New neighbour applies for permission for monstrous extension - without telling us

Mrs Shuttleworth

Mrs Shuttleworth wrote: »

So effectively that wall would be erected without my consent and I would have responsibilities in relation to the wall.

I don't want to "doxx" myself but they'd have difficulty enforcing any access order in our case. The lawful owner is disabled and paraplegic.

Start building your case.

Interested Observer

Seems to me like you need to set your outrage aside for a moment and go talk to your neighbour.

Mrs Shuttleworth

Interested Observer wrote: »

Seems to me like you need to set your outrage aside for a moment and go talk to your neighbour.

That's the whole point of my saying in the OP that as a courtesy he should have told me of his plans.

Because the application has gone in now, I have no option but to formally object.

appledrop

If you have barely seen them they could be planning to just do it up and sell it on. You need to get good advice on this as others have said + put in an objection asap. Never take it for granted that council will not pass it. They make some mad decisions. There was an issue with planning application for house on our road + neighbours came together + got professional advice on what the council usually will not accept for extension etc. The objection was accpeted by council + extension refused. A common reason is if not enough garden space left after extension then it will be refused.

Best of luck with it.

Effects

appledrop wrote: »

A common reason is if not enough garden space left after extension then it will be refused.

The amount of garden space needed per bed space was reduced last year as far as I know.

Claw Hammer

Mrs Shuttleworth wrote: »

So effectively that wall would be erected without our consent and we would have responsibilities in relation to the wall.

I don't want to "doxx" myself but they'd have difficulty enforcing any access order in our case. The lawful owner is disabled and paraplegic.

A neighbour can apply to the District Court for a "Works Order" enabling the applicant to enter onto the property of the neighbour for the purpose of maintaining their own property. If the wall is going to become effectively a party structure you should be taking steps now in relation to it.

jon1981

Stop panicking , consult an architect and draft a comprehensive observation. The process is there to listen seriously to your concerns.

We were in your situation and the development next to us was scaled back by half the proposed scale due to privacy and light concerns.

Trust the system and use an expert to draft the observation, don't half arse it.

Make a formal objection, and have a chat with the neighbour.

Figure out their plans (ie; to live there forever, or sell it on fairly sharpish).

As an aside, I can't see them selling it. Rarely (if ever) would doing this level of renovation make sense on a house you plan to sell (presumably for a profit). I'd imagine they are just renovating so they can try and get the dirty work done while they live elsewhere.

Have a chat with them. You'll find that by sitting around over-thinking it, you'll be inventing rows and arguments in your head that don't actually exist in real life.

Mrs Shuttleworth

Claw Hammer wrote: »

A neighbour can apply to the District Court for a "Works Order" enabling the applicant to enter onto the property of the neighbour for the purpose of maintaining their own property. If the wall is going to become effectively a party structure you should be taking steps now in relation to it.

Yup I checked that just now and thanks for the heads up. I'll need to see a solicitor with expertise in boundaries and party wall issues.

Orchids

jon1981 wrote: »

Stop panicking , consult an architect and draft a comprehensive observation. The process is there to listen seriously to your concerns.

We were in your situation and the development next to us was scaled back by half the proposed scale due to privacy and light concerns.

Trust the system and use an expert to draft the observation, don't half arse it.

Exactly this, we had same situation and again, development was scaled way back

shenanagans

If I bought a house and planned to build a monstrous extension then you can be damn sure I'd keep a low profile and keep well away from the new neighbours.

These new neighbours didn't consult you because if they did consult you they'd have to amend their plans....which they don't want to do. They want to build what they want. Damn the neighbours.

Object to the plans. Get advice from a professional. Do it right or you'll be looking at Trump Wall for the rest of your days.

If the neighbours show up after you object....simply say that you didn't contact them about your concerns given that they didn't contact you prior to submitting their plans.

beauf

Orchids wrote: »

Exactly this, we had same situation and again, development was scaled way back

How long ago. Everywhere I look everyones building massive square extensions to houses in a completely different style to everything around it. Its like a free for all these days.

Effects

beauf wrote: »

Everywhere I look everyones building massive square extensions to houses in a completely different style to everything around it.

Pastiche in the vernacular is long out of fashion darling.

beauf

Effects wrote: »

Pastiche in the vernacular is long out of fashion darling.

When you visit other country they retain their cultural aesthetic without pastiche.

Which is why they look like themselves and Ireland looks like nowhere, not even Ireland. The Docklands and Quays has no identity these days.

the_syco

shenanagans wrote: »

If I bought a house and planned to build a monstrous extension then you can be damn sure I'd keep a low profile and keep well away from the new neighbours.

These new neighbours didn't consult you because if they did consult you they'd have to amend their plans....which they don't want to do. They want to build what they want. Damn the neighbours.

The classic haggle; low ball, and meet somewhere in the middle.

IMO, the neighbour is seeing how far they can go, and will probably get what they want, whilst the OP thinks they won.

beauf

On one street I know a person showed one set of plans to all the neighbours then submitted something else entirely.

What they are building looks like a 4yr old drew it in crayon.

Mrs Shuttleworth

beauf wrote: »

How long ago. Everywhere I look everyones building massive square extensions to houses in a completely different style to everything around it. Its like a free for all these days.

I agree completely and it's the same with commercial properties and hotels.

The same brown bathroom.

The same open plan / kitchen diner.

The same grey walls / furniture.

60s/70s/80s futurism in architecture were innovative and ostentatious but integrated with the craftsmanship of the past.

Today's "modern home" is sterile and soulless speaks of nothing but debt.

Effects

beauf wrote: »

On one street I know a person showed one set of plans to all the neighbours then submitted something else entirely.

What's the point of that? It's even worse than showing them nothing at all?
Were they hoping no one would check once the plans were submitted?

beauf

Exactly that. Won't be borrowing any sugar I'm thinking. Objections were ignored anyway.

Its like something you made with the bits left over in the lego box. Then plonked on a site too small.

A carbuncle for future generations.

Phileas Frog

Mrs Shuttleworth wrote: »

I then dropped in a Christmas card with our mobiles on them.

It was the other way around in your OP

GrumpyMe

Claw Hammer wrote: »

It doesn't matter. If a wall is built so close to the boundary as to affect the neighbour, it is deemed to be a party wall and various provisions relating to party structures come into effect. If the only way the new wall can be maintained by accessing the neighbours property then it is a party wall for the purposes of the land and conveyancing (law reform) act 2009.

Claw Hammer wrote: »

A neighbour can apply to the District Court for a "Works Order" enabling the applicant to enter onto the property of the neighbour for the purpose of maintaining their own property. If the wall is going to become effectively a party structure you should be taking steps now in relation to it.

Apologies for slightly off topic post.

Not questioning your post(s), I'm interested in exploring more if you have a link or links to reading matter you could post?

JMNolan

GrumpyMe wrote: »

Apologies for slightly off topic post.

Not questioning your post(s), I'm interested in exploring more if you have a link or links to reading matter you could post?

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2009/act/27/section/45/enacted/en/html

Mrs Shuttleworth

Phileas Frog wrote: »

It was the other way around in your OP

You are deliberately selectively misquoting me.

We only saw them once from the window and we waved to them. They waved back and kept moving.

About a month later they dropped in the letterbox a Christmas card with their names and mobile numbers on them (in the door).

We immediately replied back by text with our names and numbers and also dropped in a card a few days later (again with our numbers).

The next correspondence/communication was the text last week telling us the site notice had gone up.

Hooe that clarifies things for you.

Mrs Shuttleworth

JMNolan wrote: »

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2009/act/27/section/45/enacted/en/html

Yup I wasn't aware of that either. Thanks for posting.

That has real implications for me given they intend building right up to that glass roof we erected and paid for covering our passageway.

Presumably given the Act (I read the sections there) they'd be able to enter our property and in fact remove our glass roof to finish their wall on their side as it would actually be classed as a party wall.

A lot of homeowners wouldn't be aware of that.

lawred2

Mrs Shuttleworth has a wife?

Effects

Mrs Shuttleworth wrote: »

That has real implications for me given they intend building right up to that glass roof we erected and paid for covering our passageway.
They'd be able to enter our property and in fact remove our glass roof to finish their wall on their side as it would actually be classed as a party wall.

I thought they were building inside the boundary wall. Does your glass rest on top of the wall or how is it done?

Any work they do to your side, involving the glass, they would have to make good again.

Addle

You'll be making a submission which contains an objection, you don't make an objection.

So they let you know that the site notice went up?

Mrs Shuttleworth

Effects wrote: »

I thought they were building inside the boundary wall. Does your glass rest on top of the wall or how is it done?

Any work they do to your side, involving the glass, they would have to make good again.

The boundary as it stands appears to be the two passageways back to back comprised of two walls I reckon no more than a cm apart.

On our wall rests the glass roof.

What the Act (as helpfully posted by another poster) suggests is that because these two walls are so close together that effectively they are party walls.

Next door according to the plans will remove the existing passageway wall on their side and replace it with the 20 foot wall which will form the side of the new extension. So this wall according to the Act may well be a party wall if they get planning for the proposed scheme.

Widdensushi

lawred2 wrote: »

Mrs Shuttleworth has a wife?

It's 2019

Effects

Mrs Shuttleworth wrote: »

The boundary as it stands appears to be the two passageways back to back comprised of two walls I reckon no more than a cm apart.

I understand now. I had just assumed that you both shared a wall.