If your car broke down on the motorway...

SweetCaliber

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

In 17 minutes at 5 in the morning I'm sure there was plenty off chances to get out and get to the barrier.

Sitting in a stationary car in the middle of the motorway in the rain was about the worst option to take.

Anyone that thinks its safer to sit in their car in torrential rain in the dark in a live lane on the m50 is out of their minds, as proven in this thread.

endacl

I was in a situation several year ago on the m50 in heavy traffic. All sorts of dashboard lights came on and the car lost power. Would rev ok, but didn’t get as far as the wheels. I was in the overtaking lane at the time, heading north just after Dundrum. I flicked the indicator on, intending to move left towards the shoulder, and as I gradually slowed, the reaction of drivers behind was to undertake at speed, to avoid slowing. It was a truck driver who copped what was going on and let me firstly into the middle lane, and then shadowed me into the driving lane. Without that particular truck driver (a Stobart). I’d have been in exactly the same position. Stuck in lane 3 with nowhere to go.

peasant

Btw

If your car engine ever conks out in a really bad spot and you need to move it a few meters to safety, you can get going on the starter motor alone.

Leave it in gear, turn the starter on and immediately press the clutch (letting go of the starter key). This should give you a little push...rinse and repeat until out of danger.
You could also try to keep the starter turning and modulate the clutch, that should also move you a bit.

Obviously not great for the components involved...but better than getting crushed by a 40 ton truck

cruizer101

5am means quiet enough so should be gaps but that also means cars going by faster and so more dangerous.
The right thing to do is to get off the road behind the barrier but I can understand someone being nervous about getting out of car on motorway and running across two lanes, especially if visibility isn't great.
I wouldn't judge as no-one here knows the exact circumstances of the situation.
Just a lesson to all to try get off the motorway if you breakdown, and in heavy rain slow down.

ED E

Orange, flashing lights. Hard Shoulder.





And again




And again






Inattentive drivers are everywhere (RSA estimate at any one time 2-6% of motorists are using their phone).
Get Out.
Stay Out.
Walk back towards traffic behind the barrier (so flying debris doesn't flay you)

Guy:Incognito

Cartroubles wrote: »

Am I missing something here? The driver said he wasn't paying attention and failed to avoid the car where other drivers succeeded. He was in the wrong completely. Pay attention when driving, simple.

But no way I'd stay in the car. Drive on the m50 daily, the standard of driving is shocking.

Where did the driver say that? He said he didn't see the hazards .

The judge said at the bottom of the article that people can be inattentive at times and that he has himself.

Wishbone Ash

whomitconcerns wrote: »

They weren't going to help her in the middle of the M50. Gardai first.. Then leave as soon as safe to do so.. Then worry about insurance and break down. None of the latter any use if your dead. As unfortunately happened here.

You're preaching to the converted. I was merely suggesting what she may have been trying to do.

CJhaughey

On UK motorways the life expectancy of someone stopped in the hard shoulder not the middle of the motorway is 15-20 minutes.
I don't care if its snowing or sleeting if you break down you get out of the car safely and move to the roadside as soon as you can.
Sitting in a broken down car on a motorway at any time is only starting the clock ticking before something hits you.

Toots

cruizer101 wrote: »

5am means quiet enough so should be gaps but that also means cars going by faster and so more dangerous.
The right thing to do is to get off the road behind the barrier but I can understand someone being nervous about getting out of car on motorway and running across two lanes, especially if visibility isn't great.
I wouldn't judge as no-one here knows the exact circumstances of the situation.
Just a lesson to all to try get off the motorway if you breakdown, and in heavy rain slow down.

The thing is it’s not really publicised that it’s so dangerous to stay in the vehicle, and I could totally understand someone feeling that they’d be better protected by their car, as opposed to running across the motorway.

Out of interest, if you break down in the far right lane, are you supposed to go behind the crash barrier in the median, or go across the lanes to the one behind the hard shoulder?

punisher5112

Toots wrote: »

The thing is it’s not really publicised that it’s so dangerous to stay in the vehicle, and I could totally understand someone feeling that they’d be better protected by their car, as opposed to running across the motorway.

Out of interest, if you break down in the far right lane, are you supposed to go behind the crash barrier in the median, or go across the lanes to the one behind the hard shoulder?

Safest option would be centre unless you have a good break in traffic.

Stay away from the car as in don't be past it or right beside be behind and back a bit so as not to be hit with anything if a crash occurred.

CJhaughey

Toots wrote: »

The thing is it’s not really publicised that it’s so dangerous to stay in the vehicle, and I could totally understand someone feeling that they’d be better protected by their car, as opposed to running across the motorway.

Out of interest, if you break down in the far right lane, are you supposed to go behind the crash barrier in the median, or go across the lanes to the one behind the hard shoulder?

If it was just me in the car I would go over on to the median strip if it was any way busy because my time exposed to danger is less than crossing three lanes.
at 5am I would see if the traffic was liight enough to cross to the hard shoulder and hop the barrier and climb up the bank.
This should be taught in driving classes and reinforced by the RSA, people really don't understand the danger they are in stopped on a motorway or even a busy dual carriageway, I've seen families stopped on the hard shoulder for a kid to pee.

Atlantic Dawn

Once the ignition is off all the safety systems will also be dead, no airbags or seatbelt pre tensioners will work if the car is crashed in to.

blackbox

Toots wrote: »

The thing is it’s not really publicised that it’s so dangerous to stay in the vehicle, and I could totally understand someone feeling that they’d be better protected by their car, as opposed to running across the motorway.

The RSA recently had a TV campaign exactly publicising that.

Nevertheless, it is the responsibility of all drivers not to crash into anything.

Cartroubles

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Where did the driver say that? He said he didn't see the hazards .

The judge said at the bottom of the article that people can be inattentive at times and that he has himself.

He obviously didn't see them due to lack of paying attention, unless you're implying the rain was so heavy that it blocked them out? If visibility was that poor he should have drastically reduced his speed.

People can be inattentive, unfortunately this time it cost a life. Some form of punishment needs to be given. Compared with a life, his sentence isn't so bad. Very bad luck for him though.

Guy:Incognito

blackbox wrote: »

The RSA recently had a TV campaign exactly publicising that.

Nevertheless, it is the responsibility of all drivers not to crash into anything.

They had a long running one about roundabouts too but I'm seeing more and more people indicating right on roundabouts ( including in the left lane on roads with 2 lanes ) when going straight at them.

Some people just dont want to be educated.......

lawred2

redcup342 wrote: »

Very sad, but you are right, not much the Truck driver(s) could do about it, death of the Woman would have been more than enough punishment.

Don't know if i'd really handle getting out of the car in the pissing rain on the M50 either tbh.

But society needs someone to blame so in this case it's the Truck Driver

But I would be ringing the Gardai not the Insurance company.

Better wet than dead

lawred2

redcup342 wrote: »

Yeh but at least you can get out and over the barrier, if you are in the overtaking lane and d!cks are undertaking you as they do on the M50 then it's quite difficult to pull into the hard should if you are losing power.

Edit:

Imagine running across from the overtaking lane (3 lanes) in the p1ssing rain

Jump the central reservation

Toots

CJhaughey wrote: »

If it was just me in the car I would go over on to the median strip if it was any way busy because my time exposed to danger is less than crossing three lanes.
at 5am I would see if the traffic was liight enough to cross to the hard shoulder and hop the barrier and climb up the bank.
This should be taught in driving classes and reinforced by the RSA, people really don't understand the danger they are in stopped on a motorway or even a busy dual carriageway, I've seen families stopped on the hard shoulder for a kid to pee.

My sister in law stopped on the hard shoulder to feed her baby. I sh1t you not. She couldn’t understand why her husband lost the plot at her when she told him. My nightmare is breaking down on a motorway with the kids in the car and having to get them all out quickly and behind the barrier.

Voodoomelon

I'd wager 90%+ of people would sit in their car stuck in a lane or on the hard shoulder. Utterly foolish. I understand not everyone is fully mobile/some may have babies/small kids etc. But standing in rain, hail or snow is 1000% times better than being mashed. Stand on the hard shoulder behind the barrier and wait for assistance, it's usually never more than a few minutes away.

Auguste Comte

If I remember correctly there was also a woman killed after stopping on the m8 to take a phone call, truck involved. Another on the M1 involved 2 trucks.

Tragedy for every one involved.

Probably something that needs to be part of learner drivers' syllabus. I learned in detail how to deal with horses, horse drawn carts, cars with no indicators, etc back in the day. Fat lot of use that was to me! Nothing about motorway breakdowns though. In fact I never had to prove I could safely drive on a motorway to get my license, but that's a whole 'nother subject.

It might seem logical that a stalled car in the middle of the motorway is not the place to be. If you haven't been formally educated on the dangers, this may or may not occur to you. Particularly on a cold, rainy morning at 5AM when you're maybe not dressed for the weather, and don't have a plan for escaping the hard shoulder (can't call a taxi to pick you up on a motorway, you might worry that it's not serious enough to call the gardai for, there's an emergency hotline somewhere around here - but where?).

Wishbone Ash

CJhaughey wrote: »

On UK motorways the life expectancy of someone stopped in the hard shoulder not the middle of the motorway is 15-20 minutes....

That type of statistic is trotted out regularly (with various minutes) but it is a bit misleading as it is the average time until someone is struck over all hard the shoulders of all motorways in the UK - not the chances of any individual motorist getting struck on a single motorway. (One of the motoring programmes did a piece on it a few years ago).

Auguste Comte

In the UK if you break down on the motorway and can't arrange to have your car removed in a timely manner then the police will have it towed for you at your expense.

I've seen cars left broken down on the side of the motorway here for days with a few cones behind them before they are removed.

CrankyHaus

Auguste Comte wrote: »

In the UK if you break down on the motorway and can't arrange to have your car removed in a timely manner then the police will have it towed for you at your expense.

I've seen cars left broken down on the side of the motorway here for days with a few cones behind them before they are removed.

I'm sure the Gardaí or the M50 operating company will arrange to do that here if you're stuck in a driving lane. The hazard that forms is enormous and has to be cleared ASAP. If she only alerted her insurance company that was a serious error.



Poor woman. Sadly you cannot depend on drivers to pay attention and slow down if the conditions make it difficult to see what's right in front of them. You don't just blindly plough on on the basis that a broken down car (or fallen debris, or any hazard) shouldn't be there. The truck driver is held to the standard of a professional driver, which he failed to meet and someone died as a result. I sympathise with him enormously but those are the facts.



The M50 in the early morning tends to have high volumes of very high speed traffic. In the dark and the rain peering back at the oncoming headlights it would be extremely difficult for that woman to make out the exact path, speed and position of vehicles approaching from behind and see when it was safe to make a break (in fact it may never have been, we weren't there).

tcawley29

Has anyone even considered the fact that the car battery may have actually died and the hazard lights turned off as a result.

Extremely harsh on the truck driver as he will now have to live with this for the rest of his life

corks finest

grahambo wrote: »

Read this story:
https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/suspended-sentence-for-truck-driver-who-caused-motorists-death-in-m50-accident-898455.html

Basically what happened was a persons car broke down on the M50 at 5am on a Wednesday morning.
The Car broke down on one of the lanes and the driver didn't make it to the hard shoulder.
The person stayed in their car for approximately 17 minutes attempting to contact their insurance company.
The hazard lights were turned on but there was torrential rain that morning.
Other cars avoided the broken down car.
A truck then hit the car, then another truck hit it. The occupant was died in hospital a few days later.
The Truck driver of the first truck was sentenced today for dangerous driving.
1 Year suspended sentence
Licence suspended for 4 years

If it were me, and it was 5am on the Motorway, I'd have gotten out of the car when a gap appeared an made my way either to the centre divide or the hard shoulder/embankment as soon as the gap appeared.
There is no way I'd have stayed in the car.

I think the licence suspended for the truck driver is harsh, it's their livelihood that's been taken away and they have no previous convictions and have shown remorse for what happened.
I think it was very stupid of the person to stay in the Car on a Motorway at that time of the day given the poor visibility.

Would you get out of or stay in the car?

Out

Dial Hard

I once saw a guy standing in front of his broken down car in the middle lane of the M50 in the pitch dark. Absolute deathwish.

Samuel T. Cogley

McCrack wrote: »

It is extremely dangerous to be stationary on a motorway and also stopped in the hard shoulder - I see it regularly - people pulled over the hard shoulder to take/make phone calls etc - they dont realise the danger they are putting themselves in at all -

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/circuit-court/suspended-sentence-for-truck-driver-who-caused-the-death-of-young-mother-1.3496298

I see this without fail on the M1 in both directions. Clowns don't even have hazards on in most cases just one indicator on.

Samuel T. Cogley

I assume you're in the wrong if you enter a near side lane and a collision happens even if you're being undertaken, still I have to say I'd risk it rather than get stuck in a live bloody lane. Had an absolute phobia of it happening in the bloody Fiat I had that just seemed to go hay wire.

Wishbone Ash

tcawley29 wrote: »

Has anyone even considered the fact that the car battery may have actually died and the hazard lights turned off as a result....

Eh, no - because the evidence presented said that other motorists saw the flashing hazard lights and took evasive action.