Ulster Team Talk Thread III: Les Miserables SEE MOD WARNING POST #1924 + #2755

Former Former

Yeah_Right wrote: »

A few hundred people that don't give a crap about rugby or already hate it.

Does it matter?? If you're a sponsor and you're seeing the trending on Twitter, you're seeing a load of people protesting on the street on a weekday afternoon, then you're going to ask yourself if you want your brand wrapped up in that.

Burkie1203

Former Former wrote: »

Does it matter?? If you're a sponsor and you're seeing the trending on Twitter, you're seeing a load of people protesting on the street on a weekday afternoon, then you're going to ask yourself if you want your brand wrapped up in that.

Doesn't matter what the court verdict. The mob will win out.

I Think their careers will have to continue outside ireland. Don't agree with it but it's inevitable

RuMan

Former Former wrote: »

Does it matter?? If you're a sponsor and you're seeing the trending on Twitter, you're seeing a load of people protesting on the street on a weekday afternoon, then you're going to ask yourself if you want your brand wrapped up in that.

If i see Ruth Coppinger protesting against something i'm investing in it

jacothelad

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Do you? I don't. Connor Murray and Simon Zebo's careers have gone from strength to strength.

Yes they have. They had the good fortune to have a video. I wonder would people be so sickeningly sanctimonious if a very, very high profile, multi capped, 6 Nations winner and GS winner was guilty of a horrendous assault causing serious injury to an innocent member of the public. Now would they have the same views that he should never play for his teams again or shirts will be burnt etc.

Let's have your answers.

Burkie1203

jacothelad wrote: »

Yes they have. They had the good fortune to have a video. I wonder would people be so sickeningly sanctimonious if a very, very high profile, multi capped, 6 Nations winner and GS winner was guilty of a horrendous assault causing serious injury to an innocent member of the public. Now would they have the same views that he should never play for his teams again or shirts will be burnt etc.

Let's have your answers.

You can add in a high profile Dublin gaa player

Or a well known LOI player with a sexual assault conviction

Awesomeness

Burkie1203 wrote: »

You can add in a high profile Dublin gaa player

Or a well known LOI player with a sexual assault conviction

I don't know about the gaa player but that LOI player is a disgrace. I would stop following my team if he played for them without doubt

stephen_n

Yeah_Right wrote: »

A few hundred people that don't give a crap about rugby or already hate it.

That looks like more than a few hundred people, wether they like or dislike rugby is entirely irrelevant to Vodafone. They use mobile phones.


[IMG][/img]

prawnsambo

jacothelad wrote: »

Yes they have. They had the good fortune to have a video. I wonder would people be so sickeningly sanctimonious if a very, very high profile, multi capped, 6 Nations winner and GS winner was guilty of a horrendous assault causing serious injury to an innocent member of the public. Now would they have the same views that he should never play for his teams again or shirts will be burnt etc.

Let's have your answers.

Are you suggesting that this has happened? Because if not, it's just pointless, hypothetical whataboutery.

joseywhales

Look people will forget about the messages, it's the forensic evidence, which proves nothing and they have been aquitted, that will stick with them forever, particularly pj. They will receive abuse over that for the rest of their careers in Ireland. If pj wants to tough it out, at reduced wages under a shower of abuse then I think it's admirable and a show of great character but it's up to him and the irfu.

Awesomeness

jacothelad wrote: »

Yes they have. They had the good fortune to have a video. I wonder would people be so sickeningly sanctimonious if a very, very high profile, multi capped, 6 Nations winner and GS winner was guilty of a horrendous assault causing serious injury to an innocent member of the public. Now would they have the same views that he should never play for his teams again or shirts will be burnt etc.

Let's have your answers.

I would not be burning shirts but I probably would say they should not play again depending on the details. Is this something that happened that I missed? If so can you point me to a link and I will give you my honest opinion

Say what you want on whatsapp. No issue with that
Do what you want behind closed doors as long as its consensual . No issue with that

If people cant see the difference between the Zebo/Murray situation and this I think its hard to explain

jacothelad

prawnsambo wrote: »

Are you suggesting that this has happened? Because if not, it's just pointless, hypothetical whataboutery.

Yes, it did happen. You mean you were not outraged?

jacothelad

Awesomeness wrote: »

I would not be burning shirts but I probably would say they should not play again depending on the details. Is this something that happened that I missed? If so can you point me to a link and I will give you my honest opinion

Say what you want on whatsapp. No issue with that
Do what you want behind closed doors as long as its consensual . No issue with that

If people cant see the difference between the Zebo/Murray situation and this I think its hard to explain

ttps://www.independent.ie/irish-news/top-rugby-star-admits-to-nightclub-assault-charge-26101953.html

RuMan

stephen_n wrote: »

That looks like more than a few hundred people, wether they like or dislike rugby is entirely irrelevant to Vodafone. They use mobile phones.


[IMG][/img]

So did the people who held Joan Burton prisoner.

jacothelad

RuMan wrote: »

So did the people who held Joan Burton prisoner.

I'm sure we could post hundreds of pictures of other ill-informed, sanctimonious, hate-fuelled mobs spewing their bile to make themselves feel just great and righteous.

Dubinusa

Zebo and Murray were not charged with rape. The female in that incident put it out on social media. She was willing and u can't rape the willing afaik.
Different scenario and circumstances. I fear the Ulster lads will have to leave.

Former Former

jacothelad wrote: »

ttps://www.independent.ie/irish-news/top-rugby-star-admits-to-nightclub-assault-charge-26101953.html

That is from 18 years ago. 18 years ffs. Horgan hadn't even played for Ireland at the time of the incident.

I'd point out that Horgan won neither a Grand Slam nor a Six Nations but that's the least of the issues with that nonsense

stephen_n

RuMan wrote: »

So did the people who held Joan Burton prisoner.

Nice hyperbole

prawnsambo

jacothelad wrote: »

Yes, it did happen. You mean you were not outraged?

Well that completely passed me by. And yes, it is outrageous. But it's still whataboutery. Is there some system that precludes you from being outraged about anything for perpetuity if you failed to be outraged about something else?

Awesomeness

jacothelad wrote: »

ttps://www.independent.ie/irish-news/top-rugby-star-admits-to-nightclub-assault-charge-26101953.html

Didn't know about that. Would like to know who threw the first punch and see some witness statements. Would have at least not selected him for a year or 2. And if he threw the first punch and was unprovoked I think its a disgrace he didn't do jail time.

But to give a couple of sporting examples of sports stars in sex situations and where my opinions would fall - nothing to do with the person/sport/team just on the situation and if they were playing for my team

Murray/Zebo - Everyone knew what they were doing. No harm
Ryan Giggs - Horrible person. Wouldn't want him as a mate but wouldn't care if he was on my team
PJ/SO - Definitely should have been found not guilty. Will never know what actually happened but from what I have seen would be uneasy cheering for them
Akinade - Cant really say what I think of him cos I will be banned but if he ever played for my time I would never attend a match again

hogandrew

Awesomeness wrote: »

Didn't know about that. Would like to know who threw the first punch and see some witness statements. Would have at least not selected him for a year or 2. And if he threw the first punch and was unprovoked I think its a disgrace he didn't do jail time.

But to give a couple of sporting examples of sports stars in sex situations and where my opinions would fall - nothing to do with the person/sport/team just on the situation and if they were playing for my team

Murray/Zebo - Everyone knew what they were doing. No harm
Ryan Giggs - Horrible person. Wouldn't want him as a mate but wouldn't care if he was on my team
PJ/SO - Definitely should have been found not guilty. Will never know what actually happened but from what I have seen would be uneasy cheering for them
Akinade - Cant really say what I think of him cos I will be banned

Johnny Evans might be a closer example. It must be the guts of 20 years ago but I think that there wasn't enough evidence to prosecute him and I've seen lots of people who believe this one shouldn't have went to trial either

Burkie1203

Awesomeness wrote: »

I don't know about the gaa player but that LOI player is a disgrace. I would stop following my team if he played for them without doubt

Google Diarmuid Connolly McGowans.

Mebuntu

If important decisions are made based on the comments of the idiots that are on Twitter or Facebook then we are in a bad place.

bilston

When is the Glasgow game?

munsterlegend

Mebuntu wrote: »

If important decisions are made based on the comments of the idiots that are on Twitter or Facebook then we are in a bad place.

The IRFU and Ulster will make their decision in a few weeks when things have died down. It won't be based on twitter or Facebook but cold business reality. I can't see them playing for Ulster again or any Irish province which effectively ends their Irish career.

prawnsambo

Mebuntu wrote: »

If important decisions are made based on the comments of the idiots that are on Twitter or Facebook then we are in a bad place.

Commercial decisions have been based on the same kinds of thing since before the advent of Facebook and Twitter. The only difference is that now they have prior warning before people start walking away.

Former Former

bilston wrote: »

When is the Glasgow game?

Not soon enough

joseywhales

As a Leinster fan I'm looking at Ulster and all the negativity over the last 3 years and thinking, there but for the grace of God. On the upside it feels like you've hit the bottom and there's a great opportunity to get the structures in place to build a truly professional efficient transparent organisation with strong ethical culture and work ethic, given the resources and tradition around Ulster. That's something to be excited about

MJohnston

joseywhales wrote: »

As a Leinster fan I'm looking at Ulster and all the negativity over the last 3 years and thinking, there but for the grace of God. On the upside it feels like you've hit the bottom and there's a great opportunity to get the structures in place to build a truly professional efficient transparent organisation with strong ethical culture and work ethic, given the resources and tradition around Ulster. That's something to be excited about

Ulster haven't hit the bottom yet at all. They've still an opportunity to sink further if they, as seems likely, do nothing about the institutional structural problems in the club.

joseywhales

MJohnston wrote: »

joseywhales wrote: »

As a Leinster fan I'm looking at Ulster and all the negativity over the last 3 years and thinking, there but for the grace of God. On the upside it feels like you've hit the bottom and there's a great opportunity to get the structures in place to build a truly professional efficient transparent organisation with strong ethical culture and work ethic, given the resources and tradition around Ulster. That's something to be excited about

Ulster haven't hit the bottom yet at all. They've still an opportunity to sink further if they, as seems likely, do nothing about the institutional structural problems in the club.

What is required imo is a player driven environment, best and henderson with others should be putting their feet down and demanding a higher level, including coaching if that's what is required. There is no greater motivation for change than angry senior players who want the best for the club.
On the grass roots level, higher support for volunteerism and appreciation is a good start.

Ardillaun

How much advice is given to players once they get on provincial teams? The change in status can disorientate some people as they become targets for all sorts of attention. I guess one can't be too paternalistic these days but a few sessions with sports figures who got into trouble and learned their lessons the hard way might be useful.