Climate Change, Feminism, White Genocide, Donald Trump

_Dara_

Candie wrote: »

The one where she says he's now become an unfunny Woody Allen? Ironically, I laughed at that one.

That's the one! She's a good writer.

take everything

I'm someone who is against oppressive leftist dogma (eg unregulated/unchecked immigration; turning a blind eye to horrendous aspects of Islamic culture while gratuitously attacking other religions for less horrendous failings; denial of biology when it suits and invoking it when it doesn't; etc etc) but seeing those Neo-nazis and their stupid confederacy love in Virginia reminds how utterly moronic and hateful people can be.

One kinda begets the other though. These racist assholes wouldn't be half as bold to air their obnoxious views if it wasn't for the current climate sick of the left.

_Dara_

_Dara_ wrote: »

That's the one! She's a good writer.

I do like her.

I liked what Andy Borowitz had to say about him too, in contradiction to Noonan: 'Say what you like, but Trump isn't a stupid man, he's a smart man with a deep understanding of what stupid people want'

Whether he's a smart man who knows stupid or a stupid man who thinks he's smart, the net result is the same. A guy who lets loose every half-thought on twitter without filter, and then in a state of bewildered agita complains about being unsupported.

take everything

take everything wrote: »

One kinda begets the other though. These racist assholes wouldn't be half as bold to air their obnoxious views if it wasn't for the current climate sick of the left.

It's so difficult to keep track of whether those of us in the liberal/ loony left are supposed to be oppressively intolerant of dissent this week, or, as you indicate, enabling racists to ventilate their obnoxious views.

Either way, I'm sure it's all our fault alright.

super_furry

It's young frustrated men being radicalised online by extremists.

That and the wimmin, but sure it's always their fault.

A Tyrant Named Miltiades!

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Either way, I'm sure it's all our fault alright.

Of course it is.

The main thing is that they're being forced to be racist, and it's not their fault. It's almost like they're victims or something.

B0jangles

Candie wrote: »

The one where she says he's now become an unfunny Woody Allen? Ironically, I laughed at that one.

I think I read it in the New Yorker, it was along the lines of "Trump is a poor man's idea of a rich man, a stupid man's idea of a smart man, and a weak man's idea of a strong man'.

Sounds a bit like what comedian John Mulaney said about him:

https://youtu.be/dBNBAgtjYV8?t=29

diograis

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

It's so difficult to keep track of whether those of us in the liberal/ loony left are supposed to be oppressively intolerant of dissent this week, or, as you indicate, enabling racists to ventilate their obnoxious views.

Either way, I'm sure it's all our fault alright.

Libtards LOL #MAGA

Junkyard Tom

Trump is Barack Obama's legacy as much as anyone else. Obama ran on the hope-and-change ticket and delivered very little change and not much hope. The US 'left' has sold its voter base out time-and-again for decades and are reaping what they've sown.

As for people who use neoreactionary buzzwords/terms, well, they are better off ignored. If you try to pin them down on what they mean when they use terms like 'cultural marxist/ism' they tend to clam up because they know it's largely meaningless.

Candie

Candie wrote: »

Of course it is.

The main thing is that they're being forced to be racist, and it's not their fault. It's almost like they're victims or something.

The same people purport to champion "individual resonsibility", except of course when the lefties force them to be racists.

Junkyard Tom

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

Trump is Barack Obama's legacy as much as anyone else. Obama ran on the hope-and-change ticket and delivered very little change and not much hope. The US 'left' has sold its voter base out time-and-again for decades and are reaping what they've sown.

That's true, and much of the same can be said of the European left (but then, I guess the European left has always been pretty diverse, from social democracy to left republicanism to socialism).

Nevertheless, one thing we can't accuse left wing parties of, is homogeny of of opinion. The left is famously (notoriously?) fragmented, with very diverse views on things like reindustrialisation, globalisation, and the EU.

Take the British Labour party, for example. The fact of someone being a Labour MP tells you absolutely nothing of their position in Brexit/ the EU, on foreign policy, or even their own leader.

That's it should be. Whether on the left or right, we should all be suspicious of ideologies that slavishly follow particular flags, despite the lack of logical connections between them. That's where political position sails close to 'cult'.

B0jangles

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

The same people purport to champion "individual resonsibility", except of course when the lefties force them to be racists.

Those damn lefties also forced them to vote for Trump

take everything

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

It's so difficult to keep track of whether those of us in the liberal/ loony left are supposed to be oppressively intolerant of dissent this week, or, as you indicate, enabling racists to ventilate their obnoxious views.

Either way, I'm sure it's all our fault alright.

That's what you got from my post?
Surely you can agree that the polarisation is self-fulfilling. Which is my point.

And what about the right fuelling the left (antifa etc). Why didn't you say those on the right should feel aggrieved with me for pointing out that the right are partly responsible for that.

Instead it's this solipsistic, defensive little bubble that the left live in. Willing to look for slight where none was intended. As in my post.

(The far right have always lived in such a bubble.).

Wonder will any rightwingers take offence at what I say.

I know plenty of people who don't care about climate change and/or are "anti-feminist" yet they can't stand Trump. Mate of mine says the most sexist stuff going (people don't get the difference between jokes and opinions it seems), hates Trump. I know people who are "right-wing" in several ways and they detest Trump.

It's a boring narrative really and doesn't bear up to much scrutiny. There's a decent amount of the US population who voted for Trump who had voted for Obama. Racists? The "far-right" or whatever ya want to call bigots managed to united behind a reprehensible candidate and just about got enough people in the centre to buy their bull**** whether it was bull**** about Hillary, bull**** about how they were the downtrodden ones, about how "they" (others) needed put in their place, how the establishment was against them and Trump would blow it all up.

donegaLroad

Syphonax wrote: »

White Genocide? Presumably thats the same thing as White genocide conspiracy theory on wikipedia? I literally never came across this before. If this is believable then im going to re-read the Holocaust denial theory.

White genocide and climate change are intrinsically linked. As temperatures increase due to climate chance, everyone's skin is becoming darker. Soon, the real white skinned people of the world will belong in areas closer to the Arctic circle. :pac:

tritium

Its realtively straightforward imho

Anyone who uses some of a range of buzzwords with any kind of frequency can probably be well predicted in their views on a wide range of topics. Said buzzwords/phrases come from both extremes and include: femininazi, misogynist, butch lesbian, patriarchy, alt right, looney liberal, cuck, cultural appropriation, snow flake....etc.

Sadly many who can be identified in the above fashion have little time or ability to listen or try to understand the views of anyone not of their mindset. Generally this has led to events like trumps election and Teresa Mays election meltdown. However both sides continue to reassure themselves this is either down to their own righteousness or the stupidity (or insert a buzzword from above) of the other side...all the while ignoring the plank in their own eye in terms of any unethical or questionable behaviour on their side

Your Face

Stock answer.

topper75

Candie wrote: »

I think I read it in the New Yorker, it was along the lines of "Trump is a poor man's idea of a rich man, a stupid man's idea of a smart man, and a weak man's idea of a strong man'.

Goodness! Has champagne socialism finally jumped the shark?! :pac:

Ubbquittious

tritium wrote: »

Its realtively straightforward imho

Anyone who uses some of a range of buzzwords with any kind of frequency can probably be well predicted in their views on a wide range of topics. Said buzzwords/phrases come from both extremes and include: femininazi, misogynist, butch lesbian, patriarchy, alt right, looney liberal, cuck, cultural appropriation, snow flake....etc.

Sadly many who can be identified in the above fashion have little time or ability to listen or try to understand the views of anyone not of their mindset. Generally this has led to events like trumps election and Teresa Mays election meltdown. However both sides continue to reassure themselves this is either down to their own righteousness or the stupidity (or insert a buzzword from above) of the other side...all the while ignoring the plank in their own eye in terms of any unethical or questionable behaviour on their side

SJW. How could you forget SJW

Wibbs

Candie wrote: »

"Trump is a poor man's idea of a rich man, a stupid man's idea of a smart man, and a weak man's idea of a strong man'.

Would sum him up pretty well for me. He's the very definition of the stereotype of the "Crass American". That so many ordinary Americans were so fed up with the political status quo and landed him in the White House said much. A real pity they didn't get the choice of a non oafish alternative. If I were American faced with him or Clinton, caught between a crock and an orange face, I'd have voted for damn near anyone else.

tritium wrote:

Anyone who uses some of a range of buzzwords with any kind of frequency can probably be well predicted in their views on a wide range of topics. Said buzzwords/phrases come from both extremes and include: femininazi, misogynist, butch lesbian, patriarchy, alt right, looney liberal, cuck, cultural appropriation, snow flake....etc.

Pretty much. And for me at least such buzzwords sound even more cringeworthy spouted secondhand by Irish voices. Never mind the other thread noting many Irish people absorbing "American" accents, too bloody many seem to think our societies are the same, with the same nonsense bubbling up in both.

Deleted User wrote:

I know plenty of people who don't care about climate change and/or are "anti-feminist" yet they can't stand Trump. Mate of mine says the most sexist stuff going (people don't get the difference between jokes and opinions it seems), hates Trump. I know people who are "right-wing" in several ways and they detest Trump.

Ditto. These boxes are only simple in echo chambers on Reddit and ArseBook. For myself I think Trump is an oaf, think man's impact on the environment and climate shifts is a plain as the nose on one's face given, think feminism has become a busted flush of mostly nonsense, think immigration into Ireland and the EU should be massively curtailed, think multiculturalism is also a busted flush, think social welfare is a basic requirement of a civilised society(though ours needs an enema) and feel a lot of sympathy for so called "millennials" who've inherited a not so great world. What box do I fit into?

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote:

That's it should be. Whether on the left or right, we should all be suspicious of ideologies that slavishly follow particular flags, despite the lack of logical connections between them. That's where political position sails close to 'cult'.

+1000. This is particularly evident online, where discourse is down voted to echo chambers where "givens" can't be questioned. On all sides. It's creeping from there into real life with it.

Ubbquittious

Wibbs wrote: »

Pretty much. And for me at least such buzzwords sound even more cringeworthy spouted secondhand by Irish voices. Never mind the other thread noting many Irish people absorbing "American" accents, too bloody many seem to think our societies are the same, with the same nonsense bubbling up in both.

I find it peculiar how people latch onto the goings on over in the States as if they're local to us. They'll import the whole racism and black lives matter thing as if it's something that's playing out on the streets of Kilkenny even though we're not the crowd who enslaved them and made second class citizens of them for years.

Similarly if there's a shooting incident in the States you'll have a good few people clamouring for single barrel shotguns and .22 rifles to be taken off their Irish owners over here despite them not being part of the problem.

Ubbquittious

Ubbquittious wrote: »

I find it peculiar how people latch onto the goings on over in the States as if they're local to us. They'll import the whole racism and black lives matter thing as if it's something that's playing out on the streets of Kilkenny even though we're not the crowd who enslaved them and made second class citizens of them for years.

Similarly if there's a shooting incident in the States you'll have a good few people clamouring for single barrel shotguns and .22 rifles to be taken off their Irish owners over here despite them not being part of the problem.

I think that's a valid point, but it works both ways.

The Trump-era climate of noxious cynicism has also been imported, and there seems to be little justification for it here.

There are so many middle-aged men, who presumably cannot afford a midlife crisis, now spouting all sorts of nonsense on social media about the victimhood of white men; there is an an echo chamber of Irish conspiracy theorists bewailing the 'MSM' (hashtag RTEbias), and getting their knickers in a twist over the threat posed by radical Islamism, despite the fact that very few Muslim refugees seem to want to come here, let alone the radical ones.

Personally, I think the anti-Trump thing has been a slippery slope for a lot of people and they're now getting led down the garden path on a whole host of issues by the pages and media they clicked Like on a year ago. I've seen two friends turn into complete and utter morons on various topics, namely the ones mentioned by the OP.

One (American) is so riddled with straight white man guilt that he thinks black people / gay / women should be allowed to be discriminatory and violent in retaliation, even against himself, for no reason other than guilt and history. He's convinced that 20% of Western people want gay people to be killed so they have a right to fear, hate and be violent to straight people.

The other (British) has lost all sense of fact-checking and doesn't realise he's being spoon-fed nonsense daily on his Facebook feed. He shares this stuff and for a while, I used to just show him they were literally lies and he finally went psycho at me and ended the friendship.



People I know who were apathetic to Trump or supported him have moved on with their lives and are now level-headed in their criticism of him, whereas a lot of the anti-Trump ones have lost the plot. Listening to people genuinely say that Trump is worse than Kim Jong Un is like sticking hot pokers in my ears.

I sat with the first guy and a few of his friends having beers a few weeks ago and a Filipina was unsure about joining her family in America to take care of her sister, because of Trump. I listened to them talk about it for a good hour and at the end of it, they all agreed she should wait it out for another year or two until he's impeached, and that's actually what she's now doing, because of her skin. I'm supposed to meet them later but I'm not sure if I can stomach it. I enjoy listening to them though because it's like live satire. "Who can overreact the most?"

tritium

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

I think that's a valid point, but it works both ways.

The Trump-era climate of noxious cynicism has also been imported, and there seems to be little justification for it here.

There are so many middle-aged men, who presumably cannot afford a midlife crisis, now spouting all sorts of nonsense on social media about the victimhood of white men; there is an an echo chamber of Irish conspiracy theorists bewailing the 'MSM' (hashtag RTEbias), and getting their knickers in a twist over the threat posed by radical Islamism, despite the fact that very few Muslim refugees seem to want to come here, let alone the radical ones.

Yep, but its not particularly new to Ireland from either left or right. We've had the irish times and sindo firmly planting a flag on their opposite agendas for quite some time now and giving uncritical platforms to the likes of Myers, Mulally et al. So much so unfortunaty that many of them, for a time at least, almost become accepted as mainstream.

Syphonax

donegaLroad wrote: »

White genocide and climate change are intrinsically linked. As temperatures increase due to climate chance, everyone's skin is becoming darker. Soon, the real white skinned people of the world will belong in areas closer to the Arctic circle. :pac:

Im one of the 3% that does not believe that humans are affecting climate change and ill doubt be moving to the artic in my lifetime

Ubbquittious

Syphonax wrote: »

Im one of the 3% that does not believe that humans are affecting climate change and ill doubt be moving to the artic in my lifetime

I'm tempted to buy a scrappeen of land with a cottage near Ittoqqortoormiit just in case. It might be covered with ice now but I'll have the last laugh when I'm growing mangos on it in a few years

ancapailldorcha

Wibbs wrote: »

What box do I fit into?

This immediately jumped to mind when I read the above:



In fairness, that's a fairly cross-spectrum collection of stances.

Syphonax

Syphonax wrote: »

Im one of the 3% that does not believe that humans are affecting climate change and ill doubt be moving to the artic in my lifetime

Are you sure you even know what climate change is, and how scientists say it will affect the planet?

The melting polar icecaps in the Arctic ocean aren't a problem in themselves. They could all melt and sea levels wouldn't rise. They're a marker for the pace of global warming, like the proverbial canary in the coalmine.

Syphonax

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Are you sure you even know what climate change is, and how scientists say it will affect the planet?

The melting polar icecaps in the Arctic ocean aren't a problem in themselves. They could all melt and sea levels wouldn't rise. They're a marker for the pace of global warming, like the proverbial canary in the coalmine.

I know climate change is happening, would have happened and will continue to happen regardless of whether there are humans on this planted or not. The actual increase in the change of the climate thats directly related to humans is negligible and just another Y2K scaremongering tactic so that we will all buy electric cars and stop paying Muslims for their oil.

RayM

Syphonax wrote: »

Im one of the 3% that does not believe that humans are affecting climate change and ill doubt be moving to the artic in my lifetime

Are you a climate scientist? The 3% figure refers not to the general public, but to the tiny number of climate scientists who disagree with 97% of their peers. Climate scientist or not, you'd want to have some amount of self-confidence to disagree with that number of experts.