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White Males Need Not Apply - British Police Ad

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135

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    #62
    Franz Von Peppercorn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,070 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn


    meeeeh wrote: »
    So there is absolutely no problem if by sheer coincidence PNSI would be 100% protestant? Good to know that people would have full trust in the force anyway.

    Historical discrimination isn’t really the same argument. Catholics were banned by law, or custom, and that’s a rectification.

    Similarly the situation in the US is different.


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    #63
    Franz Von Peppercorn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,070 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn


    lbc2019 wrote: »
    How triggered are the incels on boards they need to project perceived injustice from other countries on the much maligned straight white male lolz

    You’ve convinced us all that racial hiring in police forces is a good thing with that brilliant argument.


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    #64
    steddyeddy
    Registered Users Posts: 27,564 ✭✭✭✭steddyeddy


    AlphabetCards wrote: »
    Actually it is not. I thought you were an open minded academic?

    What bit did I get wrong?


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    #65
    lbc2019
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,291 ✭✭✭lbc2019


    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    lbc2019 wrote: »
    How triggered are the incels on boards they need to project perceived injustice from other countries on the much maligned straight white male lolz

    You’ve convinced us all that racial hiring in police forces is a good thing with that brilliant argument.


    I’m not gonna try to convince incels anything - I’m just laughing at their perceived injustice.


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    #66
    Folkstonian
    Closed Accounts Posts: 421 ✭✭Folkstonian


    lbc2019 wrote: »
    How triggered are the incels on boards they need to project perceived injustice from other countries on the much maligned straight white male lolz

    Between this post and your one on the first page, it’s clear that you are the only person who has been properly rattled by this thread.

    Everyone else seems to be participating in robust but reasonable debate, whilst you have lost a hold of yourself.


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    #67
    Eircom_Sucks
    Registered Users Posts: 3,193 ✭✭✭Eircom_Sucks


    splashuum wrote: »
    An interesting job posting from the British police. I can see why this went viral.

    https://www.facebook.com/britishtransportpolice/photos/a.323104971171991/1244843678998111/?type=3

    What ever happened to hiring the best person for the job? :rolleyes:

    Ripped off tommy robinsons post


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    #68
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,592 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    What divides society is this kind of racial huckerism. Race doesn’t exist but state sanctioned racial categorisation does.
    What divides society is the track record of discrimination against black and Asian communities that many UK police forces have demonstrated for a couple of generations. These are small steps to rebalance the scales just slightly, and the only people who get offended are those who are terrified at the idea of any kind of fair representation of people of all races and ethnicities in the police force and elsewhere.

    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    You’re a government employee right? What’s the percentage of non white Irish in your dept?
    Dunno what the numbers are, or if my organisations tracks or reports numbers. I know I've had dealings with colleagues including a black African, a lady who appears to be of Chinese extraction (based on her name and her appearance), a gent of Middle Eastern appearance/name and a few Eastern European guys.


    That kind of diversity isn't represented in senior management, mind you - but hopefully over time.


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    #69
    lbc2019
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,291 ✭✭✭lbc2019


    Folkstonian wrote: »
    lbc2019 wrote: »
    How triggered are the incels on boards they need to project perceived injustice from other countries on the much maligned straight white male lolz

    Between this post and your one on the first page, it’s clear that you are the only person who has been properly rattled by this thread.

    Everyone else seems to be participating in robust but reasonable debate, whilst you have lost a hold of yourself.

    Robust and reasonable debate?

    The buses don’t go by where you live

    This is so far removed from reality


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    #70
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,592 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

    Why would a white woman or Chinese man (etc etc etc) be any better at policing a black area than a white man? Or should we police every ethnic group with its own police force.


    Who said they are better or have to be better? Why would they be any worse?


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    #71
    Franz Von Peppercorn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,070 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn


    lbc2019 wrote: »
    I’m not gonna try to convince incels anything - I’m just laughing at their perceived injustice.

    I’ll tell my wife about my incel status. Cut out the insults. Learn to engage in debate above the age of a five year old


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    #72
    lbc2019
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,291 ✭✭✭lbc2019


    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    lbc2019 wrote: »
    I’m not gonna try to convince incels anything - I’m just laughing at their perceived injustice.

    I’ll tell my wife about my incel status. Cut out the insults. Learn to engage in debate above the age of a five year old

    Sure jan. I won’t take discussion advice from someone who taking AH bs seriously


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    #73
    Franz Von Peppercorn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,070 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    Who said they are better or have to be better? Why would they be any worse?

    Let’s do tests or interviews and see.

    Like in the job I have on a company where in fact Irish people are a minority. Nobody cares because people are there on merit. If a policy of hiring more Irish people to rectify the situation arose, I’d oppose that too.


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    #74
    Franz Von Peppercorn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,070 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »

    Dunno what the numbers are, or if my organisations tracks or reports numbers. I know I've had dealings with colleagues including a black African, a lady who appears to be of Chinese extraction (based on her name and her appearance), a gent of Middle Eastern appearance/name and a few Eastern European guys.


    That kind of diversity isn't represented in senior management, mind you - but hopefully over time.

    The four anecdotal lads without specific roles you met isn’t that convincing.

    I’ve never met an Irish civil servant or (non frontline) government employee who wasn’t white Irish. Country people are over represented too.

    If you think that “sort of diversity” in upper management is a problem though then the civil service should make quotas for civil service exams and for promotion. To me that creates the racial divisions it supposedly aims to heal. That said I can’t see it happening.

    In general companies and government use racial divisions to keep the workers in line while the jobs go to same connected network at the top. The legal system is a good example. RTE is another one.


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    #75
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,592 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    Let’s do tests or interviews and see.

    Like in the job I have on a company where in fact Irish people are a minority. Nobody cares because people are there on merit. If a policy of hiring more Irish people to rectify the situation arose, I’d oppose that too.
    Absolutely - let's do lots of tests and interviews, and let's make sure we get a good mix of people applying for the tests and interviews, and let's make sure the tests and interviews are designed to be fair to everyone to make sure that the end result has a fair chance of reflecting the wider community.


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    #76
    lbc2019
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,291 ✭✭✭lbc2019


    The Irish Civil Service have the Secrecy Act- so you would be forbidden from discussing anything to do with work outside it


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    #77
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,592 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    The four anecdotal lads without specific roles you met isn’t that convincing.

    I’ve never met an Irish civil servant or (non frontline) government employee who wasn’t white Irish. Country people are over represented too.
    Interesting how my first-hand experience is 'anecdotal' but your personal experience (or lack of experience) in meeting a group of over 36,000 people is somehow more valuable?


    There's a fair few culchies around to be sure, and lots of working class Dubs as well. Not too many of the D4 set in my experience.


    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    If you think that “sort of diversity” in upper management is a problem though then the civil service should make quotas for civil service exams and for promotion. To me that creates the racial divisions it supposedly aims to heal. That said I can’t see it happening.
    Quotas are one tool for this, and there are lots of others too - like the kind of advert in the OP to make sure that people are fully briefed on the opportunities available to them. What's the big problem with sharing information to people who might not otherwise pick it up?

    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    In general companies and government use racial divisions to keep the workers in line while the jobs go to same connected network at the top. The legal system is a good example. RTE is another one.


    That's a bit conspiratorial for me, but who knows really. Certainly, positive action measures like those referenced in the OP would be a good first step at addressing these issues.


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    #78
    meeeeh
    Registered Users Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    Historical discrimination isn’t really the same argument. Catholics were banned by law, or custom, and that’s a rectification.

    Similarly the situation in the US is different.
    It's not about discrimination, it's about effective policing. You need staff people trust to cooperate with them or you are getting nowhere. Do you really think white atheist woman will be more successful getting information from local mosque on Islamists than would be a Pakistani origin muslim man?


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    #79
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    All Irish companies are doing it very similar with looking for women to join such as bus driver, train driver etc.

    Shocking stuff to be honest.

    Whoever is suited for the job should be employed.

    For police work we really need the height brought back and to have police that can actually defend and tackle when needed.

    Most I see going around couldn't tackle a 10 year old.


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    #80
    Obvious Desperate Breakfasts
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,474 ✭✭✭Obvious Desperate Breakfasts


    Another thing that worries me about these ads specifying certain ethnicities is that it might to lead to people of that ethnicity in other companies being treated with suspicion that they weren’t the best person interviewed, even if they were the very best.


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    #81
    HappyAsLarE
    Closed Accounts Posts: 771 ✭✭✭HappyAsLarE


    The irony - while trying to be uber progressive they have in fact discrimanated.


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    #82
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,592 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    punisher5112 wrote: »
    All Irish companies are doing it very similar with looking for women to join such as bus driver, train driver etc.

    Shocking stuff to be honest.

    Whoever is suited for the job should be employed.
    Yes indeed - whoever is best suited should be employed.


    And if large groups of 'best suited' people don't engage in the recruitment process for cultural or social reasons, some positive action measures to encourage engagement can bring large numbers of extra candidates in, which is generally a good thing for an employer, right?

    punisher5112 wrote: »
    For police work we really need the height brought back and to have police that can actually defend and tackle when needed.

    Most I see going around couldn't tackle a 10 year old.


    You'd be surprised what a little training and a baton can do.

    Is this the kind of person you'd like to keep out?

    https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=2188853184664693&id=1434913843391968&__xts__%5B0%5D=68.ARA1OJmrswQMqjkZbRmd9CQtvgKdOqM0JmyTDJ4jAqSVamnQOHm4BuluyZMBW2g6xxtwoVUPWB_imFZ_L_1bUxxkVyv_VNHBaYREWJ4WTwd93iQXKIg6LIsO85q7yDRCiUG4yPcJgyiNIWYNKVQkYXxWPOgZsztwJkvNegATciDVVMJErUKu3iTgzHVOSwBRDtISMSbjnapT5jVyHYQHhOXrrxfTVzZLBBy7ksR8-jyjsrIZ4LmGMlP_OqLwDjFFts7aoa2cO5iqCdwFtVehWZwq8A0CiR-woicOfOyqs4QWkhIUMyIxW1hmdYa28TZpSe80gCwESjLjFarezjei43cTl001i88nsu5wvG792pr0dQ&__tn__=C-R


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    #83
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,592 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »
    Another thing that worries me about these ads specifying certain ethnicities is that it might to lead to people of that ethnicity in other companies being treated with suspicion that they weren’t the best person interviewed, even if they were the very best.
    Not everyone is as petty and small-minded as some posters on this thread have demonstrated.

    HappyAsLarE wrote: »
    The irony - while trying to be uber progressive they have in fact discrimanated.
    In fact, they haven't discriminated - positive action is well established in law. Achieving equal outcomes can mean treating different people differently.

    https://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1600/1*AAEFH6zoWt5kv4ppHLReqw.png


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    #84
    Robert ninja
    Registered Users Posts: 3,878 ✭✭✭Robert ninja


    meeeeh wrote: »
    It's not about discrimination, it's about effective policing. You need staff people trust to cooperate with them or you are getting nowhere. Do you really think white atheist woman will be more successful getting information from local mosque on Islamists than would be a Pakistani origin muslim man?

    The problem is the civilian in that scenario. We don't need discriminatory diversity hiring quotas to handle discriminating religious nuts. It's disturbing that people entertain the idea that a population not cooperating with law enforcement because they're not muslim/brown/whatever enough is solved with race/religion-matching.

    Also the idea that heavy muslim populated areas being policed by more muslims would somehow lead to peaceful outcomes is bloody bonkers. It would be one of the most dangerous situations; think Rotherham to but to the Nth degree.


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    #85
    fxotoole
    Registered Users Posts: 1,661 ✭✭✭fxotoole


    Airyfairy12 wrote: »
    I dont see the problem with it, if the majority of their employees are white men then surely that creates a bias. The add is not suggesting that they dont want white men in the police force, theyre encouraging different types of people to join. Surely that's a positive thing?

    ^
    This.

    People are just looking for things that aren’t there that they can be offended by


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    #86
    Tell me how
    Registered Users Posts: 21,521 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    splashuum wrote: »
    An interesting job posting from the British police. I can see why this went viral.

    https://www.facebook.com/britishtransportpolice/photos/a.323104971171991/1244843678998111/?type=3

    What ever happened to hiring the best person for the job? :rolleyes:

    You do know this is an ad trying to attract diverse applicants to considering applying for the role.
    It does not say that anyone will be excluded from applying.


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    #87
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,592 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Robert ninja wrote: »
    The problem is the civilian in that scenario. We don't need discriminatory diversity hiring quotas to handle discriminating religious nuts. It's disturbing that people entertain the idea that a population not cooperating with law enforcement because they're not muslim/brown/whatever enough is solved with race/religion-matching.

    Also the idea that heavy muslim populated areas being policed by more muslims would somehow lead to peaceful outcomes is bloody bonkers. It would be one of the most dangerous situations; think Rotherham to but to the Nth degree.
    Are you aware of the huge disconnect in British policing of black and Asian communities for the past couple of generations?


    And what makes you think that muslim police would be less effective?


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    #88
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    The minorities (afro caribbean, Muslim etc) are over-represented in prison populations there, hence they need more bruv's from these communities to address that major issue.


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    #89
    Hoboo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,525 ✭✭✭Hoboo


    Folkstonian wrote: »
    Why does the skin colour of a police officer matter?

    Is it a requirement for some people that they are dealt with by a black or Asian (or indeed white) police officer if they have been burgled or assaulted?

    If so, should we placate people like that or should they be told to get a grip?

    No mention of skin colour, they require people from different ethnic backgrounds, and yes, for police safety and cooperation I'd imagine its very necessary. Otherwise they wouldn't do it. Try telling a few london yardies to get a grip and deal with a white policeman.


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    #90
    RWCNT
    Registered Users Posts: 1,430 ✭✭✭RWCNT


    splashuum wrote: »
    An interesting job posting from the British police. I can see why this went viral.

    https://www.facebook.com/britishtransportpolice/photos/a.323104971171991/1244843678998111/?type=3

    What ever happened to hiring the best person for the job? :rolleyes:

    How did I know before even clicking the link that "White Men Need Not Apply" was your own creative licence


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    #91
    OldMrBrennan83
    Closed Accounts Posts: 26,658 ✭✭✭✭OldMrBrennan83


    RWCNT wrote: »
    How did I know before even clicking the link that "White Men Need Not Apply" was your own creative licence

    Amounts to the exact same thing.


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