ESB eCars

liamog

Define "a premium"? €0.79 a unit when you rock up with 5% left and you need to get to 85%? That's a premium of €40.45 for a 64kW car, or approx €0.11 a kilometer (at 6.8kw/kW).

The Ionity network isn't for you, it's for members of the Ionity consortium to sell cars with free/reasonably priced and available charging. If you do have to use them due to congestion on the eCars network then only charge enough to either get home or get to the next eCars point.

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117922862#Comment_117922862

Ironically, I drive a Kona. Pre Nov 2020, granted, but a Hyundai all of the same.

ted1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117922862#Comment_117922862

isn’t VW a member ? They don’t offer a discount or free mileage to my knowledge

liamog

Hyundai's charging services are offered via https://chargemyhyundai.com/web/hyundai-global, looks like it's not rolled out to Ireland yet.

VW offer the WeCharge service https://www.volkswagen.ie/en/electric-cars/charging/we-charge.html

Ironically, I drive a Kona. Pre Nov 2020, granted, but a Hyundai all of the same.

The charging services by manufacturers are targeted at new car buyers rather than existing ones. You already bought that Kona, so they don't need to make a service available to convince you to buy.

innrain

That is for Ireland as the consumers here accepts everything without complains.

Hyundai UK gives up to 2 year access to Ionity5 new owners @ 25 pence /kWh followed by a monthly subscription fee of 11.25 GBP to maintain the preferential tariff. https://chargemyhyundai.com/web/hyundai-gb/tariffs

Here is Kia https://kiacharge.com/web/kia-gb/tariffs

Pretty sure VW gives similar packages in different countries. And with the risk of sounding pedantic Ionity is 73c/kWh in Ireland directly from them.

charlieIRL

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117923152#Comment_117923152

on the free plan its €0.73 per kWh

next plan is €7.49 per month and €0.55 per kWh

top one is €17.49 per month and the charge rate drops to €0.30 per kwh

TitianGerm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117923277#Comment_117923277

So if you use more than 41 units a month you start saving money on the €17.49 plan?

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117923307#Comment_117923307

17.49/(0.73-0.30) would give you 40.67kWh as break even per month vs the no cost plan. So basically one top up in a large battery or two in a small battery, per month, and you're in profit.

mfceiling

Are Ionity making money in Ireland? Every single time I drive past the one at Kill it is always empty. I think in the last 9 months I've only ever seen a car at it twice, and I'm past it quite a bit.

ted1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117923277#Comment_117923277

4C82E665-65AE-4B2F-919A-FFBDD5DD22CB.png

79c according to their website. So no cheaper

eagerv

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117923902#Comment_117923902

And that's probably stall 2 ? That stall was on free vend the last 3 or 4 months..😉 (Not any more..)

charlieIRL

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117923967#Comment_117923967

From my app, do you not believe me??

ted1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117924099#Comment_117924099

Their site disagrees with the app… mad.

innrain

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117923967#Comment_117923967

It is an error VAT related. Used to be 79c when they were charging 23% VAT. As Revenue clarified that it should be 13.5% they have passed the saving to us. :) So Ireland is few cents cheaper than other EU countries. This is available to owners of Volkswagen Group Brands, Daimler, BMW, Ford and Hyundai cars based on the VIN. I have tried my Kona and it works. Make sure you select Ireland on the top right side of the website.

The whole point of discussion is that Ionity is a manufacturer's network similar to SuC and their prices do not reflect the free market pricing which does not exists in Ireland. If we don't count Tesla and Ionity, besides ecars, rapid chargers has easygo (about 10?) , there is another one in Roscommon from clenergy, some (4-5?) at airports/train stations for taxis and 3 free installed by the petrol stations.

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117923902#Comment_117923902

Considering the prices they charge I very much doubt it

jspuds

Well done ESB, great job 😀

https://www.siliconrepublic.com/machines/ev-electric-vehicles-ireland-ranking-europe

bodgerfederer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117922849#Comment_117922849

I’m not saying I like the higher price, just that I’d rather pay it and have something that works when I want.

11c a km, yes that’s more expensive than my diesel was at around 8/9c a km. but it ties in with what i said about it being a small market and what someone else said about do they even make a profit.

if I’m mr average and I only fast charge a couple of times a year on ionity and there’s only 15,000ish fully electric cars in the country then they only make 1,500,000. Minus all costs.

ecars are doing the opposite of providing competition.

Unfortunately we’re not a big country with lots of cars passing through to other destinations. We’re may just have to pay higher prices than main land Europe but be glad we don’t have to pay them too often.

edit- missed a zero!

AndyBoBandy

As a casual user of public charging, If eCars had a network whereby there were hubs (actual hubs where you’d never need to queue up….), and they were spaced out whereby when at one of them, you were never more that 50km away from the next one, then yeah, I’d pay €0.50-€0.60 per kWh as a PAYG customer for that level of service.

similarly I’d have no issue paying the rip off Ionity prices if I needed a charge, but to date (18 months & 41,000km), I haven’t needed to use Ionity, and have so far gotten away with Tesla & eCars.

Talking to herself about our experience in Kilcullen on Sunday, and we agreed that we couldn’t recommend anyone to go EV who was doing regular long distance drives in Ireland, unless maybe they were getting a Tesla, but even then they’d need to be sticking to SuC routes.

ted1

I’ve no problem paying the ionity charge as it would be very seldom. And I’d get a faster charge meaning I’ll spend less in the adjoining garage/ Cade/etc

the one outside Gorey suits us as we have a holiday place in Ballymoney anf a quick charge before heading home

TitianGerm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117925969#Comment_117925969

Sure everyone will be able to use the SUC shortly.

MightyMunster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117926059#Comment_117926059

Emphasis on "shortly", 2 weeks is the usual definition

markpb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117926059#Comment_117926059

I wouldn’t hold my breath for Elon/Tesla timelines 😊

zg3409

It's going a bit off topic from ESB but Ionity chargers often do not work, often multiple broken at one site, and many new EV drivers are not even aware they exist or how to start a charge there. Similar with easygo, but their chargers nearly always work or are fixed in a few days.

I agree ESB are probably pricing low to reduce competitors entering the market, but they are also rolling out so slowly like they expect others to be competiting with them in the future and like they don't want to take first mover advantage and become the rulers of intercity EV trips. Bigger batteries and a small country do mess with the profitability of their chargers, with 60+kWh batteries becoming standard many drivers can go city to city without public charging, although already 50+kW chargers on motorways are all too busy particularly at peak times like Friday evenings. It's hard to recommend an EV to those who may stray beyond home charger range regularly.

AndyBoBandy

"with 60+kWh batteries becoming standard many drivers can go city to city without public charging"

This is all well and good, but the vast vast majority of these city to city journeys will involve a return journey, and as we know, eCars are not rolling out any new AC/Destination charging sites, so a fast DC charge will be needed along the route somewhere, either on the outbound leg or the inbound. The above scenario also assumes every intercity journey starts with a 100% battery.

Case in point was on Sunday when we went from North Dublin down to Woodstock House in Kilkenny (just outside Waterford), we stopped in Kilcullen on the way down for toilet breaks, and said while we were there we'd take on hopefully enough juice to make it home later without charging. we waited for another Model 3 to leave and plugged in for 10 minutes and then left as we wanted to get where we were going. In that time, 2 Ioniq's had arrived and started queuing to charge. What didn't help was one of the spaces at the 150kW unit being ICE'd by an e-tron.. In the 10 minutes I was charging, another 3 EV's arrived and promptly left when they saw the situation, and likeliness of waiting at least an hour+ before even getting onto a charger.

A few hours later on the way home, we again needed a charge, and as we plugged in, a Leaf arrived with a Kona, and suddenly the site was at capacity... again, another 2 EV's came and left when they saw the situation....

It's just not good enough... Put in another 150kW unit, with 2 CCS plugs on it, and it will massively help the situation.

Kilcullen is a shiny new site, so I don't envisage it getting any more units anytime soon....

Busman Paddy Lasty

The whole small island vs big battery EVs doesn't apply to ESB in the same way as independent operators. They are 50% funded by the taxpayer and any network connection fees go to their parent company. They should have all their hubs rolled out by now and be looking at adding more units to these fictional hubs.

Small island vs big battery doesn't apply to commercial vehicles, light and heavy. A fully loaded electric Transit pulling a trailer might use 50kWh/100km. Needing to charge frequently during business hours too will make each unit more profitable, filling the gap when weekend travellers are at home or work.

cannco253

They also seem to be well able to assist with the rollout in the UK albeit on a totally separate basis to here. You’d think that the UK team would be speaking to the Irish office and sharing their experience.

At least it would be some form of ‘outside’ knowledge sharing rather then keeping everything locked up internally.

ted1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117928473#Comment_117928473

It’s the same office. Working off different budgets abs different guidelines, TFL must be more generous.

the_amazing_raisin

One of the main issues with Ionity in Ireland is that there aren't any free discounts, wheras customers in Germany seem to get a lot of discounts when they sign up to certain electricity or charging providers

the_amazing_raisin

I noticed a few days ago that there's ESB AC chargers on Level 0 (below ground) of pavilions shopping centre car park

Are they new or were they alway there with the others

That's 6x dual 22kW sockets total, 12 cars can charge at once. Ironically it's firmly cemented as ESBs biggest charging hub

I also saw they're looking to install 2700 solar panels on the roof. Glad to see some green energy being added to the mix

AndyBoBandy

It seems like an awful lot of AC chargers for the Pavilions SC!! Dont get me wrong, its great to see, and its exactly the type of location for such banks of 22kW chargers, but is it really needed now? when there are so few other AC units around!! Every town and village should have at least 1 AC22 in it.

I'd say the vast vast majority of people charging in th ePavillions are doing it for the handy parking space! I even did it once!!