Tommy Robinson jailed

pitifulgod

deco nate wrote: »

I don't either, but we are not talking about Ireland.

Btw you linked Muslims grooming gangs and Irish pedos together there.

i wonder what grooming Irish gangs you are going to link to.... Let me think....

Do you think sexual crimes having lenient sentencing is unique to Ireland? They've literally introduced a scheme in the UK to deal with incredibly lenient sentencing but that doesn't catch all. So complain about lenient sentencing but it has nothing to do with Tommy.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/prison-sentences-attorney-general-unduly-lenient-sentence-scheme-rapist-murderer-terror-offences-a7867351.html

I referred to rapes, not Irish pedophiles. Honestly the fact you treat the subject so lightly isn't filling me with confidence that you're remotely concerned.

Captain Obvious

deco nate wrote: »

You yourself compared the two, they are both relevant. If discussing Tommy Robinson and the reasoning behind him being how he is. then yes both sentences are relevant.

I didn't compare them. Someone else did and I pointed out how much information he left out from the comparison and how their comparison was incorrect. The other case has absolutely no connection to what Robinson was locked up for.

deco nate

pitifulgod wrote: »

Do you think sexual crimes having lenient sentencing is unique to Ireland? They've literally introduced a scheme in the UK to deal with incredibly lenient sentencing but that doesn't catch all. So complain about lenient sentencing but it has nothing to do with Tommy.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/prison-sentences-attorney-general-unduly-lenient-sentence-scheme-rapist-murderer-terror-offences-a7867351.html

I referred to rapes, not Irish pedophiles. Honestly the fact you treat the subject so lightly isn't filling me with confidence that you're remotely concerned.

Nice edit

AllForIt

Sand wrote: »

Even the UK state doesnt believe the crimes are equivalent. Umar Razaq served less than a year for raping a 13 year old. Razaq expresses no remorse and is clearly an ongoing threat to children.

Tommy Robinson will serve 13 months for standing outside a court. The UK establishment will continue to pursue Tommy Robinson for any charge they can drum up for as long as he continues to dissent.

The UK state (and indeed the people who despise Robinson) views Robinson as the greater criminal, so there is no equivalence. You are correct.

As Melanie Phillips points out in this video which is 12 years old, the attitude seems to be that anything Muslims do which is bad in the west is all our fault, the West's fault and that apparently includes the reasons why the gangs target Western white girls rather than girls from from their own cultural background.

Yes, we are being told that permissive western culture and values have somehow antagonised young Muslim males to the point that it should be taken as a mitigating factor for their actions. Even when sentences are appropriate it is still though that it is in some way our fault.

And this fits in with the treatment of TA. Because he's one of us, he's what's at the rotten core of western values that has somehow caused all these problems in the first place and he must be seen to be treated harshly as is it were to indicate a new found scene of fairness in western society. Baloney.

deco nate

Captain Obvious wrote: »

I didn't compare them. Someone else did and I pointed out how much information he left out from the comparison and how their comparison was incorrect. The other case has absolutely no connection to what Robinson was locked up for.

It has all to do with why he is protesting all this time.
And why is prepared to go to jail. Seems to be lost on a lot of people. Stupid for disobeying a court order yes.

ohnonotgmail

Sand wrote: »

The UK state paid one £651,000 and released the other after less than a year. The UK state relentlessly pursues Tommy Robinson for every misdemeanour, not matter how petty.

Do you really think I'm talking about who defends who on this thread? This thread is irrelevant.

He committed contempt of court on camera outside the court in front of many witnesses. Not a lot of pursuing required. I cant understand how people on this thread can admire somebody so thick.

Duck Soup

That, in a nutshell, is Tommy Robinson.

pitifulgod

deco nate wrote: »

Nice edit

I edited to add in a response to your own additional paragraph that you edited in... Would seem that you have no desire to discuss sentencing in general though...

Grayson

deco nate wrote: »

42 months for raping a child, HTF do you only get 42 months for raping a child?!

Thats the real question that is being brushed over.

It's got to be because of sentencing guidelines. It seemed low to me too but I don't know the case. There might have been mitigating factors (I can't think of any except giving a guilty plea, but they might exist).

I also found this

Umar Razaq, of Oxford Street, Rotherham, was found guilty of one count of sexual activity with a child - a 13-year-old girl.

He was cleared of raping another girl.

On this page I found this
https://theukdatabase.com/uk-child-abusers-named-and-shamed/facts-and-stats-on-child-abuse/sentences-explained-for-sexual-crimes/
sexual activity with a child Sexual Offences Act 2003 s. 16 5 years

The reason for the 5 years appears to be because of the age. 13 is a particular threshold. Under 13 the sentence is a lot higher. 13 and older is a different sentence. It's also different to rape from what I can tell. It's more like statutory rape. I'd imagine he wasn't charged with rape because they couldn't get it to stick. Most likely the girl said it was consensual at first. (Note: I'm absolutely not excusing anything because she might have consented or they couldn't prove she didn't. It's still a crime for a very good reason and I think that the sentence should be higher. I'm just pointing out that because of a technicality, 13 years and potentially "consensual", that's why it was a lower sentence).

So in getting 4 years he came close to the max the judge could give him.

It's kind of nuts that someone could abuse a girl the day before her 13th birthday and get put away for ages but wait a day and it's 5 years.

If you take a look at the page I linked, you'll see huge disparity in some sentences. And some are way outdated. Detention of a woman in a brothel is 2 years (1956). That's sexual slavery and it's 2 years. and Meeting child following sexual grooming is 10 years, and that's before any assault takes place. It's 2 years for exposing yourself the same for "Intercourse with a defective"

I'm wondering if some are superseded by later offenses.

But about 90% of that is way outside the scope of this thread.

WinnyThePoo

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

He committed contempt of court on camera outside the court in front of many witnesses. Not a lot of pursuing required. I cant understand how people on this thread can admire somebody so thick.

I think they admire his thickness. They don't care that he broke the law or that he could have caused a mistrial or that he pleaded guilty to the crime. Him getting angry and shouting at people , that's more important.

dense

Sand wrote: »

Point out what is untrue? Umar Razaq appealed his sentence, and was released less than a year after being convicted of raping a 13 year old girl. That is how little the UK state thinks of his crime. As I said, the UK state is very good at punishing dissent. Not so good at preventing children from being gang raped.

It's interesting that in this thread many are effectively defending a particular faith and a particular establishment/jurisdiction which they have precious little experience of, and, in the referendum threads, at every opportunity and with some relish, far less respect was being shown shown for another particular faith and establishment.

When exactly was the UK establishment and judicial system put on a pedestal that it so revered here?

We must have short memories.

That said, Robinson did behave stupidly and some might say dangerously, ignoring a warning and proceeding to do what he did.

And for that, he deserves to be punished.

But the sentence......it seems not appropriate to the crime.

deco nate

Captain Obvious wrote: »

You're presenting the information like Tommy Robinson got a significantly longer sentence than a child rapist for his actions outside the court when, in fact, he got a significantly shorter sentence. Robinson got 3 months and Umar got 42 months.

Just to get the facts right, tr got 13 months, not 3...

Captain Obvious

deco nate wrote: »

It has all to do with why he is protesting all this time.
And why is prepared to go to jail. Seems to be lost on a lot of people. Stupid for disobeying a court order yes.

No, it had nothing to do with this protest. If he was protesting the people who got away with abusing children what good is doing it outside of a trial against people who are being prosecuted for it? What is the logic there?

deco nate wrote: »

Just to get the facts right, tr got 13 months, not 3...

My understanding is he got three and it was added to the 10 month he previously had suspended because it was committed while he was on a suspended sentence.

ohnonotgmail

Captain Obvious wrote: »

No, it had nothing to do with this protest. If he was protesting the people who got away with abusing children what good is doing it outside of a trial against people who are being prosecuted for it? What is the logic there?






My understanding is he got three and it was added to the 10 month he previously had suspended because it was committed while he was on a suspended sentence.

No i think he got 10 months plus the 3 month suspended sentence that was activated.

FTA69

Stephen15 wrote: »

Generation Identity aren't fascist and nor are the BNP. Like saying that a bunch of Chlesea supporters doing the nazi salute now makes Chelsea a Fascist club.

The BNP aren't fascists? Give over. They were a violent, street-based party based on white purity and their leader used to write pamphlets denying the Holocaust for f*ck's sake. Both them and Generation Identity believe in an ethnically homogenous Europe with the encouragement of non-whites to leave. When your policies are concerned with racial homogenity then you're well into fascism.

The above are groups Robinson was in or currently supports.

https://www.generation-identity.org.uk/demands/

Likewise for people saying Robinson only read out Sellner's speech on free speech grounds - of all the cases of free speech the one he had to take up was that of an Austrian racist? The two of them are actually good mates by the way.

https://mobile.twitter.com/lucyfrown/status/923494618100125696?lang=en

Lastly, of course Tommy Robinson deserved his sentence - some of which was for breaching a previous suspended sentence. Imagine if a relative of yours was raped and then some professional attention seeker lands down outside the court with a camera potentially jeopardising the conviction of the people who did it? All for a bit of Facebook coverage.

20Cent

Generation Identity are definetly fascist. Slick videos clean cut young people. Not all these scumbags wear bomber jackets with swastika tattoos. They are trying to normalise hate and are organising themselves even have training camps dangerous group should be resisted.

thebull85

For anyone not familiar with Generation Identity,


WHO OR WHAT IS GENERATION IDENTITY?

Generation Identity (in some countries, ‘Identitarian Movement’) is a Europe-wide patriotic youth movement that promotes the values of homeland, freedom and tradition through peaceful activism, political education, and community & cultural activities. We want to create an awareness for a metapolitical patriotic value base.

The crucial questions of the 21st century will be asked in the field of identity politics. Accordingly, we, as patriotic Europeans, have to acknowledge that the current demographic situation is unfavourable for the indigenous population and that we expect many ethnic, cultural and religious conflicts unless there is a political rethink.

We aim to preserve the cultural heritage that has characterized our countries and the continent of Europe over many thousands of years. We do not want to break this chain.
That is why we see it as our mission to argue for a peaceful and secure future within Europe.

We continue along the path forged by the ethno-cultural tradition of our ancestors.

UNDERSTAND THE FACTS

We are a non-violent youth movement that highlights the need for open and honest public debate about immigration policies, identity and the future of our nations and of Europe.

Our three core aims are:

Stop the Islamisation of EuropeOppose globalisationStop and reverse the Great Replacement

Please read our FAQs and Demands pages to learn more about our movement.

Generation Identity does not provide a platform for any kind of national-socialist or fascist groups or views. We also do not get involved with conflicts outside of Europe.

FTA69

So they believe in an ethnically pure Europe and want to “reverse migrate” legal migrants and their descendants. Sellner has spoken of preserving “biological heritage”. Yeah, nothing fascistic about that at all.


https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/generation-identity-far-right-group-training-camps-europe-uk-recruits-military-white-nationalist-a8046641.html%3famp

Here’s some of their leaders ranting about the “Pakis”. I’m sure your mate Tommy is in good company with them and his Loyalist friends in Belfast giving Nazi salutes.

You would seriously want to be an utter joker if you’re an Irishman defending this sort of sh*t.

thebull85

FTA69 wrote: »

So they believe in an ethnically pure Europe and want to “reverse migrate” legal migrants and their descendants. Sellner has spoken of preserving “biological heritage”. Yeah, nothing fascistic about that at all.


https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/generation-identity-far-right-group-training-camps-europe-uk-recruits-military-white-nationalist-a8046641.html%3famp

Here’s some of their leaders ranting about the “Pakis”. I’m sure your mate Tommy is in good company with them and his Loyalist friends in Belfast giving Nazi salutes.

You would seriously want to be an utter joker if you’re an Irishman defending this sort of sh*t.

Ive seen that, personally i dont think paki is a racist word and a lot of pakistanis ive met and worked with have described themselves as paki, lets be real here why is it ok to call an austrailian an aussie, or a british person a brit.

But you cant call a pakistani a paki?

Its bull****.

Why shouldnt European people want to preserve their culture?


I remember being in school 20 years ago and a teacher telling us, one day there will be no white people (She said it like it was a good thing by the way).

dav3

thebull85 wrote: »

For anyone not familiar with Generation Identity,

Never heard of them.

They do sound like nutters all right.

thebull85

dav3 wrote: »

Never heard of them.

They do sound like nutters all right.

Can you elaborate?

dav3

thebull85 wrote: »

Can you elaborate?

Yes

thebull85

dav3 wrote: »

Yes

Are you implying these people have mental health issues? I assume so since you are calling them nutters.

ohnonotgmail

thebull85 wrote: »

Are you implying these people have mental health issues? I assume so since you are calling them nutters.

It wasn't a medical diagnosis.

FTA69

thebull85 wrote: »

Are you implying these people have mental health issues? I assume so since you are calling them nutters.

We could say you’re a nutter if you think calling Asian people “Pakis” is ok. Listen mate if you want to go around advocating the use of the word “Paki” and supporting groups that want to deport non whites then crack on but don’t be doing the snowflake routine when someone calls you a racist.

thebull85

FTA69 wrote: »

We could say you’re a nutter if you think calling Asian people “Pakis” is ok. Listen mate if you want to go around advocating the use of the word “Paki” and supporting groups that want to deport non whites then crack on but don’t be doing the snowflake routine when someone calls you a racist.

No one called me a racist.

thebull85

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

It wasn't a medical diagnosis.

who asked you? your buddy can answer for himself.

thebull85

FTA69 wrote: »

We could say you’re a nutter if you think calling Asian people “Pakis” is ok.

Who said it was ok to call Asian people pakis?

FTA69

thebull85 wrote: »

Who said it was ok to call Asian people pakis?

You. You were moaning that you’re not allowed call people Pakis as it’s not a racist term.

WinnyThePoo

thebull85 wrote: »

Who said it was ok to call Asian people pakis?

Do really think this 20 questions charade is fooling anybody.