Waterford GAA thread - mod warning post #1 and #51

Jjjjjjjjbarry

DiscoStew wrote: »

With players leaving the panel at present it might be worth thinking back on the present club campaign to see what players could potentially be brought in to a training panel now.
Avoiding the usual types who have been a part of the panel before and are unlikely to receive a recall these would be the picks for me.

Dessie Hutchinson (very obvious)
Jack Fagan
Evan McGrath (Mt. Sion)
Conor Sheahan (Ballygunner)
David Prendergast (Lismore - not sure if has been a part of the panel before)
Michael Kiely (Abbeyside)
Sean O’Brien (DLS)
David Gartland (Ardmore)

I haven’t seen as many intermediate and junior games as some posters here would have so would be interested in hearing opinions on other potential additions.

Off the top of my head to add to the above:

Meaney from DLS was very good at the weekend.
The two Powers from Clonea and whoever their number 17 was in the half back line in the last couple of games for them cleaned up the world of ball. He reminded me of De Burca.
Conor Power and Billy O'Keefe (may have the wrong name here) from Ballgunner

Jjjjjjjjbarry

tonc76 wrote: »

If anything I'd have thought that Cahill would have had a chat with Fanning or members of last years management team rather than people that had no involvement?

Possibly a decision to not give 100% or "down tools" has come back to bite a few lads. Who knows. It makes more sense than dropping proven lads before even giving them a chance to impress you. Look at what Liam Sheedy got from his has beens!

deiseach

Mastermcgrath wrote: »

Commissioner Sheedy to Secret Agent Cahill;

'Have we exterminated the enemy yet'

'Not yet commissioner. Mission in progress'

That would help explain that poxy umpire

EYEBALLSOUT

Jjjjjjjjbarry wrote: »

I can understand these 3 more than Connors.

Still 40-50 mins in Moran provided he’s prepared to play that role. Dunford in my book could do with more game time- he’s an honest player.

Noel Connors has been a great servant but he hasn’t been hitting the mark for at least 2 yrs- he’s lost his pace! But worse for me was his feigning of injury this year v Clare when he came off soft the min Shane O Donnell was cleaning him out. Made a miraculous recovery for the following weekend. Time waits for no man im afraid

Pogue eile

Jjjjjjjjbarry wrote: »

Possibly a decision to not give 100% or "down tools" has come back to bite a few lads. Who knows. It makes more sense than dropping proven lads before even giving them a chance to impress you. Look at what Liam Sheedy got from his has beens!

His 'has beens' had won an All Ireland 12 months previously, only one was 30 ( who is about to be crowned HOTY) and they had a hell of alot more credit in the bank.

Cahill is 100% right here and Fanning probably should have been brave enough to do the same, instead he ended falling between two stools. I'm sure for those who havent retired the door remains open and they can force there way back in if they are willing to give the commitment Cahill will insist on.

As an exampkle of his ruthlessness in 2015 his Tipperary team were beaten in a minor All Ireland final and three years later they won an U21 All Ireland with only 2 of that minor team starting, unlike some setups where its looks harder to get off a team/panel than get on it, Cahill takes no prisoners and if attitude/form/committment anything is not up to speed, he is not afraid to make the big calls. Cahill was also the one that insisted in Tipp that dual players simply had to pick one code or the other as the level of committment he wanted would not be possible for a dual player. This decision will ultimately play a huge role in Tipperary hurlings development going forward.

There may, in fact there almost certainly will, be some pain to begin with and alot of folk left unhappy but I absolutely guarantee, and have no doubt about it but that Liam Cahill will leave Waterford hurling in a stronger position that what he found it in.

carter10

Bones of a panel, feel free to add:

1. Billy Nolan
2. Stephen O’Keefe
3. Shane McNulty
4. Conor Gleeson
5. Calum Lyons
6. Conor Prunty
7. Philip Mahony
8. Darragh Fives
9. Darragh Lyons
10. Conor Shehan
11. Billy O’Keefe
12. Shane Fives
13. Tadgh De Burka*
14. Austin Gleeson
15. Pauric Mahony
16. Kieran Bennett
17. Jamie Barron
18. Shane Bennett
19. Jack Prendergast
20. Stephen Bennett
21. Peter Hogan
22. Patrick Curran
23. Mikey Kearney
24. Michael Kiely
25. Dessie Hutchinson
26. Conor Power
27. Cormac McCann
28. Jack Fagan

whiteandblue

carter10 wrote: »

Bones of a panel, feel free to add:

1. Billy Nolan
2. Stephen O’Keefe
3. Shane McNulty
4. Conor Gleeson
5. Calum Lyons
6. Conor Prunty
7. Philip Mahony
8. Darragh Fives
9. Darragh Lyons
10. Conor Shehan
11. Billy O’Keefe
12. Shane Fives
13. Tadgh De Burka*
14. Austin Gleeson
15. Pauric Mahony
16. Kieran Bennett
17. Jamie Barron
18. Shane Bennett
19. Jack Prendergast
20. Stephen Bennett
21. Peter Hogan
22. Patrick Curran
23. Mikey Kearney
24. Michael Kiely
25. Dessie Hutchinson
26. Conor Power
27. Cormac McCann
28. Jack Fagan

If we are looking at an initial training panel, I'd include Ian Kenny, Kieran Power, Tommy Ryan, Jordan Henley, Billy Power, Evan McGrath, Midget Roche, Tom Barron, David Prendergast, Colm Roche, Michéal Harney, Mark O'Brien, Willie Hahessy as potential panelists. I know some of those lads mightn't fit the correct age bracket but from games I've seen, they are worth a look.

Jjjjjjjjbarry

No matter who gets cut or forced out, we haven't won a championship match since 2017 let alone an All Ireland. In fairness to Cahill he's not looking for more of the same. It's worth taking a gamble if the payoff is going to be good as we've won nothing lately so not much to lose.
As much as it hurts to see some legend retire, I can't wait to see the new panel. Can't wait for the leagues to start. Lyons, Prunty and Jack P were our best players last years so more of the same please.

conor05

Pogue eile wrote: »

His 'has beens' had won an All Ireland 12 months previously, only one was 30 ( who is about to be crowned HOTY) and they had a hell of alot more credit in the bank.

Cahill is 100% right here and Fanning probably should have been brave enough to do the same, instead he ended falling between two stools. I'm sure for those who havent retired the door remains open and they can force there way back in if they are willing to give the commitment Cahill will insist on.

As an exampkle of his ruthlessness in 2015 his Tipperary team were beaten in a minor All Ireland final and three years later they won an U21 All Ireland with only 2 of that minor team starting, unlike some setups where its looks harder to get off a team/panel than get on it, Cahill takes no prisoners and if attitude/form/committment anything is not up to speed, he is not afraid to make the big calls. Cahill was also the one that insisted in Tipp that dual players simply had to pick one code or the other as the level of committment he wanted would not be possible for a dual player. This decision will ultimately play a huge role in Tipperary hurlings development going forward.

There may, in fact there almost certainly will, be some pain to begin with and alot of folk left unhappy but I absolutely guarantee, and have no doubt about it but that Liam Cahill will leave Waterford hurling in a stronger position that what he found it in.

I have cousins from Borrisleigh and they would fill me in. All of the above is true about Cahill, a complete no nonsense manager but a great manager.

He had parents ringing him and calling to his door in Tipperary saying why was little Johnny dropped off such and such a Tipp panel and Cahill took no prisoners.

In his own head, he will have a plan to win an All Ireland with Waterford by 2021, he doesn’t do second best!

mountgomery burns

Pogue eile wrote: »

His 'has beens' had won an All Ireland 12 months previously, only one was 30 ( who is about to be crowned HOTY) and they had a hell of alot more credit in the bank.

What all Ireland did Tipp win in 2017? Take your point regarding their ability alright, though it would be interesting to get a consensus on the old guard ye had twelve months ago than now with the benefit of hindsight.

Not trying to attack his decision and it's entirely Cahill's choice to make but I think with one or two names mentioned it may be harsh based on club form and contribution to the County.

Connors stands out for me. How would he make a judgement on whether these lads were prepared to make the necessary committment without actually having a look at them? Surprised this has been done before any sort of pre season work was done but then maybe it would be easier to get rid of more established lads now then in a couple of months time.

mickotallow

mountgomery burns wrote: »

What all Ireland did Tipp win in 2017? Take your point regarding their ability alright, though it would be interesting to get a consensus on the old guard ye had twelve months ago than now with the benefit of hindsight.

Not trying to attack his decision and it's entirely Cahill's choice to make but I think with one or two names mentioned it may be harsh based on club form and contribution to the County.

Connors stands out for me. How would he make a judgement on whether these lads were prepared to make the necessary committment without actually having a look at them? Surprised this has been done before any sort of pre season work was done but then maybe it would be easier to get rid of more established lads now then in a couple of months time.

This contribution thing to the county bugs me. How long are we to stay indebted to these lads because of how well they played in the past. This is the whole thing about sports management. You have to concentrate on the next game. Not one played a number of years ago.

Obviously Liam Cahill and the selectors have done their homework and have justified reasons for making these decisions. I doubt they did it on a whim or to lay down a marker if they thought it would hurt their chances of success.
Liam Cahill is not here to focus on the long term future of Waterford hurling. He is here to get results for our Senior hurlers and he will pick the panel he feels will give him the best possibility of this for 2020, not 2023.

DiscoStew

I think people who were wondering who leaked the story to the examiner are being a little naive. There was a lot of leaks from the camp last year, team selection, tactics, unrest to a certain radio presenter on local radio.
Hopefully this will stem the leak of information from the camp.

The fact this radio presenter felt the management should come on his show and be answerable for their decisions was simply embarrassing.

cul beag

mountgomery burns wrote: »

What all Ireland did Tipp win in 2017? Take your point regarding their ability alright, though it would be interesting to get a consensus on the old guard ye had twelve months ago than now with the benefit of hindsight.

Not trying to attack his decision and it's entirely Cahill's choice to make but I think with one or two names mentioned it may be harsh based on club form and contribution to the County.

Connors stands out for me. How would he make a judgement on whether these lads were prepared to make the necessary committment without actually having a look at them? Surprised this has been done before any sort of pre season work was done but then maybe it would be easier to get rid of more established lads now then in a couple of months time.

Well I would imagine he has seen Connors playing for the past 2 years and from making miraculous recovery from game ending injuries to not having a sweeper in front of him and just being poor in all the games he thought like a lot of us that his time was up. No place for sentiment at this level and if you watched Passage playing this year you could see he was miles away from his previous best.

mountgomery burns

mickotallow wrote: »

This contribution thing to the county bugs me. How long are we to stay indebted to these lads because of how well they played in the past. This is the whole thing about sports management. You have to concentrate on the next game. Not one played a number of years ago.

Obviously Liam Cahill and the selectors have done their homework and have justified reasons for making these decisions. I doubt they did it on a whim or to lay down a marker if they thought it would hurt their chances of success.
Liam Cahill is not here to focus on the long term future of Waterford hurling. He is here to get results for our Senior hurlers and he will pick the panel he feels will give him the best possibility of this for 2020, not 2023.

I mean based on his performances on the field and nothing else, I think he has something to offer on the field and not as a mascot or hanger on looking to get an opportunistic medal (if we're so lucky).

Your last paragraph is true of every manager who has ever managed at inter-county level. I won't be here bringing this up if things don't go well, I'm optimistic about next year too but that's just my opinion on Noel Connors initial omission which I expect is unlikely to be reversed. And it could well be shrewd in the end, we will see.

EYEBALLSOUT

DiscoStew wrote: »

I think people who were wondering who leaked the story to the examiner are being a little naive. There was a lot of leaks from the camp last year, team selection, tactics, unrest to a certain radio presenter on local radio.
Hopefully this will stem the leak of information from the camp.

The fact this radio presenter felt the management should come on his show and be answerable for their decisions was simply embarrassing.

Have to agree. This radio presenter is out of control at times with the way he carries on.
Its a local radio station not Sky News, players retire, get dropped every year- get on with it by thanking them for their service and not giving this kind of crack oxygen. Its the mgmts decision- its over, move on

Obi1mikal

whiteandblue wrote: »

If we are looking at an initial training panel, I'd include Ian Kenny, Kieran Power, Tommy Ryan, Jordan Henley, Billy Power, Evan McGrath, Midget Roche, Tom Barron, David Prendergast, Colm Roche, Michéal Harney, Mark O'Brien, Willie Hahessy as potential panelists. I know some of those lads mightn't fit the correct age bracket but from games I've seen, they are worth a look.

Dont want to be pick holes in panels. But Darragh Lyons is not good enough, david prendergast should replace him on that list or eddie Hayden from ballygunner should be part of panel. Conor power doesn't start for ballygunner so surly cannot be part of a Waterford panel. Personally I think tommy ryan, michael harney and mark o brien we should be moving away from. Time for new blood for the training panel, conor ryan from roanmore looks like a right prospect. Is DJ foran gone from the panel??

cul beag

Obi1mikal wrote: »

Dont want to be pick holes in panels. But Darragh Lyons is not good enough, david prendergast should replace him on that list or eddie Hayden from ballygunner should be part of panel. Conor power doesn't start for ballygunner so surly cannot be part of a Waterford panel. Personally I think tommy ryan, michael harney and mark o brien we should be moving away from. Time for new blood for the training panel, conor ryan from roanmore looks like a right prospect. Is DJ foran gone from the panel??

Wonder how he’ll deal with the Darragh Fives injury problems? Will he be as patient as the 2 previous managers?

iebamm2580

thesaturdayman wrote: »

the stereo typical kind of idiot on here.

no it isnt true.

McConnells Toyota he is a national brand ambassador, and the company insisted he have his number 4 etc.[/QUOT

so it is true except the the tom murphy bit, all i asked was a question that you confirmed, and how exactly is number 4 his number? Its **** like this,that wouldnt fly in tipp i can guarantee you.

Stopitwillya

We have a good keeper in Stephen O Keeffe so would like to see Billy Nolan tried outfield this year. Wing forward preferably. Good paw, well able to win his own ball and well able to take a score. Would be no harm to try him their in the league.

We need more tall players like him in the forwards as we just have too many small forwards.

Alf Tupper

iebamm2580 wrote: »

thesaturdayman wrote: »

the stereo typical kind of idiot on here.

no it isnt true.

McConnells Toyota he is a national brand ambassador, and the company insisted he have his number 4 etc.[/QUOT

so it is true except the the tom murphy bit, all i asked was a question that you confirmed, and how exactly is number 4 his number? Its **** like this,that wouldnt fly in tipp i can guarantee you.

Bang on. When the question was asked about the same guys getting the cars every year the answer given was they were given to the most senior guys on the panel. The caveat not mentioned was that you had to be a member of the DLS old boy's club. For instance Shane Fives has been on the panel since 2008 and was never given a car while others only on the panel a wet day were driving around in free cars.
If Liam Cahill breaks up that clique he will have made a good start.

iebamm2580

Im not from Waterford but i know in tipp a player would not agree to get the number he usually wears on a freebie car, cahill would hate that ****. How can a player think thats ok, what does it say to other panel members that are trying for the number 4 shirt.

mountgomery burns

iebamm2580 wrote: »

Im not from Waterford but i know in tipp a player would not agree to get the number he usually wears on a freebie car, cahill would hate that ****. How can a player think thats ok, what does it say to other panel members that are trying for the number 4 shirt.

Think you're making a bigger deal out of it than it is and my **** would Tipp lads not agree to a free car.

iebamm2580

mountgomery burns wrote: »

Think you're making a bigger deal out of it than it is and my **** would Tipp lads not agree to a free car.

The free car thing is fine as many county players get but let me re-phrase i would hope tipp players would have the commons sense to not put their usual number on a car, i think it smacks of entitlement, anwyay im not here for an argument, best of luck next year and hope to see swash buckling hurling of old from waterford that i know cahill and bevans will encourage.

thesaturdayman

iebamm2580 wrote: »

The free car thing is fine as many county players get but let me re-phrase i would hope tipp players would have the commons sense to not put their usual number on a car, i think it smacks of entitlement, anwyay im not here for an argument, best of luck next year and hope to see swash buckling hurling of old from waterford that i know cahill and bevans will encourage.

Did you ever think Toyota insisted on it & not Noel?! Probably not as it doesn’t fit the narrative.

There is no smoke without fire, so what’s the problem here?

The Ballygunner lads? The city lads? The former Harty cup players? The western crew? Dungarvan colleges crew?

Seems to be a never ending circle or bull**** to me.

killbillvol2

iebamm2580 wrote: »

The free car thing is fine as many county players get but let me re-phrase i would hope tipp players would have the commons sense to not put their usual number on a car, i think it smacks of entitlement, anwyay im not here for an argument, best of luck next year and hope to see swash buckling hurling of old from waterford that i know cahill and bevans will encourage.

The whole point of putting a player in a sponsored car is so that they'll be recognised. Get it?

And to help people recognise them you give them a recognisable f***ing number. Is that concept too complicated for you?

sasta le

Well regardless of who wanted the number he will have to buy a car soon

Cake Man

Stopitwillya wrote: »

We have a good keeper in Stephen O Keeffe so would like to see Billy Nolan tried outfield this year. Wing forward preferably. Good paw, well able to win his own ball and well able to take a score. Would be no harm to try him their in the league.

We need more tall players like him in the forwards as we just have too many small forwards.

Yeah this is the one slight concern I'd have with dispensing Maurice, we don't seem to have any big physical target men type of forwards? Somebody above mentioned DJ Foran but hard to know if he will be involved. We seem to have an abundance of forwards in a similar model - small, fast, good hurlers but not blessed with huge physicality. I'm thinking Curran, Dunford, Tommy Ryan, Stephen Bennett, Mikey Kearney, Jack Prendergast, Peter Hogan etc. If Cahill is looking to develop a game plan around utilising the strengths of these lads (i.e. good movement and getting quick low ball into space for them to get on the end of) then all well and good. No use doing some of the brainless stuff we've seen the last few years with loading high ball into them as they simply won't win much high ball.

conor05

Delighted to see the panel get a much needed shake up from the Derek McGrath era.

Some lads on the panel got way too comfortable.

I can’t wait to see the passion and correct attitude back in the Waterford jersey for 2020.

iebamm2580

killbillvol2 wrote: »

The whole point of putting a player in a sponsored car is so that they'll be recognised. Get it?

And to help people recognise them you give them a recognisable f***ing number. Is that concept too complicated for you?[/QUOTE

Why the **** does he have to have number 4 on it as if he owns that jersey, put his name on the car that would be more recognizable no? Do you get it now or i s that too complicated for you.

iebamm2580

thesaturdayman wrote: »

Did you ever think Toyota insisted on it & not Noel?! Probably not as it doesn’t fit the narrative.

There is no smoke without fire, so what’s the problem here?

The Ballygunner lads? The city lads? The former Harty cup players? The western crew? Dungarvan colleges crew?

Seems to be a never ending circle or bull**** to me.

So how come other players in other counties dont have their number on it, i know plenty players in tipp who dont have usual numbers on it just a usual reg. If its about being recognized put the county name or players name on it, simple, who the **** is entitled to think they have a jersey all year around before the season even begins. May not have been connors fault but he is old enough now to have common sense and not just go along with what a sponsor says.