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The Liam Miller memorial match and Rule 42

  • 21-07-2018 6:38am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 22,384 ✭✭✭✭ Conor74


    Surprised that the issue that has put the GAA into the front pages and headlines is not the subject of a thread.

    Thoughts?

    For me the ban is patently ridiculous in this day and age, when across the world other sports share facilities where possible to optimise funding, share costs etc.

    On the other hand, what's also ridiculous is the sight of politicians and public figures coming out, pretending to be surprised by it and having a go at the GAA when it's been in place since time immemorial. And Government after Government has handed huge cheques to the GAA knowing full well of the restrictions in place. There was at least an implied acceptance of the situation.

    While it may be too late for Liam Miller's family, hopefully the outcry will see the matter back on the agenda and the appropriate Motion will be brought and vote cast to prevent this happening again.


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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,447 ✭✭✭ Sheep breeder


    Look the gaa treated their own bad this summer in wicklow and Kildare over playing matches on their own grounds.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,437 ✭✭✭ harr


    Once an organisation get public money and grant money to build /improve facilities those facilities should be for the public to use and not to line the pockets of said organisation.
    Was there not an EU ruling on this matter?


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,339 ✭✭✭ threeball


    The top brass could have overturned a very negative year for them by classifying this as a charity event and allowing it to ahead. Instead they launched themselves headlong into another battle on the PR front.

    The statement they released I presume came from Alan Milton. If so the guy should be sacked. PR is about getting people on side. Talking about taking legal advise to determine that you're right is not the way to go about that. He made a total shambles of the Newbridge fiasco too. The performance on newstalk was combative and cringeworthy.

    The GAA have won no friends this year and fell out with a lot of supporters. They're eroding goodwill at a rate not seen before and I don't see it stopping anytime soon. I think we're less than 10yrs away from them being a carbon copy of the FA or FAI where only the elite matter to them.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,275 ✭✭✭✭ Fr Tod Umptious


    There is a certain cohort of "soccer people" in this country that are in constant jealousy of the GAA and when things like this come up they shout as loud as they can.

    I certainly think that, in the future, the GAA can amend it's rules to allow certain circumstance like this, just like it did for the RWC and for Croke Park.

    I don't think the GAA have done anything wrong here, they have a rule and it's a rule that cannot be changed on the fly.
    But as I said there are always people who will attack the GAA and as the OP said always politicians and the like who will bring this up and act surprised when the GAA say no.

    And this notion that just because the GAA get public funding then their grounds should be open in very very over simplified.

    The GAA give far more back to society than they take out.
    Go to another country and you will find swathes and swathes of "playing fields" and public facilities, and payed for by taxpayers and maintained by local councils.

    You don't have that in Ireland, what you do have are thousands of GAA facalities, payed for in part by the tax payers, but largely by the club members and maintained by the hard work and dedication of local club members.

    They save the tax payer millions every year when it comes to the provision of facilities.

    And other sports bodies get funding too remember.

    Because this is very much a Cork soccer event on a Tuesday afternoon in September I think the right play for it is Turners Cross, it will be a far more "authentic" way to celebrate the mans life.

    And you can be damn sure many Cork GAA fans will be there and many many more will contribute towrads the fund.


  • Registered Users Posts: 22,384 ✭✭✭✭ Conor74


    harr wrote: »
    Was there not an EU ruling on this matter?

    I have seen reference to this elsewhere.

    If there is, that's serious. But not for the GAA. But for the civil service officials or Government department that authorised the grant when the dogs on the street know the GAA rule.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 21,746 ✭✭✭✭ ted1


    harr wrote: »
    Once an organisation get public money and grant money to build /improve facilities those facilities should be for the public to use and not to line the pockets of said organisation.
    Was there not an EU ruling on this matter?
    That money is recouped quickly enough.
    It provides a venue for concerts which fill the hotel , pubs and restaurants. Jobs created, taxes paid and money pumped into the local community.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭ Bonniedog


    I agree with Tod.

    We have all sorts of characters jumping on the band wagon to try to browbeat the GAA on this.

    Were they even asked by the organisers before they began to talk up the use of PUC?

    I have to confess I never heard of the chap Miller so no idea of how popular he is, but given that Cork City's average attendance is around 4,000, it is surely huge leap of imagination to assume they might even half fill PUC.

    As Tod said there are a lot of soccer people here who hate the GAA. FAI demonstrated this when allowed use Croke Park, by changing the name of Hill 16 to "North Terrace" on their tickets. Anyone who thinks that was other than childish reflection of their hatred and jealousy of the GAA is naïve.


  • Registered Users Posts: 22,384 ✭✭✭✭ Conor74


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    I have to confess I never heard of the chap Miller so no idea of how popular he is, but given that Cork City's average attendance is around 4,000, it is surely huge leap of imagination to assume they might even half fill PUC.

    As well as Cork City FC he also played for Manchester United and Celtic - clubs with a huge following here - and the Irish national side.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭ Bonniedog


    Right. And is the Aviva closed then?


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,275 ✭✭✭✭ Fr Tod Umptious


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    I agree with Tod.

    We have all sorts of characters jumping on the band wagon to try to browbeat the GAA on this.

    Were they even asked by the organisers before they began to talk up the use of PUC?

    I have to confess I never heard of the chap Miller so no idea of how popular he is,
    but given that Cork City's average attendance is around 4,000, it is surely huge leap of imagination to assume they might even half fill PUC.

    As Tod said there are a lot of soccer people here who hate the GAA. FAI demonstrated this when allowed use Croke Park, by changing the name of Hill 16 to "North Terrace" on their tickets. Anyone who thinks that was other than childish reflection of their hatred and jealousy of the GAA is na.

    He played in the premier league and for Ireland, he was a bit of a journey man, had a stint with Man Utd but never really made it there, not unlike many of the current Ireland team.

    But he was from Cork, and like all things Cork he was a big deal for Cork people.

    And that's why I also think moving it out of Turner's Cross would take away from the event. It's a Cork City FC/Cork soccer event.
    They should celebrate him on their own patch.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 22,384 ✭✭✭✭ Conor74


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    Right. And is the Aviva closed then?

    He's from Cork.

    The Aviva is in Dublin.


  • Registered Users Posts: 27,192 ✭✭✭✭ super_furry


    Conor74 wrote: »

    While it may be too late for Liam Miller's family, hopefully the outcry will see the matter back on the agenda and the appropriate Motion will be brought and vote cast to prevent this happening again.

    What makes you think it would pass? For many in charge of the GAA and people here it seems too, things are very much working as intended right now.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,004 ✭✭✭ C__MC


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    Right. And is the Aviva closed then?

    They want to play it in his own county- where he was from be silly to drag it to Dublin


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,004 ✭✭✭ C__MC


    Wasn’t there American football in croker a while back? It’s ridiculous to be fair but the GAA are stuck in the Stone Age on certain things.


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,746 ✭✭✭✭ ted1


    C__MC wrote: »
    Wasn’t there American football in croker a while back? It’s ridiculous to be fair but the GAA are stuck in the Stone Age on certain things.
    American football does not compete for players with the GAA.
    They would have planned long in advance. Not 2 months before hand.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭ Bonniedog


    C__MC wrote: »
    They want to play it in his own county- where he was from be silly to drag it to Dublin

    No-one is asking them to. They can have it in Cork city ground. He didn't play for Cork GAA.

    The arrangements for the soccer and rugby internationals in CP was a one off. We can't have situation where GAA is being pressurised to host other sports at the drop of a hat. Especially by people who have no time for us.

    Unlike the FAI, the GAA is a democratic organisation that requires the consent of its members, not the whim of some unaccountable oligarch. You would imagine that former President Kelly might be aware of this,


  • Registered Users Posts: 27,192 ✭✭✭✭ super_furry


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    No-one is asking them to. They can have it in Cork city ground. He didn't play for Cork GAA.


    https://twitter.com/con_oregan/status/1020228615655444481?s=21


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,989 ✭✭✭ theoneeyedman


    Look on the face of it, I personally have no problem with the game in PUC, but as usual the 'issue' is being used to bash the GAA for having the vision to build stadia around the country.

    The 'tax payers money' argument is interesting. There is tax payers money invested in ballyliffan golf course, can I organise a charity rugby game there? There was tax payers money given to St Vincent's hospital for example, can I just demand to use some of their facilities when I want? No, no I can't.

    As an aside, I assume all of the participants in this charity event are doing so free gratis, for nothing, and without huge 'expenses'. I've seen some of the costs involved with these 'charity' soccer events in the UK in the last and they would make your eyes water, with appearance money/expenses etc (Eric Cantona springs to mind). I certainly hope all of the money raised wherever it is held goes to the Miller family trust.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,275 ✭✭✭✭ Fr Tod Umptious



    Padraig Harrington played football in Croke Park, should they play a pitch and putt tournament there ?

    Miller's game was soccer and that was his career and that's what he played at the highest level, that's what he represented Ireland at.

    Not GAA.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,167 ✭✭✭ B-D-P--


    So if the gaa don't back down, it has to be played in a 7000 seater stadium in cork.... Why not the Aviva??


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,934 ✭✭✭ dixiefly


    harr wrote: »
    Once an organisation get public money and grant money to build /improve facilities those facilities should be for the public to use and not to line the pockets of said organisation.
    Was there not an EU ruling on this matter?


    Is this the Alan Milton you are referring to?

    Experienced Head Of Media Relations with a demonstrated history of working in the sports industry. Skilled in Crisis Communications, Event Management, Editing, Journalism, and Public Speaking. Strong media and communication professional with a Master of Arts (MA) focused in Journalism from DCU.

    Skilled in crisis communications....yeah right!

    As a by the way, I remember being at an American Football game in Navan in 2012. How did that game get played with this rule in place?


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,339 ✭✭✭ threeball


    Padraig Harrington played football in Croke Park, should they play a pitch and putt tournament there ?

    Miller's game was soccer and that was his career and that's what he played at the highest level, that's what he represented Ireland at.

    Not GAA.

    It's a charity event ffs. A lot of the money is going to a hospice who comfort people through their last agonising days of succumbing to cancer. Many of them will be lifelong gaa members but don't let that get in the way of sticking by "The rules" which this year have been shown can be bent to suit any particular situation.


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,746 ✭✭✭✭ ted1


    dixiefly wrote: »

    As a by the way, I remember being at an American Football game in Navan in 2012. How did that game get played with this rule in place?
    They probably went through the appropriate process and gave plenty of notice.


    There are channels which allow exceptions

    remember this. https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaa-club-fined-2-000-for-allowing-jamie-carragher-soccer-school-on-premises-1.2523022?mode=amp


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,339 ✭✭✭ threeball


    dixiefly wrote: »
    Is this the Alan Milton you are referring to?

    Experienced Head Of Media Relations with a demonstrated history of working in the sports industry. Skilled in Crisis Communications, Event Management, Editing, Journalism, and Public Speaking. Strong media and communication professional with a Master of Arts (MA) focused in Journalism from DCU.

    Skilled in crisis communications....yeah right!

    As a by the way, I remember being at an American Football game in Navan in 2012. How did that game get played with this rule in place?

    Yes, he's an abrasive dipstick. Totally unsuited to PR. Can't remember the last time the GAA had good PR.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 537 Niles Crane


    Conor74 wrote: »
    He's from Cork.

    The Aviva is in Dublin.


    He was a soccer player.

    PUC is a GAA ground.


    The GAA should have turned a blind eye and done the right thing (and they probably will in the end) but lets not pretend that the organisers were completely unaware of the GAA's rule, if they had tried working with the GAA and presenting an argument to them through proper channels permission would have been granted but instead they decided to take the undignified approach and make a big spectacle out of this when there was no need to purely so they could get their little digs in at the GAA.


  • Registered Users Posts: 22,833 ✭✭✭✭ Dyr


    This is a bit like your alcoholic deadbeat relative demanding that his family move into your house because they were put out in the street for him gargling away the rent. Apparently the fact that he doesn't have his **** together is your fault.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,231 ✭✭✭ wonga77


    Bambi wrote: »
    This is a bit like your alcoholic deadbeat relative demanding that his family move into your house because they were put out in the street for him gargling away the rent. Apparently the fact that he doesn't have his **** together is your fault.

    Wat8.jpg?1315930535


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,016 ✭✭✭ Bridge93


    Bambi wrote: »
    This is a bit like your alcoholic deadbeat relative demanding that his family move into your house because they were put out in the street for him gargling away the rent. Apparently the fact that he doesn't have his **** together is your fault.

    This isn't an FAI event. It's a charity event that happens to be a football game


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭ Bonniedog


    Bridge93 wrote: »
    This isn't an FAI event. It's a charity event that happens to be a football game

    Of course it requires FAI involvement!

    You can be certain a lot of people will be wetting their beaks as usual.

    Read some of Dunphy's old articles about the FAI and such events. Neither their "culture" nor nepotism has changed.

    Barge pole - other end of :)


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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,016 ✭✭✭ Bridge93


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    You can be certain a lot of people will be wetting their beaks as usual.

    Read some of Dunphy's old articles about the FAI and such events. Neither their "culture" nor nepotism has changed.

    Barge pole - other end of :)

    I'm sure they will and I've no time for anyone involved with the running of the FAI. If they try hijack this they should be harshly told where to go


This discussion has been closed.
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