Apple has just ponied up 14 Billion

Riddle101

Give me the €14 billion to mind. I'll keep it safe in my account for them.

irishproduce

canonball5 wrote: »

What country would be given 14.3 billion and then turn around and say "ah lads, it's grand, we don't really need it".

Essentially it all distills down to who needs who more.

Country category A)
They have a huge population (base) and significant international authority, they extract tax on the basis that they will happily accept as much as is going to be paid and it is the payers issue if they would like to challenge that.

Country category
Much smaller population (base) and very little international authority. Country B is very happy to have a company resident who has a huge customer base and who has a significant market authority.
This country is going to accept as much tax as was promised between the two parties when the agreement was struck to locate in country B.

That is it essentially.
In this case, Ireland needs Apple more than Apple needs Ireland.

That would not be the case with Canada/ France/ Australia for example.
But there are pros and cons to being in a small country. Most pressing is that we are not all up on top of each other packed in like some places. Quality of life here is great, so let's continue to make agreements with the likes of Apple I say.

Agent Coulson

Riddle101 wrote: »

Give me the €14 billion to mind. I'll keep it safe in my account for them.

Just for a year and you'll never have to work again from the interest alone when you hand back the €14 billion.

NIMAN

Apple can easily afford this, its like a few cent falling out of their pocket.

I say take it, tell the world we are using it for the good of the Irish people, to try to solve this housing crisis, and spend it on that.

I think Apple won't mind, and won't move all their business out of the country as some fear.

Worth a punt?

aidanodr

murpho999 wrote: »

Do people who don't get that the government are trying to stop the EU from scrapping Ireland's low corporate tax rate that has ensured we have hundreds of thousands of jobs here?

If that goes then so will the companies and the jobs.

Has the story moved on a bit?

Irish May Face EU Tax Pressure in Return for Brexit Support - BLOOMBERG

riffmongous

murpho999 wrote: »

Do people who don't get that the government are trying to stop the EU from scrapping Ireland's low corporate tax rate that has ensured we have hundreds of thousands of jobs here?

If that goes then so will the companies and the jobs.

Where will they go?

Hitman3000

Deleted User wrote:

I expect a nuanced conversation on taxation and economics and not a bunch of mongs thinking they know what they're talking about.

In AH??? lol. You should be banned alone for the use of the word "mong".

Hitman3000

Agent Coulson wrote:

Just give everyone in the Country a free iPhone & iPad and call it quits.

Prefer a Samsung 8 if it's all the same.

Turnipman

canonball5 wrote: »

Yes I do. We have shown that we're completely incompetent when it comes to our own tax regulation and perhaps they could do a better job. At the very least they couldn't do a worse job.

The level of economic and fiscal ignorance displayed by some posters on this thread is genuinely staggering. :eek:

NIMAN

murpho999 wrote: »

Do people who don't get that the government are trying to stop the EU from scrapping Ireland's low corporate tax rate that has ensured we have hundreds of thousands of jobs here?

If that goes then so will the companies and the jobs.

So if Ireland's corp tax rate is made the same as rest of Europe, all the multinationals will up sticks and leave Ireland because these companies can get the same tax rate elsewhere?

That doesn't make sense, when they have operations already up and running here, staff in place, buildings secured etc.

CPTM

canonball5 wrote: »

What country would be given 14.3 billion and then turn around and say "ah lads, it's grand, we don't really need it".

A country who's trying to convince the large corporations of the world to come to Ireland to do business. Ireland is all about jobs right now and keeping them. More people earning and spending. Do you think the EU would care about our jobs if Apple upped and left to Poland?

CPTM

NIMAN wrote: »

So if Ireland's corp tax rate is made the same as rest of Europe, all the multinationals will up sticks and leave Ireland because these companies can get the same tax rate elsewhere?

That doesn't make sense, when they have operations already up and running here, staff in place, buildings secured etc.

If their staff can't find anywhere to live and the wages are cheaper elsewhere I can see some reasons to pack up and leave. What about attracting foreign investment - The next Googles/Apples? They will come, and they will leave when they see the state of our housing/health/immigration system. Do you know, to get a critically skilled worker into the country (a worker which we've described as something have have a vital need for) it is currently taking over 4 months to process. England can process this within 2 weeks. I wouldn't come near ireland if I were a multinational company aside from the tax break. We don't even have good weather for the senior decision makers to go golfing in!

Alpha_zero

Europe motivation behind their stance on Apple is political, many companies received the same sort of state aid as Apple did.

Apple probably are one of the largest employers in this country and their large scale presence has facilitated many other tech companies to develop and generate employment.

What if apple were to scale down its operations here.

Alpha_zero

Netherlands and Luxembourg are popular European destinations that also offer the same bespoke tax arrangements as Ireland.

noodler

God, so many inaccuracies.

Its under appeal by Apple so it can't be spent.

Wed end up having to repatriate it to third countries. It isn't our money.

ARNOLD J RIMMER

Alpha_zero wrote: »

Netherlands and Luxembourg are popular European destinations that also offer the same bespoke tax arrangements as Ireland.

Yeah, Juncker didn't have an issue with it when prime minister of Luxembourg.

ARNOLD J RIMMER

noodler wrote: »

God, so many inaccuracies.

Its under appeal by Apple so it can't be spent.

Wed end up having to repatriate it to third countries. It isn't our money.

Its under appeal from the Irish Government also.

OldMrBrennan83

miece16 wrote: »

Ireland, because this country is backwards

Jobs are worth more.

facehugger99

canonball5 wrote: »

What country would be given 14.3 billion and then turn around and say "ah lads, it's grand, we don't really need it".

A country that realises the importance of the FDI sector to its' economy?

Probably the main reason our economy doesn't look like Greece's.

jmayo

NIMAN wrote: »

So if Ireland's corp tax rate is made the same as rest of Europe, all the multinationals will up sticks and leave Ireland because these companies can get the same tax rate elsewhere?

That doesn't make sense, when they have operations already up and running here, staff in place, buildings secured etc.

Remember Dell moving manufacturing to Poland.

You have probably more chance of hanging on to someone like Intel who have some major capital investment here, but the likes of your software development companies or internet based companies with development, management, support, finance based here could move very quickly to a more tax friendly environment.
That means Microsoft, Google, Facebook, Paypal, Linkedin, eBay could move if they needed to.

Watch how fast car companies based in UK are going to be moving manufacturing to the likes of Slovakia if there is a hard Brexit.

Nissan, Toyota, BMW, Ford, Jaguar-Landrover (Tata) have all warned British government that the industry directly employing over 850,000 people (in manufacturing and component supply) and generating annual turnover of over $110 billion is at stake.

Alpha_zero wrote: »

Europe motivation behind their stance on Apple is political, many companies received the same sort of state aid as Apple did.

Apple probably are one of the largest employers in this country and their large scale presence has facilitated many other tech companies to develop and generate employment.

What if apple were to scale down its operations here.

Hell the french bailed out PSA (Peugeot Citroen group) in 2014 when it looked like their GM deal had turned sour and they would lay off anything up to 10,000 staff in France.
They claimed it wasn't state aid since they only took a 13% stake in the company.

These are the sames shytes forever carping about us giving state aid to companies through low corporate taxes. :mad:

Guy:Incognito

canonball5 wrote: »

What country would be given 14.3 billion and then turn around and say "ah lads, it's grand, we don't really need it".

A country that doesn't want to open itself up to anything by admitting it broke the rules in the first place?

jmayo

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

A country that doesn't want to open itself up to anything by admitting it broke the rules in the first place?

Ah yes the rules.
Would these be like the rules like the ones concerning keeping the budget deficit in check that are meant to be adhered to by the likes of Ireland and Greece, but not France or Italy?
Perhaps we are talking about rules around acceptance of refugees/asylum seekers ala the Dublin Regulation that the German chancellor threw out the window when it suited her ?

Speaking of taxes, it seems that Rules are rather like taxes.
They are for the little people or the little countries.

snotboogie

canonball5 wrote: »

Yes I do. We have shown that we're completely incompetent when it comes to our own tax regulation and perhaps they could do a better job. At the very least they couldn't do a worse job.

You can’t be serious, I can understand moral qualms concerning our corporate tax regulation but it’s probably the most successful use of tax regulation in the world, either us or Singapore.

noodler

jmayo wrote: »

Ah yes the rules.
Would these be like the rules like the ones concerning keeping the budget deficit in check that are meant to be adhered to by the likes of Ireland and Greece, but not France or Italy?
Perhaps we are talking about rules around acceptance of refugees/asylum seekers ala the Dublin Regulation that the German chancellor threw out the window when it suited her ?

Speaking of taxes, it seems that Rules are rather like taxes.
They are for the little people or the little countries.

Jesus.

I seen some random whataboutery on this site before but that's up there.

jammiedodgers

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

The money is just resting in our account

It's our money, we just don't to fill out the forms

soups05

ok lads, how about this for a suggestion.

Leo can fly over and have a closed door meeting with the big boys of the EU. He can lay it out like this

Lads, ye are gonna ruin the country if ye keep this up so here is what we are gonna do...

We will keep the 14 bill...cheers for that

We will lower our corp tax...lets say 6% AND offer better rates to anyone pulling outta the EU block to come here.

We will drop outta the EU making vague claims (like the ones posted here already) about corruption, dodgy taxes etc in the EU.

We will join Britain in trade partnership so no hard border...screw you junker.

We will ring up our kindly uncle Donald and tell him he was right and the EU is full of commies and muslims and request he make us the newest state in the US in return for massive amounts of missles/tanksplanes etc to be based here. (think of the jobs that would bring in)

we then ditch the Euro for the almighty Dollar and erect a giant two fingered salut in the direction of Brussels.

Now if we could just figure how to move the whole country to the east coast of the US, somewhere warm like, then we be set.

anyone got Elon musks number handy? he seems like a bright lad who's up for a challenge.

noodler

soups05 wrote: »

ok lads, how about this for a suggestion.

Leo can fly over and have a closed door meeting with the big boys of the EU. He can lay it out like this

Lads, ye are gonna ruin the country if ye keep this up so here is what we are gonna do...

We will keep the 14 bill...cheers for that

We will lower our corp tax...lets say 6% AND offer better rates to anyone pulling outta the EU block to come here.

We will drop outta the EU making vague claims (like the ones posted here already) about corruption, dodgy taxes etc in the EU.

We will join Britain in trade partnership so no hard border...screw you junker.

We will ring up our kindly uncle Donald and tell him he was right and the EU is full of commies and muslims and request he make us the newest state in the US in return for massive amounts of missles/tanksplanes etc to be based here. (think of the jobs that would bring in)

we then ditch the Euro for the almighty Dollar and erect a giant two fingered salut in the direction of Brussels.

Now if we could just figure how to move the whole country to the east coast of the US, somewhere warm like, then we be set.

anyone got Elon musks number handy? he seems like a bright lad who's up for a challenge.

Well you are joking at all but.

Its not our money it will be claimed by other countries.

Lower CT rate isn't as much use if we are outside the EU.

Ditching one currency we can't control for another we can't control seems pointless.

soups05

ah c'mon noodler, at least back me on the moving the country to somewhere warmer bit

noodler

soups05 wrote: »

ah c'mon noodler, at least back me on the moving the country to somewhere warmer bit

Fine

doolox

The place that the Donald says did not lose as many people in the recent storms as it really did.

Out of the frying pan into the fire.