Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on [email protected] for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact [email protected]

Dublin - Metrolink (Swords to Charlemont only)

16364666869180

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 200 ✭✭selassie




  • Registered Users Posts: 9,340 ✭✭✭Shedite27




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,077 ✭✭✭gjim


    Ryan was a big supporter of the Rethink Metro crowd and the Danville Avenue NIMBYs so has no love at all for ML. I'm pessimistic - I don't expect him to put up a fight for it. It's pretty ironic that it'd have been far more likely for ML, the largest PT transport initiative in nearly 40 years, to be prioritised in the NDP if the Green party wasn't part of the government. Actually it's not ironic - it's depressing.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 8,449 CMod ✭✭✭✭Sierra Oscar


    Deeply disappointing. Is it any wonder the Greens get swept away after a few years in power? They're given a real chance to be progressive and invest heavily in public transport. However instead they focus on the punitive end of the Green agenda on things such as carbon taxes while only meddlng around the edges in terms of public transport and giving people the choice to move away from their reliance on their cars. I reckon he will bundle a review of the route into a delay announcement.

    I think it would be fair to see that the construction of MetroLink would have been one of the biggest green initiatives in the history of the State when you consider its potential for vast swathes of people to abandon their cars in favour of reliable public transport. Despite this we have a Green Minister for Transport pushing the project out by nearly a decade. The mind boggles.

    The likes of Eamon Ryan will be shoving 70 by the time the opening of MetroLink is on the horizon. His generation simply don't care about investment in big and long term public transport projects.



  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,307 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    You'll rarely find me defending Eamon Ryan but he has been shafted here.

    In 2015, the timeline for new Metro North ("optimised" Metro North - remember chatter of surface running in Ballymun) was published with a start date of 2021 and opening date of 2027. This timeline has never really been updated, for a project that went through 12 months of persistent wrangling and political interference from the moment the route was published in March 2018. There was a very, very optimistic scenario published in 2019 of parallel planning permission and procurement which got completely and utterly unravelled by Covid.

    Where we are now: the project is going for a railway order in Q1 2022. This will take an absolute minimum of 12 months. If they go ahead with parallel procurement assuming they are fairly optimistic of getting planning, we may see a start in 2024, which would be prep work and enabling for the tunnel etc. This would have been made so much easier with realistic timelines



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 762 ✭✭✭starkid


    Ah here, will you stop.

    Ryan is at the heart of this. He helped spread fear (and ultimately delay) in 2018 about the Luas to Metro upgrade. He actively backed nimbys in Dunville avenue. I know this because i lived there and saw the flyers, heard the older people talk about how bad the Metro would be.

    The ultimate irony will be the day people of Ranelagh won´t be able to board a luas as the thousands of units come on stream in Cherrywood and Carrickmines etc.

    Ryan actively partook in the torpedoing of critical infrastructure. HE limply and half heartily backed it and fudged it by encouraging the monaers and naysayers to talk about rethinking the route, even though the route had been set before the original luas was built. I hope he and his party are wiped from the political map. He is 100 per cent part of who to blame.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,610 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    It is pretty clear that Ryan is not fighting for Metrolink the way he should be. He will let it go to ABP because preventing that would destroy his political career. I get the impression that he would be happy for ABP to reject it. All we can hope for now is a new government by the time the RO is granted. If the next government contains the GP, I can't see Ryan being GP leader or being a senior member of the government. He has become a full on local NIMBY politician, his Green credentials are gone and the GP was already moving away from him.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,449 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    What grounds would ABP have for rejecting the current proposal? There is very little opposition to it at this stage.

    To be fair the Greens they have not objected to the current proposal between Swords and Charlemont - we need a bit of perspective here.

    The issue is ultimately a political one - whether a government (and indeed the railway sceptical in the civil service who advise them) has the will to fund the project. That’s the nub of this now.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,610 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    I didn't suggest that ABP would reject Metrolink, just that I get the impression that Ryan would be happy if they did (that way he gets the redesign he has been pining for without having to be the one who sets the project back).

    I also never said anything about the GP objecting to Metrolink. Ryan himself supports redesigning the southern end and was a big part of the campaign to not have Metrolink connect to the existing Green Line. Like I said, he seems increasingly isolated within the party he leads.

    The issue is a political one but the problem with that is that the current Minister for Transport isn't fighting for it the way that he should. He should be driving the project and promoting it but he clearly wont do that. A MfT worth his salt would be putting pressure on his government colleagues when talking to the press, not these wishy washy answers he is giving.



  • Registered Users Posts: 326 ✭✭MyLove4Satan


    Expect journalists to start inserting 'the controversial' phrase before MetroLink in all future news stories after the government ministers and senior civil servants take them out to lunch and also sudden talk of 'why not extend the Finglas Luas all the way to the airport instead!" - "sure it will still connect with the DART at Broombridge."

    Just watch.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 2,326 ✭✭✭crazy 88


    Serious question. Are we over regulated and pander to NIMBYs too much? I'm not saying we should bulldoze all objections but how did democratic counties like the UK and US build metros in such a relatively short space of time with respect to planning laws/dealing with NIMBYs?



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,238 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    Politicians pander far too much to a noisy minority. Although I think the use of nimby is often not really fair, not every objection is nimby, in fact I think a lot of what we call nimby are in fact genuine issues for the people objecting. If an old woman objects to say the dunville crossing being closed and she uses it for her walk to the shop then I don’t think that’s nimby, that doesn’t mean I think she should be able to halt what’s happening but it’s a genuine objection.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,449 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    Any redesign of the southern end though has nothing to do with the current proposal.

    Also, while the hoo-ha around Ranelagh wasn’t helpful, I think that people here are over-egging it somewhat.

    The southern part of the route was scuppered ultimately by the sewer that was discovered to be in the way at the canal. That required a complete redesign and the NTA at that point shelved the southern section pending an alternative design in favour of proceeding with the northern route in the meantime.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,326 ✭✭✭crazy 88


    Yes some ojections are justified but my question is how did metros in other cities ever get built if they adhere to fair planning? At this rate we'd have the equivalent of the London underground in Dublin in about 700 years



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,238 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    Well really my first line answered that, politicians pander! They can’t see past the electoral cycle.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,610 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    You seem to be constantly replying to things I didn't say!



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,449 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,282 ✭✭✭D.L.R.


    The amateurism is palpable with the Irish state.



  • Registered Users Posts: 145 ✭✭VeryOwl


    The fact half the Government was at the opening of a small train station on Sunday congratulating themselves, tells us everything we need to know about the scale of their ambitions. Toy town clowns government of small-minded frauds.

    "Hopeful for 2034" is the statement of someone who's passionless about a project and fine using the planning system as an excuse to let it die. With Metro now in ruins, I hope those who are more active and open in campaigning for transport now understand they're dealing with charlatans and adjust their strategy accordingly.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,517 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    The way are system is setup they really dont have choice but see past the electoral cycle



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    Because you would walk to the airport nearly as quick... and its rubbish proposal on a number of fronts...



  • Registered Users Posts: 326 ✭✭MyLove4Satan


    The primary reason the MetroLink and DART expansion has been permanently cancelled is to safeguard the electricity capacity supply for the Data Centers. Ryan and Co had a toss up between Amazon and Public Transport and Amazon was given priority.



  • Registered Users Posts: 326 ✭✭MyLove4Satan


    and this means this won't happen??? You do know this is Ireland right?



  • Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 26,398 Mod ✭✭✭✭Peregrine


    I would agree with a lot of that but his bloody incompetence at speaking up and explaining what's going on is staggering. It's looking like funding is not the issue but long project delays itself (although, it's still not entirely clear).

    There's no chance of a 2030 opening now. I thought it was possible but I've had to put away my optimism, re-evaluate and I've come to the conclusion that 2032 is more likely. That's without any funding issues.



  • Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 26,398 Mod ✭✭✭✭Peregrine


    I'm intrigued by how quiet the Irish Times has been on the issue. Every other news outlet including RTE and the Irish Examiner in the Irish Times Group have reported it.

    Some of you may remember the hostility of the Irish Times towards the Metro North project in the 2000s. This is the editorial they wrote at the inception of what we now know as MetroLink.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/editorial/decision-on-metro-north-in-dublin-confirms-narrow-thinking-1.2374668



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,331 ✭✭✭Keyzer


    At this stage, its beyond pathetic.

    We have a transport minister who "hopes" this major infrastructure initiative will be in place by 2034, 13 years from now. Discussions around a train link to the airport and an underground rail network have been going on for decades. For the life of me, I have no idea what these morons are doing.

    Rail services in Dublin city are ridiculous with trains still stopping on the Maynooth line in the morning to wait for a chance to get into Connolly. Its been like this for over 30 years (probably more).

    We have a Luas system which is going to be completely overloaded. Why on earth the Luas stopped at Broombridge is, again, beyond my comprehension. It should have gone all the way to Blanchardstown or further.

    Zero initiative, zero ambition, zero strategic thinking...

    I'll say one thing about Ryan, its not all his fault. Its a failure of multiple Governments going back through the years.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,238 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    Ah would you stop, that’s just nonsense and adds nothing to the discussion.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,331 ✭✭✭Keyzer




  • Registered Users Posts: 326 ✭✭MyLove4Satan


    It adds the cold, stark reality of what is going on. I am astounded so many of you here still have so much unconditional faith considering the last half century of what the Irish political establishment has done in this regard.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 16,418 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    Did you make that up yourself or read it somewhere? The power requirements of the metro are absolutely nothing in the grand scheme of things.



Advertisement