The Dominance of Dublin GAA *Mod warning post#1*

kilns

Hawkeye9212 wrote: »

What will these merged teams be called? You'd need to move away from the county system if you wanted a competitive championship. County loyalty will be too hard to break.

Leitrim have 2 Connacht titles. They've never won Sam. No amount of restructuring will change this.

Dublin and Kerry have won 50% of the All-Ireland titles. They will continue to dominate the competition like they have always done.

Giving them a name would be the last if the worries!

kilns

grbear wrote: »

Some interesting splits there but they seem to be based on a counties current strength in the GAA without placing much value on factors like population and more importantly current growth or decline in population. Counties like Louth and Wicklow may be considered traditionally weak but their populations are growing way faster than the likes of Mayo and Kerry for instance. Those trends would have to be accounted for in any redrawing of boundaries.

The complete non-reaction of the wider GAA community to some of the stuff exposed by the audits into Galway GAA worries me. People seem happy to box it off as "oh those Tribesmen, what are they like at all" and act as if some of the issues highlighted can't possibly exist elsewhere. There needs to be a system where a random set of counties are externally audited each year to highlight any shortcomings in how counties handle money. Revenue from club games in Galway is up by literally hundreds of thousands since new measures were brought in to keep track of ticket money while attendances haven't jumped significantly. Is Galway really the only county in Ireland where money was growing legs because the controls weren't/aren't tight enough?

As I said it’s only off the top of my head stuff more criteria would be needed to come up with the new “franchises” the problem with Louth if you left them stand alone they will fall even further behind and never improve

gaffer91

kilns wrote: »

That is complete bull and you know it.

Give one reason how splitting Dublin will benefit a county like Longford who have only won one ever Leinster title in 1968

I already gave a reason in a post (#3741) you have already replied to (your post #3769).

Hawkeye9212

kilns wrote: »

As I said it’s only off the top of my head stuff more criteria would be needed to come up with the new “franchises” the problem with Louth if you left them stand alone they will fall even further behind and never improve

Armagh/Down - Newry Mountaineers

Louth/Meath - Boyne

gaffer91

PerryB78 wrote: »

You left out the home advantage. Those aren't the only advantages either, but they're the most consequential ones.

I love this angle in particular that gaff has continuously spouted on this thread. If I remember correctly back in 2009, following the 17 pt win over Dublin, the kerry folk relished playing Dublin in croker as they felt the home advantage was in fact a detriment to Dublin as it increased the pressure on them. Fast forward 10 years and they're now whingeing about it being suddenly an advantage. So what's it to be? Whats changed in that time? Only the greatest team in history who have proven time and time again that whatever's thrown at them, they can handle. Give it a rest, the current Dublin dominance is cyclical and it wont last, it's just a very special team

That analysis in 2009 was wrong- playing at home for important matches has always helped Dublin. In the same way that playing at home helps teams in virtually every team sport. That really isn't a controversial point.

This isn't cyclical- the necessary factors are present to ensure endless Dublin dominance. These factors include population, funding, playing at home and other things. We've already seen the Leinster Championship destroyed as a competition and we are currently seeing it with the All- Ireland. Dublin have lost numerous excellent players over the last few years and there is an endless conveyor belt of newer, often superior, players able to take over.

As these victories are built on unfair advantages, what can we do to help manage the situation? Simple, split Dublin into four teams to ensure the meaningful survival of the competition and thus help all counties.

Hawkeye9212

gaffer91 wrote: »

That analysis in 2009 was wrong- playing at home for important matches has always helped Dublin. In the same way that playing at home helps teams in virtually every team sport. That really isn't a controversial point.

This isn't cyclical- the necessary factors are present to ensure endless Dublin dominance. These factors include population, funding, playing at home and other things. We've already seen the Leinster Championship destroyed as a competition and we are currently seeing it with the All- Ireland. Dublin have lost numerous excellent players over the last few years and there is an endless conveyor belt of newer, often superior, players able to take over.

As these victories are built on unfair advantages, what can we do to help manage the situation? Simple, split Dublin into four teams to ensure the meaningful survival of the competition and thus help all counties.

They should split Kerry in two. Munster is a joke as well. I'll walk away from the intercounty scene if they split Dublin. It will just result in several Dublin teams dominating alongside Kerry instead of one.

Higgins5473

Hawkeye9212 wrote: »

They should split Kerry in two. Munster is a joke as well. I'll walk away from the intercounty scene if they split Dublin. It will just result in several Dublin teams dominating alongside Kerry instead of one.

Don't worry, as far as I can see the only place Dublin being split in two is being realistically discussed are by lads crying bitter lemon tears into their pints in shebeens in Mayo and on this thread by the same. It's not happening.

PerryB78

gaffer91 wrote: »

That analysis in 2009 was wrong- playing at home for important matches has always helped Dublin. In the same way that playing at home helps teams in virtually every team sport. That really isn't a controversial point.

But it hasn't though has it? it was put forward for years that it increased the pressure on Dublin, especially during the AI drought between 95-2011

This isn't cyclical- the necessary factors are present to ensure endless Dublin dominance. These factors include population, funding, playing at home and other things. We've already seen the Leinster Championship destroyed as a competition and we are currently seeing it with the All- Ireland. Dublin have lost numerous excellent players over the last few years and there is an endless conveyor belt of newer, often superior, players able to take over.

We've always had the bigger population and what are the 'other things' you talk about? Munster is no better a championship than leinster now is it?

As these victories are built on unfair advantages, what can we do to help manage the situation? Simple, split Dublin into four teams to ensure the meaningful survival of the competition and thus help all counties.

Your whole argument smacks of sour grapes and bitterness, Dublin wont be split, it dosent have to happen and it never will so get used to it, your persistent crying is funny though

gaffer91

Hawkeye9212 wrote: »

They should split Kerry in two. Munster is a joke as well. I'll walk away from the intercounty scene if they split Dublin. It will just result in several Dublin teams dominating alongside Kerry instead of one.

Kerry don't have any comparable unfair advantages as Dublin. It's not just the success that matters for Dublin, it's the unfair advantages that they are built off too e.g funding, population etc.

The provincials can be done away with if people were that way inclined- Dublin will have to be split regardless.

I think most Dublin fans wouldn't walk away, regardless of your own views. Rivalry would quickly develop between the new Dublin divisional sides and most supporters would quickly row in behind them.

gaffer91

Higgins5473 wrote: »

Don't worry, as far as I can see the only place Dublin being split in two is being realistically discussed are by lads crying bitter lemon tears into their pints in shebeens in Mayo and on this thread by the same. It's not happening.

It will happen eventually or Gaelic Football will die at inter- county level. It's becoming a mainstream conversation anyway- immediately after the final replay this year you had McStay, RTE, Colm O'Rourke and Sean Moran talking about about Dublin's unfair advantages and/or the need to split them.

gaffer91

PerryB78 wrote: »

Your whole argument smacks of sour grapes and bitterness, Dublin wont be split, it dosent have to happen and it never will so get used to it, your persistent crying is funny though

Your post formatting is dreadful.

There's no sour grapes at all- just a desire to do what's best for Gaelic Football.

Some arguments might have been "put forward" about Croke Park not helping Dublin but they were obviously nonsense- Dublin would undoubtedly have won even less from 95- 2011 without these unfair advantages.

You always had a bigger population and it was always such a statistical outlier that it was unfair. Population alone was grounds for a two way split. It's only because of the financial doping that I came round to a four way split. As I've repeatedly stated, it's the combination of advantages that Dublin enjoy that mean they need to be split, not just any one individually.

Other things would include better sporting facilities generally available in Dublin, ease of fielding a team because basically the entire squad can live and work locally unlike in other counties, and so on. These are less important than the population, funding etc so they are not mentioned as often.

Anyone looking at the GAA in 2019 with an unbiased eye will be forced to conclude that splitting Dublin is the single best step that can be taken to help the inter- county game.

dunnerc

gaffer91 wrote: »

Kerry don't have any comparable unfair advantages as Dublin. It's not just the success that matters for Dublin, it's the unfair advantages that they are built off too e.g funding, population etc.

The provincials can be done away with if people were that way inclined- Dublin will have to be split regardless.

I think most Dublin fans wouldn't walk away, regardless of your own views. Rivalry would quickly develop between the new Dublin divisional sides and most supporters would quickly row in behind them.

I think you havnt a clue :rolleyes: Dublin fans will never accept a split not ever
But no harm in dreaming though

Hawkeye9212

gaffer91 wrote: »

Kerry don't have any comparable unfair advantages as Dublin. It's not just the success that matters for Dublin, it's the unfair advantages that they are built off too e.g funding, population etc.

The provincials can be done away with if people were that way inclined- Dublin will have to be split regardless.

I think most Dublin fans wouldn't walk away, regardless of your own views. Rivalry would quickly develop between the new Dublin divisional sides and most supporters would quickly row in behind them.

Dublin fans will walk away. The only stadiums in Dublin capable of holding intercounty games are Croke Park and Parnell Park. The two counties in South Dublin won't have a local team to support. Unless you're in favour of building a new stadium in South Dublin.

PerryB78

gaffer91 wrote: »

Your post formatting is dreadful.

There's no sour grapes at all- just a desire to do what's best for Gaelic Football.

Some arguments might have been "put forward" about Croke Park not helping Dublin but they were obviously nonsense- Dublin would undoubtedly have won even less from 95- 2011 without these unfair advantages.

You always had a bigger population and it was always such a statistical outlier that it was unfair. Population alone was grounds for a two way split. It's only because of the financial doping that I came round to a four way split. As I've repeatedly stated, it's the combination of advantages that Dublin enjoy that mean they need to be split, not just any one individually.

Other things would include better sporting facilities generally available in Dublin, ease of fielding a team because basically the entire squad can live and work locally unlike in other counties, and so on. These are less important than the population, funding etc so they are not mentioned as often.

Anyone looking at the GAA in 2019 with an unbiased eye will be forced to conclude that splitting Dublin is the single best step that can be taken to help the inter- county game.

My formatting would be as good as yours if I spent the same amount of time that you do on here obsessing about us. Try dress it up as something that's best for GAA but it's only your 'desire' to see Dublins dominance end as you hate it, any true GAA fan would admire this Dublin team but you have never given them any credit whatsoever. This team have raised the bar higher than ever before and created history in the process but all you do is belittle it. It's people like you that make it all the more sweeter, keep banging your head off the wall, it wont get you anywhere but more bitter

RoyalCelt

We all admired the great kerry and killenny teams as they were real counties who didn't have ridiculous advantages. And in some cases the GAA made moves to even things particularly for killenny. They put Galway into Leinster and gave Dublin hurling massive funding. Both moves directly limited their success.

Neither played almost every match at home or received funding like Dublin have. They also didn't have the sponsorship of a province or the population.

I do agree Dublin should be split into 4. They should be split into 2 and massive funding should go into counties who still can't compete. There's no reason you couldn't have a championship with at least 10 serious contenders. At present we have 1.

beggars_bush

gaffer91 wrote: »

It will happen eventually or Gaelic Football will die at inter- county level. It's becoming a mainstream conversation anyway- immediately after the final replay this year you had McStay, RTE, Colm O'Rourke and Sean Moran talking about about Dublin's unfair advantages and/or the need to split them.

Or just reduce the funding allocated
Dublin have ample resources themselves, and the rest of the country is subsidising them for too long

Spend it on improving other counties

Hawkeye9212

RoyalCelt wrote: »

We all admired the great kerry and killenny teams as they were real counties who didn't have ridiculous advantages. And in some cases the GAA made moves to even things particularly for killenny. They put Galway into Leinster and gave Dublin hurling massive funding. Both moves directly limited their success.

Neither played almost every match at home or received funding like Dublin have. They also didn't have the sponsorship of a province or the population.

I do agree Dublin should be split into 4. They should be split into 2 and massive funding should go into counties who still can't compete. There's no reason you couldn't have a championship with at least 10 serious contenders. At present we have 1.

4 of these contenders will be Dublin teams so we could end up with all-Dublin finals. That would definitely kill the intercounty game.

STB.

Yeah, none of this going to happen.


Stop whinging about how good Dublin are and look at improving your own County teams.

Will require a lot of training, no drinking and total dedication.

The Lost Sheep

RoyalCelt wrote: »

We all admired the great kerry and killenny teams as they were real counties who didn't have ridiculous advantages. And in some cases the GAA made moves to even things particularly for killenny. They put Galway into Leinster and gave Dublin hurling massive funding. Both moves directly limited their success.

going Dublin are not a real county is just childish and not anything near a real argument. They do have big advantages over many of their big rivals though. Has galway and Dublin really challenged kilkenny in leinster though?

Neither played almost every match at home or received funding like Dublin have. They also didn't have the sponsorship of a province or the population.

huge percentage of Dublin funding goes on development officers etc and they have a population bigger than all of connacht and most of Ulster so should they not have much more funding as a result?

Ido agree Dublin should be split into 4. They should be split into 2 and massive funding should go into counties who still can't compete. There's no reason you couldn't have a championship with at least 10 serious contenders. At present we have 1.

Dublin if they even should be split should be split in 2. If you are going to split Dublin in 4 then other counties should also be split. We dont just have 1 serious contender and in no way could we have 10 serious contenders. That's a third of the entire country.

STB. wrote: »

Yeah, none of this going to happen.

Stop whinging about how good Dublin are and look at improving your own County teams.

Will require a lot of training, no drinking and total dedication.

Honestly there is one poor lad here who must be responsible for a third of all the posts on this thread. Professional help may not be of any use at this stage.

that's a load of rubbish especially the drinking, training. Are you seriously suggesting many counties dont do enough training or are dedicated enough?

MayoAreMagic

Hawkeye9212 wrote: »

It won't work. Nobody will support a team which isn't based in the area of its namesake.

But Dublin north and dublin south would be based on the area where people are from...

Even ignoring that for a second. The whims of one county cant hold the rest of the gaa world to randsom. If you really cant stand not being an entire entity then you could always get the railway cup going again.
In reality, what are dubs even afraid of? They would still have multiples of what kerry would have, in both teams and all the other advantages would still be there. If these famous structures are even half as good as they are supposed to be you should be beating them and everyone else regularly within a couple of years. That is the reality.

MayoAreMagic

STB. wrote: »

Yeah, none of this going to happen.


Stop whinging about how good Dublin are and look at improving your own County teams.

Will require a lot of training, no drinking and total dedication.

Honestly there is one poor lad here who must be responsible for a third of all the posts on this thread. Professional help may not be of any use at this stage.

This wasnt what dublin did to improve.

PerryB78

beggars_bush wrote: »

Or just reduce the funding allocated
Dublin have ample resources themselves, and the rest of the country is subsidising them for too long

Spend it on improving other counties

Wow just wow, one of the most bizarre things I've read on here. Beggars_bush more like Beggars_belief 😂😂😂

Hawkeye9212

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

But Dublin north and dublin south would be based on the area where people are from...

Even ignoring that for a second. The whims of one county cant hold the rest of the gaa world to randsom. If you really cant stand not being an entire entity then you could always get the railway cup going again.
In reality, what are dubs even afraid of? They would still have multiples of what kerry would have, in both teams and all the other advantages would still be there. If these famous structures are even half as good as they are supposed to be you should be beating them and everyone else regularly within a couple of years. That is the reality.

South Dublin doesn't have a stadium capable of holding intercounty games. Also, you're not a psychic. I'm not a Dub.

Dr. Bre

You can’t just create teams and expect fans to support these newly created teams. If the split happened and fell flat on its face you would have the biggest populated county not interested in Gaelic games . A risk the GAA will not take and rightly so.

RedDevil55

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

huge percentage of Dublin funding goes on development officers etc and they have a population bigger than all of connacht and most of Ulster so should they not have much more funding as a result?

The funding is grossly disproportionate. The GAA have funded over 50 development officers in Dublin for the last 12 years. Kerry, Mayo, Donegal and Tyrone have had 2 each over that time. I don't believe that's right but apparently others disagree.

RedDevil55

Hawkeye9212 wrote: »

South Dublin doesn't have a stadium capable of holding intercounty games. Also, you're not a psychic. I'm not a Dub.

Most counties don't have home games in the Leinster championship so a precedent is there

Bonniedog

RedDevil55 wrote: »

Most counties don't have home games in the Leinster championship so a precedent is there

Dublin have been beaten once in 30 away games in Leinster since 1973.

RedDevil55

Bonniedog wrote: »

Dublin have been beaten once in 30 away games in Leinster since 1973.

You are not very clever are you?

Stick to the old soccerball son.

Fair play Dublin but the point I was making is that a hypothetical South Dublin team needn't play their games in South Dublin.

I'm not sure what my intelligence level or soccer interests have to do with this thread.

Hawkeye9212

RedDevil55 wrote: »

Fair play Dublin but the point I was making is that a hypothetical South Dublin team needn't play their games in South Dublin.

I'm not sure what my intelligence level or soccer interests have to do with this thread.

Defeats the whole point of supporting your local team.

beggars_bush

PerryB78 wrote: »

Wow just wow, one of the most bizarre things I've read on here. Beggars_bush more like Beggars_belief ������

Well where does the money come from Dublins coaching setup?
The other counties via central council