Homelessness on the rise (over 130 more children) - Mod Warning Post #392

Gatling

Sleeper12 wrote: »

No more homeless in hotels by July. Was it 2016 or 2017?

Wonderful government.

But they are actually getting somewhere just slowly ,
But look at the various housing associations cluid,circle tuath they have brought several thousand properties for social housing in the last few years ,
I still think we need a deterent to stop people just walking away from properties and self declaration of homelessness safe in the knowledge they will be put into hotels and b&bs long term with zero financial outlay for them (with the exception of hubs)

Graces7

Graces7 wrote: »

Given that folk can be on a housing list for many years even with children. you are expecting young couples couples to defer having children because the govt is making a mess of social housing?

If you can’t afford to house yourself you can’t afford kids simple as that. If you can never afford to house yourself you should never have kids. I as a tax payer have absolutely no interest in funding the housing of other people and their kids I’ve enough to pay for my own family and home.

Old diesel

Gatling wrote: »

Sleeper12 wrote: »

No more homeless in hotels by July. Was it 2016 or 2017?

Wonderful government.

But they are actually getting somewhere just slowly ,
But look at the various housing associations cluid,circle tuath they have brought several thousand properties for social housing in the last few years ,
I still think we need a deterent to stop people just walking away from properties and self declaration of homelessness safe in the knowledge they will be put into hotels and b&bs long term with zero financial outlay for them (with the exception of hubs)

I thought the top reason for homelessness was termination of tenancy by landlords????.

For example the landlord selling the property or a family member moving in.

amcalester

Graces7 wrote: »

Given that folk can be on a housing list for many years even with children. you are expecting young couples couples to defer having children because the govt is making a mess of social housing?

Yes.

People who are paying for their own home are doing it so why not the ones who get homes for free?

Gatling

Old diesel wrote: »

I thought the top reason for homelessness was termination of tenancy by landlords????.

For example the landlord selling the property or a family member moving in.

This is what were told , there is no checks in this place the actually verify this is true ,hence the self declaration of homelessness , nothing from the landlord or asking the landlord if non payment of rents or arrears was the reason

Blueshoe

Graces7 wrote: »

Given that folk can be on a housing list for many years even with children. you are expecting young couples couples to defer having children because the govt is making a mess of social housing?

Another generation born with the hand out.
That is alot of non contributory pensions and social welfare for the people who get up early every day to pay for

TSQ

Nicole Gigantic Seashell wrote: »

If you can’t afford to house yourself you can’t afford kids simple as that. If you can never afford to house yourself you should never have kids. I as a tax payer have absolutely no interest in funding the housing of other people and their kids I’ve enough to pay for my own family and home.

Just to cheer you up.... Heard interview on the news today about a family of 7 kids between 3 and 14 years tragically “homeless”. Apparently had a private rented house but had to leave because it was overcrowded (would that have been after the 5th, 6th or 7th kid?). Moved to England but moved back here because of issues (probably brits wouldnt give them a 7 bedroom house). So back here and being put up in various B&Bs. The discussion was all hand-wringing, must build more houses, what about the children, and god forbid anyone should even question why unemployed, homeless parents decided to have 7 kids on the social.

Macha

Nicole Gigantic Seashell wrote: »

If you can’t afford to house yourself you can’t afford kids simple as that. If you can never afford to house yourself you should never have kids. I as a tax payer have absolutely no interest in funding the housing of other people and their kids I’ve enough to pay for my own family and home.

This is entirely nuts. Why aren't we asking why is the housing sector in Ireland in so much crisis, it's preventing people from having children?

I know that I delayed having children because I did so many unpaid internships and took so long to get a decent paid job and paid so much rent that I wasn't financially stable enough until I was in my early 30s. Do we really want to encourage people to have children later and later, or even put it beyond the reach of many?

The Irish housing sector is ****ed up but so is the conversation about it.

CoffeeBean2

Macha wrote: »

because I did so many unpaid internships

That was your first mistake! What field would require you to do that? I hope you warn everyone you know to stay well away from it.

Macha

CoffeeBean2 wrote: »

That was your first mistake! What field would require you to do that? I hope you warn everyone you know to stay well away from it.

It doesn't matter what field it is, this applies to many fields and you're missing the point.

Should having children only be the preserve of the wealthiest 20%, or those lucky enough to inherit property? There are a million reasons why someone could go from a stable financial situation to struggling, especially in Ireland where everything is so goddamn expensive (thanks in part to the entirely mismanaged housing sector).

Yeah, how dare people assume they will not struggle to find secure, stable housing and have children. The bare faced cheek of them.

Graces7

grassroot1 wrote: »

No try in this order job partner house kids
To expect a house in your preferred location to be handed to you because you have a sence of entitlement is crazy

If that were true it would be crazy .. that is your "opinion"

Graces7

Macha wrote: »

This is entirely nuts. Why aren't we asking why is the housing sector in Ireland in so much crisis, it's preventing people from having children?

I know that I delayed having children because I did so many unpaid internships and took so long to get a decent paid job and paid so much rent that I wasn't financially stable enough until I was in my early 30s. Do we really want to encourage people to have children later and later, or even put it beyond the reach of many?

The Irish housing sector is ****ed up but so is the conversation about it.

Thank you. Simply thank you.

Graces7

Deleted User wrote: »

Great news. The system is working.

You contradict your earlier ideas

Not working when folk are being forced not to have a family....and are being accused of all manner of abuses by folk who do not know them

grassroot1

Macha wrote:

This is entirely nuts. Why aren't we asking why is the housing sector in Ireland in so much crisis, it's preventing people from having children?

But it's not in crisis outside of the main urban areas houses are available
Having kids is a huge responsibility and I have sympathy for your situation but having kids to bump yourself up the council housing list is wrong

Graces7

Being English, seeing the attitude here to social housing and more especially those who need it is a revelation not welcome

As a warbaby, I grew up in a country where the homeless situation makes Ireland look like a holiday camp. Whole towns and cities bombed out, and homelessness rife. The landscape of my childhood was bombsites.

The rebuilding was swift; we had whole fields of prefabs as an immediate support and rebuilding started immediately.

Vast council estates and no discrimination or stigma and no judgementalism . You need a roof; we have a roof for you.

Sure the system gets " abused" if it is allowed to but never the attitude here, Never this "them and us " idea when anyone can fall on hard times . We were fully aware of what a "welfare state" is and means. Whereas here there is not that awareness.

Tomorrow's homeless are today's rich folk

Graces7

grassroot1 wrote: »

But it's not in crisis outside of the main urban areas houses are available
Having kids is a huge responsibility and I have sympathy for your situation but having kids to bump yourself up the council housing list is wrong

Prove that accusation please? The lady in this case was offered only a place in a women;s refuge and as she said, she is not being abused to that was inappropriate and would split her family - and take a place others might need.

She is seeking a roof for herself and her babies like any good mother and the system is failing her as it fails so many.


Can you really ask of folk that they be denied children for the govts mess up?

Can you also please define and elucidate your opening idea? There ar every very few vacant houses available anywhere at suitable prices. I know this through experience.

Time to stop blaming folk you have no acquaintance with. Counterproductive

Sleeper12

Jupiter Mulligan wrote:

Steady on, Doofus. You don't genuinely think that an election will resolve the homelessness problem?

No but regardless of the result, we can only end up with a better government

SirChenjin

Graces7 wrote: »

Being English, seeing the attitude here to social housing and more especially those who need it is a revelation not welcome

As a warbaby, I grew up in a country where the homeless situation makes Ireland look like a holiday camp. Whole towns and cities bombed out, and homelessness rife. The landscape of my childhood was bombsites.

The rebuilding was swift; we had whole fields of prefabs as an immediate support and rebuilding started immediately.

Vast council estates and no discrimination or stigma and no judgementalism . You need a roof; we have a roof for you.

Sure the system gets " abused" if it is allowed to but never the attitude here, Never this "them and us " idea when anyone can fall on hard times . We were fully aware of what a "welfare state" is and means. Whereas here there is not that awareness.

Tomorrow's homeless are today's rich folk

Is this still the situation in the UK today?

Macha

grassroot1 wrote: »

But it's not in crisis outside of the main urban areas houses are available
Having kids is a huge responsibility and I have sympathy for your situation but having kids to bump yourself up the council housing list is wrong

I find your answer really puzzling.

Ireland's crèche and school infrastructure is abysmal. Most parents I know have their childcare stitched together between grandparents, younger siblings, nannies and crèches, or they're paying big money for crèches. It's also entirely possible to be working full time and not be able to afford to rent in Dublin on the private sector.

Should the parents leave their network of support plus their jobs the kids friends all of that to move our of an urban area? Again, WHY aren't we asking why we would expect people to do such a thing? It is not like this in other western European counties.

I repeat: the Irish housing sector is completely ****ed up and so is the conversation around it.

Amirani

Sleeper12 wrote: »

No but regardless of the result, we can only end up with a better government

You're naive or deluded. How many elections have you voted in in Ireland? This "better Government waiting around the corner" malarkey sounds like something a 14 year old would be saying.

Sleeper12

Amirani wrote: »

You're naive or deluded. How many elections have you voted in in Ireland? This "better Government waiting around the corner" malarkey sounds like something a 14 year old would be saying.

Well as this is one of the worst governments we've had we can only improve

Wanderer78

Sleeper12 wrote:

Well as this is one of the worst governments we've had we can only improve

Does our political system have the abilities to truly change things, even if a 'better government' is elected?

Amirani

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Well as this is one of the worst governments we've had we can only improve

Care to list some examples of better ones we've had?

Graham

Mod Note

Please don’t. This is accommodation & property, there are other more appropriate forums for party politics.

Graces7

Macha wrote: »

I find your answer really puzzling.

Ireland's crèche and school infrastructure is abysmal. Most parents I know have their childcare stitched together between grandparents, younger siblings, nannies and crèches, or they're paying big money for crèches. It's also entirely possible to be working full time and not be able to afford to rent in Dublin on the private sector.

Should the parents leave their network of support plus their jobs the kids friends all of that to move our of an urban area? Again, WHY aren't we asking why we would expect people to do such a thing? It is not like this in other western European counties.

I repeat: the Irish housing sector is completely ****ed up and so is the conversation around it.

Thank you. What comes across in these threads is an aspect akin to?? "punishment" for not being able to find a house etc. In any other area if someone made a stand to try to house their family, there would be applause.. Look at them showing initiative! etc.

All they are doing is trying to find a safe home for their family.

And it is up to the officials to decide on housing.

Old diesel

Macha wrote: »

grassroot1 wrote: »

But it's not in crisis outside of the main urban areas houses are available
Having kids is a huge responsibility and I have sympathy for your situation but having kids to bump yourself up the council housing list is wrong

I find your answer really puzzling.

Ireland's crèche and school infrastructure is abysmal. Most parents I know have their childcare stitched together between grandparents, younger siblings, nannies and crèches, or they're paying big money for crèches. It's also entirely possible to be working full time and not be able to afford to rent in Dublin on the private sector.

Should the parents leave their network of support plus their jobs the kids friends all of that to move our of an urban area? Again, WHY aren't we asking why we would expect people to do such a thing? It is not like this in other western European counties.

I repeat: the Irish housing sector is completely ****ed up and so is the conversation around it.

THIS.....

It is amazing how people want a Nurse to have his/her pay curtailed - yet reckon when the same nurse goes to pay for housing he or she should pay the market rate no matter how unaffordable the rent.

And if a Garda got a mortgage in 2006 he or she shouldnt get the "excessive" 2006 pay that enabled them get the mortgage.

Yet the view is taken that the landlord that bought the house next door at same price as the Garda also in 2006 should be fully entitled to make a return on the property.

Now I would say you could argue that if the Gardas pay in 2006 that got them the mortgage was excessive - then so arguably was the price the landlord and Garda paid for the houses.

Graces7

SirChenjin wrote: »

Is this still the situation in the UK today?

In what respect please? I have not been back for nearly 20 years. I watch various programmes re landlords etc and there is not the stigma we see here on boards. It is they are doing wrong eg not paying, trashing properties
There was a feature on one family; 18 kids all grown up and having kids and the council knocked 2 houses into one for them. But not the automatic condemnation we see here.

There is a new series specifically re council properties being misused and again, not the ire we see here.

We did literally grow up with council housing as standard whereas here ?

And in the UK getting a council house is very hard. The rules are strict.

eurokev

Macha wrote:

I know that I delayed having children because I did so many unpaid internships and took so long to get a decent paid job and paid so much rent that I wasn't financially stable enough until I was in my early 30s. Do we really want to encourage people to have children later and later, or even put it beyond the reach of many?

I think we really should start discouraging certain sections of society from having children, ala the 21yr old expectant mother who already has 2 kids.
I would imagine she has never worked, I'm going to go out on a limb and say the same about the partner.
At the age she is at she should be finishing up some sort of training to begin a career, but she has probably come from a background where what she has seen, shows her that having kids is a means of getting a house and making more in welfare payments.

This young one is, and more than likely always will be a drain on our society and offer nothing in return. Her kids following the example they have been set are more likely to follow the same path.
In 30yrs time, this one couple could have produced a half dozen kids who are now producing kids. That's a massive massive expense to the system, when 2 have turned in to 20 needing 8 homes.
Why are people like this enabled by having everything provided for them. It boils my blood TBH.

However we do want to make it easier for the, gaurd and the nurse, the mechanic and the hairdresser, the landscaper and the office worker to have a home and kids.
But unfortunately supply cannot keep up with demand because people like the young one are draining the system, snatching up everything that the workers taxes are paying for and making everything more expensive for the workers as a result.
This means that the workers will have to have kids later and in fewer numbers, but these kids are more likely to go on and contribute because they will have been brought up that way. But now in the future these fewer kids of the working couple are going to have to support the kids of the young ones loins and therin the system runs dry and collapses.
Unfortunately I will be old hopefully, and in need of health services and care which there will be no money there to pay for either.

Gatling

Graces7 wrote: »

And in the UK getting a council house is very hard. The rules are strict.

I don't believe it is ,

But unlike here councils have no problems finding properties to rent for people needing housing no where near where you might want to live as in neighbouring county's or further afield , London borough council does it quite well they will find a property and help with access to a school or schools you will get called into a meeting where your told you have a set of keys for a house several hundred miles away from where you want to live take ,you have to take it or we discharge you from our responsibility to house you ,
You actually need to prove in some cases you can physically support yourself or family through work or running a business to stay in some parts of London ,

It's actually easier to get housed in the uk going by reports of people who have left Ireland for the uk and got housing from another local authority only to return several years later demanding housing from another local authority here.

Cal4567

Gatling wrote: »

But they are actually getting somewhere just slowly ,
But look at the various housing associations cluid,circle tuath they have brought several thousand properties for social housing in the last few years ,
I still think we need a deterent to stop people just walking away from properties and self declaration of homelessness safe in the knowledge they will be put into hotels and b&bs long term with zero financial outlay for them (with the exception of hubs)

Future has to be with the housing associations. Yes, progress but it is slow, building is slow, the public sector is slow and landlords leaving the scene is only making it worse or slowing the benefits of progress. With all the bulding going on, we will probablt start to see real progress well into next year - after the election. Along with other misdeameanours, most likely too late for FG to benefit.

Murphy's co housing comments were not well received by younger voters FG should be courting.