Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Jamal Khashoggi killed in Saudi embassy.

Options
2456

Comments

  • Options
    #32
    Skylinehead
    Registered Users Posts: 11,690 ✭✭✭✭Skylinehead


    https://www.vox.com/platform/amp/2018/10/17/17990268/pat-robertson-khashoggi-saudi-arabia-trump-crisis?__twitter_impression=true

    Could only think of this :D



  • Options
    #33
    alaimacerc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,224 ✭✭✭alaimacerc


    FTA69 wrote: »
    This is about oil nothing else. It’s embarassing.

    Just to be picky, the US doesn't really need them for energy security any more, as was previously the case.

    Just their money. (... which they happen to get from oil, of course.)


  • Options
    #34
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    3DataModem wrote: »
    To be fair to him, he basically said "there's 500bn of business on the line, so we are going to take a good hard look before jumping to conclusions"

    What conclusions are there to draw?

    Regardless of what exactly happened to this poor fella it's been established with CCTV footage that he went into the Saudi consulate and never came back out.

    So whether or not he was dismembered, accidentally died during an 'interrogation', was beamed up by aliens or is pulling an Assange....the saudis know more then they are telling.


  • Options
    #35
    alaimacerc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,224 ✭✭✭alaimacerc


    wexie wrote: »
    But whereas if he had been 'some Turkish reporter*' it would have taken a few days to get over the 'outrage' I think now it might actually take a few weeks. [...]

    *Turkish reporters disappear all the time

    There's something to that. And likewise, the Saudis execute their own citizens at a rather brisk rate, for things fairly low down the criminality spectrum (if on it at all).

    It being in another country elevates it to an international incident. (Pretty much by definition!)


  • Options
    #36
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    Hector Savage wrote: »
    Sickening the way Trump is trying to downplay it, I would have expected him to at least have the courage to call it out.

    Yeah, he should have done what Obama would have done. Given lip service to it while carrying on as beforehand in the background.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #37
    Mutant z
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,487 ✭✭✭Mutant z


    If there's one country which should be blown off the map its the KSA but this disguating country will be treated with kid gloves as usual just to keep arms sales booming its not what you do but who does it.


  • Options
    #38
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,153 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    FTA69 wrote: »
    Horrible repulsive regime. When they’re not bombing and starving their neighbours in Yemen they’re funding Salafist Islam and terrorism over here. Utterly backed to the hilt by the US and Britain et al as well, which makes a total mockery of any pretence toward a “war on terror” or anything else.

    This is about oil nothing else. It’s embarassing.


    Probably something to do with the $900m loan that trumps son-in-law received from the Qataris. https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2018/05/kushner-cos-brookfield-qatar


    Trump puts his families businesses about EVERYTHING else.


  • Options
    #39
    alaimacerc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,224 ✭✭✭alaimacerc


    wexie wrote: »
    What conclusions are there to draw?

    Regardless of what exactly happened to this poor fella it's been established with CCTV footage that he went into the Saudi consulate and never came back out.

    So whether or not he was dismembered, accidentally died during an 'interrogation', was beamed up by aliens or is pulling an Assange....the saudis know more then they are telling.

    I imagine that if the Saudis write the Turks a large enough cheque, there will suddenly be some remarkably fuzzy CCTV footage "found" that proves he did leave the embassy after all. "Subsequent" disappearance is now a total mystery. The lavishly described recordings from inside the embassy never actually appear.


  • Options
    #40
    alaimacerc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,224 ✭✭✭alaimacerc


    Nixonbot wrote: »
    https://www.vox.com/platform/amp/2018/10/17/17990268/pat-robertson-khashoggi-saudi-arabia-trump-crisis?__twitter_impression=true

    The US "Christian" Right. If they were at the Sermon on the Mount, they'd be heckling at the back.


  • Options
    #41
    alaimacerc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,224 ✭✭✭alaimacerc


    Hector Savage wrote: »
    Sickening the way Trump is trying to downplay it, I would have expected him to at least have the courage to call it out.

    Keep lowering your expectations of Trump.

    Bit more.

    Bit more still.

    No, I'll tell you when, really...


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #42
    Mutant z
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,487 ✭✭✭Mutant z


    If there's one country which should be blown off the map its the KSA but that disgusting country is treated with kid gloves just to boost arm sales note the lack of reaction to Yemen in which Saudi is heavely involved its simply seen as a minor inconvenience.


  • Options
    #43
    Deise Vu
    Registered Users Posts: 1,931 ✭✭✭Deise Vu


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    Probably something to do with the $900m loan that trumps son-in-law received from the Qataris. https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2018/05/kushner-cos-brookfield-qatar


    Trump puts his families businesses about EVERYTHING else.

    God forbid that it looks like I’m defending Trump but it should be pointed out that the Qataris are the best of enemies with the Saudies. The Qataris are on Iran’s side in the insanity that is Middle Eastern politics.


  • Options
    #44
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,153 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Deise Vu wrote: »
    God forbid that it looks like I’m defending Trump but it should be pointed out that the Qataris are the best of enemies with the Saudies. The Qataris are on Iran’s side in the insanity that is Middle Eastern politics.


    Indeed they are but perhaps you should have read the article


    Some political observers’ eyebrows were raised when, just a few weeks after Charlie’s talks with the Qataris fell apart, his son endorsed a Saudi- and U.A.E.-led blockade of Qatar.
    One wonders if the Trump administration will continue to support the blockade, or whether it will suddenly have a change of heart now that the Qatar Investment Authority, via Brookfield, has opened its wallet.


  • Options
    #45
    Deise Vu
    Registered Users Posts: 1,931 ✭✭✭Deise Vu


    ChikiChiki wrote: »
    US hypocrisy really is something to behold. I think the reported audios of torture and fingers being cut off is a subtle message to journalists not to push to hard with this story.

    https://www.smh.com.au/world/north-america/no-coincidence-saudi-arabia-delivers-us100m-to-us-after-trump-s-rogue-killers-rationale-20181017-p50a5j.html

    Given the international condemnation and the consequences for Davos in the Sand and other Saudi dreams of becoming known for something other than oil fields I think it is much more likely that these leaks are only because of Turkish spying.

    If this is the case, the torture and brutal murder were just a personal message. That is a level of psychosis that exceeds ISIS standards. At least their barbarism had an effect of spreading fear and gaining propaganda.


  • Options
    #46
    Odhinn
    Registered Users Posts: 7,983 ✭✭✭Odhinn


    wexie wrote: »
    What conclusions are there to draw?

    Regardless of what exactly happened to this poor fella it's been established with CCTV footage that he went into the Saudi consulate and never came back out.

    So whether or not he was dismembered, accidentally died during an 'interrogation', was beamed up by aliens or is pulling an Assange....the saudis know more then they are telling.




    Somebody may well emerge and "take the bullet" for the crown prince - spend a few years inside and quietly released later on.


    Overall the whole thing is a bit mad. They know their embassy is being watched. He could have "fallen" off a balcony, "shot" himself, "overdosed" somewhere, all of which leave some plausibile deniability.


  • Options
    #47
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    Odhinn wrote: »
    Overall the whole thing is a bit mad. They know their embassy is being watched. He could have "fallen" off a balcony, "shot" himself, "overdosed" somewhere, all of which leave some plausibile deniability.

    I think that is probably the more worrying development.

    It's worrying that a Russian defector was nearly assassinated on English soil, it's worrying that a Saudi dissident was (allegedly) murdered in the Saudi consulate.

    What's more worrying is that they were both done in such brazen ways as to nearly not be deniable, and then denied with 'implausible' deniability.

    I'd be surprised if similar things haven't happened in the not so distant past but they were the good old 'mugging gone wrong', heart attack, car accident ya know, good aul sensible ways of bumping off people.

    There's a very interesting article here about the Russian practice of Vranyo.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/23/magazine/from-russia-with-lies.html

    (yes yes I know that it's Saudi's we're talking about but the idea is the same :they're lying, we know they're lying, they know that we know that they are lying but they keep lying anyway)


  • Options
    #48
    Deise Vu
    Registered Users Posts: 1,931 ✭✭✭Deise Vu


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    Indeed they are but perhaps you should have read the article

    The article states that the Qataris have bailed the Kushners out of a disastrous property investment after initially baulking. In between baulking and deciding to back the Kushners, Jared endorsed the Saudi led blockade of Qatar because of their alleged support for terrorism.

    If Jared now considers the Qataris to be his best buddies due to their munificence then the USA are more likely to condemn the Saudis than less likely. Or am I missing something?


  • Options
    #49
    Zebra3
    Registered Users Posts: 13,851 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    PlaneSpeeking wrote: »
    No but they don't have to be craven hypocrites like RBB.

    We get it. You don’t like him. But he doesn’t have anything to do with the topic so why are you boring us?


  • Options
    #50
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,153 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Deise Vu wrote: »
    The article states that the Qataris have bailed the Kushners out of a disastrous property investment after initially baulking. In between baulking and deciding to back the Kushners, Jared endorsed the Saudi led blockade of Qatar because of their alleged support for terrorism.

    If Jared now considers the Qataris to be his best buddies due to their munificence then the USA are more likely to condemn the Saudis than less likely. Or am I missing something?

    yes
    One wonders if the Trump administration will continue to support the blockade, or whether it will suddenly have a change of heart now that the Qatar Investment Authority, via Brookfield, has opened its wallet.


  • Options
    #51
    Ipso
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,995 ✭✭✭Ipso


    Trump has also boasted of his real estate dealings with the Saudis, and they are also big customers in his hotels.
    https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-saudi-arabia-financial-interests-ties-hotel-bookings-sales-2018-10

    Now of course Trump/US can't be singled out for dealings with the sh1t hole, but when you look at his stance towards Cuba, Iran etc it males it a bit more ridiculous.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #52
    orourkeda1977
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,628 ✭✭✭orourkeda1977


    Herb Powell wrote: »
    Trump would love so early to be able do the same, nothing will happen.

    You dont think he's the first president to have that idea do you?


  • Options
    #53
    mad muffin
    Registered Users Posts: 8,034 ✭✭✭mad muffin


    A professional hit this was not…


  • Options
    #54
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    Interesting article here that identifies the members of the 'alleged' hit team.
    I'd love to know quite what 'innocent' explanation is going to be given for a bunch of Royal Guards, intelligence officers and a forensic pathologist to have taken 2 private jets for a daytrip to Turkey :rolleyes:

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-45906396


  • Options
    #55
    sbsquarepants
    Registered Users Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭sbsquarepants


    wexie wrote: »
    Except he wasn't 'some Turkish reporter' he was a Saudi reporter living in the US working for the Washington Post.

    Sorry - typo! I meant to say Saudi reporter.

    Point stands - they just don't care.

    Imagine now if this had of happened in the Iranian embassy! Same bloke, same grissly end, different building. The bombs wouldn't stop for days until the full outrageousness of the situation was made clear to the despots in Tehran. Then years of harsh sanctions would be required till they learned their lesson.

    The freedom to oppress of the press is sacrosanct after all!

    The hypocrisy is sickening!


  • Options
    #56
    Pero_Bueno
    Closed Accounts Posts: 502 ✭✭✭Pero_Bueno


    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/oct/19/crown-prince-mohammed-jamal-khashoggi-killing-mi6-sir-john-sawers
    Crown prince ordered killing according to ex MI6 chief.

    Jaysus!


  • Options
    #57
    Franz Von Peppercorn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,070 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    Indeed they are but perhaps you should have read the article

    The US support of Saudi has existed long before trump and will exist after him. It’s deeply emeshed. Obama was helping them bomb Yemen.


  • Options
    #58
    Ipso
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,995 ✭✭✭Ipso


    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    The US support of Saudi has existed long before trump and will exist after him. It’s deeply emeshed. Obama was helping them bomb Yemen.

    And Trump has increased the help, and said he doesn't want to piss them off as it will impact weapons sales.

    It's hilarious how he had more criticism for Taylor Swift than the Saudis.


  • Options
    #59
    nthclare
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,316 ✭✭✭nthclare


    Saudi is a sandpit with a pond of sludge underneath,a wasteland of sand and scrub.....

    As for Iran it's a beautiful country, amazing culture.
    Jews Christians and Muslims living together in Persia the cradle of civilisation.

    Tattoo Parlours, bars and clubs for the Christians and Jews...

    Thriving businesses, shopping centres​ Trans gender friendly....

    Although they've no time for wahabbism and sunni style Sharia law...

    They hang people, but no head chopping....

    They're trendy, intelligent and some of the most beautiful men and women on the planet...

    As for Saudi it's not a place I'd like to go, but Iran it's on my wish list...

    They're the envy of the middle East...

    Long live Persia


  • Options
    #60
    Zebra3
    Registered Users Posts: 13,851 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    nthclare wrote: »
    Saudi is a sandpit with a pond of sludge underneath,a wasteland of sand and scrub.....

    As for Iran it's a beautiful country, amazing culture.
    Jews Christians and Muslims living together in Persia the cradle of civilisation.

    Tattoo Parlours, bars and clubs for the Christians and Jews...

    Thriving businesses, shopping centres​ Trans gender friendly....

    Although they've no time for wahabbism and sunni style Sharia law...

    They hang people, but no head chopping....

    They're trendy, intelligent and some of the most beautiful men and women on the planet...

    As for Saudi it's not a place I'd like to go, but Iran it's on my wish list...

    They're the envy of the middle East...

    Long live Persia

    Stone the odd woman to death too but sure no harm, eh?


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #61
    Ipso
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,995 ✭✭✭Ipso


    nthclare wrote: »
    Saudi is a sandpit with a pond of sludge underneath,a wasteland of sand and scrub.....

    As for Iran it's a beautiful country, amazing culture.
    Jews Christians and Muslims living together in Persia the cradle of civilisation.

    Tattoo Parlours, bars and clubs for the Christians and Jews...

    Thriving businesses, shopping centres​ Trans gender friendly....

    Although they've no time for wahabbism and sunni style Sharia law...

    They hang people, but no head chopping....

    They're trendy, intelligent and some of the most beautiful men and women on the planet...

    As for Saudi it's not a place I'd like to go, but Iran it's on my wish list...

    They're the envy of the middle East...

    Long live Persia


    Wasn't sure if you were serious, although it could be the result of the childish idea that many people have that leads them to be soft on places because they don't like the US.
    https://www.amnesty.org/en/countries/middle-east-and-north-africa/iran/


Advertisement