Star Trek: Picard - Amazon Prime [** POSSIBLE SPOILERS **]

Calhoun

The amazon prime paying off , im looking forward to it.

FutureGuy

Burty teaching me lots of new words. Klutzman and Disgracery.

AtomicHorror

FutureGuy wrote: »

Burty teaching me lots of new words. Klutzman and Disgracery.

FutureMan! You'd expect someone who considers themselves the gatekeeper of Trek canon to have been particular about your username...

Calhoun wrote: »

The amazon prime paying off , im looking forward to it.

Keep debating whether to keep the subscription but they keep us coming back.

My wife subscribed for Outlander, I supported it for the sake of American Gods and the Expanse. Now I'm addicted to Outlander, and Picard is on the way. We're now debating Apple TV and Disney+... both have merits.

If Picard ends up disappointing, then I'm sure there'll be another Trek along shortly. Bit like Doctor Who in that way.

Calhoun

AtomicHorror wrote: »

Keep debating whether to keep the subscription but they keep us coming back.

My wife subscribed for Outlander, I supported it for the sake of American Gods and the Expanse. Now I'm addicted to Outlander, and Picard is on the way. We're now debating Apple TV and Disney+... both have merits.

If Picard ends up disappointing, then I'm sure there'll be another Trek along shortly. Bit like Doctor Who in that way.

I love the delivery service that comes with it so for me that pays for it but exclusive programs like Picard will keep it a bit longer. Only pity with all these services is they are becoming too fragmented, some of the other amazon stuff is not very good.

pixelburp

AtomicHorror wrote: »

[...]
Keep debating whether to keep the subscription but they keep us coming back.

My wife subscribed for Outlander, I supported it for the sake of American Gods and the Expanse. Now I'm addicted to Outlander, and Picard is on the way. We're now debating Apple TV and Disney+... both have merits.

If Picard ends up disappointing, then I'm sure there'll be another Trek along shortly. Bit like Doctor Who in that way.

Amazon has a fewer TV options than Netflix (so am in the same boat as you), but that's probably because the latter is notorious for its "Moar Content!!!" approach to programming.

To throw out some suggestions to you both: Man in the High Castle, Sneaky Pete, Carnival Row (ish), Marvellous Mrs. Maisel are a couple more Amazon Originals worth checking out if you haven't already (forgive the off-topic'ness)

FutureGuy

AtomicHorror wrote: »

FutureMan! You'd expect someone who considers themselves the gatekeeper of Trek canon to have been particular about your username...

The irony is not lost on me!

AMKC

Just seen it advertised there while watching DS9 on the SYFY channel. Cool.

I vwonder how long it will be before its on terrestial T.V? just like Discovery is now

Brian?

Evade wrote: »

I like them, I think people should watch them, but great? I can't agree. There are a couple of really good episodes but there are a lot of dire ones too.

Great at the time. You can’t judge them through a modern lens.

AtomicHorror

Brian? wrote: »

Great at the time. You can’t judge them through a modern lens.

Not sure that defense holds up. Seasons 3 and 4 have held much better under the modern lens. Besides which, I'd guess most of us remember feeling that way about them in 89/90. It didn't take much hindsight.

There are some standout episodes in the first two seasons. But there was also Star Trek's only clip-show episode. Barf.

helimachoptor

Cannot wait for this, a week away

Rawr

AtomicHorror wrote: »

Not sure that defense holds up. Seasons 3 and 4 have held much better under the modern lens. Besides which, I'd guess most of us remember feeling that way about them in 89/90. It didn't take much hindsight.

There are some standout episodes in the first two seasons. But there was also Star Trek's only clip-show episode. Barf.

+1
I would agree too. Although it is clear that TNG is a product of 80's and early 90's television, there are certain elements of TNG(and indeed any good show regardless of era) that translate well to now. Specifically character development and well put together stories that I feel can resonate with modern audiences.

The episodic style of TNG-era shows stick out as a trait of typical 90's era shows that aired before long story arcs became more common, but beyond that it was still good sci-fi.

But that said, yes there were some bad episodes back in the day including the infamous clip-show...

pixelburp

Brian? wrote: »

Great at the time. You can’t judge them through a modern lens.

Naw, TNG was ropey in those early seasons and the reasons for the wonky scripts are well known and documented. Hard to write competent, interesting scripts when Rodenberry's lawyer was preventing literal character conflict in the pages among other issues, and the end result was there on screen.

FutureGuy

Watched I, Borg last night with the missus. Enjoyed it far more than I remember I did. Will watch Descent I and II tonight.

Evade

Brian? wrote: »

Great at the time. You can’t judge them through a modern lens.

I don't do that. I'm only comparing TNG to TNG and seasons one and two are by far the weakest.

Brian?

Evade wrote: »

I don't do that. I'm only comparing TNG to TNG and seasons one and two are by far the weakest.

It’s all subjective, of course, but I still think they were fantastic.

Some episodes weren’t great, but they were still pretty good. I never finished one dissatisfied, the only time I was unhappy was when I missed one and had no idea when it’d be on again.

Brian?

pixelburp wrote: »

Naw, TNG was ropey in those early seasons and the reasons for the wonky scripts are well known and documented. Hard to write competent, interesting scripts when Rodenberry's lawyer was preventing literal character conflict in the pages among other issues, and the end result was there on screen.

That may be your opinion, man*. But I loved them and I really don’t think I’m the only one.

I’m going out on a limb here. This is controversial, I know. But it’s the first 2 seasons of TNG were better than the first 2 seasons of any subsequent Star Trek series. They were better than any series of Enterprise and better than most seasons of Voyager.

*i have no idea if you’re a man.

Evade

Brian? wrote: »

Some episodes weren’t great, but they were still pretty good. I never finished one dissatisfied, the only time I was unhappy was when I missed one and had no idea when it’d be on again.

If we're talking watching them as a kid I probably enjoyed all of them. I was fortunate to have Sky One back then so if I missed it at 5pm it was on again at 10pm.

Season one and two of DS9 are better. I was watching the season two opening trilogy last night and it holds up very well.

pixelburp

Brian? wrote: »

That may be your opinion, man*. But I loved them and I really don’t think I’m the only one.

I’m going out on a limb here. This is controversial, I know. But it’s the first 2 seasons of TNG were better than the first 2 seasons of any subsequent Star Trek series. They were better than any series of Enterprise and better than most seasons of Voyager.

*i have no idea if you’re a man.

Of course, but I think you said you watched TNG as it aired first time? Dare I say your love for those seasons is grounded in that emotional connection you had from the excitement at "new Trek". Not a judgement, nor trying to claim objectivism or anything, just that there's a context IMO that probably adds an extra texture to your watching of - say - "Angel One" compared with mine

I've found that most SciFi during their first seasons are usually kinda terrible - most often because those first episodes have to cover a lot of world-building, introductions, exposition & simply the writers discovering what WORKS in their show. Off the top of my head: TNG; DS9; Enterprise; Farscape; Babylon 5; The 100; Agents of SHIELD; The Expanse; Firefly , to name a few. All very variable in quality while the kinks were worked out.

Still to this day, the BSG reboot remains the only show I've watched where it nailed it within that first season, with even one of the series' best episodes being the very first - "33". A premise and plot that to this day remains untapped and generally unrepeated.

Evade

pixelburp wrote: »

Still to this day, the BSG reboot remains the only show I've watched where it nailed it within that first season, with even one of the series' best episodes being the very first - "33". A premise and plot that to this day remains untapped and generally unrepeated.

BSG had a huge advantage in starting with a mini series, that got a lot of the bumpiness out of the way.

TheIrishGrover

Evade wrote: »

BSG had a huge advantage in starting with a mini series, that got a lot of the bumpiness out of the way.

True. But even so, the miniseries itself hit the ground running. Taking the miniseries and season 1 together, it was simply stunning how much it nailed. A simply stunningly confident season 1. When you consider:

"Rebooting that Star Wars knock off with Face and from The A-Team and Paw from Bonanza and that robot monkey/dog thing and annoying kid? Really? And Starbuck's a woman now? OMG How can we blame Kathleen Kennedy this time?"

Within the first 30 mins of the miniseries all doubts were cast aside. I remember a friend had saved the miniseries when it was on Sky. Showed it to me a couple of weeks later over a couple of beers. He put on the first episode. I didn't say a word throughout. At the end he said "Oh, not your thing? OK, we'll put on something else" "HELL NO! that was fantastic!!"

And that was FIFTEEN YEARS AGO!

Evade

TheIrishGrover wrote: »

True. But even so, the miniseries itself hit the ground running. Taking the miniseries and season 1 together, it was simply stunning how much it nailed. A simply stunningly confident season 1. When you consider:

It was very good but I wonder if it had started off with a series how long odd things like Six's glowing spine and Earth being a hidden military base would have gone on.

Rawr

TheIrishGrover wrote: »

True. But even so, the miniseries itself hit the ground running. Taking the miniseries and season 1 together, it was simply stunning how much it nailed. A simply stunningly confident season 1. When you consider:

I remember being surprised how good a job they managed of that reboot. I had grown up with the original and the Cylons were always a favorite "baddie" on my list.

On watching the mini-series I was unsure though. I wasn't really into the redesigned Galactica, or the redesigns of the Cylon Base-ships / Raiders. I also had a really bad feeling about the "Human-cylons" meaning that they never bother with the cost of costuming/CGIing Cylon centurions and just have actors being "Secret Cylons". Swapping Starbuck's gender was something I was unsure of too. Starbuck had always been a cigar-smoking cheeky playboy, and I didn't see a gender swap working there. However it did work. She wasn't really "Starbuck" though, more Kara Thaise really and very much a clearly different character which her own development independent of the original and I liked that. Effort was clearly spent.

And this kind of is a point the comes into my head now and again. You can of course take a franchise or show from 20, 30 or 40 years ago, and update it with modern techniques. But what matters in the end is the effort put into it. Effort into story, effort into character development effort into making it a complete satisfying experience. The BSG reboot pulled it off. Other reboots have too, and Picard can also do this if they have put the effort in.

If they can avoid tossing around plot-salad like they delivered in the last season of Discovery and put it all together into a quality story, then I think we're going to have a good time.

However, if they have simply run around the place for the past year like headless chickens, putting the words "Picard" "Borg" "Romulans" and "Deux ex machina" into a random word generator for their plot...then I'm probably not going to be very happy.

I'm hoping for the former to be the case.

pixelburp

A proper clip of the show has popped up; nothing spoiler'y, it's just scene setting of Picard's life at his vineyard:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8tdEKz_vFc

marcbrophy

I just noticed that today is 17/01
Happy Enterprise Day folks!

Sorry

Anyway, here's hoping we all enjoy Picard next Friday

_Kaiser_

pixelburp wrote: »

A proper clip of the show has popped up; nothing spoiler'y, it's just scene setting of Picard's life at his vineyard:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8tdEKz_vFc

I like it. Very different tone of course, but having Picard finally speak French is a nice touch!

And in weird reference of the day, it reminded me of this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=klbetjyK0oE

Ah JR/Larry Hagman. Like Picard, he was a legend

pixelburp

Funny, I listened to the French and my first instinct was "wait, surely with the Universal Translators, Picard always spoke French?" That thought quickly followed by "... oh god no, I've become THAT kind of fan"

_Kaiser_

pixelburp wrote: »

Funny, I listened to the French and my first instinct was "wait, surely with the Universal Translators, Picard always spoke French?" That thought quickly followed by "... oh god no, I've become THAT kind of fan"

My first thought was, ah feck.. someone uploaded a French clip!

Stark

I over-analysed it too.

I figure in the 24th century, French has become a minority language and Picard speaks it in the same way an Irish person might speak Irish. ie: infrequently and not in most day to day conversations. I seem to recall him speaking a few words of French on TNG as well but very infrequently.

Evade

Didn't data refer to it as an archaic language in Up the Long Ladder? Picard was not impressed. I think he spoke French to his grandmother when they went to the fantasy galaxy.

AMKC

marcbrophy wrote: »

I just noticed that today is 17/01
Happy Enterprise Day folks!

Sorry

Anyway, here's hoping we all enjoy Picard next Friday

Such a pity it was not out today. They missed a trick there. Of course in America that would be 01/17 as they are backwards a bit.

So Patrick Stewart is on The Graham Norton Show tonight. Who is going to watch it?

I am going to record it myself and wait till I have seen a couple of episodes of Picard before I watch it incase there is a spoiler in it.