman

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Well maybe we shouldn't all own cars. I've never owned one. If things were planned better we wouldn't need them. There are many things we can do, like changing our diets, our consumption habits etc, that can help the situation before we start trying to stop population growth - and lets face it that's never going to happen so it's a moot point.

So you have the priveleged life of living somewhere with public transport, well done you . Many people do not have that luxury. Youre no better than those people who watch those shows about obese poor people and go 'why don't they just eat healthy salads and drink smoothies instead of eating 20p chicken nuggets'

Thelonious Monk

Eric Cartman wrote: »

So you have the priveleged life of living somewhere with public transport, well done you . Many people do not have that luxury. Youre no better than those people who watch those shows about obese poor people and go 'why don't they just eat healthy salads and drink smoothies instead of eating 20p chicken nuggets'

Pretty much everyone I know has a car, and every house in Dublin from what I can see. It's a choice for many. My point was not everyone needs one or will ever own one.

Eric Cartman

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Pretty much everyone I know has a car, and every house in Dublin from what I can see. It's a choice for many. My point was not everyone needs one or will ever own one.

And a requirement for many others also . Any increase in the cost of motoring might encourage more priviledged people to make the change but cripples those who do not have a choice. These people tend to be on lower incomes also. Increasing the cost of motoring is an attack on the working and lower middle classes exclusively.

Yellow_Fern

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Pretty much everyone I know has a car, and every house in Dublin from what I can see. It's a choice for many. My point was not everyone needs one or will ever own one.

You wouldnt buy one on a whim. They are expensive and a hassle and people will cease buying them when there are an attractive alternative

jackboy

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Well you all admit there's a big problem with consumption and resources but are unwilling to change anything. I assume none of you have kids.

There is plenty that could be changed without negatively impacting people’s lives. The vast majority of houses are filled with useless junk. Why not put colossal taxes on private helicopters, nobody needs them. We actually import potatoes to Ireland. There are vast amounts of things we can do to reduce consumption and pollution before we make our lives worse.

Thelonious Monk

Yellow_Fern wrote: »

You wouldnt buy one on a whim. They are expensive and a hassle and people will cease buying them when there are an attractive alternative

People do buy them on a whim. People at my work drive in from places like Artane and Clondalkin, single people with no kids. You could walk to town from these places.
And every 2nd car is an SUV, especially in the more affluent areas. They should be taxed to oblivion imo.
But yes better alternatives are required, and we need to stop planning the country around cars.

Tell me how

gozunda wrote: »

I do love the whole ignoring the elephant in the room thing - for the reason it's an elephant!

As car_radio says above - there's plenty of opportunities. Education being the main one ...

What type of education?
Where?
Do you see any issue arising out of such education?
Do you think such education will have sufficient impact to bring about the required change within a meaningful time frame?
Do you see any other issues with such an approach?

Throwing out such ideas like this without analysis is pointless.

blinding

car_radio19834 wrote: »

Disincentivise having kids. No childrens allowance for more than 1 kid. Lower tax band for people with 1 kid or less.

There's loads of opportunities.

Hasn’t worked out well for the Chinese and Chinese girls .

Hence the Chinese brought it to an end . The Japanese also have low birth rates and that not going well for them either.

gozunda

Tell me how wrote: »

What type of education?Where?Do you see any issue arising out of such education?Do you think such education will have sufficient impact to bring about the required change within a meaningful time frame?Do you see any other issues with such an approach?

Throwing out such ideas like this without analysis is pointless.

So much like your comment above and others?

It's not my idea btw. The UN in its
the State of the World Population Report (SWOP) state clearly that expanding women and girls access to education and the opportunities it enables, is key to managing population growth. 

https://www.bridgeinternationalacademies.com/sustainable-population-depends-on-education/

Also:

https://ec.europa.eu/jrc/en/facts4eufuture/eu-demographic-scenarios/girls-education-global-population-growth

Increasing girls' education is key for the future of population growth in Africa and the world

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2015/07/how-education-can-moderate-population-growth/

One of the most powerful tools in stemming population growth will be education,

Btw reply was in response to this:

lets face it that's never going to happen so it's a moot point obviously

But as you said "throwing out such ideas like this without analysis is pointless"...

Odd it is not equally applied no?

Thelonious Monk

It isn't Africans that are the problem though it's westerners like us. How do you reduce population in rich countries?

jackboy

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

It isn't Africans that are the problem though it's westerners like us. How do you reduce population in rich countries?

Not true. There are massive problems in Africa. Overpopulation and destruction of habitats is widespread

Thelonious Monk

jackboy wrote: »

Not true. There are massive problems in Africa. Overpopulation and destruction of habitats is widespread

Maybe but you could say the same about ireland and Europe.

jackboy

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Maybe but you could say the same about ireland and Europe.

Of course.

Winning_Stroke

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Maybe but you could say the same about ireland and Europe.

Ireland's hardly overpopulated.

Thelonious Monk

Winning_Stroke wrote: »

Ireland's hardly overpopulated.

We have zero wildreness and the whole country is a farm basically. Biodiversity is f*cked here.

easypazz

Winning_Stroke wrote: »

Ireland's hardly overpopulated.

Thanks mainly to a famine.

But at the rate population is growing we are struggling to supply enough houses for people.

AllForIt

I'm not particularly a great fan of Ben Shapiro but this did make me laugh.

https://twitter.com/benshapiro/status/1220054674130132992

Thelonious Monk

easypazz wrote: »

Thanks mainly to a famine.

But at the rate population is growing we are struggling to supply enough houses for people.

Well if people are saying overpopulation is the problem it doesnt really matter where the people are located in a globalised world. As we consume things from all over the world population would need to drop here too.
Can anyone realistically see this being implemented?

gozunda

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Well if people are saying overpopulation is the problem it doesnt really matter where the people are located in a globalised world. As we consume things from all over the world population would need to drop here too.Can anyone realistically see this being implemented?

So wringing hands and giving out about everything else is a realistic solution is it? Why can't education be advocated and implemented? As per previous - education is recognised as a means of helping improve women lives, society and reducing population pressures. Or like farming and much everything else you dont agree with that either?

Ireland birth rate has been falling fairly steadily since the 1970s with a figure of 1.77 births per woman (Eurostat figures) and now below the population replacement level (without the effect of migration) considered to be 2.1 live births per woman. So looks like you'll get your drop Thelonoius - but migration should help make up for that ....

KyussB

AllForIt wrote: »

I'm not particularly a great fan of Ben Shapiro but this did make me laugh.

https://twitter.com/benshapiro/status/1220054674130132992

Perfect example of peoples willingness to be 'deceived' when it suits their point of view.

The statement you are perpetuating, is that she wants net zero emissions right now, today. Not to begin the path towards that, but to have that right now straight away - which is the difference between realistic vs impossible.

You did not fact check whether or not she said that. I will bet that, rather than admit she did not say that, instead you'd just walk back the claim into weaker form.

Basically, you put forward the strong/impossible claim about what she said, in order to ridicule her - then I bet you'd wilfully/deceitfully lie, by using the weaker/realistic claim to try and back up that she did say the former.

Lets see you quote her directly, to back up what you're perpetuating - and to see if you stick to the stronger claim, or try to walk it back with the weaker claim.

Paddygreen

Is anyone else hoping Corona wipes out millions of people. Humanity is a disease that needs to be exterminated. I am like His Royal Highness Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh, Earl of Merioneth, Baron Greenwich, Royal Knight of the Most Noble Order of the Garter, Extra Knight of the Most Ancient and Most Noble Order of the Thistle, Member of the Order of Merit, Knight Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order, Grand Master and First and Principal Knight Grand Cross of the Most Excellent Order of the British Empire, Additional Member of the Order of New Zealand, Extra Companion of the Queen's Service Order, Knight of the Order of Australia, Royal Chief of the Order of Logohu, Extraordinary Companion of the Order of Canada, Extraordinary Commander of the Order of Military Merit, Canadian Forces Decoration, Lord of Her Majesty's Most Honourable Privy Council, Member of the Queen's Privy Council for Canada, Personal Aide-de-Camp to His Majesty King George VI, Lord High Admiral of the United Kingdom... I also want to reincarnate as a deadly virus.

Paddygreen

gozunda wrote: »

Ireland births rate has been falling fairly steadily since the 1970s with a figure of 1.77 births per woman (Eurostat figures) and now below the population replacement level (without the effect of migration) considered to be 2.1 live births per woman. So looks like you'll get your drop Thelonoius - but migration should help make up for that ....

We need migration to fill the jobs the Irish are too lazy to do. My Polish cleaner barely has any time for recreation so I doubt her carbon footprint would be any bigger than it is in Poland.

BluePlanet

gozunda wrote: »

True but Afaik the catholic church are not trying to claim that civilisation is going to end in approx 10 years as promoted by some of the more belligerent climate alarmists - greta included

Where did she say that civilization would end in 10 years?

gozunda

Paddygreen wrote: »

We need migration to fill the jobs the Irish are too lazy to do. My Polish cleaner barely has any time for recreation so I doubt her carbon footprint would be any bigger than it is in Poland.

Didn't say otherwise. We are talking about changes in population across the globe. In Ireland the birth rate per woman is declining - but it is suggested that immigration will somewhat ameliorate that ...

Eitherway there's several threads on stereotyping the Irish doing the rounds atm. Your comments might be better suited there I reckon.

gozunda

BluePlanet wrote: »

Where did she say that civilization would end in 10 years?

Not just 10 years - but 10 years, 252 days and 10 hours to be precise...

Something she has been variously touting in her speeches. Afaik the first was when she spoke before British parliament in April 2019, where she claimed that “Around the year 2030, 10 years 252 days and 10 hours away from now, we will be in a position where we set off an irreversible chain reaction beyond human control, that will most likely lead to the end of our civilisation as we know it.”

Speech here:
https://youtu.be/rYNM4rsnNFM