Gangland Shootings [Mod Note in Post #1]

Are Am Eye

the sheriff is HERE wrote: »

i personally think its a great idea, protection of life, yer are all been watched, try to minimize gangland killings.

You're absolutely right. But that is an overt surveillance operation.

Wanderer78

the sheriff is HERE wrote:

i personally think its a great idea, protection of life, yer are all been watched, try to minimize gangland killings.

But they already know they're being watched by law enforcement and other criminals

Captain Obvious

Are Am Eye wrote: »

You're absolutely right. But that is an overt surveillance operation.

No, overt surveillance would be what they did to The General. Openly following him and taking pictures. Covert surveillance would be where the surveillance is not noticeable. They might know they are under surveillance but they don't know by who or how.

Cazale

The photo identification of Patrick Hutch has been ruled admissible by the judge so the trial continues.

Suckit

I don't think them knowing they are being watched will deter the scumbags that much. I reckon it will just push them to use new tactics and maybe find new ways to hide in the open. I don't think it will stop any murders, maybe just move the planned location, i.e. less likely to fire upon a house.

I read an article last night before bed that said they believe the kinahans are funding the Ballymun faction to take them out, but i cannot find the article.


There is another picture of Cumberton in this article, is that cropped from the same picture that was in the other thread, that had a celebrity and the suspect in the Gareth Hutch murder who was caught in the UK?

https://www.rte.ie/news/courts/2018/0129/936786-sunset-house/

benny79

Cazale wrote: »

The photo identification of Patrick Hutch has been ruled admissible by the judge so the trial continues.

He will definitely walk now sure what other evidence is there?

ohnonotgmail

benny79 wrote: »

He will definitely walk now sure what other evidence is there?

the evidence was ruled admissible not inadmissible so he will definitely not walk.

begbysback

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

the evidence was ruled admissible not inadmissible so he will definitely not walk.

Not so sure - if what I read is true, that only 2 out of some hundred could identify the person in the photo, then he should still walk, unless some sort of facial recognition technology is also used as evidence.

It would make the DPP and the Garda a joke if he walks - so somehow I think a non jury court will see he doesn't, given the current climate.

Suckit

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/gardai-release-cctv-images-of-car-used-in-hutch--kinahan-feud-shooting-826067.html

Gardaí release CCTV images of car used in Hutch - Kinahan feud shooting

Gardaí investigating the murder of Derek Coakley Hutch have released CCTV images of the car they believe was used by the suspects.

Derek Hutch, also known as Derek Coakley, was shot dead at the Bridgeview Halting Site in Ronanstown almost two weeks ago.

The 27-year-old had previously been warned his life was in danger. The father-of-two was buried in Glasnevin Cemetery and is survived by his mother Noleen, his partner Nikita, his children and his brother Nathan.

He is the 14th victim of the ongoing Hutch - Kinahan feud in the city.

Detectives are trying to establish the movements of a black Toyota Avensis registration 04-D-72956 in the days prior to the murder, and the hours immediately after it.

It is believed that those involved in the murder transferred to the Avensis at Crag Avenue, Clondalkin, Dublin 22 after setting fire to a VW Golf, registration 05-CE-1675, which was used in the murder.

The Avensis was then found on fire at Snowdrop Walk, Darndale, Dublin 17 at 6.25pm on the January 20, just over three hours after the murder.

ohnonotgmail

begbysback wrote: »

Not so sure - if what I read is true, that only 2 out of some hundred could identify the person in the photo, then he should still walk, unless some sort of facial recognition technology is also used as evidence.

It would make the DPP and the Garda a joke if he walks - so somehow I think a non jury court will see he doesn't, given the current climate.

the court has decided that the evidence is admissible. They accept that he was the person dressed as a woman.

https://www.rte.ie/news/courts/2018/0202/937822-regency/

begbysback

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

the court has decided that the evidence is admissible. They accept that he was the person dressed as a woman.

https://www.rte.ie/news/courts/2018/0202/937822-regency/

Don't have a great legal understanding here, but I believe that states it has been accepted as evedince, rather than fact it is him in the picture - difference being that no judgement has been made whether it is him or not in the picture, just that the picture can be presented as evidence.

And imo, on its own, insufficient for a conviction.

ohnonotgmail

begbysback wrote: »

Don't have a great legal understanding here, but I believe that states it has been accepted as evedince, rather than fact it is him in the picture - difference being that no judgement has been made whether it is him or not in the picture, just that the picture can be presented as evidence.

And imo, on its own, insufficient for a conviction.

the evidence will be that it was him dressed as a woman. shown carrying a handgun into the hotel. the defence will have a hard time convincing a judge otherwise. he's fecked. his only chance of getting off with this is gone.

begbysback

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

the evidence will be that it was him dressed as a woman. shown carrying a handgun into the hotel. the defence will have a hard time convincing a judge otherwise. he's fecked. his only chance of getting off with this is gone.

Like I already said, if what I read is true then the prosecution can present 2 people who say they are sure it's him, the defence can present 20 who say they cannot identify him as the person in the picture, and they already knew him.

ohnonotgmail

begbysback wrote: »

Like I already said, if what I read is true then the prosecution can present 2 people who say they are sure it's him, the defence can present 20 who say they cannot identify him as the person in the picture, and they already knew him.

"I cannot identify him" is not the same as "it isn't him".

pablo128

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

"I cannot identify him" is not the same as "it isn't him".

Well you could say the same about the prosecution so.

ohnonotgmail

pablo128 wrote: »

Well you could say the same about the prosecution so.

except the prosecution have witnesses that say it is him

Benteke

admissible
ədˈmɪsɪb(ə)l/Submit
adjective
1.
acceptable or valid, especially as evidence in a court of law.
"the tape recording was admissible as evidence"
synonyms: allowable, allowed, permissible, permitted, acceptable, passable, tolerable, satisfactory, justifiable, defensible, supportable, well founded, tenable, sound, sensible, reasonable; More


I just thought I would post this for those who are struggling to understand the concept of how the law works

the sheriff is HERE

Reg: 10D126064
Vehicle: 2010 Renault Kangoo ML19 85 DCI 5DR
Colour: White


Vehicle Registration Number: 10D126064
Vehicle Details: RENAULT / KANGOO
Change Of Vehicle Ownership

No Changes notified in the last 3 months
Vehicle Registration Certificate

No Vehicle Registration Certificate issued in the last: 3months

Any way of a person to find out if a van/car is stolen because it seems the day of stealing cars for hits are gone and they aint no bangers.

Captain Obvious

Don't need to steal a car. The registration of vehicles is a joke in this country. Buy a car from someone on Done Deal and give them fake name and address. Safer than driving around in a stolen car.

the sheriff is HERE

the van has me puzzled, maybe from a car dealership, it wouldn't if bought cost hundreds more like thousands.

would the ballymun guy, be flush with cash and gun used roughly 1000 dollars from what ive seen, and just left in the van.

another question is ken foy for the herald and independent a real person or a pseudonym?

pablo128

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

except the prosecution have witnesses that say it is him

They can say it is him all they like. They have to prove it beyond reasonable doubt though.

#Smokey#

the sheriff is HERE wrote: »

the van has me puzzled, maybe from a car dealership, it wouldn't if bought cost hundreds more like thousands.

would the ballymun guy, be flush with cash and gun used roughly 1000 dollars from what ive seen, and just left in the van.

another question is ken foy for the herald and independent a real person or a pseudonym?

glocks are around 2/2.5k euro and i think only makarovs and other 9x18mm pistols are a good bit cheaper as the S&B rounds are harder to come by as a standard 9mm is 9x19mm .

With the price of stuff so low from holland and the uk spending 3-4k to take someone out would barely be 2 weeks profits if that

ohnonotgmail

pablo128 wrote: »

They can say it is him all they like. They have to prove it beyond reasonable doubt though.

It is the special criminal court. No jury. he is fecked.

Benteke

pablo128 wrote: »

They can say it is him all they like. They have to prove it beyond reasonable doubt though.

They just need to convince 3 judges and they have because they have allowed it as evidence, You know this is in the special criminals court don't you?

DEFTLEFTHAND

I frequent a few organised crime sites around the internet and everyone agrees that this Irish thing is insane. It's like Chicago in the 1920s, lads been gunned down right left and centre on the streets.

The likes of the mob in New York these days only use murder as a last resort, and even then they dispose of the body. They realised that the crazy days of past decades caused massive damage to all five families with numerous members going down for life. Their lot has improved in recent years since the decision was made to cutback on senseless violence, coupled with the fact that the Feds began focusing more on terrorism post 9/11.

These Irish don't seem to have the sense to realise that murder is bad for business

Odelay

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

I frequent a few organised crime sites around the internet and everyone agrees that this Irish thing is insane. It's like Chicago in the 1920s, lads been gunned down right left and centre on the streets.

The likes of the mob in New York these days only use murder as a last resort, and even then they dispose of the body. They realised that the crazy days of past decades caused massive damage to all five families with numerous members going down for life. Their lot has improved in recent years since the decision was made to cutback on senseless violence, coupled with the fact that the Feds began focusing more on terrorism post 9/11.

These Irish don't seem to have the sense to realise that murder is bad for business

What sites do you read?

thebaz

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

I frequent a few organised crime sites around the internet and everyone agrees that this Irish thing is insane. It's like Chicago in the 1920s, lads been gunned down right left and centre on the streets.

The likes of the mob in New York these days only use murder as a last resort, and even then they dispose of the body. They realised that the crazy days of past decades caused massive damage to all five families with numerous members going down for life. Their lot has improved in recent years since the decision was made to cutback on senseless violence, coupled with the fact that the Feds began focusing more on terrorism post 9/11.

These Irish don't seem to have the sense to realise that murder is bad for business

thers gangland shootings in south Chicago, Memphis and St Louis most nights - gangs have changed - yes New York crime has certainly gone down.

Captain Obvious

Benteke wrote: »

They just need to convince 3 judges and they have because they have allowed it as evidence, You know this is in the special criminals court don't you?

My understanding is they have accepted it is evidence but they haven't ruled on how compelling it it. They might still decide two Gardaí isn't convincing enough to convict.

yourdeadwright

thebaz wrote: »

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

I frequent a few organised crime sites around the internet and everyone agrees that this Irish thing is insane. It's like Chicago in the 1920s, lads been gunned down right left and centre on the streets.

The likes of the mob in New York these days only use murder as a last resort, and even then they dispose of the body. They realised that the crazy days of past decades caused massive damage to all five families with numerous members going down for life. Their lot has improved in recent years since the decision was made to cutback on senseless violence, coupled with the fact that the Feds began focusing more on terrorism post 9/11.

These Irish don't seem to have the sense to realise that murder is bad for business

thers gangland shootings in south Chicago, Memphis and St Louis most nights - gangs have changed - yes New York crime has certainly gone down.

I think the the gangs in Chicago and Memphis are not seen as organised crime in the states,
They tend to only use that terminology organised Crime for Cartel's and Mafia in the states, the shooting's in Chicago are seen as street gangs, who tend to stick to there own [font=Arial","sans-serif]Neighbourhood ,I know its still murder and gangs but there seen differently[/font]
[font=Arial","sans-serif]The US see Organised Crime as a treat to the nation but street gangs are a locally based issue to the Police or FBI[/font]

Benteke

Captain Obvious wrote: »

My understanding is they have accepted it is evidence but they haven't ruled on how compelling it it. They might still decide two Gardaí isn't convincing enough to convict.

They could but my money is on him been fecked