Cost of Building a House 2019

kieran.

It is calculated versus the size of the house. There may also be additional levies for an urban house too.

Stan27

km79 wrote: »

If he decides to use an architect
If not add 2/3k onto engineer approx And subtract the 15k
I didn’t use an architect. Engineer did planning for approx 2.5 and will be doing construction drawing , signing off in stages etc for another 4.5 k
Water connection for me is approx 2k
Planning contribution approx 2k

Planning contribution in Kildare is like 12k!!!!!!!!!!

omathum2

ECO_Mental wrote: »

PM sent...if these lads werent busy two weeks ago they must be by now...:P

Hi there, I'm just moving to Tender Stage for self build, and I'd be much obliged if you could share your cost comparison. Building near Cork so hoping it should be comparable.

893bet

If you haven’t planning already then I suggest shaving off 800-1000 square foot. If you don’t do this, some day you will regret it.

Save yourself a fortune in building, heating and cleaning for the next 40 years.

2000sqft well designed wont feel that much smaller than the average 3000sqft house.

P2C

That’s mental I spent 2.5k on my arch 10 years ago and he signed off on the house.

kieran. wrote: »

Approx 40k is typical

ESB 2.5k
Irish water 6k Water + effluent (12k for septic tank and perc area + GWS water connection)
Solicitors 5k (Inc topo and site tests)
Arch 15k
Eng 5k
Ber 1.5k (Inc Air test)
Planning contributions 5k

thomas 123

Hey All,

Sanity check here, planning a build in rural east Galway.

We currently have a budget(Mortgage pre-approval) of 250K less 25K for site(Secured).

Of course, like everyone, we want the dream 2000SqFT home.

I have sourced an engineer who I am quite happy with and his costs are reasonable inc plans (7-8K vat included)

Do I have any hope of getting what I want do ye think?

We have a plasterer in the family who will do all the plastering as well as any other jobs he is happy to do so I think this is a big saving.

We are happy to get to whatever finish the bank is happy with, I am led to believe this is (Kitchen/Bathroom/Doors/skirting boards/Bedroom).

We are also prepared to do any groundwork's needed - to clarify any drives or lawns etc, I will leave the foundations to the experts.

We are also in a position to hold off and secure more funding from the bank down the line due to salary increases, but on the flip side I will be paying a larger mortgage in any case.

Thoughts much appreciated.

dubrov

P2C wrote:

That’s mental I spent 2.5k on my arch 10 years ago and he signed off on the house.

In fairness you can't compare prices now to ten years ago. Back then architects were working for slightly more than minimum wage as there was no work out there

km79

thomas 123 wrote: »

Hey All,

Sanity check here, planning a build in rural east Galway.

We currently have a budget(Mortgage pre-approval) of 250K less 25K for site(Secured).

Of course, like everyone, we want the dream 2000SqFT home.

I have sourced an engineer who I am quite happy with and his costs are reasonable inc plans (7-8K vat included)

Do I have any hope of getting what I want do ye think?

We have a plasterer in the family who will do all the plastering as well as any other jobs he is happy to do so I think this is a big saving.

We are happy to get to whatever finish the bank is happy with, I am led to believe this is (Kitchen/Bathroom/Doors/skirting boards/Bedroom).

We are also prepared to do any groundwork's needed - to clarify any drives or lawns etc, I will leave the foundations to the experts.

We are also in a position to hold off and secure more funding from the bank down the line due to salary increases, but on the flip side I will be paying a larger mortgage in any case.

Thoughts much appreciated.

We are also at the mortgage stage in rural south mayo
Hoping to break ground in Spring
We have bought the site already. Using it as the deposit on mortgage of 275k and have cash in the bank
Same size house
Being honest I worry if we will get it finished for that . Trying to build one for 225 k is very optimistic
That’s just over 100 a square foot
You are looking at 130-150 realistically from all the people I’ve been talking to who have built in the last few years . 2 of them in East galway as it happens !

thomas 123

km79 wrote: »

We are also at the mortgage stage in rural south mayo
Hoping to break ground in Spring
We have bought the site already. Using it as the deposit on mortgage of 275k and have cash in the bank
Same size house
Being honest I worry if we will get it finished for that . Trying to build one for 225 k is very optimistic
That’s just over 100 a square foot
You are looking at 130-150 realistically from all the people I’ve been talking to who have built in the last few years . 2 of them in East galway as it happens !

Thank you for the reply!

Thats what I am thinking, we can hold off till mid next year and that should give us mortgage approval of 270k ish plus the Help to buy + savings.

Could you share or PM me the engineer you are using, I am Project managing myself and going direct labour in any case so gathering all the quotes I can!

thomas 123

km79 wrote: »

We are also at the mortgage stage in rural south mayo
Hoping to break ground in Spring
We have bought the site already. Using it as the deposit on mortgage of 275k and have cash in the bank
Same size house
Being honest I worry if we will get it finished for that . Trying to build one for 225 k is very optimistic
That’s just over 100 a square foot
You are looking at 130-150 realistically from all the people I’ve been talking to who have built in the last few years . 2 of them in East galway as it happens !

Can you also tell me more about buying the site and using it as the deposit? Did you get planning on it then buy it? That may be an idea right there.

Francescoli

893bet wrote: »

If you haven’t planning already then I suggest shaving off 800-1000 square foot. If you don’t do this, some day you will regret it.

Save yourself a fortune in building, heating and cleaning for the next 40 years.

2000sqft well designed wont feel that much smaller than the average 3000sqft house.

A good architect can really maximise what you get for the space when you start going big,they will be able to cut it down without much compromise.

I have seen so many houses that were a good 500sq ft + bigger than they needed to be.
So much waste but most people only realise this 6 months or a year after they have settled in.

They money saved by cutting 500 so sq ft off the build can be used to make a much nicer living space overall imo.

CorkRed93

Francescoli wrote: »

A good architect can really maximise what you get for the space when you start going big,they will be able to cut it down without much compromise.

I have seen so many houses that were a good 500sq ft + bigger than they needed to be.
So much waste but most people only realise this 6 months or a year after they have settled in.

They money saved by cutting 500 so sq ft off the build can be used to make a much nicer living space overall imo.

All personal preference and down to family size etc but agree. Have family members who have built 3000sqft + houses with rooms empty and unused for years. "but its good to have them just incase" dont subscribe to that logic myself but most of the older generation do

Francescoli

CorkRed93 wrote: »

All personal preference and down to family size etc but agree. Have family members who have built 3000sqft + houses with rooms empty and unused for years. "but its good to have them just incase" dont subscribe to that logic myself but most of the older generation do

Yeah everyone is different and have different needs but there does seem to be a tendecency here to build as big as possible and in a lot of cases without much consideration for whats needed.
A well designed and sized house ,build to a high spec would be my preference rather than a big square monstrosity just for the sake of it

DPower2020

ECO_Mental wrote: »

You will never really know unless you price off at least two builders (preferably more) that way you can compare. I would always recommend getting a QS do up a detailed BOQ and send out for tender. Best grand or two you will ever spend. You can chop and change afterwards from the BOQ. Less arguments with your builder afterwards about costs as its all laid out, sign a formal contract as well with them RIAI yellow or blue I think.


But if you are just scoping out that €150 sounds reasonable.

Hi Eco_Mental...I'd be very grateful of some info from you (like your architects details?)
Our background is that we have just appointed an architect to design what we thought would be a 2500-3000sqft house in Cork.
We had thought €500k would be plenty as build costs

We have just got costs from QS/architects to "align our brief with the budget" and have been blown away by the prices.
QS is saying €250-€300 per sqft.
The 2900sqft house they sketched, are saying will cost €800-€900k to build
The architect fees are 9% - so even for our budget €500k, they are looking for €45k
When we shopped around before appointing them, a few others were in the same space cost-wise (about 10-12% of build cost).
They are charging €12k to bring it to planning (which they call stages 1-4). Stages 5-8 are from tender to completion.

So I am intrigued by your architect prices which are a fraction of ours.

All the costs on here are WAY less than what we are experiencing.
Clearly we are going wrong somewhere
All advice appreciated. Thanks

DPower2020

DPower2020 wrote: »

Hi Eco_Mental...I'd be very grateful of some info from you (like your architects details?)
Our background is that we have just appointed an architect to design what we thought would be a 2500-3000sqft house in Cork.
We had thought €500k would be plenty as build costs

We have just got costs from QS/architects to "align our brief with the budget" and have been blown away by the prices.
QS is saying €250-€300 per sqft.
The 2900sqft house they sketched, are saying will cost €800-€900k to build
The architect fees are 9% - so even for our budget €500k, they are looking for €45k
When we shopped around before appointing them, a few others were in the same space cost-wise (about 10-12% of build cost).
They are charging €12k to bring it to planning (which they call stages 1-4). Stages 5-8 are from tender to completion.

So I am intrigued by your architect prices which are a fraction of ours.

All the costs on here are WAY less than what we are experiencing.
Clearly we are going wrong somewhere
All advice appreciated. Thanks

Also Google tells me that there is a publication by the RIAI on Construction Cost Guidelines for 2019.....it seems to concur with the 2500-2800 per sqm or up to 3500 if you wanted a nice finish.

Help please!!

Francescoli

Averi Few Keypunch wrote: »

Would anyone have a comment on how realistic 125 euro a sq foot is with direct labour?

It seems optimistic but hard to say without knowing wxactly what you plan on doing.A 3000sqft build,even a small increase above €125 in cost per square ft is going to spiral very quickly. Can you afford to go,135 or 145 sq ft, 30k to 60k more?

I mentioned a QS previously and imo its the only route to go,get a professional in and do it right.

Regularly hear of people thinking they will be doing dozens of jobs themselves when they go direct labour but often the case is they just aren't in a position to do it due to lack of time/Knowledge.

have2flushtwice

Your saving on the project manager or builder cost, the builder isn't doing the grunting, he's doing the coordination and shopping around. His wages are what your saving. If you can do that yourself that's one bit bit it isn't easy. If you can do a few bits along the way it's even better.
The way I looked at it was in average every man on site was 180 per day out if my budget.

ECO_Mental

I got one or two PMs over the last week to share a bit more on my house build costs (Just outside Cork City) and I decided to do it on the thread for everybody. I am currently at €2,312/sqr meter and that’s for an architect designed house, split level, UFH, A2W heat pump, flooring, triple glazed Alu Clad windows, kitchen, painting…..basically turn key move in with your bags. I will insert my full break down of costs below and I think this is everything planning fees etc. I am looking at coming in just under €600k when Im finished as im expecting there will be a few more variations or additions. I got back 3 tenders and two were at 600k and the other was at €575k. I did some chopping and changing and got it down to 545k. I tendered at the start of this year.

One or two posters were being told around €2800/sqrm as budget costs from their architects and although this seems at the high side but that should be a move in price turn key cost and for a non-standard high spec house . This is what annoys me sometimes with lads saying that they built their house for €100 sqrft etc and they cant believe what I am paying. But I would take that with a pinch of salt they are probably not including kitchen, flooring, fit out, planning fees…and all the other costs. They probably got their cousin in a digger to do the foundations and its taken them 2 years to do it….Yes I could have done it cheaper using a simple design, lower spec, smaller! not used a passive foundation system on a split level house with fancy angles as well

Building a house is not cheap and its complicated these days you will have to get Architects engineers PSDP and the banks will almost require it. Its certainly will be easier to get the money if they know you are doing it properly. What I can say unless you want to build the house of your dreams in the location you want or you just want a house to live in you will certainly/probably buy a house cheaper and your stress levels will certainly be lower 😊. We looked at the property market and figured for what we were looking for, we would have to pay this amount and more and we wouldn’t have gotten a house nowhere near the quality and design of what we are getting. We are really looking forward to moving in it is the house our of dreams and it will be worth it for us….but ask me again next July when we are due to move in.

My costs below include some variations I haven’t priced up yet, but some are deletions so I am saving money also. I have included equipment such as deep freezers, Wi-Fi equipment etc as I am trying to be thorough to get an actual cost of building my house.
Hope this helps
Regards
EcoMental



Description of works Type Quote/Estimate % VAT Total
WALL FINISHES INTERNALLY Building Costs €27,214.50 13.5% €30,888
WALL FINISHES EXTERNALLY Building Costs €17,610.00 13.5% €19,987
SUBSTRUCTURE Building Costs €44,814.36 13.5% €50,864
STEELWORK Building Costs €14,007.20 13.5% €15,898
STAIRS Building Costs €7,771.70 13.5% €8,821
SITE STRUCTURES Building Costs €4,884.00 13.5% €5,543
SITE SERVICES (Piped & Ducted) Building Costs €18,226.08 13.5% €20,687
SITE SERVICES (Mainly Electrical) Building Costs €5,335.00 13.5% €6,055
SITE PREPARATION Building Costs €3,492.00 13.5% €3,963
ROOF STRUCTURE Building Costs €19,093.82 13.5% €21,671
ROOF FINISHES Building Costs €28,965.07 13.5% €32,875
ROOF : COMPLETIONS Building Costs €6,439.98 13.5% €7,309
PAINTING AND DECORATING Building Costs €11,873.00 13.5% €13,476
MECHANICAL INSTALLATION Building Costs €42,105.50 13.5% €47,790
INTERNAL WALLS, PARTITIONS Building Costs €5,501.55 13.5% €6,244
INTERNAL WALLS : COMPLETIONS Building Costs €8,941.32 13.5% €10,148
FOOTPATHS & DRIVEWAY Building Costs €11,469.80 13.5% €13,018
FLOOR STRUCTURE Building Costs €8,074.50 13.5% €9,165
FLOOR FINISHES Building Costs €17,211.28 13.5% €19,535
EXTERNAL WALLS : COMPLETIONS Building Costs €33,710.40 13.5% €38,261
EXTERNAL WALLS Building Costs €42,878.34 13.5% €48,667
ELECTRICAL INSTALLATION Building Costs €20,129.50 13.5% €22,847
DRAINAGE & REFUSE DISPOSAL Building Costs €1,680.00 13.5% €1,907
CEILING FINISHES Building Costs €12,456.95 13.5% €14,139
BUILDING FITTINGS Building Costs €26,250.00 13.5% €29,794
GENERAL CONDITIONS & PRELIMINARIES Building Costs €33,500.00 13.5% €38,023
Deep freezer Equipment €545 0.0% €545
Whirlpool dryer Equipment €575 0.0% €575
Dream Machine Pro Equipment €319 21.0% €386
UniFi nanoHD Access Point  Equipment €149 21.0% €180
Switch Equipment €337 23.0% €415
Legal Work Site Transfer Professional Fees €704 0.0% €704
BER Assessor Professional Fees €280 0.0% €280
Legal Work Professional Fees €1,400 21.0% €1,694
Architect Stage 3 Professional Fees €5,500 23.0% €6,765
Architect Estimate or variations Professional Fees €1,000 23.0% €1,230
Structural Engineer Professional Fees €4,800 23.0% €5,904
Supervision Stage 4 Professional Fees €4,250 23.0% €5,228
QS tender phase Professional Fees €1,900 23.0% €2,337
Initial budget costs Professional Fees €800 23.0% €984
Tender Evaluation Professional Fees €550 23.0% €677
PSDP Professional Fees €1,290 23.0% €1,587
Architect Stage 1 and 2 Professional Fees €4,000 23.0% €4,920
Planning Fees Services €5,118 0.0% €5,118
Build insurance Services €620 0.0% €620
Commencement Notice Services €30 0.0% €30
Network Connection Services €2,000 23.0% €2,460
Service Connection Services €1,000 23.0% €1,230
Fencing around site Building Costs €1,969 13.5% €2,235
Total €583,679

zf0wqv9oemuasj

Thanks for a very informative post.

I might have a question or two as I process all the information but one that springs out is what does the following refer to - external wall, external wall completions and external wall finishes? They add up to a lot just on external walls so wondering what each of the three actually entail.

I’m guessing block work, plastering and stone work but the costs surprise me if broken down like that.

Thanks.

ml100

Thanks for posting that info EcoMental, we were granted planning permission a few months ago, trying to decide it go to tender now or hold off until the spring, need to sort out which professional to go with 1st, ie. Stick with the architect + structural engineer or go with just structural engineer.
I heard its difficult to get builders to quote right now with covid backlogs etc and I assume Brexit wont help matters as some material costs could change alot depending on what way that goes.
When you were tendering did you specify window manufacturer, also what type of roof do you have, natural slate etc as there can be big differences in the costs there, if you didn't specify did the builders specify what manufacturer they will be using?

BryanF

Ml100,
You typically have drawings and specification package when seeking tenders. It sounds like you haven’t started this process with arch/eng. if you start it now, you might have something ready for spring tendering.

ECO_Mental

Averi Few Keypunch wrote: »

Thanks for a very informative post.

I might have a question or two as I process all the information but one that springs out is what does the following refer to - external wall, external wall completions and external wall finishes? They add up to a lot just on external walls so wondering what each of the three actually entail.

I’m guessing block work, plastering and stone work but the costs surprise me if broken down like that.

Thanks.

External walls is the block work basically
External Wall Completions is Windows
External Wall finishes is plastering and some zinc cladding I have

ECO_Mental

ml100 wrote: »

Thanks for posting that info EcoMental, we were granted planning permission a few months ago, trying to decide it go to tender now or hold off until the spring, need to sort out which professional to go with 1st, ie. Stick with the architect + structural engineer or go with just structural engineer.
I heard its difficult to get builders to quote right now with covid backlogs etc and I assume Brexit wont help matters as some material costs could change alot depending on what way that goes.
When you were tendering did you specify window manufacturer, also what type of roof do you have, natural slate etc as there can be big differences in the costs there, if you didn't specify did the builders specify what manufacturer they will be using?

I am a bit untypical for my build process because I got planning 10 years ago but for various reasons (global recession...) only building now. So I had to get a second architect to do up the detailing but he was too busy for the supervision, so I went with the structural engineer. And to be honest that worked out good because by the time you get to site its mostly construction/structural issues you will be dealing with and the engineer will sort all these.


Regarding tendering all I can say is make it easy for them to tender for your job. Get a QS and do up a detailed BOQ, because if you don't the contractors will have to do it them selves and it will cost them money and time so they mightn't bother. One of the best decisions I have made is getting a QS, I have spent about €4k in fees to him but I can sleep easy at night knowing I have solid contract and I see where I am spending money and where I can save money. Any variations and changes are transparent, stage payments are a breeze and I know I ask my builder to do something its easy to figure out how its going to save me or cost me. Builders also like dealing with BOQ's (well legit good contractors) less agro and risk for them.


No I didn't spec the window supplier or any of the other equipment just had a detailed spec in the tender. I spec'd my windows as triple glazed aluclad with a certain U-Value he is using Munster joinery for my windows though. Thats not saying that you cant, you can spec or nominted any supplier or anything you want. Also slates I didnt get natural slates just Tegral Thrutone it wast down to cost but I just wanted a clean sharpe slate, also I will be having PV panels on the roof so a lot of them are going to be covered anyway

zf0wqv9oemuasj

ECO_Mental wrote: »

External walls is the block work basically
External Wall Completions is Windows
External Wall finishes is plastering and some zinc cladding I have

Thanks, I hadn’t considered Windows as included so that would explain the costs. Thanks.

ml100

BryanF wrote: »

Ml100,
You typically have drawings and specification package when seeking tenders. It sounds like you haven’t started this process with arch/eng. if you start it now, you might have something ready for spring tendering.

Hi, no I haven't started tendering for this house yet, I did tender for a different project 3 years ago that we didn't proceed with and I was surprised at how little detail on bigger items were included in the first draft of the tender I got from our architect technician, to try and get apples for apples comparison between returned tenders I got the architect to specify exact slates and window manufacturers etc.

The reason why I asked the question is to try find out was it normal not to specify these details in the tender? There could easily be 20k price difference between different window manufacturers, so how can you tell which builder is the best value unless you know what materials he is using.

ml100

ECO_Mental wrote: »

I am a bit untypical for my build process because I got planning 10 years ago but for various reasons (global recession...) only building now. So I had to get a second architect to do up the detailing but he was too busy for the supervision, so I went with the structural engineer. And to be honest that worked out good because by the time you get to site its mostly construction/structural issues you will be dealing with and the engineer will sort all these.


Regarding tendering all I can say is make it easy for them to tender for your job. Get a QS and do up a detailed BOQ, because if you don't the contractors will have to do it them selves and it will cost them money and time so they mightn't bother. One of the best decisions I have made is getting a QS, I have spent about €4k in fees to him but I can sleep easy at night knowing I have solid contract and I see where I am spending money and where I can save money. Any variations and changes are transparent, stage payments are a breeze and I know I ask my builder to do something its easy to figure out how its going to save me or cost me. Builders also like dealing with BOQ's (well legit good contractors) less agro and risk for them.


No I didn't spec the window supplier or any of the other equipment just had a detailed spec in the tender. I spec'd my windows as triple glazed aluclad with a certain U-Value he is using Munster joinery for my windows though. Thats not saying that you cant, you can spec or nominted any supplier or anything you want. Also slates I didnt get natural slates just Tegral Thrutone it wast down to cost but I just wanted a clean sharpe slate, also I will be having PV panels on the roof so a lot of them are going to be covered anyway

It has taken us 3 years to get planning, so in a similar situation as yourself in that we have had very little interaction with our architect of the last year and a half and now that we are ready to proceed he is too busy right now to do tender spec but has let us know that we'll need to get a structural engineer to do up draws at an extra cost not specified in his initial fee schedule, so we are trying to decide if we need him at all and just use a structural engineer.
Also he will not do an opt-out of assigned certification which is adding more cost to us and money to him and I'm not sure we will get anything other than paper work for this extra cost.

ECO_Mental

ml100 wrote: »

Hi, no I haven't started tendering for this house yet, I did tender for a different project 3 years ago that we didn't proceed with and I was surprised at how little detail on bigger items were included in the first draft of the tender I got from our architect technician, to try and get apples for apples comparison between returned tenders I got the architect to specify exact slates and window manufacturers etc.

The reason why I asked the question is to try find out was it normal not to specify these details in the tender? There could easily be 20k price difference between different window manufacturers, so how can you tell which builder is the best value unless you know what materials he is using.

This is one of the best reasons for using a detailed BOQ as well, as you can compare apples with apples. My QS after we got back the 3 tenders easily compared the three tenders and could see where the differences were. You can use this then as a negotiation tool saying to them look you are very high here compared to the others is there a mistake or can you reduce etc etc.

BryanF

ml100 wrote: »

Hi, no I haven't started tendering for this house yet, I did tender for a different project 3 years ago that we didn't proceed with and I was surprised at how little detail on bigger items were included in the first draft of the tender I got from our architect technician, to try and get apples for apples comparison between returned tenders I got the architect to specify exact slates and window manufacturers etc.

The reason why I asked the question is to try find out was it normal not to specify these details in the tender? There could easily be 20k price difference between different window manufacturers, so how can you tell which builder is the best value unless you know what materials he is using.

You pay the arch tech and Qs to compare the ‘apples and oranges’ once the tenders are in

ml100

ECO_Mental wrote: »

This is one of the best reasons for using a detailed BOQ as well, as you can compare apples with apples. My QS after we got back the 3 tenders easily compared the three tenders and could see where the differences were. You can use this then as a negotiation tool saying to them look you are very high here compared to the others is there a mistake or can you reduce etc etc.

Did the builders specify which window manufacturer they were quoting you for in the returned tenders?, if they didn't how can the qos or architect or you compare the quotes?, The reason why I ask is that the tenders I did get back for example didn't specify heating system manufacturer, we specified an air to water, ufh etc but none of them specified which system they were going to install, again there could easily be 5k of a difference, I'm trying to gauge if the experience I had the last time we tendered is typical as I can't see how these professionals have enough information to make an informed decision.

zf0wqv9oemuasj

kieran. wrote: »

Approx 40k is typical

ESB 2.5k
Irish water 6k Water + effluent (12k for septic tank and perc area + GWS water connection)
Solicitors 5k (Inc topo and site tests)
Arch 15k
Eng 5k
Ber 1.5k (Inc Air test)
Planning contributions 5k

Just a brief update since we were discussing this.

I have been invoiced yesterday by my arch for all work to date - from first meeting to planning submitted.

Fully custom design with a number of iterations in it
Construction drawings
Percolation tests
Preliminary site survey
Completion and submission of planning application
All fees for planning etc.

2200 incl VAT.

This is much more inline with what I was expecting than some of the figures I’m seeing here which were worrying me but I’m happier now and would hope to be closer to 20k than 40k on the list quoted. Will keep updating my costs here for comparison for others.