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Drought....Hosepipe Ban.... next they'll be calling for Water meters

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    #152
    GreeBo
    Registered Users Posts: 27,053 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    sbsquarepants wrote: »
    You don't remember the flood warnings only 5 or 6 weeks ago? Storm Emma and the beast form the East was what 4 or 5 months ago? Remember all that stuff on the telly, hoping it would thaw slowly so we wouldn't all drown under the vast quantity of melt water!

    I don't know what the actual figures are for the year - but I'd hazard a guess they aren't too much down on average. It's been a few weeks of nice weather. The rain will be back soon enough. It's hardly the Sahara now is it!

    You dont think we are down on average??
    Seriously? It hasnt rained in any significant way in Dublin for over 7 weeks.
    "A few weeks of nice weather"?
    We've had near record temperatures for weeks....are you comparing us to Spain again?

    Thats BallyBunion golf course....you tell me.


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    #153
    GreeBo
    Registered Users Posts: 27,053 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    beveragelady wrote: »
    But I can use all the road I want! It's not like I'm paying for other people to access a service that I can't access myself...

    The well analogy is nonsense. I pay for the well. My tax contributions don't go towards my water supply, they go towards other people's. I pay for my water supply on top of paying for other people's. They don't contribute towards mine at all. There is no way you can pretend that is fair.

    Good lord, I'll try again.

    You pay for your own road usage on top of other peoples.
    Its no different than water.
    If you only want to pay for things you use yourself I suggest you leave society.


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    #154
    GreeBo
    Registered Users Posts: 27,053 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    sbsquarepants wrote: »
    Surely in this day and age there is a better solution than treating every drop of water and then pumping it to a manky tank in the attic so it can be used for showers and flushing toilets!

    This is a wet country - droughts are not an existential threat, it could be decades before we see a run of weather like this again. The problem is not lack of rain it's lack of processing capacity and the seemingly accepted fact that half of everything we do process, we basically just spill on the ground.

    It is pointless telling people to conserve water, while simultaneously wasting half your water. I watered some of the plants out my back last night, just the ones that looked thirsty - I used a watering can and kept track of how much I used - 180L.

    I could let them die and save enough water to keep the leaks going for roughly another 1/16th of 1 second - now wouldn't that just make all the difference. If I do that every second day for the month I've basically used 1 seconds worth of the water that's pissed away to god knows where.

    Maybe worry about fixing that first and how people brush their teeth second!

    If you were the only person drawing water then that would be fine, but multiply your 1s by all the people consuming water during this historic dry period and you get where we are now.

    I totally agree that we should be separating grey water from black water, but if you think the bill for fixing the leaks is going to be expensive, what do you reckon it will cost to re plump every house in the country AND double the number of water pipes?


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    #155
    beveragelady
    Registered Users Posts: 854 ✭✭✭beveragelady


    GreeBo wrote: »
    Good lord, I'll try again.

    You pay for your own road usage on top of other peoples.
    Its no different than water.
    If you only want to pay for things you use yourself I suggest you leave society.

    And I will try one last time too.

    I use the road so I'm required to pay for it.
    I don't use public water, yet I pay for it as well as my own water.
    I pay for what I use, and more. It seems to me that it is glaringly obvious that requiring everybody to pay for ONLY the water they use would be a good thing.

    My taxes pay for the education of children who aren't mine, but that's fine because it benefits the society of which I am part. I pay for for social workers to help people I've never met, because it benefits society. How on earth does it benefit anybody if a measurable, expensive commodity is provided for free to some at the expense of others? It's not just the poor or the disadvantaged who can leave their taps running while I pay for their water and my own, it's those in mansions and stylish townhouses too you know.


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    #156
    nthclare
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,316 ✭✭✭nthclare


    GreeBo wrote: »
    You dont think we are down on average??
    Seriously? It hasnt rained in any significant way in Dublin for over 7 weeks.
    "A few weeks of nice weather"?
    We've had near record temperatures for weeks....are you comparing us to Spain again?

    Thats BallyBunion golf course....you tell me.

    Lahinch golf course looks like a desert too


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    #157
    Roger Hassenforder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    beveragelady wrote: »

    The well analogy is nonsense. I pay for the well. My tax contributions don't go towards my water supply, they go towards other people's. I pay for my water supply on top of paying for other people's. They don't contribute towards mine at all. There is no way you can pretend that is fair.

    ever gotten a grant beverage lady?


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    #158
    Hitman3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭Hitman3000


    Roger Hassenforder wrote:
    ever gotten a grant beverage lady?

    You mean the grant that is avaible to well owners and group schemes?


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    #159
    beveragelady
    Registered Users Posts: 854 ✭✭✭beveragelady


    Roger Hassenforder wrote: »
    ever gotten a grant beverage lady?

    Nope. Now that I think of it, I've never even been given a lousy grant.


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    #160
    my3cents
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,764 ✭✭✭my3cents


    beveragelady wrote: »
    Nope. Now that I think of it, I've never even been given a lousy grant.

    https://www.housing.gov.ie/water/water-services/rural-water-programme/private-wells
    A grant of up to 75% of the cost, subject to a maximum grant of €2,031.58, is available, subject to certain conditions.


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    #161
    beveragelady
    Registered Users Posts: 854 ✭✭✭beveragelady


    Rules for grants for wells...
    https://www.housing.gov.ie/water/water-services/rural-water-programme/private-wells
    Only one grant per house will be allowed in any seven year period
    The proposed work must cost more than €635

    Doesn't have anything to do with the daily costs of running a well...
    Electricity and wear and tear on pump.
    UV and other purification.
    Softening
    Storing
    Well-cleaning, if needed.


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    #162
    Hitman3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭Hitman3000


    beveragelady wrote:
    Rules for grants for wells...


    But there is a grant paid for by other taxpayers who will not benefit from your well.....or the well of another who receives this grant.


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    #163
    my3cents
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,764 ✭✭✭my3cents


    beveragelady wrote: »
    Rules for grants for wells...
    https://www.housing.gov.ie/water/water-services/rural-water-programme/private-wells
    Only one grant per house will be allowed in any seven year period
    The proposed work must cost more than €635

    Doesn't have anything to do with the daily costs of running a well...
    Electricity and wear and tear on pump.
    UV and other purification.
    Softening
    Storing
    Well-cleaning, if needed.

    Softening and storing are your problem but the grant does cover UV and other purification if your water quality is poor.


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    #164
    the_pen_turner
    Registered Users Posts: 7,506 ✭✭✭the_pen_turner


    my3cents wrote: »
    https://www.housing.gov.ie/water/water-services/rural-water-programme/private-wells

    how many houses are there that are older than 7 years and not conected to main and have no mains anywhere near them.

    very few i would guess


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    #165
    shootermacg
    Registered Users Posts: 4,833 ✭✭✭shootermacg


    I buy all my drinking water from the shops. I would barely use the Dublin piss for washing.


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    #166
    my3cents
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,764 ✭✭✭my3cents


    the_pen_turner wrote: »
    how many houses are there that are older than 7 years and not conected to main and have no mains anywhere near them.

    very few i would guess

    So if you need to replace your pump, switch gear and improve your water quality on an existing well then you can easily get the bill to over €635.


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    #167
    sbsquarepants
    Registered Users Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭sbsquarepants


    GreeBo wrote: »
    You dont think we are down on average??
    Seriously? It hasnt rained in any significant way in Dublin for over 7 weeks.
    "A few weeks of nice weather"?.

    I'd say we're down alright - I just don't know by how much (Do you know?)
    I suspect not by that huge an amount and I'm absolutely sure that we'll catch back up again in the very near future.
    It's just a few weeks of nice weather. We haven't turned into Qatar.
    GreeBo wrote: »
    We've had near record temperatures for weeks....are you comparing us to Spain again?.

    I think you have me mixed up with someone else.


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    #168
    the_pen_turner
    Registered Users Posts: 7,506 ✭✭✭the_pen_turner


    my3cents wrote: »
    So if you need to replace your pump, switch gear and improve your water quality on an existing well then you can easily get the bill to over €635.

    thats great but the mains passes most homes in the country. it would only be the very remote that would even qualify.


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    #169
    Roger Hassenforder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    beveragelady wrote: »
    Nope. Now that I think of it, I've never even been given a lousy grant.

    hmmmm

    whats your LPT rate?


    I suppose there's no point asking whether you have you agricultural land, with nice road frontage, funded by the tax payer?

    those roads you use to access your rural house?
    is your tax contribution proportional to the length of road and the cost of it maintenance?


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    #170
    Roger Hassenforder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    the_pen_turner wrote: »
    thats great but the mains passes most homes in the country. it would only be the very remote that would even qualify.

    11% of the population are on wells


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    #171
    the_pen_turner
    Registered Users Posts: 7,506 ✭✭✭the_pen_turner


    Roger Hassenforder wrote: »
    11% of the population are on wells

    thats not relivent to that grant.
    you must not have access to mains near by. that would rule out a lot of that 11%.
    it rules me and everyone i can think of with a well out


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    #172
    my3cents
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,764 ✭✭✭my3cents


    the_pen_turner wrote: »
    thats not relivent to that grant.
    you must not have access to mains near by. that would rule out a lot of that 11%.
    it rules me and everyone i can think of with a well out

    Then why don't they get connect to the mains supply if its so expensive to have your own well?

    No one I know with a well has any choice in the matter except a neighbor who put one in so he didn't have to pay water bills LOL :D


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    #173
    BarryD2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,732 ✭✭✭BarryD2


    beveragelady wrote: »
    It's complete nonsense to suggest that there are (or were) rules against harvesting rainwater, or gathering your own water in any other way. In fact on the website they encourage rainwater harvesting to water gardens.
    This is exactly the sort of stupid argument dim people made, and very dim people got worked up about, when there were protests against paying for water.

    They were the blind leading the gullible.


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    #174
    GreeBo
    Registered Users Posts: 27,053 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    beveragelady wrote: »
    My taxes pay for the education of children who aren't mine, but that's fine because it benefits the society of which I am part. I pay for for social workers to help people I've never met, because it benefits society. How on earth does it benefit anybody if a measurable, expensive commodity is provided for free to some at the expense of others? It's not just the poor or the disadvantaged who can leave their taps running while I pay for their water and my own, it's those in mansions and stylish townhouses too you know.

    You don't see how providing water for people who need to use public water is good for society?:confused:

    BTW, its not provided for free to anyone.


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    #175
    BarryD2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,732 ✭✭✭BarryD2


    my3cents wrote: »
    https://www.housing.gov.ie/water/water-services/rural-water-programme/private-wells

    FYI, we got a new well bored and pump installed last year as previous wells were failing. Total cost c €7,500 plus a good bit of work. Grant €2031. That leaves us paying €5,000+ and running costs etc. That amounts to more than 30 YEARS of your miserably low average €150 annual public water bills.

    Put this on top of significant previous (ungranted) expenditure on wells, pumps and water treatment.

    People who live on public water supplies have little concept of how lucky they are and it'll only hit home when the taps dry up. Then the sh*t will hit the fan.
    the_pen_turner wrote: »
    how many houses are there that are older than 7 years and not conected to main and have no mains anywhere near them.

    very few i would guess

    That is a real urban viewpoint. A great many dwellings are located far from public water & sewage systems.


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    #176
    BarryD2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,732 ✭✭✭BarryD2


    GreeBo wrote: »
    You don't see how providing water for people who need to use public water is good for society?:confused:

    BTW, its not provided for free to anyone.

    You might as well argue that FREE Sky Sports, FREE internet, FREE electricity, FREE heating oil etc etc is all good for society.

    Of course, they'd be great and wouldn't we all like to use these to our hearts content.. but that ain't the way that society runs.


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    #177
    Roger Hassenforder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    the_pen_turner wrote: »
    thats not relivent to that grant.
    you must not have access to mains near by. that would rule out a lot of that 11%.
    it rules me and everyone i can think of with a well out

    Eh no.
    Nice attempted recovery though :)

    Wayer mains dont pass all but the " most remote" places. A lot of Ireland isnt on mains water, even less on mains sewer.


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    #178
    K.Flyer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,565 ✭✭✭K.Flyer


    Roger Hassenforder wrote: »
    Eh no.
    Nice attempted recovery though :)

    Wayer mains dont pass all but the " most remote" places. A lot of Ireland isnt on mains water, even less on mains sewer.

    You would be surprised how many houses surrounding Dublin who are actually stuck on wells, and you would be forgiven for thinking that they are on mains given their proximity to Dublin.
    My brother is on a well and would happily pay to get connected to the mains, but the computer says no!
    Its a bit like broadband etc, two telegraph poles away are fine, but after that its smoke signals.


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    #179
    Hitman3000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭Hitman3000


    K.Flyer wrote:
    You would be surprised how many houses surrounding Dublin who are actually stuck on wells, and you would be forgiven for thinking that they are on mains given their proximity to Dublin. My brother is on a well and would happily pay to get connected to the mains, but the computer says no! Its a bit like broadband etc, two telegraph poles away are fine, but after that its smoke signals.


    Did he find out the water supply was a well before or after he bought the house?


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    #180
    Elmer Blooker
    Registered Users Posts: 6,042 ✭✭✭Elmer Blooker


    Hector Bellend wrote: »
    Yeah. It's about time we grew up and paid for our water.
    Pay who? Some big North American conglomerate? I'm convinced Irish Water was set up to be privatised. I would have no problem paying for the water I use if my money stayed in the country to fix leaking pipes but would it? :pac:


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    #181
    BarryD2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,732 ✭✭✭BarryD2


    Elmer Blooker wrote: »
    Pay who? Some big North American conglomerate? I'm convinced Irish Water was set up to be privatised. I would have no problem paying for the water I use if my money stayed in the country to fix leaking pipes but would it? :pac:

    That's an easy out. It all comes down to who you want believe. Is it the various political parties that have been running the state since it's foundation or those who are seeking to raise their profile and happy to run any agenda, mislead the public etc., in their pursuit of votes??

    The idea that the water of Ireland and the impossibility of defining that, is to be sold off to some USA multi national is just baloney.


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