National Hurling League 2019 Discussion

Bonniedog

OldMrBrennan83 wrote: »

Could they not have made it a top division and a second tier? And then just rename 2A as 3, 2B as 4, etc. Such a bloody faff.

Ah now!

Hurling would die so it would if certain counties were relegated to a Division Two. So division two was called in a stroke of Orwellian inspiration: 1B

OldMrBrennan83

And not even 1B any more. Hurling does need a good strong dose of 'if you're relegated then you should have played better'. Same as all these teams in football moaning about a tier 2 - stop being shít then.

Bonniedog

Indeed. No-one gave a flying fart when it was Laois, Dublin, Westmeath, Antrim up and down like a whoor's drawers.

But god forbid that one of God's Elect pay the price for not being as good as they are in their own minds.

And no, I am not talking about Kilkenny who have never once engaged in any special pleading - not that they need to - and who have stuck up for the little guys when they were shafted by the committee men in the past.

Davys Fits

Bonniedog wrote: »

Indeed. No-one gave a flying fart when it was Laois, Dublin, Westmeath, Antrim up and down like a whoor's drawers.

But god forbid that one of God's Elect pay the price for not being as good as they are in their own minds.

And no, I am not talking about Kilkenny who have never once engaged in any special pleading - not that they need to - and who have stuck up for the little guys when they were shafted by the committee men in the past.

Offaly were a so called 'elite' team not too long ago and their downfall continues without interference. Im not sure who or what you are referring to? If Galway or Waterford ended up fighting for their lives in div1b there would be something seriously wrong and I dont expect it would happen in one season either. Thats just fact not elitist.

Bonniedog

Cork, Wexford and Limerick all kicked up over their being relegated since 2006. Which is why they invented 1A and 1B. It's really only a psychological thing and the play offs mean that there is little difference between the games for the top ten teams in 1A and B. Only issue ever was relegation from B and that has involved more or less the same teams every year since 1B was set up.


None of the top ten teams are in danger of being relegated to what is in reality the third division. It was being relegated from the old division one (now 1A!) that offended the above. That hasn't mattered since new structure and won't matter in one next year.

On the other hand, Westmeath were thrown out of the Leinster SHC and denied league promotion at a time when they were improving. And there was an attempt to stop Dublin being promoted in 2006 after winning ten games in a row to win division II.


The original plan for next year by the way was no promotion from 2A. That seems to have been changed. Which is a good thing.

PTH2009

Be some laugh if they made the league open draw with teams from 1A-3B

Champions league style

of the many potential ties
Limerick vs Cavan
Kilkenny vs Sligo
London vs Clare
Waterford vs Louth
Tipp vs Leitrim
Galway vs Wicklow
Wexford vs Tyrone
Cork vs Monaghan

dastardly00

PTH2009 wrote: »

Be some laugh if they made the league open draw with teams from 1A-3B

Champions league style

of the many potential ties
Limerick vs Cavan
Kilkenny vs Sligo
London vs Clare
Waterford vs Louth
Tipp vs Leitrim
Galway vs Wicklow
Wexford vs Tyrone
Cork vs Monaghan

We'd get to visit some GAA grounds that we've never been to so that would be a positive

Bonniedog

Interesting results today.

Limerick still on top with four teams on 4 points and Tipp languishing at bottom but could still make the play offs if they beat Cork.

In 1B, Dublin, Galway and Waterford all assured of play off place with fourth place or relegation game for Laois or Carlow down to last. Offaly already in relegation spot.


Dublin will beat Laois so Carlow need to beat Offaly which they should and avoid relegation play off and get to quarters which would be a nice achievement for them apart from guaranteeing safety.

Stevecw

Bonniedog wrote: »

Interesting results today.

Limerick still on top with four teams on 4 points and Tipp languishing at bottom but could still make the play offs if they beat Cork.

In 1B, Dublin, Galway and Waterford all assured of play off place with fourth place or relegation game for Laois or Carlow down to last. Offaly already in relegation spot.


Dublin will beat Laois so Carlow need to beat Offaly which they should and avoid relegation play off and get to quarters which would be a nice achievement for them apart from guaranteeing safety.

That last min free today was huge for Carlow, a draw keeps it in our hands. Beat Offaly next week and we stay up in 1B which would be amazing! Gets us to a qf too, v winners of 1A I see! Ok well, that is something hopefully we have to worry about next week and not be thinking about playing Offaly again in a relegation final. After drawing with Galway that wud be a big let down.

Bonniedog

Staying up will be the big achievement for Carlow. A quarter final very likely against AI champions Limerick is a bonus of some sort!

When Dublin were in similar situation it was the donkey work done to stay up and/or be promoted that counted towards progress. Shipped some horrific hidings on the way against better opposition so attitude towards those games needs to be good; not seeing them as massive setbacks but part of the learning curve.

PTH2009

If 2 teams end up on the same points after 2morrows game then H2H will count towards final placing

Score difference will decide placings if 3 or more teams end up on the same points

So many different scenarios can happen in 1A with it wide open. Limerick are deff through too the QFs. Any of the other 5 can make the Quarters

1B- A win for Dublin with a Galway loss/draw will give them top spot as they have the h2h over Wateford. A Galway win vs Waterford will give them top spot no matter what Dublins result is. For Wateford too get top spot (Laois beat/draw with Dublin coupled with a Waterford win over Galway) seens unlikely. A carlow win would be enough too get them 4th spot but a Laois victory /draw would give Laois the 4th spot. Offaly can't go through

2019 QFs
1st 1A vs 4th 1B
2nd 1A vs 3rd 1B
3rd 1A vs 2nd 1B
4th 1A vs 1st 1B

The team who had the less home games in the group stage will get home advantage. Coin toss for home advantage if both teams had he same amount of home games

1A- 5th vs 6th in a no point relegation game
1B- 5th vs Offaly with the losers being relagated too 2A for 2020

2020 divison 1 league groups

Group A
1st placed team in 1A 2019
4th placed team in 1A 2019
Winner of 1A 5th/6th playoff 2019
2nd placed team in 1B 2019
3rd placed team in 1B 2019
div 2A winner

Group B
2nd placed team in 1A 2019
3rd placed team in 1A 2019
Loser of the 1A 5th/6th playoff 2019.
1st placed team in 1B 2019
4th placed team in 1B 2019
Winner of the 1B relegation playoff 2019 (5th vs 6th)

OldMrBrennan83

That's a great win for Wicklow up in Derry. Be hard to repeat it again next week but much better campaign that I thought would have happened with the change in management.

PTH2009

The gods of weather acting the prick again and postponing a load of important 1A and 1B games today
1A- Wexford vs Kilkenny and Cork vs Tipp were postponed
1B- Waterford vs Galway
prob be played next weekend 9th/10th March

more than likely meaning everything will be pushed back a week now with the QFs now being the weekend of 16th/17th March with the semis being on 23th/24th March with final being 30th/31st March. Clashing with the football final

Clare vs Limerick in 1A finished a draw meaning Limerick Top 1A and will face Laois in the QFs with Clare not knowing there fate til the other games are played. Carlow vs Offaly in the 1B relagation playoff

Dublin beat Laois 0-13-0-11 in 1B but wont knw there finishing spot til the Waterford vs Galway game is played but knw Waterford cant top the divison as they have the h2h. Galway will go top if they beat Waterford putting Dublin in 2nd and Waterford 3rd

2020 Divison 1
Group A
1 Limerick
2 4th 1A 2019
3 Winner of the 1A Relagation playoff
4 Dublin/Galway or Waterford
5 Dublin/Galway or Waterford
6 Westmeath or Kerry

Group B
1 2nd 1A 2019
2 3rd 1A 2019
3 Loser of the 1A Relagation playoff
4 Dublin or Galway
5 Laois
6 Offaly or Carlow

Bonniedog

Good win by Offaly. Means they play Carlow again in the play off with the boost of that behind them.

Pity the other games were postponed as league will finish in a bit of a mess with final on first weekend in April.

PTH2009

Bonniedog wrote: »

Good win by Offaly. Means they play Carlow again in the play off with the boost of that behind them.

Pity the other games were postponed as league will finish in a bit of a mess with final on first weekend in April.

Sat 30th March- Football Div 3 and Div 4 finals
Sun 31st March- Football Div 2 and Div 1 Finals

they could actually play the hurling final on Sat 30th March as not many other than supporters of the Div 3/4 finalists will care really about the games. They could easily fix it for TV by putting some online etc

imagine if the hurling final got moved too Croke Park for the 31st March making it a triple header and a full house (div 2 Football on 12pm, Hurling 2pm and football 4pm)

RMAOK

PTH2009 wrote: »

Sat 30th March- Football Div 3 and Div 4 finals
Sun 31st March- Football Div 2 and Div 1 Finals

they could actually play the hurling final on Sat 30th March as not many other than supporters of the Div 3/4 finalists will care really about the games. They could easily fix it for TV by putting some online etc

imagine if the hurling final got moved too Croke Park for the 31st March making it a triple header and a full house (div 2 Football on 12pm, Hurling 2pm and football 4pm)

Couldn't see the hurling and football league finals on the one day at croke Park (especially if the dubs are in the football) as it would affect attendance imo.

More likely that the hurling final will be in thurles

zetecescort

not sure about this year but the camogie league final has been played before the hurling in recent years too

OldMrBrennan83

zetecescort wrote: »

not sure about this year but the camogie league final has been played before the hurling in recent years too

And could you imagine if they turned around and didn't then? There'd be a meltdown.

arctictree

PTH2009 wrote: »

The gods of weather acting the prick again and postponing a load of important 1A and 1B games today
1A- Wexford vs Kilkenny and Cork vs Tipp were postponed
1B- Waterford vs Galway
prob be played next weekend 9th/10th March

more than likely meaning everything will be pushed back a week now with the QFs now being the weekend of 16th/17th March with the semis being on 23th/24th March with final being 30th/31st March. Clashing with the football final

Clare vs Limerick in 1A finished a draw meaning Limerick Top 1A and will face Laois in the QFs with Clare not knowing there fate til the other games are played. Carlow vs Offaly in the 1B relagation playoff

Dublin beat Laois 0-13-0-11 in 1B but wont knw there finishing spot til the Waterford vs Galway game is played but knw Waterford cant top the divison as they have the h2h. Galway will go top if they beat Waterford putting Dublin in 2nd and Waterford 3rd

2020 Divison 1
Group A
1 Limerick
2 4th 1A 2019
3 Winner of the 1A Relagation playoff
4 Dublin/Galway or Waterford
5 Dublin/Galway or Waterford
6 Westmeath or Kerry

Group B
1 2nd 1A 2019
2 3rd 1A 2019
3 Loser of the 1A Relagation playoff
4 Dublin or Galway
5 Laois
6 Offaly or Carlow

Anyone know if the restructure also applies to division 2?

jr86

Judging by early indications matches could be in serious bother for the weekend again with lots of rain promised

Club games in April could well be in jeopardy for some counties, if that were the case. Which would be a disaster in some counties

Expecting the league to run smoothly from january to the 31st of March is wishful thinking of the highest order, given the time of year

I know the system is changing but playing Quarter Finals and drawing it out as much as possible is absolutely daft

Bonniedog

In fairness, how many counties actually used April for club games last year?


My recollection is that the counties still involved in latter stages of the hurling and football leagues were among those who did!


Which is perhaps a clue to why certain others are languishing behind at both club and county.


Just a thought !

Mehapoy

jr86 wrote: »

Judging by early indications matches could be in serious bother for the weekend again with lots of rain promised

Club games in April could well be in jeopardy for some counties, if that were the case. Which would be a disaster in some counties

Expecting the league to run smoothly from january to the 31st of March is wishful thinking of the highest order, given the time of year

I know the system is changing but playing Quarter Finals and drawing it out as much as possible is absolutely daft

I think they may need to bite the bullet and play a couple of matches in october/november when the weather is often quite good, then start again in feb, leave Jan as a free month except for fitzgibbon and drop the quarter finals

jr86

Mehapoy wrote: »

I think they may need to bite the bullet and play a couple of matches in october/november when the weather is often quite good, then start again in feb, leave Jan as a free month except for fitzgibbon and drop the quarter finals

They used to play league in October/November up until around 2001/2002 I think. It used to be only a few weeks after the All Ireland Final

I suppose its not possible anymore with club unfortunately.

You're right though, and pitches are often in complete sh1te January, February and March. From talking to several club players, plenty of clubs only had their first outdoor run-out in the first round of the league last weekend. They had to train indoors until that as the pitches were in no state. This is an annual occurrence now.

tipp_tipp_tipp

Looks like it will be a long night for Laois, total hurling from Limerick so far. The goal was sublime!

RMAOK

tipp_tipp_tipp wrote: »

Looks like it will be a long night for Laois, total hurling from Limerick so far. The goal was sublime!

It's shaping up to be a bit of a turkey shoot tbh.

If limerick keep this up, they'll win by 20 points.

Laois can't afford to have the wides they are having atm

tipp_tipp_tipp

They've settled into it better now. Working the ball nicely at times. Endless wides costing them as you mentioned.

conor05

Laois have some good hurlers and if they converted a few more chances they would be a lot closer to Limerick.

You can see Eddie Brennan has them trying to find a man with a hand pass on the overlap instead of hitting the ball for the sake of clearing it.

tipp_tipp_tipp

Think it's fair to say Laois were robbed by the ref!

Bonniedog

I'd imagine TG4 were kicking themselves that the quarter final they got was this one.

Laois are a dogged enough team with some handy hurlers and well enough organised, but light years away from the likes of Limerick who missed an horrendous amount of scoreable chances and didn't hardly bother with looking for goals.

Hopefully, next weekend's games are better.

Mantis Toboggan

Laois still need lots of improving and more underage development before they can dine at the top table.