Beep scheme - anyone joining

irishguy19772

Any restrictions on selling the calves? Usually sell them as runners in Aug/Sept.

Earnshaw

Fecal egg count (Option 2)

Wondering what does this entail? As in how many suckler cows do I need a fecal sample from?

I can't do Option 1's as i'm in organic status. Meal would be too expensive and vaccination is prohibited.

wrangler

Earnshaw wrote: »

Fecal egg count (Option 2)

Wondering what does this entail? As in how many suckler cows do I need a fecal sample from?

I can't do Option 1's as i'm in organic status. Meal would be too expensive and vaccination is prohibited.

I'd say it's faecal egg counts on the calves, is it.
Cows would be resistant to worms

Grueller

wrangler wrote: »

I'd say it's faecal egg counts on the calves, is it.
Cows would be resistant to worms

Nope. Cows. Put cows into clean pen, gather 10 random samples, test them. Discuss findings with vet.

wrangler

Grueller wrote: »

Nope. Cows. Put cows into clean pen, gather 10 random samples, test them. Discuss findings with vet.

MUST be for fluke or maybe rumen fluke

Earnshaw

Grueller wrote: »

Nope. Cows. Put cows into clean pen, gather 10 random samples, test them. Discuss findings with vet.

Thanks! I presume the samples are sent to a lab for testing....?

tractorporn

Earnshaw wrote: »

Fecal egg count (Option 2)

Wondering what does this entail? As in how many suckler cows do I need a fecal sample from?

I can't do Option 1's as i'm in organic status. Meal would be too expensive and vaccination is prohibited.

Ermm vaccination is allowed under organic regs you just have to show that you need to do it. I vaccinate for blackleg here and theres no problem, I have a letter from my vet saying I need to do it and I'm covered for 5 years.

Anto_Meath

Just had a read of the vaccine element of this. It's a little confusing. Like you have two options. You either do them once because its difficult to get them in and handle them or you do them twice. I am guessing most farmers would be going option 1.
From the department on vaccination requirements.

Applicants must choose one of the following vaccination protocols:
Option 1. (if there is a short time before risk period or if cattle can only be handled once)
• Single RSV and Pi3 Intranasal 2 to 4 weeks before weaning/housing/sale
• At the same time, a Single (or 2 dose program) IBR live intra-muscular injection (2 to 4
weeks before weaning/housing/sale)


Option 2. (if there is more time before risk period or a broader coverage including bacteria is
required)
• First subcutaneous injection of RSV, Pi3 and Mannhaemia haemolytica dead, 6 to 8
weeks before weaning/housing/sale
• Second subcutaneous injection of RSV, Pi3 and Mannhaemia haemolytica dead, 2 to 4
weeks before weaning/housing/sale
• At the same time as the second injection, a Single IBR live intra-muscular, 2 to 4 weeks
before weaning/housing/sale
The procedures in both options must be completed in full and are equally applicable to both
spring and autumn born calves.

893bet

Any update on how the feed ration element is going to be proved?

Just meal docket?

lab man

893bet wrote:

Any update on how the feed ration element is going to be proved?

893bet wrote:

Just meal docket?

ya my advisor said 2 weeks before weaning 1 week after and keep dockets

High bike

lab man wrote: »

ya my advisor said 2 weeks before weaning 1 week after and keep dockets

is there a minimum quantity??

tanko

The terms and conditions say four weeks pre weaning and two weeks post weaning that nuts/ration must be fed.
It doesn't say how much, just says that enough should be fed to give an adequate level of nutrition whatever that means.

Dunedin

Aravo wrote: »

Signed up. Vaccination and the faecal egg count. Will see down the line if I will do the egg count, no info on labs yet.

Went to sign up earlier and couldn’t find the place on Ag.ie

Can anyone direct me

tanko

Log into Agfood.ie
Click on Beep-S on menu (fourth one down)
Click on Applications, click on the small circle and put a dot in it (i think)

lab man

High bike wrote:

is there a minimum quantity??

i dunno , i ment to register. gtvodaly but couldnt get time as selling alot of hsy atthe moment , do i just ring icbf and say i need to register ?

High bike

lab man wrote: »

i dunno , i ment to register. gtvodaly but couldnt get time as selling alot of hsy atthe moment , do i just ring icbf and say i need to register ?

log on to agfood only takes 2 mins

Simmental.

Results from last years scheme
https://www.icbf.com/wp/?p=15811

charolais0153

Simmental. wrote: »

Results from last years scheme
https://www.icbf.com/wp/?p=15811

So the differnec for a 20 cow herd of 5 star cows vs 1 star cows is 720 euro based on that, top 20% vs botton 20%

Grueller

charolais0153 wrote: »

So the differnec for a 20 cow herd of 5 star cows vs 1 star cows is 720 euro based on that, top 20% vs botton 20%

Shows the absolute futility of putting in big effort with beef

tanko

Grueller wrote: »

Shows the absolute futility of putting in big effort with beef

With the protection of quotas gone i can't see any reason why dairying won't go the same way.

Grueller

tanko wrote: »

With the protection of quotas gone i can't see any reason why dairying won't go the same way.

The only reasons I see is that it is a full time job. Part time dairying is not really viable for most so if margins go people will have to exit. That's not the case with beef. 12 hours a week can actually run a tight ship on a dry stock farm.
The second reason is the diversity of the product. Look at how many beef derived products are in a supermarket. Now compare that to milk.
Maybe I am wrong. I hope not though as I have a ball of cash spent to get into dairying.

tanko

I hope i'm wrong, time will tell.

Anyway it's good to see ICBF finally admit that the difference between what they class as a 1* and a 5* suckler cow isn't worth talking about.

I suppose they'll have to carry on with it, all those 100K+ salaries down there will have to be justified in some way.

ABitofsense

When is the best time to do the weighing or does it really matter?

We usually creep feed here around August (calves ~5 months old) so plan is to weigh before I start to get a baseline of how they perform with creeping. More out of interest really to see their performance.

Dunedin

Signed up yesterday. All measures. Picked the vaccination option as have been doing it with weanlings for last 7-8 years anyways

Anto_Meath

Signed up yesterday, going with the meal feeding as I don't sell wealings but do feed a little bit of meal to get them used of coming in and out of the yard as it leaves them easier for handling when they are bigger. Anything to keep limos quite is a good idea.
Have 1 cow that calved last November (an experiment) so will be weaning her calf in August so might start with the pinch of meal then. Not going for November calving again while I have a a fine animal now, the cow takes a lot of extra feeding over the winter and you would feel sorry for the calf on the cold wet nights and thankfully we had no hard frost or snow this winter.

tanko

ABitofsense wrote: »

When is the best time to do the weighing or does it really matter?

We usually creep feed here around August (calves ~5 months old) so plan is to weigh before I start to get a baseline of how they perform with creeping. More out of interest really to see their performance.

Before you start creep feeding them would probably be the ideal time, it would give you a good idea how each cow is feeding their calf.

patsy_mccabe

Lads, a couple of neighbours are signing up for this and they have asked me for help. Both are registered on agfood.ie as they need this already for the single payment (BPS).
Am I right in saying that the inputted data, cattle weights etc can only be inputted on www.icbf.com and not agfood.ie ............... or can they just fill in the forms and send them in themselves?

I did mine all last year on www.icbf.com.

Also, can a few of us share the scales for the day.

50HX

You can do a paper form for them, just get them to request it from icbf a week or so before

7 day period to log weights from weigh date afaik

Yes you can share the scales as long as the number is recorded for each of them they are fine

Hard Knocks

For the faecal samples is it just cows calved in reference period or do calves have to be done too?

High bike

Hard Knocks wrote: »

For the faecal samples is it just cows calved in reference period or do calves have to be done too?

just the cows afaik

893bet

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Lads, a couple of neighbours are signing up for this and they have asked me for help. Both are registered on agfood.ie as they need this already for the single payment (BPS).
Am I right in saying that the inputted data, cattle weights etc can only be inputted on www.icbf.com and not agfood.ie ............... or can they just fill in the forms and send them in themselves?

I did mine all last year on www.icbf.com.

Also, can a few of us share the scales for the day.

The 60 quid per year on herdplus app is more than worth it for convienience of beep, bdgp and thinks like tracking expected calving dates, serve date etc.

dohc turbo2

Is it not compulsory to be on icbf for the likes of these schemes

pure breed

High bike wrote:

just the cows afaik

Do all the cows need a sample of faeces taken or just a few in the herd.
I think someone mentioned here or I read somewhere else that you could say powerhose a pen and leave a few cows in it for couple hrs and then come back and take you samples?

893bet

pure breed wrote: »

Do all the cows need a sample of faeces taken or just a few in the herd.
I think someone mentioned here or I read somewhere else that you could say powerhose a pen and leave a few cows in it for couple hrs and then come back and take you samples?

I think per the scheme the samples are supposed to be labelled to the specific cow and then you need to dose in accordance with the results.

893bet

pure breed wrote: »

Do all the cows need a sample of faeces taken or just a few in the herd.
I think someone mentioned here or I read somewhere else that you could say powerhose a pen and leave a few cows in it for couple hrs and then come back and take you samples?

I think per the scheme the samples are supposed to be labelled to the specific cow and then you need to dose in accordance with the results.

patsy_mccabe

Shur, chase a cow around the field and when she sh1ts herself, take the sample.

Jeo John

I signed up for Beep a week ago how do you know if application is accepted??

tanko

Jeo John wrote: »

I signed up for Beep a week ago how do you know if application is accepted??

You can check on Agfood.ie under BEEP-S, Applications, view Application. Or you can check on ICBF.com. I'm not sure if you need Herdplus to do this.

solerina

dohc turbo2 wrote: »

Is it not compulsory to be on icbf for the likes of these schemes

No

minerleague

Joined up after saying was done with any more schemes (fed up with inspections etc ) but like bord bia it is almost compulsory by default to be in. A lot of these schemes seem to be dreamed up by people justifying their jobs by doing something.

Dunedin

minerleague wrote: »

Joined up after saying was done with any more schemes (fed up with inspections etc ) but like bord bia it is almost compulsory by default to be in. A lot of these schemes seem to be dreamed up by people justifying their jobs by doing something.

As long as I keep getting money, I hope they keep justifying their jobs.......

minerleague

Dunedin wrote: »

As long as I keep getting money, I hope they keep justifying their jobs.......

I suppose but income from actual farming seems to go down by the same amount as we get in
payments opening us up to criticism from anti farming types that were unviable. also as I get older these scheme ( including glas ) seem more like dole payments

Turbohymac

Feck all these penny making schemes around making farmers jump through hoops for pittance..it far past time that farm produce actually made a decent price that wouldn't require loads of stupid subsidies and grants..the eu have now given an initial 80million to irish meat factories to store excess meat for up to 6 months..AND the president of ifa was bladdering that at least the door was open and there would hopefully room for much more money from the EU to meat processors.. and wait for it the ifa guy then went on to say that hopefully the meat factories might be able to pass some of the 80m onto the farmers when there selling their animals into the factories... ok good to see brown envelopes are still around ..

bogman_bass

Turbohymac wrote: »

Feck all these penny making schemes around making farmers jump through hoops for pittance..it far past time that farm produce actually made a decent price that wouldn't require loads of stupid subsidies and grants..the eu have now given an initial 80million to irish meat factories to store excess meat for up to 6 months..AND the president of ifa was bladdering that at least the door was open and there would hopefully room for much more money from the EU to meat processors.. and wait for it the ifa guy then went on to say that hopefully the meat factories might be able to pass some of the 80m onto the farmers when there selling their animals into the factories... ok good to see brown envelopes are still around ..

Well there is a post straight from the Beefplan playbook

oneten

playbook ? that implies forward planning , and a coherent strategy to achieve concrete results
no chance .

ABitofsense

From reading the criteria for the Faecal samples, it states that a min of 10 samples be taken and that the cows tag be recorded for each container. It reads like every cow needs to be sampled, could be a while watching & waiting for cows to sh#te in the yard!! Am i interpreting it correctly

alps

Turbohymac wrote: »

the eu have now given an initial 80million to irish meat factories to store excess meat for up to 6 months ..

Just wondering....would it have made more sense to send back the unsold cuts to the farmer?

bogman_bass

ABitofsense wrote: »

From reading the criteria for the Faecal samples, it states that a min of 10 samples be taken and that the cows tag be recorded for each container. It reads like every cow needs to be sampled, could be a while watching & waiting for cows to sh#te in the yard!! Am i interpreting it correctly

Run 10 of them up the crush. Stick a gloved finger in her bum and she’ll give you a sample.

Dozer1

so on the vaccination option,
is there a reason we can't vaccinate them as calves as oppose to having to tackle them as weanlings.
I thought from here https://www.bovilis.ie/pneumonia/ it would make more sense to do then as calves but from below it looks like its only to be done max 8 weeks prior to weaning/housing/sale

Applicants must choose one of the following vaccination protocols:
Option 1. (if there is a short time before risk period or if cattle can only be handled once)
Single RSV and Pi3 Intranasal 2 to 4 weeks before weaning/housing/sale
At the same time, a Single (or 2 dose program) IBR live intra-muscular injection (2 to 4
weeks before weaning/housing/sale)

Option 2. (if there is more time before risk period or a broader coverage including bacteria isrequired)
First subcutaneous injection of RSV, Pi3 and Mannhaemia haemolytica dead, 6 to 8
weeks before weaning/housing/sale
Second subcutaneous injection of RSV, Pi3 and Mannhaemia haemolytica dead, 2 to 4weeks before weaning/housing/sale
At the same time as the second injection, a Single IBR live intra-muscular, 2 to 4 weeks before weaning/housing/sale

The procedures in both options must be completed in full and are equally applicable to both spring and autumn born calves

Hurling Hereford

Sligoronan wrote: »

Did anybody register scales yet. I can seem to find how to do so on the ICBF site.

Give ICBF a buzz on (023) 8832883 and they'll advise you as to what to do fairly lively