DCM 2019 - Mentored Novices Thread

Mr. Guappa

kemcloughlin wrote: »

- Did you complete all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?
Yes.

- Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace?
3 mile easy 11.56/mile; 6 mile easy 12.04/mile; 3 mile easy 11.29/mile and 12 mile LSR 12.18/mile
So doing ok pace wise on average but the 1st 6 miles of that LSR were too fast - and I think that was my downfall by the end. Anyway, learned a lesson and onwards and upwards.

- Any regrets in signing up for a marathon?
No. I'm halfway through the training and there are 11 weeks to go. Still early days. Really looking forward to doing my 14 mile on Galway Bay next Saturday and I am loving my weekly swim.

Question - I am assuming I don't need to modify anything this week - Tullamore Half isn't until 31st August?

Great to see that you slowed the easy runs down last week, although I still think they can be easier still!

Yeah, no need to modify anything this week. That race finishes in the stadium with a lap of the track - would like to do it myself sometime actually.

Mr. Guappa

Fraggle07 wrote: »

- Did you complete all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?
No. Did RnR today so am short on the Sunday 3m rec.
I took an extra rest day earlier in the week after physio piled on extra exercises.

- Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace? 
My 2nd 4mile easy was a little fast. It was raining and got quite dark, I was eager to get home! I did pretty well to keep pace down in today's RnR as I was running this at LSR pace.

I really enjoyed LSR today. It felt comfortable. I didn't break a sweat or feel tired. A million miles away from last weeks' 16mile which I found tough.

Despite enjoying today's RnR half marathon. Once I stopped agony kicked in. Ive had really bad hip pain all evening. I'm hobbling about. Physio had me doing extra squat and hip exercises earlier this week. Something has gone wrong!! Will see how things go but I reckon I'll need to wind things back this week.

- Any regrets in signing up for a marathon? 
Nope. Just frustrating now that the injuries / pain are starting.
I'm really enjoying the running so far.

Nice job keeping the pace in check at the RnR - that discipline will stand to you come the early miles of DCM. How did you find the hills?

Hopefully the hip pain is something minor, but you're right to scale things back this week if required. Fingers crossed for you.

Fraggle07

Mr. Guappa wrote: »

How did you find the hills?

I really liked the course, hills didn't seem to bother me much at the slower pace. I think it would have been a different story if I was racing it. It was great to get hills in with my usual route being so flat. I stopped at the latter water stations to refill my water bottle and take a gel.

In Phoenix park I happened to meet a neighbour as I was going up that long hill with the drag. It was a great distraction. I was chatting away and past the hill before I even realised it!

Huzzah!

Doc76 wrote: »

Yes but I think the LSR could’ve been a bit slower (as I mentioned I tripped and fell toward the end of it and really sped up after that as was self conscious of my bloody knee!) good news is I didn’t do any serious damage and felt totally fine today on recovery run.

If it makes you feel any better, I fell off a bike in College Green during rush hour once, then wandered around town with a bloody knee until some kind soul in Elvery's sat me down with a first aid kit.

DBB wrote: »

Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace?

Yes. Feeling stronger than ever this week, as I'm running along I have "you can do this!" thoughts going through my head!
The last 3 miles of the lsr yesterday were frustrating, because my heart rate was slightly up, presumably getting a little tired. But I did not feel like slowing down to accommodate this, I felt comfortable to keep going at a similar pace of earlier miles... I was getting annoyed at my watch buzzing at me! So I sort of ignored it and ran those last few miles at a pace I found comfortable.
Love the easy running, the fact that I ran further yesterday than I've ever run in my life, but could still go about my normal day afterwards!

I've been meaning to say, it's been great to see the fruits of all your hard work with training at the appropriate paces/effort. It's been noticeable on Strava, so don't let it slip now!

Laineyfrecks

How was week 7 for you?
- Did you complete all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?

Yes all runs completed

- Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace?

Yes most of my runs felt very comfortable but i am still working on my pmp, finding it hard to get it spot on!

- Any regrets in signing up for a marathon? :eek:

No regrets at all - as i said at the start i have never ever followed any kind of structure for running but i am enjoying the discipline of the plan & actually feel stronger as a runner!

Mentally this has been my toughest week but its done now so onto a fresh more positive week

Best of luck to all in week 8 & thanks to the mentors for their help & guidance so far!

Irishder

WEEK 7 REVIEW


How was week 7 for you?
- Did you complete all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?
No - Missed one 3 mile as i was away, however done loads of cycling, swimming and surfing so not going to be to hard on myself for missing the 3 miles.
- Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace?
Not sure, i done the 12 miles LSR at 11 min/mile could prob slow this to 11:15?
- Any regrets in signing up for a marathon?
No regrets, however i am starting to realize it is a huge undertaking and needs to be given the right priority. I am loving the mental health benefits and enjoying my own company. Plan on doing all training runs alone. Weight is not budging, obviously eating like a horse post runs

As the miles increase i have a few concerns/questions.

- Running socks and underwear (Male), currently wearing Pennies best but beginning to chafe in all the wrong places, any recommendations?.

- Water, did not bring any water on my 12 mile run the weekend, took 3 gels. This was a bit stupid in hindsight as i had a fairly bad headache when i got home. Dont fancy carrying a bottle of water for 2 hours, i suppose i should just pop into a shop?.

- Stomach was a bit queezy after the 3rd gel but this could be down to not drinking water as well?

Treviso

Here are a few suggestions from me

Irishder wrote: »

- Running socks and underwear (Male), currently wearing Pennies best but beginning to chafe in all the wrong places, any recommendations?.

Try to purchase proper running socks, try the twin skin ones. they can be bought cheaply at Sports Direct (Lidl/Aldi sometimes have running equipment events). For underwear, it's a personal choice. Stick with what you're wearing but use bodyglide to prevent chaffing. Or wear no underwear as most running shorts have an inner mesh - I found this led to chaffing when it rained. Or use those 2 in 1 running shorts which I find don't chaff me at all - https://www.sportsshoes.com/product/asi6057/asics-race-2~in~1-7-inch-running-short/

Irishder wrote: »

Water, did not bring any water on my 12 mile run the weekend, took 3 gels. This was a bit stupid in hindsight as i had a fairly bad headache when i got home. Dont fancy carrying a bottle of water for 2 hours, i suppose i should just pop into a shop?.

Carry a 2 euro coin and stop at a shop is a good idea. Another is to plan the LSR that you loop back to your car. You can leave small bottles of water on the bonnet and pick up as you go past. Another is to plant those bottles along the route before the run. For me, I wouldn't be carrying water for the duration of the run - try to mimic marathon conditions.

Stomach was a bit queezy after the 3rd gel but this could be down to not drinking water as well?

Most gels do require water but that just makes it easier to consume them really. Fair play for taking 3 of them without water. TBH, gels can do that to the body so that is why you use them on your LSR as a practise. Find the right gel for you. If you think your body can handle 4-5 of them during the marathon, then stick with that type

greentea is just wrong

Did you get in all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?
Yep:
Tuesday --> 6.01miles @ 10.27/mile
Wednesday--> 3.03miles @ 10.34/mile
Thursday --> 3.05miles @ 10.54/mile
Saturday--> 12.03miles @ 12.02/mile. Stopped for a bottle of juice around 10 miles in, in shop on way home



Did you run all the runs at an appropriate pace?

My easy runs probably a little fast? My LSR, I am worried that I am not going quick enough? Felt stronger this week than last week, think this was a combination of it being cooler & running slower. Felt okay until I got home & felt quick sick/tired for a while, but was okay after a 20 min nap and some food.

Any regrets in signing up for a marathon?
None so far )

jackc101

- Did you complete all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?
All runs completed (Monday is always my rest day)
- Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace?
Easy & LSR were 6.35/km ish, PMP was 5.35/km, happy out.
- Any regrets in signing up for a marathon?


As others have said, I'm not sure if I could hold the PMP for 26.2 but I trust the plan

Wombled

How was week 7 for you?
- Did you complete all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?
All runs completed
- Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace?
3 mile 11.14
6 mile 11.56
3 Mile 11.42
12 mile 12 25
- Any regrets in signing up for a marathon?
No regrets, liking the discipline and mental challenge. Trying not to think about the idea of running 26 miles in one go, scary stuff.

This week my plans has to be swopped around to accommodate my work schedule. I have to do my LSR on Thursday morning. I have been out this morning, felt great and really strong, unlike Saturday morning where I felt at times it was really tough.
..

mister paul

Did you complete all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?

All runs completed.

Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace?

Mostly at appropriate pace, although some of the midweek MP miles were very much at the lower end of my target pace.

Any regrets in signing up for a marathon?

No regrets yet.

DeepBlue

- Did you complete all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?
Skipped the Sunday recovery run. Did all the rest.
- Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace?
The easy runs on Tuesday and Thursday were done at the appropriate pace. The 5 mile PMP run was about 40s/mile faster (just felt in good form and left it go) and the LSR was run at just slightly faster than PMP.
- Any regrets in signing up for a marathon?
Some minor quibbles. I didn't realise how I'd have to drop or slow down other running events (races, parkruns) for the marathon. Likewise I've had to drop some cycling events I'd like to have done in favour of the marathon. It does seem a lot of sacrifice for one event which itself might not even go well. I think if I were to do another marathon I'd go for one where the training block is over the winter so that I can leave the summer free.
However I'm also enjoying the training for the most part and getting a sense of accomplishment when another week is ticked off and I'm probably saving quite a bit in event fees . Prior to starting the marathon training I had a niggly slight knee pain since last September/October which I feared would get worse with more mileage. Instead it's disappeared which I think is due to the slower paces.


Regarding this week's LSR I know I ran it too fast and that that was wrong. I started it and ran the first couple of miles at what I felt was easy before looking at the watch. When I realised I was going faster than planned I decided on a whim to see how long I could keep it going for before having to switch back to slower pace. I got to about 11 or 12 miles before it started to feel "not easy". Tbh I got a great confidence boost that I felt comfortable for the majority of the run and could have kept going for quite a while longer if I had to do so. And there's 2 months of training still to go.

Karlos80

Did you complete all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?

All bar recovery on Sunday (went doing a big physical job after LSR on sat. it was something that had to get done that day as was put off from last Monday, and took all day. On Sunday I felt I was coming fown with flu, even had to go back to bed to lie down. Feel fine today, so putting it down to doing way too much on Sat in bad weather, maybe not eating enough, had plenty of water)

Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace?

Felt good all week, like there was plenty more mile in the tank
Easy runs - 6.20p/k
LSR - 6.35p/k
PMP run - 5.50p/k

Any regrets in signing up for a marathon?
No regrets, but it's not that easy having to take it serious and put off other thing to prioritise running, easier said than done, but feel a group like this helps with just getting out. If it was easy everyone would do it.

Supercell

Just a note for any of you doing the Kilcock 10 miler this weekend, they have a nice running track that's about a mile long IIRC. Last year I did 6 miles before the race on it and then the race 10 to make up the planned 16 on the day. If you are doing the DCM race series 10 miler the following weekend you might want to consider this option.
I'm planning to do the same this year. Its a lovely flat course in really scenic countryside, probably my favourite course of all the runs I've done.

Sunday Runner

Hi Everyone,

I'm still happy I signed up for the marathon, I'm excited to see what the coming weeks will bring. I'm also enjoying the longer runs too, but it's still taking me ages to settle into them. I love it when it goes up to 15, 16, 17 and it keeps ticking away.

Mileage was down last week - usual life dramas, unexpected visitors and one night we were all set to head out for a long run and the baby fell and hurt himself pretty bad. (He's fine now, but he was very drowsy afterwards and I wasn't going to leave him!). Mileage was well up the week previous though and I am feeling good. Back home now after an active holiday, but lovely food and no work. Thanks to some sound advice on here I did some of the suggested routes; Rosscarberry via Warren strand cliff walk, out to Rathbarry, back via Ardfield rowing club, past the Red Strand and back down again over the cliff. I did that route a few times - 10 miles and I added a few loops to get to 13.1. Also did Barleycove to Crookhaven on a scorching hot day - those hills, i'll never forget them. Up and up and up!

Got back pretty late on Saturday and I was up at 4:30am to get ready for the Rock n Roll half. I have to say, at the start line I was exhausted and cold. I didn't kill myself, but I was aiming for 2 hours and I came in at 1:58. Delighted. I shadowed the 2 hr pacer and I wanted to get back to say hello and thank you, but couldn't get back to him with the crowds. The race itself was good, loads of hills which I wasn't expecting, but I had done some horrendous terrain on holiday and it definitely stood to me. Hung around for the fun run with the kids, then home to relax.

I've made the switch to the HH plan and it's working out a lot better for me! I can fit it in around my gym sessions and i'm enjoying it more.

Huzzah!

rizzee wrote: »

-

The last 5 km was on a main road and the rain was clearing up by then. I had a 500ml with me and was sipping every 4km or so. The last 2km was torture, almost limp and running on the spot, I think it was a mental barrier because I knew I was close to home.

Got in the door 19.05km done in 1:56:57, straight in for stretches and the fridge for a big feed! I realise this way too fast and will take it on board especially with the 14mile this Saturday. Stiff last night but fresh as a daisy today with no pains or niggles!! Delighted. Definitely my favourite run I've done so far!!

I'm glad it went well. I think you might have struggled near then end because you ran too fast.

How's the niggle?

Irishder wrote: »

WEEK 7 REVIEW


How was week 7 for you?
- Did you complete all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?
No - Missed one 3 mile as i was away, however done loads of cycling, swimming and surfing so not going to be to hard on myself for missing the 3 miles.
- Did you complete all the runs at an appropriate pace?
Not sure, i done the 12 miles LSR at 11 min/mile could prob slow this to 11:15?
- Any regrets in signing up for a marathon?
No regrets, however i am starting to realize it is a huge undertaking and needs to be given the right priority. I am loving the mental health benefits and enjoying my own company. Plan on doing all training runs alone. Weight is not budging, obviously eating like a horse post runs

As the miles increase i have a few concerns/questions.

- Running socks and underwear (Male), currently wearing Pennies best but beginning to chafe in all the wrong places, any recommendations?.

- Water, did not bring any water on my 12 mile run the weekend, took 3 gels. This was a bit stupid in hindsight as i had a fairly bad headache when i got home. Dont fancy carrying a bottle of water for 2 hours, i suppose i should just pop into a shop?.

- Stomach was a bit queezy after the 3rd gel but this could be down to not drinking water as well?

You've had advice on socks and carrying water. I would add maybe just buy one pair of socks and try them out to see if you like them. Socks are the only type of gear I'm picky about and the twin skinned ones would be a big no no for me.

In terms of the LSR, how did the pace feel? It would probably be no harm to slow to 11:15 per mile.

greentea is just wrong wrote: »

Did you get in all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?
Yep:
Tuesday --> 6.01miles @ 10.27/mile
Wednesday--> 3.03miles @ 10.34/mile
Thursday --> 3.05miles @ 10.54/mile
Saturday--> 12.03miles @ 12.02/mile. Stopped for a bottle of juice around 10 miles in, in shop on way home



Did you run all the runs at an appropriate pace?

My easy runs probably a little fast? My LSR, I am worried that I am not going quick enough? Felt stronger this week than last week, think this was a combination of it being cooler & running slower. Felt okay until I got home & felt quick sick/tired for a while, but was okay after a 20 min nap and some food.

Any regrets in signing up for a marathon?
None so far )

You do need to slow down, yes, please The LSR pace is where all your runs should be at a minimum.

clickhere

Hi all, I went with the plan that Huzzah suggested as I was running the R/ROLL half on Sunday. Everything went very well and I enjoyed it. Now my present fitness levels are 5K 23:26. 10K 49:55. Half Marathon 1:49:18. What is the best site to to use to get the proper pacing I should be running at for easy, LSR, and PMP. Thanks for all the help.

skyblue46

clickhere wrote: »

Hi all, I went with the plan that Huzzah suggested as I was running the R/ROLL half on Sunday. Everything went very well and I enjoyed it. Now my present fitness levels are 5K 23:26. 10K 49:55. Half Marathon 1:49:18. What is the best site to to use to get the proper pacing I should be running at for easy, LSR, and PMP. Thanks for all the help.

Recovery 10:40, Easy and LSR 10:20, PMP 9:09

There are different sites that give different ranges but these paces fit well for the plan I think.

clickhere

skyblue46 wrote: »

Recovery 10:40, Easy and LSR 10:20, PMP 9:09

There are different sites that give different ranges but these paces fit well for the plan I think.

Thanks for the quick response skyblue46 and the information. How do I convert that to pace using KMs. Sorry for being a pain.

skyblue46

clickhere wrote: »

Thanks for the quick response skyblue46 and the information. How do I convert that to pace using KMs. Sorry for being a pain.

6:37, 6:25, 5:41

https://www.depicus.com/swim-bike-run/pace-conversion-chart

Not a pain at all. Only too happy to help.

pd79

Did you complete all runs ?
Yep 5k at 7:08/km
10k at 7:22
5k at 7:17
And 19k at 7:40/km
Was quiet tired this week and bit worried about pain in knees by end of long run . Plan on new runners this week

Any regrets ?
No regrets but few wobbles about magnitude of 42km ! But happy with how training is going

Casey78

clickhere wrote: »

Thanks for the quick response skyblue46 and the information. How do I convert that to pace using KMs. Sorry for being a pain.

Not trying to be pedantic but if your goal is sub 4 then your PMP should be faster than 9:09/mile.
Reason being you won't run the exact distance, you will in fact in all probability be over it.
I know people who have got caught out and missed their goal by a minute or two because of this.
If I was you I would be doing 9min miles or at a minimum 9:05. This might not sound like a big difference from 9:09 but over 26.2 or possibly 26.4 miles it all adds up.
So even in training its important to use the slighty faster PMP when your plan asks for MP runs.
That's my 2 cents anyway.

skyblue46

Casey78 wrote: »

Not trying to be pedantic but if your goal is sub 4 then your PMP should be faster than 9:09/mile.
Reason being you won't run the exact distance, you will in fact in all probability be over it.
I know people who have got caught out and missed their goal by a minute or two because of this.
If I was you I would be doing 9min miles or at a minimum 9:05. This might not sound like a big difference from 9:09 but over 26.2 or possibly 26.4 miles it all adds up.
So even in training its important to use the slighty faster PMP when your plan asks for MP runs.
That's my 2 cents anyway.

No argument on the specifics of this. However my experience of the novices thread (including what I did myself!) is that everyone runs faster than they are told to. 9:09 will become 9:00 and 9:00 will become 8:50 :pac:

Ais_Byrne7

Well done all on another week done and dusted!

Did you get in all the runs on your plan - if not, then why not?
Yes, all runs done with runners yoga as my cross train day


Did you run all the runs at an appropriate pace?
I've slowed down a lot (thank god) but can be slower again. It's a constant battle that i'm still working on!!

Any regrets in signing up for a marathon?
No regrets so far!


My only issue this week ( and in general) is my rather annoying sensitive stomach! I've to watch what I eat before a run/race or else I'm running to the loo or trying not to vomit From trial and error, I've learned that banana + oats work for me 2 + hours before a race, but apart from water/energy drink, I can't eat anything else until I cross the finish line. I can get away with this for HM distance, but I know this won't be the case for DCM.

So far I've tried jelly beans and clif blocks, both have been a disaster [I don't think the sugar sits down well], so next stop is gels! The amount of availability and advice online re.gels is overwhelming...would anyone have any idea what ones I should look into keeping my dodgy tummy in mind???

skyblue46

I wouldn't hesitate to recommend Maurten gels. They're on the expensive side as gels go but I found them excellent.

Laineyfrecks

skyblue46 wrote: »

No argument on the specifics of this. However my experience of the novices thread (including what I did myself!) is that everyone runs faster than they are told to. 9:09 will become 9:00 and 9:00 will become 8:50 :pac:

Haha good to know

eabha19

Mr. Guappa wrote: »

I noticed you are running the sixth day most weeks - don't be afraid to give yourself that extra day off, particularly if you're feeling overly tired and sluggish. An extra days rest can often be the best thing to do. Not sure if you're planning a few miles tomorrow, but I'd take the rest tbh.

4:20 would be 9:55/mi, but I'd stick to 10:00/mi anyway for now. Nice job on the easy pacing too.

Thanks for that - I skipped tonight but still had to head out to the club for a presentation to one of our members who has retired from work. The hubby was wondering why I was going to club in my civvies and gave me a very strange look when I said Mr Guappa had advised me to drop my run tonight! :pac: I also got about 9 hours sleep last night there or thereabouts which is unheard of for me! No daytime napping for me today.

Djoucer

skyblue46 wrote: »

I wouldn't hesitate to recommend Maurten gels. They're on the expensive side as gels go but I found them excellent.

Are the gels not a big of a marketing gimmick? Sure the elites are using them but they’re only running for two hours.

I’ve read that unless you plan to take 4 every hour to get the max energy, you’re just as well off with any other gels.

A 4 hour marathon means 16 gels. That’s about €40.

I’d argue for a first marathon, they’re a waste of time and money. Simply not practical.

And the elites are using the drink version not the gels from what I can see.

DBB

skyblue46 wrote: »

I wouldn't hesitate to recommend Maurten gels. They're on the expensive side as gels go but I found them excellent.

Based on advice like Skyblue46's above (and another previous mentor... Kellygirl maybe? Ariana maybe? It's ages since I read it )), because I have a dodgy tummy, I invested in Maurten gels. I like them, they don't bother my tummy!
Mind you, it's tummy pains and cramps I get, rather than needing a race to a toilet

On that note, I *think* I have sorted out my tummy issues, after years of suffering through races and training, I finally added 2 and 2 together, kicking myself I didn't cop it earlier. I was diagnosed with a congenital hiatus hernia (constriction at top of tummy) some years ago. It never occurred to me that this was causing problems... But I have since discovered that runners with hiatus hernias... You guessed it... Tend to suffer from severe upper tummy cramps! Sheesh! There are medications that stop the problem, which I've tried, and alleluia! The pain is gone
Which is great, because it was ruining any chance I had of enjoying longer runs in particular.

skyblue46

Djoucer wrote: »

Are the gels not a big of a marketing gimmick? Sure the elites are using them but they’re only running for two hours.

I’ve read that unless you plan to take 4 every hour to get the max energy, you’re just as well off with any other gels.

A 4 hour marathon means 16 gels. That’s about €40.

I’d argue for a first marathon, they’re a waste of time and money. Simply not practical.

And the elites are using the drink version not the gels from what I can see.

I was particularly referring to the posters tummy problems. I found High 5 gels, clif blocs etc to be sickingly sweet and couldn't stomach them. I thought the Maurtens were much easier on the stomach.