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Bus Eireann - seriously poor

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24567…13

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    #32
    Xterminator
    Registered Users Posts: 4,733 ✭✭✭Xterminator


    .
    It's like this because government policy and spending dictates it.

    no. the rudeness is cultural and endemic in the organisation. the customer should be the focus of the business, not an inconvenience at best. you don't see it happening in the private sector, where we are told the terms and conditions are worse.

    Its not acceptable, and blaming it on government subvention levels is excusing the individuals who are responsible for how they go about their job.


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    #33
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 29,037 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Xterminator wrote: »
    no. the rudeness is cultural and endemic in the organisation. the customer should be the focus of the business, not an inconvenience at best. you don't see it happening in the private sector, where we are told the terms and conditions are worse.

    really? you don't see it happening in the private sector? sorry to burst your bubble but yes you do. there is for the most part less of a chance of getting away with such behaviour and rightly so, but to suggest such behaviour doesn't happen in the private sector is just not true.
    Xterminator wrote: »
    Its not acceptable, and blaming it on government subvention levels is excusing the individuals who are responsible for how they go about their job.

    such behaviour isn't exceptible, agreed. however suggesting that government underfunding is causing problems is not excusing the individuals at all. nobody has excused them.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #34
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    I don't get this complaining about staff when complaining about DB/BE/IE. Staff are just doing a job which they are paid a wage to do. For example a bus driver does not have to be or need to be super courteous and friendly as they are not customer service assistants they are bus drivers who are paid to drive a bus in a safe and efficient manner.

    I meet very friendly people and some very unfriendly people on a daily basis some these people happen to work for private companies too such as in shops. When they are rude I accept that they're personality is unfriendly or they are having a bad day same goes for bus drivers some are very nice and friendly some are grumpy and the majority are somewhere in between just like people in everyday life who can also fit into these categories.

    If you don't like people being rude to you stay at home because it's a fact of everyday life that some people will be rude to you.

    Company/Government is another issue as it requires drivers to communicate with passengers and vice versa as you have either pay a fare to the driver or tag a leap card on which is done by the driver. If all city buses were made cashless and leap cards were validated separately with flat like the left hand validator on DB then nobody will ever have to deal or complain about an unhelpful bus driver ever again in this country.

    Look at other countries for example if you take a bus in most European cities you will not have to communicate with the driver meaning as buses are cashless and validation is done by the passenger meaning you can get on and off the bus without having to communicate with the driver.

    If you don't have communicate you don't have any reason to complain about a driver unless he/she is driving in an unsafe manner which is fair enough.


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    #35
    j8wk2feszrnpao
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,438 ✭✭✭j8wk2feszrnpao


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    If you don't like people being rude to you stay at home because it's a fact of everyday life that some people will be rude to you.
    When paying for a service you shouldn't have to accept it. Bus drivers in the main are fine, poor service (or rude service) is not acceptable.
    People will be rude to you, that is a fact. Being on the receiving end when you are correct and a paying customer is something you shouldn't have to deal with.


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    #36
    jimmycrackcorm
    Registered Users Posts: 14,336 ✭✭✭✭jimmycrackcorm


    Cork Truck Driver wrote:
    Would you rather some or all of the Cork routes were put out to tender in a similar fashion to that in Dublin and Waterford?

    Tendering in itself can also have negative impacts however, poor buses/low drivers pay etc.

    Actually it porridges something better, a quality service for consumers.
    magentis wrote:
    That same driver could be nearing the end of a day spread over 13 hours(excluding his commute time),he may also have done the same the 2 or 3 days before.15 hours from the time he left his own house and family to the time he got back.Not very conducive to road safety now is it?Where the RSA recently stated fatigue is a major issue on our roads.

    Trying to suggest that drivers are actually driving all thirteen hours? And what's with the point about spending two hours getting to and from work?


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    #37
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 29,037 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    jimmycrackcorm wrote: »
    Actually it porridges something better, a quality service for consumers.

    i'm afraid that is not always true, it is not a given and there is no guarantee of that happening.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #38
    Frostybrew
    Registered Users Posts: 357 ✭✭Frostybrew


    The issue is with senior management and the board of Bus Eireann and CIE. There is no interest in running a good service. This attitude filters down to all levels of the company.

    For the Cork area I would create a new Cork Transport Authority with new management, that have the requisite skills to run a public transit authority; as opposed to having it staffed with political appointees, who's only qualification is to back some political party.


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    #39
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    munstermagic11 wrote: »
    When paying for a service you shouldn't have to accept it. Bus drivers in the main are fine, poor service (or rude service) is not acceptable.
    People will be rude to you, that is a fact. Being on the receiving end when you are correct and a paying customer is something you shouldn't have to deal with.

    Did I say it was acceptable?

    There are plenty of things that are not acceptable but you have to accept. The world isin't fair. You are right you shouldn't have to deal with it but you do anyway. The only ones providing a poor service are The NTA and BE not it's drivers or other staff.


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    #40
    Frostybrew
    Registered Users Posts: 357 ✭✭Frostybrew


    For the record I find the majority of the drivers to be friendly and helpful, with the exception of a small minority of bad tempered older drivers.

    I use the bus regularly, and you definitely get the impression that the powers that be see the regional city services as a social service for various disadvantaged sections of our society; rather than a transit solution for commuters and the general public.


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    #41
    j8wk2feszrnpao
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,438 ✭✭✭j8wk2feszrnpao


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    Did I say it was acceptable?

    There are plenty of things that are not acceptable but you have to accept. The world isin't fair. You are right you shouldn't have to deal with it but you do anyway. The only ones providing a poor service are The NTA and BE not it's drivers or other staff.
    You hinted that if you encountered it, you should stay at home.

    And you don't have to accept it, you should confront such unacceptable rudeness.
    Are you seriously saying drivers/staff are not being rude at times? They are the front line staff who deal directly with the customer.

    I agree that it starts at the top. But it's not just the those at senior management, the entire company suffers from having the monopoly it does; reflected in the many poor encounters the customers have with it's staff.


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    #42
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 29,037 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    munstermagic11 wrote: »
    You hinted that if you encountered it, you should stay at home.

    And you don't have to accept it, you should confront such unacceptable rudeness.
    Are you seriously saying drivers/staff are not being rude at times? They are the front line staff who deal directly with the customer.

    I agree that it starts at the top. But it's not just the those at senior management, the entire company suffers from having the monopoly it does; reflected in the many poor encounters the customers have with it's staff.

    the company doesn't suffer from having a supposed monopoly (something they have actually never had on a lot of routes) . badly behaved and rude staff are nothing to do with monopolies, we know this because badly behaved and rude staff exist in many different companies in many different industries.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #43
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    munstermagic11 wrote: »
    You hinted that if you encountered it, you should stay at home.

    And you don't have to accept it, you should confront such unacceptable rudeness.
    Are you seriously saying drivers/staff are not being rude at times? They are the front line staff who deal directly with the customer.

    I agree that it starts at the top. But it's not just the those at senior management, the entire company suffers from having the monopoly it does; reflected in the many poor encounters the customers have with it's staff.

    Yes what I'm pointing is that there are many that are unacceptable which you have to accept for example I don't find littering acceptable but I have to accept it otherwise I would never be able to leave my house again. I believe the same could apply here not making it right.

    But other than that the reason the service provided by BE is so bad is because most people are willing to accept the shoddy service which is mostly managements fault. If the offices of county council's, BE, DB, IE, CIE, DoT and The NTA were bombarded with complaints on a daily basis then they would eventually have to do something to improve the service as they have respond to each and every complaint meaning eventually they will get so sick of reading and responding to complaints they may rectify the issues.

    But unfortunately people in Ireland are not willing to complain and will put up with poor service as the people who have to use the services are willing to put up with the poor service on offer and the ones aren't willing use the service are not using the service provided and instead go by car further congesting our streets and polluting our air because of the poor service provided.


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    #44
    Evil-1
    Registered Users Posts: 44 ✭Evil-1


    Why oh why do people complain to Bus Eireann about problems on PSO routes, that is pointless as Bus Eireann is only the contractor on route 223, you need to complain to the people who are actually responsible for that route , https://www.nationaltransport.ie/bus-licensing/make-a-complaint/


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    #45
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Evil-1 wrote: »
    Why oh why do people complain to Bus Eireann about problems on PSO routes, that is pointless as Bus Eireann is only the contractor on route 223, you need to complain to the people who are actually responsible for that route , https://www.nationaltransport.ie/bus-licensing/make-a-complaint/

    This has been explained already many times previously... On this exact thread.


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    #46
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 29,037 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    punisher5112 wrote: »
    This has been explained already many times previously... On this exact thread.

    agreed. but to be fair, the average member of the public is unlikely to know of the NTA, who they are or what they do. they will know of the operator however. now personally i blame the NTA for that for not informing the public about them, or if they are, it's certainly not a visible information campaign as i have never saw any public promotion myself.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #47
    j8wk2feszrnpao
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,438 ✭✭✭j8wk2feszrnpao


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    Yes what I'm pointing is that there are many that are unacceptable which you have to accept for example I don't find littering acceptable but I have to accept it otherwise I would never be able to leave my house again. I believe the same could apply here not making it right.
    So you are saying it's acceptable?
    We are not talking about littering. This is a thread on the OPs experience with the bus service; that's what we are dealing with here.
    And you don't have to accept littering. You can now photograph someone, report them.....or even just pick it up yourself and put it int the bin; it doesn't already have to end in the doomsday-like scenario in your mind that one must lock themselves into their house.
    Stephen15 wrote: »
    But unfortunately people in Ireland are not willing to complain
    The OP did complain, so this isn't a correct statement. People in Ireland do complain; complaints are logged all the time.


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    #48
    j8wk2feszrnpao
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,438 ✭✭✭j8wk2feszrnpao


    end of the road wrote: »
    the company doesn't suffer from having a supposed monopoly (something they have actually never had on a lot of routes) . badly behaved and rude staff are nothing to do with monopolies, we know this because badly behaved and rude staff exist in many different companies in many different industries.
    I didn't say rude/bad staff are exclusive to monopolies; just that it's a factor that doesn't help with their work practices.
    I've worked in plenty of private companies and it's there as well; it's just that with the private company, you typically can go somewhere else if you encounter bad service.


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    #49
    sondagefaux
    Registered Users Posts: 1,443 ✭✭✭sondagefaux


    Seems like the Passage service has been rubbish for some time now:
    https://www.irishexaminer.com/video/news/passage-needs-services-protest-over-223-bus-service-466094.html


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    #50
    sondagefaux
    Registered Users Posts: 1,443 ✭✭✭sondagefaux


    Seems like the Passage service has been rubbish for some time now:
    https://www.irishexaminer.com/video/news/passage-needs-services-protest-over-223-bus-service-466094.html


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    #51
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 29,037 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    munstermagic11 wrote: »
    I didn't say rude/bad staff are exclusive to monopolies; just that it's a factor that doesn't help with their work practices.

    well, that's not what my reading of your post suggests, but fair enough. even with your clarification, i can say that monopolies have no part to play in this.
    munstermagic11 wrote: »
    I've worked in plenty of private companies and it's there as well; it's just that with the private company, you typically can go somewhere else if you encounter bad service.

    well actually, with any company public or private you can go somewhere else if others are providing a competing offering. being able to go elsewhere isn't to do with the fact a company is private, but the fact that the industry can support multiple service providers.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #52
    Curb Your Enthusiasm
    Registered Users Posts: 3,470 ✭✭✭Curb Your Enthusiasm


    Just to update the thread, I received a reply today from the regional manager of BE Cork, after I forwarded my complaint to the acting CEO of BE, who then CC'd this regional manager.

    Below is the explanation;

    At Bus Eireann we are aware of the importance of providing an efficient and reliable service which adheres to our scheduled timetable and therefore it is most disappointing to hear of events as described by you.



    On Monday, 29th January, 2018, the 07:25 Monkstown/Cork terminated at Parnell Place and did not serve CIT due to a scheduling error. This was a very regrettable occurrence and I certainly apologise for the inconvenience caused to you and for the subsequent disruption to your attendance at college.



    On Tuesday, 30th January, 2018, the 07:25 Monkstown/Cork service failed to operate due to a breakdown in service. Whereas every effort was made to allocate replacement resources, unfortunately it was not possible to do so in sufficient time to operate the service and I apologise for the further difficulties caused to you.



    Please be assured that I am aware that our customers depend on us to get to their destinations in a timely manner. To experience disruption with our service on two mornings is certainly less than satisfactory and I sincerely regret the impact that this has had on your college attendance. The service will now be closely monitored to underpin reliability and to return this service to a high standard.



    May I also assure you that at Bus Eireann customer care is of the utmost importance to us. Bus Eireann staff are expected to engage with customers in a polite and courteous manner at all times. It is very regrettable to hear that you felt our staff did not engage with you in an appropriate manner and I wish to apologise for the further distress caused to you. The staff members in question have been identified and will be interviewed under Bus Eireann procedures.

    He also stated when I asked for more detail into the mysterious 'scheduling error' the following;

    With reference to the service terminating in Parnell Place Bus Station, our driver was aware that the service operates to CIT, but was instructed by our Service Supervisor to commence operation on another Route. The decision was made by our Service Supervisor and I sincerely regret the inconvenience that this caused.



    The driver who left the bus was of the understanding that a second driver would operate the service to CIT and was unaware that the service would not continue on route. However, there was certainly a breakdown in information provided to our customers, and I regret that this further added to the situation.

    He also stated the following;

    Route 223 is a high capacity route and I am aware of the recent difficulties with this Route. The service has been negatively impacted by some operational issues but the majority of delays and missed trips are due to traffic congestion in the city centre and on approaches to the city.



    However, we are closely monitoring this Route and it is our intention to improve Route 223 by increasing frequency and allocating extra resources to the service. In the interim, we have engaged a private bus operator to operate the 07:25hrs ex Monkstown/CIT service on our behalf, which will safeguard the reliability of this service.

    Don't know what to think to be honest. Cutting a single service half way through the route seems ridiculous. I understand buses break down but maybe they should introduce a way of communicating this to customers so we're not waiting on a bus for over an hour just for it not to show. Whether this be via app, website etc.

    Regarding promised improvements to the service; I'll have to see it to believe it. But it's a response nonetheless. It's also worth noting that I was offered a months free red zone leap card as a gesture of goodwill which of course I appreciate being offered.

    If anyone has complaints regarding their BE service, I strongly advise that they skip customer service and go straight to the regional manager or CEO, as it gets replies much faster and it seems the complaints will be taken more seriously also. PM me if you need details.

    I'll keep ye updated on the service anyhow.


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    #53
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    munstermagic11 wrote: »
    So you are saying it's acceptable?
    We are not talking about littering. This is a thread on the OPs experience with the bus service; that's what we are dealing with here.
    And you don't have to accept littering. You can now photograph someone, report them.....or even just pick it up yourself and put it int the bin; it doesn't already have to end in the doomsday-like scenario in your mind that one must lock themselves into their house.

    No I'm not saying it's acceptable. I'm not suggesting locking yourself in your house I'm suggesting the opposite. What I'm basically saying is if we don't accept that people may behave in ways we do not like then the alternative is to wrap ourselves up in cotton wool and stay at home.
    The OP did complain, so this isn't a correct statement. People in Ireland do complain; complaints are logged all the time.

    Yes but only the minority. If we were to bombard BE and The NTA with complaints then they will have to improve the service eventually.


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    #54
    j8wk2feszrnpao
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,438 ✭✭✭j8wk2feszrnpao


    end of the road wrote: »
    well, that's not what my reading of your post suggests, but fair enough. even with your clarification, i can say that monopolies have no part to play in this.
    It can play a part.
    end of the road wrote: »
    well actually, with any company public or private you can go somewhere else if others are providing a competing offering.
    Yes, if an alternative exists. Public Service wise, you tend not to have an alternative.


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    #55
    j8wk2feszrnpao
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,438 ✭✭✭j8wk2feszrnpao


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    No I'm not saying it's acceptable. I'm not suggesting locking yourself in your house I'm suggesting the opposite. What I'm basically saying is if we don't accept that people may behave in ways we do not like then the alternative is to wrap ourselves up in cotton wool and stay at home.
    Right. So not acceptable. And the alternative is not locking yourself up; not required at all.

    Stephen15 wrote: »
    Yes but only the minority
    I would suggest that it tends to be the minority who have a valid complaint. And the OP did complain and did get a reply. So people do complain, and at least the OP has gotten some degree of a response.


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    #56
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Great result CYE

    Do keep informed and I would still suggest any complaints to nta as they control it all now this means any changes to routes or extra buses etc.


    Hopefully things can change and improve across the country.

    Our government won't do it unless pushed big time.


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    #57
    Sephiroth_dude
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 80,182 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sephiroth_dude


    I found some of the ticket sales staff and the information staff at parnell place very unhelpful and very rude, in particular a young lad, I'm not sure if he still works there, he always seemed very angry and god forbid if you didn't hear him, he'd bite the head off ya.


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    #58
    Frostybrew
    Registered Users Posts: 357 ✭✭Frostybrew


    Looks like BE is getting a new senior management team. I wonder will this make a difference. Though looking at their background they could be preparing it for a sell off.


    Ray Hernan - Chief Executive Officer (ex Ryanair, currently acting CEO)
    Allen Parker - Chief Customer Officer (currently Aircoach MD)
    Tom Delaney - Chief Financial Officer (ex Bank of England)


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    #59
    Mardyke
    Registered Users Posts: 576 ✭✭✭Mardyke


    This is an interesting thread. I've found BE service to be awful for many years but it seems to be worse than ever now.

    Sorry if I've missed it but what are the emails of the relevant people to report issues to?

    I recently got refund for a taxi that I had to get when a bus failed to show. I'm going to continue with that approach but also would be interested in letting management know about poor customer service when it arises.


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    #60
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Mardyke wrote: »
    This is an interesting thread. I've found BE service to be awful for many years but it seems to be worse than ever now.

    Sorry if I've missed it but what are the emails of the relevant people to report issues to?

    I recently got refund for a taxi that I had to get when a bus failed to show. I'm going to continue with that approach but also would be interested in letting management know about poor customer service when it arises.

    Contact CEO and nta and TDs


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    #61
    EnzoScifo
    Registered Users Posts: 409 ✭✭EnzoScifo


    There are a few knock on reasons for the crap punctuality of buses in Cork at the moment.

    Traffic is now worse in the city than it was during the boom years 12 years ago. Bus use has also skyrocketed in the past 5 years.

    Investment is just not there for BE. Plenty of new double deckers, but they were just replacing older buses for the most part.

    Very little infrastructure improvements have happened in the city since the crash. Only in the past year or so have new bus lanes and priority started to be built.

    Retired staff were not replaced due to the public sector embargo on hiring. This means there are now not enough or even no relief drivers to replace sick drivers or disrupted services.

    The NTA have made some silly changes to routes, which smack of someone in dublin looking at google maps and drawing with crayons. For example the 203 was extended from Ballyphehane to Leghenamore, but not enough time is built in to the timetable to deal with constant traffic jams on the bridge at the Togher junction of the South Ring. Reliability has gone seriously out the window as a result.

    All in all, many have to take the blame, but mainly the department of transport and the NTA for ignoring the danger signs of a creaking bus network and not implementing suitable solutions and funding.


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