John Delaney at the FAI Thread - (Mod Notes in OP)

givyjoe

fullstop wrote: »

Ok I’ll bite, seeing as you keep making this point and it looks like most people have you on ignore...surprisingly.

You posted the below earlier in the thread

“Unfortunately our government is the stingiest government in the entire EU when it comes to sports investment. But no one talks about that. They just blame the FAI for everything and don’t see the bigger picture.”

When asked to back this up you posted a link proving that our government were in fact the complete opposite, and are one of the highest investors in sport per capita in Europe. Why, then, do you inisist on trying to blame the government instead of the leech that is John Delaney bleeding Irish football dry?

Why .. ? hand, bites, feed him.

howiya

Irishmale0399 wrote: »

What does Peak 6 wealth have to do with thr FAI breaking contracts or paying compensation, if they wanted they could buy the LOI and every club in it?? Based on that logic then Peak6 being billionares, they should be paying money to junior clubs around Ireland.....or finacing the youth set up Ireland wide as punishment for being clever business men and having more than the rest. A few years back that would border on communist thinking...;)

.

How on earth do you get to the suggestion that peak6 should be paying money to junior clubs?

The FAI has a fixed budget. If they have to pay compensation to Dundalk it has to come from within that budget. I'd rather they spent it elsewhere. Boosting participation, stuff like that.

Peak6 can spend their own money however they like

D14Rugby

howiya wrote: »

How on earth do you get to the suggestion that peak6 should be paying money to junior clubs?

The FAI has a fixed budget. If they have to pay compensation to Dundalk it has to come from within that budget. I'd rather they spent it elsewhere. Boosting participation, stuff like that.

Peak6 can spend their own money however they like

The FAI maintain their strength by selectively funding grassroots football, if there's less to fund that then their strength diminishs, and when it emerges that they chose to pay the select few on extortionate wages their full wages while cutting grassroots funding that will hurt them more, can you not see this or do you not want to?

howiya

Necro wrote: »

Here's the sad thing in all of this.

Sports Ireland could take the nuclear option and cut all funding to the FAI, but it would be the grassroots that suffer, not the board.

Given the level of investment from public funds in proportion to the FAI's yearly 50 million turnover, unfortunately they are slightly limited here in terms of what they can do.

I can imagine the FAI suits are basically laughing at this public outrage from their ivory tower, knowing full well that SI won't do that as they can just plead the pauper then and stop funding local clubs as a result, with no knock on effect to their salaries or anything tangible.

Kind of explains the FAI defenders attitude on here as well, they know well there isn't anything they can do.

Truthfully, unless the fans simply stop attending games, boycott all FAI sponsors products and have a detrimental impact on their income streams then no true change will ever happen.

Frustrates the hell out of me tbh. The entire board are clearly not fit for purpose not just based off this 100k that they are doing cartwheels over trying to avoid explaining, but their entire approach to the game here in Ireland. But as public funding is so low (and that's another issue), there isn't enough accountability to rout the whole lot of them and enact a lasting change.

Can SI bypass the FAI and fund local football directly to the same amount? I don't know if it's possible but it might loosen the grip on power in abbotstown

howiya

D14Rugby wrote: »

So your logic is Delaney would get the money from the wrong place so he's right not to pay at all? Thats some serious mental gymnastics there

No the logic is that he's out to get the best deal for the FAI on behalf of stakeholders in Irish football. Dundalk on the other hand are out to get the best deal for themselves.

Did he or did he not get a good deal in this instance?

howiya

D14Rugby wrote: »

The FAI maintain their strength by selectively funding grassroots football, if there's less to fund that then their strength diminishs, and when it emerges that they chose to pay the select few on extortionate wages their full wages while cutting grassroots funding that will hurt them more, can you not see this or do you not want to?

Their strength doesn't diminish. The same popularity contests still go on. The only thing that diminishes is the amount of money these people sucking up to Delaney are fighting over.

Necro

howiya wrote: »

Can SI bypass the FAI and fund local football directly to the same amount? I don't know if it's possible but it might loosen the grip on power in abbotstown

Unlikely tbh. From my (very basic) knowledge of how this sort of funding is given to grassroots - coming from a GAA background here, but I understand the process is somewhat similar - it works as such:

Local club needs financial assistance to build amenities such as a clubhouse or changing rooms.

They need to get it signed off on at local level (the governing body who manages their league) and then at national level as well. (This is very basic, it's actually much more complex)

SI pay the FAI this money and then they determine who receives the funding.

I'd imagine that in order for local clubs to apply directly to SI that they'd need to circumvent or legislate existing rules that are in place in relation to the awarding of this funding.

I was listening to Newstalk there and the comparison was made to boxing, which is much more highly state funded than the FAI, and as such SI would have much more control to crack the whip there.

In terms of it only being 2.7million they provide per annum, it's peanuts in comparison to the FAI's annual turnover, but also very important funding for the local clubs.

I don't know exactly how it's distributed (never been involved in a local soccer club) but there's a lot of I's and T's to be dotted and crossed, I don't think it's possible tbh.

D14Rugby

howiya wrote: »

No the logic is that he's out to get the best deal for the FAI on behalf of stakeholders in Irish football. Dundalk on the other hand are out to get the best deal for themselves.

Did he or did he not get a good deal in this instance?

If you count breaking contract law as a good deal then yeah, similar to a bank robber getting a good deal.

howiya wrote: »

Their strength doesn't diminish. The same popularity contests still go on. The only thing that diminishes is the amount of money these people sucking up to Delaney are fighting over.

You contradict yourself here. The money is the power, less money going around less money.

Corholio

howiya wrote: »

How on earth do you get to the suggestion that peak6 should be paying money to junior clubs?

The FAI has a fixed budget. If they have to pay compensation to Dundalk it has to come from within that budget. I'd rather they spent it elsewhere. Boosting participation, stuff like that.

Peak6 can spend their own money however they like

The 'have to' is simple contract fundamentals. Dundalk's only fault is that they are 'small' and probably knew most people wouldn't care if compensation was paid or not. Imagine the Scot FA or English FA not paying compensation to say, Everton or Celtic for their managers because they wanted to put it into grass roots.

The wealth of the clubs owner has zero to do with it. You mentioned earlier that clubs lose their managers all the time without compensation. I can't think of many or any contracted managers in club football who leave jobs without compensation. If the FAI were so worried about said budget maybe they shouldn't be overpaying their CEO, then pretty small in comparison compensation wouldn't even be an issue.

It was completely wrong for the FAI to in effect poach a manager from a club.

By all means approach the club and seek an amicable solution. But to paraphrase Ricky Ross in Glengarry Glen Ross, they should be there to help clubs, not to fxxk them up.

joeysoap

howiya wrote: »

How on earth do you get to the suggestion that peak6 should be paying money to junior clubs?

The FAI has a fixed budget. If they have to pay compensation to Dundalk it has to come from within that budget. I'd rather they spent it elsewhere. Boosting participation, stuff like that.

Peak6 can spend their own money however they like

Sorry but I have to come in here again.

Your posts seem to imply that because Dundalk have rich owners they shouldn’t receive any money, even if due.


Every LOI club fundraises to survive. Dundalk, Rovers, Pats, Waterford etc are no exception to this basic fact.

Dundalk have amongst the highest priced season tickets in the league. ( should they be cheap because the owners are rich?)

Dundalk ( and every other club) work hard at selling programs, goal time etc on match days to gather revenue.

Dundalk( and every other club) charge for match sponsorship, match mascots etc. They also look for player sponsorship, home and away for the season

Dundalk have a weekly lotto.

Dundalk website is currently advertising pitchside advertising available for sale.

Dundalk fundraise through bar sales.

In short, like every other club, Dundalk fundraise to survive or improve.

joeysoap

D14Rugby wrote: »

If you count breaking contract law as a good deal then yeah, similar to a bank robber getting a good deal.

howiya

D14Rugby wrote: »

If you count breaking contract law as a good deal then yeah, similar to a bank robber getting a good deal.



You contradict yourself here. The money is the power, less money going around less money.

So sue them for breach of contract law then?

It's not a contradiction. The allocation of the money is the power, not the money itself. Each "project" gets a few thousand less. JD tells people he'd like to have given them more and they lap it up.

D14Rugby

howiya wrote: »

So sue them for breach of contract law then?

It's not a contradiction. The allocation of the money is the power, not the money itself. Each "project" gets a few thousand less. JD tells people he'd like to have given them more and they lap it up.

Yeah that's a good plan, sue they people that control when you get your main income and how much of it you can get and that can fine you at will, that's really damn clever why hasn't anyone thought of doing that before.

Delaney says he'd like to give more, people notice the drop from yeah before, ask why, he says they had to pay compensation, everyone wonders why the FAI can't budget properly and why grassroots had to pay the price and not the ceo on god knows how much after expenses more like

howiya

D14Rugby wrote: »

Yeah that's a good plan, sue they people that control when you get your main income and how much of it you can get and that can fine you at will, that's really damn clever why hasn't anyone thought of doing that before.

The whole point of paying compo when taking someone’s manager is to avoid getting sued. So if they’re not going to be sued why pay compensation?

irelandrover

How did the FAI actually manage to avoid paying compensation? Also, i assume it's Kenny that would be sued since he is the one that broke his contract.

malinheader

Just listening to a representative from sports Ireland on rte one. She was asked a few questions about what will happen if the fai fail to give a plausible explanation of the bridging loan next Tuesday. Listening to her I fear this is going to be another sham of an enquiry and Dodgy Delaney and his cronies will walk away once again. Hopefully I'm wrong.

Chancer3001

I was shocked that the fai seemingly avoided contract law and a dundalk lawsuit somehow...

Then i googled it and it couldnt be more simple.

Fai contacted dundalk. Dundalk agreed to let him go for free cos it was his national team and not a different club.

As simple as that.

Nice move by dundalk. Great negotiating by delaney.

No dodginess. No law suits. No bank robbery behaviour.

Sorry to dampen the outrage again.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/dundalk-have-not-been-paid-compensation-for-the-loss-of-manager-stephen-kenny-37565368.html

Irishmale0399

howiya wrote: »

How on earth do you get to the suggestion that peak6 should be paying money to junior clubs?

The FAI has a fixed budget. If they have to pay compensation to Dundalk it has to come from within that budget. I'd rather they spent it elsewhere. Boosting participation, stuff like that.

Peak6 can spend their own money however they like

OK another queston.....


If you are buying a car that is 1000€ more than you have budgeted for what do you do???


1. Walk away and buy what you can afford.
2. Spend over budget and know what effect it will have. Your risk
3. Sit down with the dealer and try to find a way to get a better price.


All the FAI would have had to do was talk to Peak6 from the first moment. Makes a mockery of the assosiation who are supposed to be an example to its members...the message they sent was clear......"Poach managers..no risk".


As I already said surely it is Peak6 who should decide what they do with compensation they get for a man they had under contract.

What would have been the case had Dundalk lost their way without Kenny and the Peal6 investment went belly up. Would the FAI have stepped in and covered the loss??



What if they had gone for the UCD manager and had to pay compo to UCD....would the FAI have said to Peak6...You are grand we screwed you so you can screw them???

Chancer3001

They did sit down with them sure.

Its in the link i posted.

Jd sat down with 2 of them and negotiated the best deal possible

D14Rugby

howiya wrote: »

The whole point of paying compo when taking someone’s manager is to avoid getting sued. So if they’re not going to be sued why pay compensation?

Are you really saying why shouldn't a sports governing body do the right thing to a sports club because they know that they have so much power over them so won't be sued? Give your head a shake there will ya

Dots1982

D14Rugby wrote: »

Are you really saying why shouldn't a sports governing body do the right thing to a sports club because they know that they have so much power over them so won't be sued? Give your head a shake there will ya

I’m sure if JD had insisted on paying compo to Dundalk even though it wasn’t ever going to be asked for then that would be a universally popular decision.

There definitely wouldn’t be a load of people saying why are a cash strapped organization like the FAI giving away free money. There would be no chance John Delaney would be criticized as incapable of negotiationing on behalf of the association because he gives away money when he doesn’t need to.

Absolutely no chance.

Chancer3001

Chancer3001 wrote: »

I was shocked that the fai seemingly avoided contract law and a dundalk lawsuit somehow...

Then i googled it and it couldnt be more simple.

Fai contacted dundalk. Dundalk agreed to let him go for free cos it was his national team and not a different club.

As simple as that.

Nice move by dundalk. Great negotiating by delaney.

No dodginess. No law suits. No bank robbery behaviour.

Sorry to dampen the outrage again.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/dundalk-have-not-been-paid-compensation-for-the-loss-of-manager-stephen-kenny-37565368.html

It is your prerogative to defend Delaney by googling and searching around for ex post facto defences as and when issues arise.

Those who take an interest in the club game here were very unimpressed by what happened at that time.

Even if the FAI appealed to Kenny's ambitions and prised him from the club that way, it was widely regarded as very shoddy that the national association would take advantage of that to get away without so much as offering a cent.

Chancer3001

To googling and searching?

Yeah its literally the first hit on google.

I would have been shocked at dundalks behaviour if they werent suing the fai for compo.
Made no sense.

Turns out the 2 lads in charge gave kenny their blessing.

People can be outraged all they want. I think its a nice story

D14Rugby

Chancer3001 wrote: »

To googling and searching?

Yeah its literally the first hit on google.

I would have been shocked at dundalks behaviour if they werent suing the fai for compo.
Made no sense.

Turns out the 2 lads in charge gave kenny their blessing.

People can be outraged all they want. I think its a nice story

No, according to Delaney they did. The Dundalk statements and even Kenny himself in interviews paints a very different picture.

It was basically a case of the FAI saying we're not paying compensation so either cooperate or we'll make life difficult for you and we'll get him in the end one was or another. Very much bully tactics from the people supposed to be supporting these clubs.

Chancer3001

Chancer3001 wrote: »

People can be outraged all they want. I think its a nice story

It's yesterday's news for most LoI fans, the outrage was spent long ago.

Tbh, I think we're all getting far too much enjoyment out of seeing Delaney pinned and squirming and the whole edifice crumbling to be outraged about anything. It's pure popcorn "zip ah dee doo day/my oh my what a wonderful day" time for most.

Irishmale0399

Chancer3001 wrote: »

To googling and searching?

Yeah its literally the first hit on google.

I would have been shocked at dundalks behaviour if they werent suing the fai for compo.
Made no sense.

Turns out the 2 lads in charge gave kenny their blessing.

People can be outraged all they want. I think its a nice story

2 lads in charge?? Would you care to name them???


Dundalk FC was at the time and is stille majority owned by Peak6 and a supporting consortium.


It is public knowledge in Dundalk and the village Kenny lives in outside it that the FAI spoke to Kenny long before the telephone was lifted to the chairman in the US. Didnt Kenny take part in planning meetings the day before he was appointed and he himself admitted publically the deal was off at that time and he was sure it wasnt going any further as he wanted the first team job or nothing. Furthermore people around him admitted it was made public before agreed as Kenny wanted to inform the club, Perth and the players himself.....someone at the FAI sent out a tweet before that could happen.



Between Dundalks owners and the FAI there is no love lost and JD knows it. The Yanks are by no way impressed with the workings of the FAI and their approach to the LOI and player developement.



Do you think the FAI would have allowed the LOI clubs to show goals clips on social media during live games for the good of their hearts??? Who asked the questions??? Who could pay the lawyers more??? Who found out that the FAI did indeed sell LOI rights to RTE as part of their broadcasting deal but insisted for years they were getting nothing for it???

Chancer3001

The two lads are named in the link i provided a few posts ago.

secman

No amount of posts by chancer on boards.ie is going to do Sepo Delaney any good when he appears before the oireachas committee.
Wouldn't even countenance answering any of his posts either, total waste of time and energy.

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