Dublin - BusConnects

cgcsb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121753381#Comment_121753381

All the applications are in already

cgcsb

Seems quiet on ABP's side, I would have expected some corridors to be granted by now on the same basis as Clongriffin and LV, i.e. very little cpo. The Bray corridor and the Ballymun/Finglas corridor could surely be granted on that basis.

Although the Bray corridor has some seriously poor designs close to the city centre so maybe there'll be significant changes there.

Also the phibsboro section is a total mess, all design guidance was ignored.

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121852202#Comment_121852202

I read on social media that the Rathfarnham-Templeogue corridor will not have an oral hearing, which bodes well as it has major traffic changes.

ABP pushed back the deadline to the end of July for the Bray corridor.

Both of the corridors you mention do still have significant improvements for buses, who carry the lion’s share of people along them, and which the project is supposed to be primarily about.

LXFlyer

An updated final network map has been uploaded on the BusConnects website and is here:

https://busconnects.ie/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/Network-Redesign-Map-2023.pdf

Changes reflected in this are:

• Any changes in the routes implemented so far when compared with the original plan
• Dotted lines showing planned routings where construction will allow

To summarise the future changes by Spine phase:

H-Spine Phase

H1 shown as extending to Clongriffin Station in the future (dotted line)

C-Spine Phase

Revised future routing for the C2 shown in Adamstown (dotted line)

Western Orbitals Phase

Future W61/W62 merger shown (dotted line)

Northern Orbitals Phase

Future extension of N6 to Blackbanks (dotted line)

Future routing of N4 through Waterville (dotted line)

E-Spine / N2 Phase

Revised routing for E2 via Balbutcher Lane (South) to terminate at IKEA (instead of Charlestown)

Revised routing for N2 via Aughrim Street, Manor Street, Blackhall Place and the Quays to/from Heuston Station

Revised routing for 19 in Wadelai Estate (same as current 11); revised route via Balbutcher Lane (North), IKEA and St. Margaret's Road

Revised routing for L1/L2/L3 shown

D-Spine Phase

Revised routing for D3 at Clongriffin, with future routing shown too (dotted line)

F-Spine Phase

Revised routing for F1 via Melville Road, Jamestown Road and St. Margaret's Road to terminate at IKEA (instead of Charlestown)

Revised routing for F2 via Rossmore Road to terminate at current route 150 terminus (instead of Spawell)

Revised routing for 23 via Melville Road to terminate at Charlestown

Revised routing for 24 via Airport perimeter road (not serving Horizon Logistics Park / Harristown)

Route 82 shown as operating to Kiltipper (instead of Killinarden), routing via the old Tallaght Road rather than Tallaght bypass and will terminate at Merrion Square rather than Ringsend Garage.

Revised routing for L89 to operate from Broombridge Station via Broombridge Road, Ballyboggan Road, Finglas Road and then via planned routing to Toberburr where the route will now terminate (extension to Swords has been dropped - this is covered by Local Link route 196 (this route isn't on the map)

Ranelagh Radial Phase

L35 now shown as terminating at Balally LUAS stop (instead of Dundrum LUAS)

loco_scolo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121876643#Comment_121876643

That's great thanks for posting. Interesting that College Green is still used for the A-Spine and some other routes..

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121876722#Comment_121876722

It doesn't reflect the revised City Centre routings to the A-Spine phase that will happen when College Green is pedestrianised.

spacetweek

The road realignments at Greenhills and Kilnamanagh for D spine aren’t shown. I hope they’re still going ahead.

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121881170#Comment_121881170

I would take a planning application over a network map any day.

spacetweek

Well that’s good to hear. Though i still consider the realignments they are doing in that spine to be very watered down compared to the initial proposal.

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121888830#Comment_121888830

Are you referring to road realignments?

Which ones aren’t good?

CatInABox

Looks like the finglas route has gotten planning permission

https://twitter.com/neasa_neasa/status/1768214318435156086

spacetweek

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121888919#Comment_121888919

The last time I saw the plan it was proposed to build a bus-only road here in order to realign the Greenhills road:

https://maps.app.goo.gl/pucdrKaxwm8MPEcM9?g_st=ic

The original plan was a 4-lane road here with severing of the exiting section of Greenhills Rd the other side of Parkview. That was far better.

A short section of bus only road will require buses to turn onto it through lights the shortly afterwards turn back off through lights. At rush hour this could be tricky and enforcement will be required to stop cars using the bus only road. It’s sub standard.

Can I get a link to the finalised version of the D spine plans?

p_haugh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121893798#Comment_121893798

https://tallaghtclondalkinscheme.ie/, specifically https://tallaghtclondalkinscheme.ie/wp-content/uploads/sites/9/2023/05/03.-General-Arrangement.pdf for the drawings

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121893798#Comment_121893798

FYI Your terminology is wrong - it's not the D-Spine - they are the bus routes.

You're talking about the Tallaght Clondalkin Core Bus Corridor - which is the infrastructure works.

Given that the spines go cross-city, it's important to distinguish what you're talking about!

spacetweek

Thanks. Yes, it's the inferior treatment at Parkview in Kilnamanagh that they're going with - a bus only road. Not a happy camper!

LXFlyer

A judicial review is being sought against the planning permission for Clongriffin Core Bus Corridor planning application over a bus stop location on the Malahide Road.

https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/dublin/2024/03/18/legal-action-from-artane-residents-threatens-new-busconnects-corridors-in-dublin/

spacetweek

Could you really launch a JR over a single bus stop? She does sound quite reasonable in the article though.

CatInABox

Hasn't been accepted by the high court yet, and for once I'm not actually sure if it'll be accepted or not.

I get the feeling that her problems with the consultation is that it didn't result in what she wanted rather than any actual problem with the consultation.

In terms of constitutional property rights, I guess that they're going to argue that while she might not own the path outside her house, it will impact on their property with many more people outside.

I don't know, it seems a stretch to me.

bk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121908154#Comment_121908154

Unless the article is leaving something out, there doesn’t sound like anything that would warrant a JR here.

You can’t get a JR just because a planning decision doesn’t go your way, normally it requires an argument that the planning authority process was legally flawed or ignored some piece of legislation, etc.

CatInABox

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121908251#Comment_121908251

Which is, I presume, why they're throwing out that there's problems with the consultation and the constitutional issues. Despite the numerous JR's over the last few years, it's a fairly high standard to met though.

specialbyte

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121907936#Comment_121907936

These folks are total chancers. Here's their submission to ABP: https://www.pleanala.ie/publicaccess/Observation/313182/ABP-313182-22%20-%20Observations%20-%20Anna%20Hofheinz%20&%20Others.pdf?r=806958385995

In the section complaining how the bus stop will ruin the architectural heirtage of their cottages they write:

The NTA claims that a bus shelter was committed out of courtesy to the residents. While we agree that it would not be acceptable for any of the properties on Artane Cottages Lower to have a bus shelter located within 3m of their front windows

So the residents argue against a bus stop shelter at that location. But in their online petition they complain about the lack of shelter:

These are proposed to be replaced by a single bus stop outside Artane Cottages Lower, on a narrow footpath with no room for a bus shelter.

From the Irish Times article:

but are opposed to the removal of two existing bus stops with shelters on the Malahide Road and their replacement with one unprotected stop.

So they are happy that there isn't a bus shelter in the submission to ABP and now that the bus stop is without a shelter that's a key part of their complains.

You can read the NTA's response to their submission here pages 56-6: https://www.pleanala.ie/publicaccess/Responses/313182/NTA%20-%20Response%20to%20ABP%20Submissions%20-%20July%2022.pdf?r=660570

From the very first public meetings this crowd have always complained about the loss of the 3.5m wide footpath outside their houses where they currently illegally park their cars. I think everything else is just smoke and mirrors round this as their real complaint.

They touch on this in the end of their submission to ABP:

4.3 proposed access to residential parking

Clarification is required as to the proposed access to residential parking for Artane Cottages Lower. Vehicular access to the rear lane is primarily via the southern gate between nos. 3 and 4 Artane Cottages Lower. The manual gate at this location requires any vehicle looking to access the rear lane to pull up on the footpath in order to open the rate, with a risk of obstruction to the proposed cycle and bus lane. Therefore, most residents parking currently is via informal parking on the footpath. This arrangement needs to be formalised either into residents permit parking (1 space per house, with planted areas in between) or into improvements to the access to the rear lane during the implementation phase, e.g. via motorised gate.

Likewise, the NTA must undertake to not install any bollards between the cycle path and the bus lane outside Artane Cottages Lower, as this interferes with short-term deliveries and maintenance access to the properties.

So they want to formalise their illegal footpath parking, get better access to their rear lane (fine) but also don't want any bollards out front that would prevent them from continuing to illegally park in the cycle lane / footpath. Like I said: chancers.

I hope the High Court tells them to get lost.

loco_scolo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121908836#Comment_121908836

It's obvious the residents of the cottages have shot themselves in the foot on this one. I can't imagine the other residents in the area will be happy that two sheltered stops will be consolidated into one unsheltered stop. Definitely a degradation of service for those.

I do think it sets a bad precedent though. They've given in to a very small number of residents, to the detriment of the entire local area. I'd be pretty pssd off if I lived nearby.

At this stage, the cottages should just push for a compromise and get a shelter stop. Otherwise people will be sitting and leaning on their windows all day long waiting for buses. Can't see a JR going anywhere on this one.

LXFlyer

The Belfield/Blackrock CBC has now been approved by ABP.

https://www.pleanala.ie/en-ie/case/313509

That’s 4 out of 12 approved.

AngryLips

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121969763#Comment_121969763

The glaciers are receding faster from climate change than APB are getting through these planning approvals.

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121970180#Comment_121970180

The CBCs are coming at a fairly regular pace now.

Given that only a certain number can be in construction at any one time, I’d not be too concerned.

Bsharp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121970216#Comment_121970216

Their sequential construction is proposed spatially to minimise disruption on key corridors into the city, so we do need enough approved to be able to achieve what was set out in the EIAR. Hopefully the clongriffin challenge is quashed so clongriffin, Liffey valley and belfield could proceed together from the outset, they're well spaced out.

dublinman1990

That's great news about the Blackrock-Belfield corridor getting approval.

However; I see on the ABP website that it has been granted with conditions.

What are the conditions attached to this project?

specialbyte

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121971606#Comment_121971606

Everything is granted with conditions. For example, condition 1 starts as "The proposed development shall be carried out and completed in accordance with the plans and particulars lodged with the application, exception as may otherwise be required to in order with the following conditions", which is the boilerplate condition that ABP and all local councils apply to every single grant of planning permission.

You can read all of the conditions in the Order document here (starts at page 13): https://www.pleanala.ie/anbordpleanala/media/abp/cases/orders/313/d313509.pdf?r=098382064052

There are no surprising conditions in there at all. Everything is pretty standard stuff. Condition 4 makes super super minor alterations to the plans like removing advertising from some bus shelters, removing trees in a heirtage area and adding a yellow box for Blackrock College, which are all minor additions in response to plannning submissions.

The conditions are near identical to what the Inspector recommended in their report. The board decided not to accept one of the conditions recommended by the inspector and you can see the commentary on that at the top of page 13 of the PDF I linked.

GusherING

We are now 2 months away from local elections. Wonder if we will see a slight pause in further orders being finalised so they don't become politicised by local authority politics.

cgcsb

4 granted now, all spaced out, enough to tender for construction surely.