DCM 2019 - Mentored Novices Thread

Laineyfrecks

coogy wrote: »

Ratoath?

No the one i am doing is in Monasterevin

Rojo

Loving the running slower. Feel much more in control of my body! :-)

Mr. Guappa

Rojo wrote: »

Loving the running slower. Feel much more in control of my body! :-)

Well you're going to really love my next piece of advice so

Slow Down! You should add another minute (per mile) to your easy pace. You've ran all your recent runs at in or around PMP for a 4 hour marathon. Your easy pace should be a good minute slower than it currently is - say 10:15/mile or slower.

Rojo

This training keeps getting better and better.

Thanks for the guidance, Mr. Guappa. Really appreciate it.

For the LSR tomorrow what should I be aiming for time-wise?

Thanks again!

Mr. Guappa

Rojo wrote: »

This training keeps getting better and better.

Thanks for the guidance, Mr. Guappa. Really appreciate it.

For the LSR tomorrow what should I be aiming for time-wise?

Thanks again!

No bother, thanks!

I'd say no faster than 10:30/mile for the LSR.

Rojo

Excellent stuff. :-)

fatboyfin

Hello all,

still reading loads to get my head properly into the run slow frame of mind. I am not 100% sure of what my final target will be for the marathon, but will be somewhere between 3.45 and 3.30. Slowed down this week to 9min miles quite successfully last night - and I am conscious that I am deviating slightly from the boards 2019 plan. However, I am going to try and stick to the structure, ethos and variety of the plan, but just increase the mileage on some of the shorter runs (some of the more experienced runners can tell me if this is a good or bad idea!).

Whilst delving deep into the 2016 board, this stood out for me:

"If you do long runs in this intensity range, a 22-mile (35 km) run will take approximately the same amount of time as your marathon. By running for the length of time you hope to run the marathon, you also provide psychological reinforcement that you can run at a steady pace for that amount of time." quoted from Pfitzinger and Douglas during a explanatory discussion by some of the key motivators / coaches - and for me was a great way to understand in a relative way what to aim for.

I know we are not at the 22mile run yet, but I looked up to run 22miles in 3hr 30 (for the sake of argument) equates to 9min30sec miles. To run the marathon in the same time will require 8min miles - which to me seems an impossible leap but I know from training last year, I could run my LSR in 9.30 pace comfortably.

So, in summary - I shall go out tomorrow and try to slow my pace down to 9min30s for a 10mile run. I just hope that this target isn't too slow for me!

I am really enjoying the chat on this board, and the likes and comments on strava, and the new followers and following. I wish I had seen something like this for previous training.

Happy training all, stay safe, injury free and positive.

Baz

Mr. Guappa

fatboyfin wrote: »

Hello all,

still reading loads to get my head properly into the run slow frame of mind. I am not 100% sure of what my final target will be for the marathon, but will be somewhere between 3.45 and 3.30. Slowed down this week to 9min miles quite successfully last night - and I am conscious that I am deviating slightly from the boards 2019 plan. However, I am going to try and stick to the structure, ethos and variety of the plan, but just increase the mileage on some of the shorter runs (some of the more experienced runners can tell me if this is a good or bad idea!).

Whilst delving deep into the 2016 board, this stood out for me:

"If you do long runs in this intensity range, a 22-mile (35 km) run will take approximately the same amount of time as your marathon. By running for the length of time you hope to run the marathon, you also provide psychological reinforcement that you can run at a steady pace for that amount of time." quoted from Pfitzinger and Douglas during a explanatory discussion by some of the key motivators / coaches - and for me was a great way to understand in a relative way what to aim for.

I know we are not at the 22mile run yet, but I looked up to run 22miles in 3hr 30 (for the sake of argument) equates to 9min30sec miles. To run the marathon in the same time will require 8min miles - which to me seems an impossible leap but I know from training last year, I could run my LSR in 9.30 pace comfortably.

So, in summary - I shall go out tomorrow and try to slow my pace down to 9min30s for a 10mile run. I just hope that this target isn't too slow for me!

I am really enjoying the chat on this board, and the likes and comments on strava, and the new followers and following. I wish I had seen something like this for previous training.

Happy training all, stay safe, injury free and positive.

Baz

I love your enthusiasm, but you are focusing far too much on target times for an event that is 4 months away. Train to your current abilities and leave the target come to you, don't chase it. On a similar note, stop thinking about 22 milers (that aren't even on the plan!) and just worry about the next run, and the next week.

You should keep your long runs at closer to 10:00/mile for now.

Soulsun

Mr Guappa and co..

at what stage would we need to start taking gels?

fatboyfin

Mr. Guappa wrote: »

I love your enthusiasm, but you are focusing far too much on target times for an event that is 4 months away. Train to your current abilities and leave the target come to you, don't chase it. On a similar note, stop thinking about 22 milers (that aren't even on the plan!) and just worry about the next run, and the next week.

You should keep your long runs at closer to 10:00/mile for now.

Cheers, will try and slow slow it down tomorrow. Fingers crossed

kyomi

Soulsun wrote: »

Mr Guappa and co..

at what stage would we need to start taking gels?

I'd also be interested to hear this. A couple of people who have done marathons before advised me to start getting used to gels as soon as possible, and on that advice I bought a couple of Hi 5 gels this week. I thought I might try one towards the end of Sunday's long run, close enough to my house in case it upsets my stomach.

I got the aqua type and the regular type so I'll try one this week and the other one next week.

Huzzah!

Soulsun wrote: »

Mr Guappa and co..

at what stage would we need to start taking gels?

kyomi wrote: »

I'd also be interested to hear this. A couple of people who have done marathons before advised me to start getting used to gels as soon as possible, and on that advice I bought a couple of Hi 5 gels this week. I thought I might try one towards the end of Sunday's long run, close enough to my house in case it upsets my stomach.

I got the aqua type and the regular type so I'll try one this week and the other one next week.

You'll get different answers to this. It's certainly worth trying them out and no harm taking one as a practice like you suggest.

Some people don't take gels until their runs get to the 18/20 mile mark. I take them for long runs over the half distance or about 2:30 in duration.

Huzzah!

Good luck to those racing this weekend. I know some of you are running Clontarf and Lainey is taking part in a 5k. Be sure to report back how you get on.

rainbow kirby

Soulsun wrote: »

Mr Guappa and co..

at what stage would we need to start taking gels?

I tend to take one if I'm out for more than around 2 hours. That's more like around 11 miles at my LSR pace.

Unknownability

Unknownability wrote: »

What a lovely morning, got up early and got the 8 miles out of the way.

Which turns out is my second longest run ever, did it at 8'15 m/m, which was faster than I intended and average heart beat was 158.

Hope everyone enjoys it today.

Had to move some runs around this week due to work and weddings.

So I did the second long run tonight, 10 miles at 8'55 m/m and average heart rate of 155.

Got into a stride so was easy to slow down and run at that pace.

Will need to look in to hydration and gels as they get longer.

Only another 16 lsrs to go

Laineyfrecks

Huzzah! wrote: »

Good luck to those racing this weekend. I know some of you are running Clontarf and Lainey is taking part in a 5k. Be sure to report back how you get on.

Actually turns out it doesn't look like i'll be racing Sunday but would like to thank all here for the advice & tips

Unknownability

pac_man wrote: »

What's your max heart rate just out of interest?

On that run or in general? In that run It was 161 and my max doing an intense session is 182.

Mr. Guappa

kyomi wrote: »

I'd also be interested to hear this. A couple of people who have done marathons before advised me to start getting used to gels as soon as possible, and on that advice I bought a couple of Hi 5 gels this week. I thought I might try one towards the end of Sunday's long run, close enough to my house in case it upsets my stomach.

I got the aqua type and the regular type so I'll try one this week and the other one next week.

I'd try the aqua one first. They are basically the same thing, except the aqua one has added water meaning it goes down easier. They are also a bit bulkier, which is a consideration if you're carting 7 of them around the DCM course with you!

We have enough carbohydrate stores (glycogen) to fuel us for roughly two hours at marathon effort. It's not necessarily a bad thing to go a bit longer than the two hours in training without adding additional fuel, as we are then training our body to use fat as a fuel source. However, we also need to practice our fuelling strategies ahead of the race, and ensure that whatever we are going to be taking on race day agrees with us.

Unknownability

pac_man wrote: »

I just had a look at some of your posts just to get an idea of what type of running you are doing and you've made great progress over a short period of time.Well done! Your times get slower as the distance goes up but that's fairly common
as you haven't got the endurance built up.

Your paces seem decent enough but I'd be curious to know how truly easy them runs are.One way of verifying that is knowing your max heart rate.
What was your max HR after your 5K PB? If it's 182 then your runs are too quick.

Thanks for your feedback, yesterday was my second longest run ever. So totally agree that I'm still building endurance and getting the miles into my legs.

I wouldn't have my max heart rate really as I've only got the watch with a built in monitor at the start of the plan and haven't really been out of my comfort zone. Previously I'd the chest band but didn't really use it.

These rounds do feel quite easy as in not out of breath, could have a conversation and at the end I'm debating whether to stick to the plan or just keep going.

Original I wasn't going to race the upcoming 10k but I'll try find one now to get a max heart rate.

skyblue46

I'd agree wholeheartedly with pac_man on this one. There is no doubting your potential but everything indicates you are still running 'easy' a touch on the fast side. 155 would not truly be an easy running HR unless you have an outlier max HR. I know you find it very easy but that's when you compare it to what you were doing previously...there is likely another level for you to ease towards.

On a general point it's also important to remember that cardio and muscular fitness are the quickest to show improvement from an increase in training. I'd compare these to the engine of a car. The chassis, the structure that holds the car together, is what defines the real quality in a car build. In human terms the chassis are our bones, ligaments and tendons. Unfortunately they take a lot longer to develop and strengthen. In no time at all runners can improve their engine but haven't given the chassis time to strengthen. It's like sticking a Ferrari engine into an 80's Fiesta body and expecting it to hold together....it will if you idle around but not if you drive the bejaysus out of it. Running slowly (and sometimes on grass) allows the ligaments, tendons and bones to strengthen without the impact forces that faster running bring.

SeeMoreBut

With avg hr what was the avg over last few miles to first few. And same with pace. If same pace I’d expect a gradual climb. If he was same pace fall away?

On consuming gels etc. Don’t want till it’s to late to take them on board. Learn how to carry a 250 ml bottle of water while running. So many people grab a bottle. Take a swig and halfway to next water station they’re gasping for water. Try and carry one. Come to next station drink/pour it over yourself. Grab next bottle and old one into bin. Even if you have a belt I’d still do this

rizzee

13km Lsr done in 1:19. Hazey rain, love it. Feeling good!

Mrs Mc

Huzzah! wrote: »

You'll get different answers to this. It's certainly worth trying them out and no harm taking one as a practice like you suggest.

Some people don't take gels until their runs get to the 18/20 mile mark. I take them for long runs over the half distance or about 2:30 in duration.

I had terrible stomach problems with gels on my last marathon to try get things right I have actually started testing them out purely to see how my stomach reacts to them this time around. I don’t actually need them yet but if I’m running for 100/120 mins I am testing after an hour just to see how stomach reacts. Long runs can be all good dress rehearsals for race day to try out what food works what clothes work and what gels work.

passinginterest

Damp and misty in Clontarf this morning. I ran with the 2 hour pacers (who did a great job) for about 9 miles. Heart rate was a bit higher than I'd have liked early on but it settled and I kept it very steady until I started to push. The beach run was tricky enough, so when I found myself getting ahead of the pacers a bit on the way back I was happy enough, because it meant I could ease off a bit and let them back to me again if needed. I was feeling very comfortably and once we got to the end of the beach there was just over 2 miles to go so I started to pick it up. Second last mile was about my half marathon pace but I got a bit carried away with the last mile and it was more like 10k pace. It was nice to be feeling so strong, but I do think it was a bit silly because I was probably risking injury for no long term benefit. Chip time of 1.56.34. A delicious jam donut at the end and happy days. Definitely boosted the confidence a bit to be feeling that strong at this point. Overall it's a nice race but vert tight and congested at times and the beach run wouldn't be everyone's cup of tea.

pd79

13k Lsr done, felt good, it tires for last km. Kept pace at 7:15 , so it took 1hr 34. First run where I felt good. Well done everyone , week two done !

Soulsun

missed my LSR today due to family reasons...
I am on HH Wk2 and have completed all runs to date.
Any suggestion on what to do regarding my plan
Do I alter it? do my LSR tmw?

Huzzah!

Soulsun wrote: »

missed my LSR today due to family reasons...
I am on HH Wk2 and have completed all runs to date.
Any suggestion on what to do regarding my plan
Do I alter it? do my LSR tmw?

While I would try to keep to the schedule as the plans progress, as a once off, if you're taking Monday off, I think you can do your LSR tomorrow.

ByrneDCMbrian

Lrs this morning 10 mile kept the pace at 9.40 to 10 mins per mile felt very comfortable. Time was 1hr 38 Love running in the rain. As for gels I took one this morning say about 7 mile in. I use the aqua gel orange flavour to me it's just like Robsons drink.

Rojo

Loved my LSR today. I didn’t start until around 21:00 and there was gorgeous light and it was nice and cool. I still need to slow down my pace a little bit... but I’m heading in the right direction. Well done on week 2, everyone. :-)

Dante

passinginterest wrote: »

Damp and misty in Clontarf this morning. I ran with the 2 hour pacers (who did a great job) for about 9 miles. Heart rate was a bit higher than I'd have liked early on but it settled and I kept it very steady until I started to push. The beach run was tricky enough, so when I found myself getting ahead of the pacers a bit on the way back I was happy enough, because it meant I could ease off a bit and let them back to me again if needed. I was feeling very comfortably and once we got to the end of the beach there was just over 2 miles to go so I started to pick it up. Second last mile was about my half marathon pace but I got a bit carried away with the last mile and it was more like 10k pace. It was nice to be feeling so strong, but I do think it was a bit silly because I was probably risking injury for no long term benefit. Chip time of 1.56.34. A delicious jam donut at the end and happy days. Definitely boosted the confidence a bit to be feeling that strong at this point. Overall it's a nice race but vert tight and congested at times and the beach run wouldn't be everyone's cup of tea.

We were going at a similar enough pace so - think my chip time was around 1:54. It was my first proper run since the Limerick half over 2 months ago so took it fairly handy but its comforting to know I could finish the distance in a reasonable time without much training. Thought it was a fun race overall although, like you mentioned, I really didn't enjoy the beach stretch....could feel my shins burning big time from the loose sand. Other than that I was pretty happy (apart from the many blisters afterwards ).