The Weird, Wacky and Awesome World of the NFL - General Banter thread V3

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

Oat23 wrote: »

His crime here is being a moron. He's a 77 year old billionaire who got caught getting a rub and tug in a crappy massage parlour when he could easily purchase the services of literally any escort on the planet to come to his home or a hotel.



Or he could have just went to Nevada where brothels are legal.

Exactly that.

jack presley wrote: »

Hasn’t he got a 35 year old girlfriend?

No idea, although the idea of an old, widowed billionaire having a young gf wouldn't surprise me.

Deco99 wrote: »

See this is part of the problem, you're normalising that behaviour as if it's ok. The problem with brothels is it creates a demand for vulnerable women to be taken advantage of. The investigation was into human trafficking and ended up nabbing Kraft and others. Maybe educate yourself. Plus as pointed out he has plenty of cash to not be in that place and get his end away.

Come off it now. With talk like that I hope the device you typed that on and the clothes on your back don't take advantage of any over-worked children in any part of the world.
And is Kraft implicated in any human trafficking charge? Hyperbolic nonsense. He's being charged with soliciting sex, no more.

Adamcp898

eagle eye wrote: »

No, but I'd be pretty shocked if Kraft did that. As I said I'm not sure how much there is to this because of his age.
Even if there was we all know he will never be convicted. He has too much money for that to happen.
His name will be sullied whether he did anything or not.

Why do you keep bringing up his age as if it is of any relevance?

jack presley

Adamcp898 wrote: »

Why do you keep bringing up his age as if it is of any relevance?

Yeah I don't get the age argument either. It's not like he's senile. He's the billionaire head of the most successful American sports franchise of the last 20 years. You don't do that without being on your game mentally.

Although he must have liked the thrill of being in a seedy massage place or something and that's just weird. I'm sure there are loads of classier places within an hour's drive of that place. I was reading that he is still with that 39 year old girlfriend but she recently had a kid but he isn't the father so he hasn't got a normal relationship going in the first place.

eagle eye

Adamcp898 wrote:

Why do you keep bringing up his age as if it is of any relevance?

How many 77 year olds have a working organ?

jack presley

eagle eye wrote: »

How many 77 year olds have a working organ?

I'm not doing it but I'm sure if you searched "sex at 77", Google will throw up some answers. Although expect to see plenty of viagra ads for the following few weeks.

Adamcp898

eagle eye wrote: »

How many 77 year olds have a working organ?

Again. Relevance?

adrian522

Oat23 wrote: »

Now we pray the Niners don't tag Robbie Gould and let him come home.

https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1099078342974885888?s=19

Not sure why Rapsheet thinks he'll find work quickly. Maybe as a camp body but he's not walking into a job after 11 misses including one that cost us a playoff win.

Why wouldn't he? After the bears cut Gould he went on to be one of the best in the league over the next few seasons.

It happens often that a move for a kicker improves fortunes greatly.

Foxtrol

eagle eye wrote: »

Gotta be honest I would be proud to be still able to get it up when I'm 77.
I'm not sure for that very reason, age, that there is much to this.

There are plenty of medications out there that can sort that out.

Serious blinkers to claim there is nothing to this. Even if you ignore the police statement that they have a video evidence of him do you really think he went to a grim looking strip mall for their spa services?

Foxtrol

adrian522 wrote: »

Why wouldn't he? After the bears cut Gould he went on to be one of the best in the league over the next few seasons.

It happens often that a move for a kicker improves fortunes greatly.

Yeah, Bears fans seem to have extremely short memories. They were happy enough to chase Gould out of town after a down period.

I'm on the record of not liking the franchise tag but I'll be annoyed if the 49ers don't tag Gould if they can't come to an agreement before FA. It is the exact situation where it is supposed to be used and if the Bears really want him they can offer a trade.

jack presley

Foxtrol wrote: »

There are plenty of medications out there that can sort that out.

Serious blinkers to claim there is nothing to this. Even if you ignore the police statement that they have a video evidence of him do you really think he went to a grim looking strip mall for their spa services?

I reckon on both occasions just as he was passing by the Orchards of Asia he needed to go to the toilet, and you know 77 year olds, when they have to go they have to go. And while in there he spilled water on his clothes while washing his hands so had to take them off so they could get dried. All completely innocent, wait and see.

Realt Dearg Sec

Foxtrol wrote: »

Yeah, Bears fans seem to have extremely short memories. They were happy enough to chase Gould out of town after a down period.
.

That's nonsense.

jack presley

Seriously though, to be fair to Kraft he did make a $100,000 donation to an anti-people trafficking charity a few years back so I doubt it even crossed his mind that the women there were there against their will. He just let the dick take over his decision making when he wanted to get his end away and maybe like the thrill of doing it in a seedy brothel.

Foxtrol

jack presley wrote: »

I reckon on both occasions just as he was passing by the Orchards of Asia he needed to go to the toilet, and you know 77 year olds, when they have to go they have to go. And while in there he spilled water on his clothes while washing his hands so had to take them off so they could get dried. All completely innocent, wait and see.

As he is a widower this can be the only explanation

eagle eye

Foxtrol wrote:

Serious blinkers to claim there is nothing to this. Even if you ignore the police statement that they have a video evidence of him do you really think he went to a grim looking strip mall for their spa services?

Here we go again, no matter what I'm discussing you are always on the other side.
What have they video evidence of?

Foxtrol

jack presley wrote: »

Seriously though, to be fair to Kraft he did make a $100,000 donation to an anti-people trafficking charity a few years back so I doubt it even crossed his mind that the women there were there against their will. He just let the dick take over his decision making when he wanted to get his end away and maybe like the thrill of doing it in a seedy brothel.

This is probably true but he wouldn't be the first person who gave donations or helped out causes which they themselves were knowingly taking advantage of or hurting. People can use it as cover and/or to make themselves feel better about what they've done. Also, that amount is absolute pennies to him.

Foxtrol

eagle eye wrote: »

Here we go again, no matter what I'm discussing you are always on the other side.
What have they video evidence of?

Maybe if you did some research before automatically defending anything Patriots related we mightn't be on the opposite side so often

Police said Kraft visited the Orchids of Asia Day Spa in Jupiter, Florida, twice. Video footage shows him receiving "paid acts" in a room at the spa and surveillance video shows him being driven to the spa, police Chief Daniel Kerr said Friday.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/22/us/robert-kraft-solicitation/index.html

jack presley

eagle eye wrote: »

Here we go again, no matter what I'm discussing you are always on the other side.
What have they video evidence of?

As of now, we don't know what the video shows apart from him being inside the premises. I doubt they have video of him actually doing the deed so my guess would be it's of money exchanging hands. The police are holding a press conference on Monday so we'll find out more then I'd imagine.

Edit - Foxtrol has a more thorough answer to this.

Oat23

adrian522 wrote: »

Why wouldn't he? After the bears cut Gould he went on to be one of the best in the league over the next few seasons.

It happens often that a move for a kicker improves fortunes greatly.

Robbie Gould was consistently one of the best kickers in the league for years, playing half of his games at the toughest stadium to kick at. A combination of a poor season where he cost us a few games coupled with a big cap hit meant he was let go. He wasn't "run out of town" as Foxtrol seems to think. A business decision was made, a poor one looking back. But as Gould himself has said, being let go is what made him refocus and get back to his best.



That's quite a different situation to Parkey, who has never been great. He has a short range and isn't accurate. He'll get a job in the XFL, maybe.


On top of that he seems to be a sh*tty team mate. The whole team and fan base were still reeling from his miss and he goes on the today show for a damage-control interview without consulting the team. "Me not We" as Nagy called it.

eagle eye

Foxtrol wrote:

Maybe if you did some research before automatically defending anything Patriots related we mightn't be on the opposite side so often

Paid acts is the wording. What does that mean? If I went to a spa and got a foot massage is that a paid act?
I'm not defending anybody. I'm saying I find it hard to believe that he'd be up to much at 77 years of age.
People here talking about viagra and all sorts. When you get to to that age sex isn't very important.

Foxtrol

eagle eye wrote: »

Paid acts is the wording. What does that mean? If I went to a spa and got a foot massage is that a paid act?
I'm not defending anybody. I'm saying I find it hard to believe that he'd be up to much at 77 years of age.
People here talking about viagra and all sorts. When you get to to that age sex isn't very important.

I'm struggling to believe you are really this naive.

jack presley

eagle eye wrote: »

Paid acts is the wording. What does that mean? If I went to a spa and got a foot massage is that a paid act?
I'm not defending anybody. I'm saying I find it hard to believe that he'd be up to much at 77 years of age.
People here talking about viagra and all sorts. When you get to to that age sex isn't very important.

I doubt they'd have arrested him for getting a foot massage. 77 really isn't that old these days. Have you seen the video of him dancing with Cardi B after the Superbowl? He seems quite lively still.

OOnegative

Bob tells Roger I was simply researching a new massage therapist for the Patriots, everyone is happy, matter is forgotten about and we move on.........

Adamcp898

eagle eye wrote: »

Paid acts is the wording. What does that mean? If I went to a spa and got a foot massage is that a paid act?
I'm not defending anybody. I'm saying I find it hard to believe that he'd be up to much at 77 years of age.
People here talking about viagra and all sorts. When you get to to that age sex isn't very important.

Yes. Exactly. With a legal mind like this you should offer your services as a solicitor.

Unfortunately for you though Ol' Bob likes to solicit something entirely different and won't require your services no matter how willing you are to offer them

Deco99

Big Pussy Bonpensiero wrote: »

Come off it now. With talk like that I hope the device you typed that on and the clothes on your back don't take advantage of any over-worked children in any part of the world.
And is Kraft implicated in any human trafficking charge? Hyperbolic nonsense. He's being charged with soliciting sex, no more.

Setting aside the false equivalence, if I owned a child labour factory would it change the point that what he is charged with is not "unlucky" or you "gotta feel for him".

Trying to suggest that we are claiming Kraft is involved with the Human Trafficking is disingenuous. The links between prostitution and sex trafficking are well documented so I don't need to educate on that. I say man making use of brothel, regardless of age, is wrong. If you feel otherwise, that's your view and we disagree.

Foxtrol

Oat23 wrote: »

Robbie Gould was consistently one of the best kickers in the league for years, playing half of his games at the toughest stadium to kick at. A combination of a poor season where he cost us a few games coupled with a big cap hit meant he was let go. He wasn't "run out of town" as Foxtrol seems to think. A business decision was made, a poor one looking back. But as Gould himself has said, being let go is what made him refocus and get back to his best.

That's quite a different situation to Parkey, who has never been great. He has a short range and isn't accurate. He'll get a job in the XFL, maybe.

On top of that he seems to be a sh*tty team mate. The whole team and fan base were still reeling from his miss and he goes on the today show for a damage-control interview without consulting the team. "Me not We" as Nagy called it.

I think it is very much debatable on the kicking situation in that stadium. Other stadiums are on average windier, colder, and have more varied direction.

There are definitely differences and I was somewhat hyperbolic with that phrasing but there are similarities on how the Bears are dealing with this. I feel you're being very harsh on Parkey, his % stats the year before he joined the Bears were better than Gould ever had as a Bear and the stats for his first year in Philly were only topped twice by Gould over his 11 years as a Bear. If Parkey can gain the consistency of his good years he could be very good.

Nagy is one to talk when he (or his coaching staff) were throwing Trubisky under the bus earlier in the season. Standard coaching do as I say, not as I do.

Oat23

Foxtrol wrote: »

I think it is very much debatable on the kicking situation in that stadium. Other stadiums are on average windier, colder, and have more varied direction.

There are definitely differences and I was somewhat hyperbolic with that phrasing but there are similarities on how the Bears are dealing with this. I feel you're being very harsh on Parkey, his % stats the year before he joined the Bears were better than Gould ever had as a Bear and the stats for his first year in Philly were only topped twice by Gould over his 11 years as a Bear. If Parkey can gain the consistency of his good years he could be very good.

Nagy is one to talk when he (or his coaching staff) were throwing Trubisky under the bus earlier in the season. Standard coaching do as I say, not as I do.

% is misleading since we rarely ever trusted him to make a kick beyond 45 as he hasn't got the leg or accuracy for it, so his % is going to be higher that it would otherwise be with a team that trusts their kicker enough to at least give them a chance to make a long kick.

You said he needs to be consistent, which goes for every kicker. Their careers are defined on their consistency. Parkey has had 4 teams in 5 seasons because he isn't consistent. He was injured a few years ago which hasn't helped his career either.

As for Nagy throwing Trubisky under the bus, that's a ridiculous comment. A coach talking sense in press conferences and discussing the flaws his QB needs to work on, a QB he has been hired to develop, is not the same as throwing him under the bus. Nagy doesn't bulls*t people. Earlier on in the season it was obvious Mitch was having problems with accuracy, footwork and going through his reads so why lie when a journalist asks about it? It's a complicated system that takes ages to master. He has said that since he was hired.

eagle eye

Foxtrol wrote:

I'm struggling to believe you are really this naive.

It's about understanding that it's easy to be arrested in a sting without doing anything wrong. Surely the man deserves to be considered innocent until such time as it's proven he did something wrong.
I'm not saying he didn't do something illegal. I'm saying that based on his age and the fact that we don't have any evidence that I'm willing to wait and see. We are on the outside and don't have any information. We know that up to this point Kraft has no history of anything like this so the reasons for me doubting it based on the information we have, and his age, are common sense.
Thankfully I'm not a social media twit who swallows everything posted on there. I don't read the rubbish on Twitter and those other sites. It seems these days that you are guilty on there without any evidence.

Foxtrol

Oat23 wrote: »

% is misleading since we rarely ever trusted him to make a kick beyond 45 as he hasn't got the leg or accuracy for it, so his % is going to be higher that it would otherwise be with a team that trusts their kicker enough to at least give them a chance to make a long kick.

That's fair enough, like most stats they are only useful with context.

You said he needs to be consistent, which goes for every kicker. Their careers are defined on their consistency. Parkey has had 4 teams in 5 seasons because he isn't consistent. He was injured a few years ago which hasn't helped his career either.

Very few kickers are going to never have dips in their performance and if you throw them out when they do you end up in the situation where the Bears are longingly looking at Gould.

You can say 4 teams in 5 seasons but I can easily point to the fact he was so good the year before and the Bears gave him the 3rd highest guaranteed money for a kicker in the league, so there was clearly a number of teams in for him.

As for Nagy throwing Trubisky under the bus, that's a ridiculous comment. A coach talking sense in press conferences and discussing the flaws his QB needs to work on, a QB he has been hired to develop, is not the same as throwing him under the bus. Nagy doesn't bulls*t people. Earlier on in the season it was obvious Mitch was having problems with accuracy, footwork and going through his reads so why lie when a journalist asks about it? It's a complicated system that takes ages to master. He has said that since he was hired.

So it is fine for Nagy to say whatever he wants to journalists but Parkey speaking to the media shows he's a poor teammate? I'm happy to be corrected on these but I didn't see much direct vocal self criticism from Nagy on the mistakes he had during the year or be vocal in defending Parkey after the game as he was to attack him.

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

Deco99 wrote: »

Setting aside the false equivalence, if I owned a child labour factory would it change the point that what he is charged with is not "unlucky" or you "gotta feel for him".

Trying to suggest that we are claiming Kraft is involved with the Human Trafficking is disingenuous. The links between prostitution and sex trafficking are well documented so I don't need to educate on that. I say man making use of brothel, regardless of age, is wrong. If you feel otherwise, that's your view and we disagree.

What are you babbling on about. Your first paragraph doesn't make sense, but keep the patronising comments coming.
The links between clothing manufacturing and child labour are well documented also, if you aren't aware of that maybe you need the education. And yes, the argument is a false equivalence, that was the point of it. You are the one saying he took advantage of trafficked women. He took advantage of trafficked women in the same way you are taking advantage of child labourers.

And obviously my view on what he did is different on this matter.
Were he a 30 something year old, I wouldn't feel bad for him.
Were his wife still alive, I wouldn't feel bad for him.
But Robert Kraft is the owner of an NFL team that I happen to support. He's everything that most fans would want in an owner, and he's done more good in his life than most people could ever aspire to. He was an idiot for doing what he did, and his reputation will take an absolute hammering for something that a lot of elderly, rich people would be guilty of. So yes, I do feel bad for the man.

Foxtrol

eagle eye wrote: »

It's about understanding that it's easy to be arrested in a sting without doing anything wrong. Surely the man deserves to be considered innocent until such time as it's proven he did something wrong.
I'm not saying he didn't do something illegal. I'm saying that based on his age and the fact that we don't have any evidence that I'm willing to wait and see. We are on the outside and don't have any information. We know that up to this point Kraft has no history of anything like this so the reasons for me doubting it based on the information we have, and his age, are common sense.
Thankfully I'm not a social media twit who swallows everything posted on there. I don't read the rubbish on Twitter and those other sites. It seems these days that you are guilty on there without any evidence.

For someone who was happy a few days ago to claim with zero evidence that Kaepernick conned the public with his protest for financial gain you've turned very quickly to shout 'innocent until proven guilty' in this case